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Replying to Understanding the 2012 Buick LaCrosse with eAssist System


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Posted 08 November 2014 - 01:38 AM

Sounds like the turbo steamer (if it works financially to be mass produced) could net a substantial gain to all vehicles.  It could be one of those pieces of technology that everyone begins to use if it really can capture as much waste heat as BMW's claims would have us believe.  In conjunction with a mild hybrid system we could potentially see some pretty substantial gains in both city and highway mileage in the future.  Definitely good news!

 

The turbosteamer is designed to capture wasteheat from the exhaust and coolant and transform it into usable energy.  Water injection is designed to cool the intake charge to prevent detonation and allow for higher compression ratios in the engine.  I think someone has proposed an engine that has an extra "water cycle" where water is injected after the exhaust stroke to be turned to steam to convert waste heat into mechanical work, but that would require a decent sized water tank.  A lot of guys use water/methanol injection on their diesels to keep their EGTs down, but some of those systems really use an incredible amount of water/methanol.  I think some inject over 10% water/methanol mixture v/v with diesel into the air charge.  Since most guys use the windshield reservoir for this its a huge pain since it can get emptied pretty darn fast.  If diesels had gone the route of water/methanol injection instead of urea injection to control Nox diesels would be more efficient, have more power, and would have cleaner valves.  Bummer on that one.  If a good set of tuners comes along for Chrysler's ecodiesel that allows the SCR to be shut off and a kit created to use the urea tank for water/methanol injection I would buy one in a heartbeat.

 

Water injection has a nasty habit of chewing up spark plug electrodes in short order. The problem is not so much corrosion, but that there is no spark plug which is of the proper heat range for when the misting is on and when the misting is off.


Posted 20 October 2014 - 10:28 PM

Sounds like the turbo steamer (if it works financially to be mass produced) could net a substantial gain to all vehicles.  It could be one of those pieces of technology that everyone begins to use if it really can capture as much waste heat as BMW's claims would have us believe.  In conjunction with a mild hybrid system we could potentially see some pretty substantial gains in both city and highway mileage in the future.  Definitely good news!

 

The turbosteamer is designed to capture wasteheat from the exhaust and coolant and transform it into usable energy.  Water injection is designed to cool the intake charge to prevent detonation and allow for higher compression ratios in the engine.  I think someone has proposed an engine that has an extra "water cycle" where water is injected after the exhaust stroke to be turned to steam to convert waste heat into mechanical work, but that would require a decent sized water tank.  A lot of guys use water/methanol injection on their diesels to keep their EGTs down, but some of those systems really use an incredible amount of water/methanol.  I think some inject over 10% water/methanol mixture v/v with diesel into the air charge.  Since most guys use the windshield reservoir for this its a huge pain since it can get emptied pretty darn fast.  If diesels had gone the route of water/methanol injection instead of urea injection to control Nox diesels would be more efficient, have more power, and would have cleaner valves.  Bummer on that one.  If a good set of tuners comes along for Chrysler's ecodiesel that allows the SCR to be shut off and a kit created to use the urea tank for water/methanol injection I would buy one in a heartbeat.


Posted 20 October 2014 - 02:29 PM

yeah, not at all the same as the BMW concept.


Posted 20 October 2014 - 02:05 PM

I remember most of them were in a plate you put under the carburetor and it misted or sprayed water very finely with the fuel so it got sucked down the engine to make the fuel more efficient. Yet it seemed to have issues around specific RPM if memory serves me correct.


Posted 20 October 2014 - 01:03 PM

I think that is a different type of system than what BMW did with the Turbo Steamer.


Posted 20 October 2014 - 12:13 PM

 

What about the BMW Turbo-Steamer that boiled water off the exhaust heat to run.... something?

 

I wonder how much water a system like that would consume?  I guess in theory one could make a closed loop system where boiled water was then condensed and boiled again.  Heck, if a system like that was not used you could probably do away with the entire cooling system since you could just boil water directly from the engine heat as well as from the exhaust.  You would take all of that waste heat that gets dumped into the atmosphere and doing work with it.  I wonder if a water injection system, maybe with an extra couple of strokes could suck enough heat out of the engine to reduce or eliminate the cooling system. 

 

Shame its so expensive to develop new car tech.  Lots of interesting ideas out there.

 

Water injections was a big deal in the late 70's I remember my dad and I trying a number of systems that came to market. But they never really panned out. Course we did not have the computers and the technology then to probably make it a reality. Something very well could work today.


Posted 20 October 2014 - 10:14 AM

It's closed loop


Posted 20 October 2014 - 09:23 AM

What about the BMW Turbo-Steamer that boiled water off the exhaust heat to run.... something?

 

I wonder how much water a system like that would consume?  I guess in theory one could make a closed loop system where boiled water was then condensed and boiled again.  Heck, if a system like that was not used you could probably do away with the entire cooling system since you could just boil water directly from the engine heat as well as from the exhaust.  You would take all of that waste heat that gets dumped into the atmosphere and doing work with it.  I wonder if a water injection system, maybe with an extra couple of strokes could suck enough heat out of the engine to reduce or eliminate the cooling system. 

 

Shame its so expensive to develop new car tech.  Lots of interesting ideas out there.


Posted 19 October 2014 - 08:39 PM

What about the BMW Turbo-Steamer that boiled water off the exhaust heat to run.... something?


Posted 17 October 2014 - 11:21 PM

Also, if its technically too difficult to use exhaust gasses to generate electricity directly, would it be possible to setup some of these hybrids with a smaller engine and small turbo and run a miller cycle?  Are the small turbos still too slow to spin up to be of use for a miller cycle engine?

 

With every manufacturer so anxious to turbo everything (allegedly for CAFE reasons) I have wondered why they don't switch to miller cycle engines.  They're already spending the money on forced induction and they would get better fuel economy out of the system.


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