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  • Drew Dowdell
    Drew Dowdell

    Mercedes-AMG Unveils the CLA 35

      ... the sleeker version of the A 35 AMG Sedan...


    Mercedes took the wraps off the Mercedes-AMG CLA 35 ahead of its debut at the New York International Auto Show next week.   The CLA 35 is the sleeker, more coupe-like version of the Mercedes-AMG A 35 Sedan that was unveiled two weeks ago. Much of the same hardware that goes into the A 35 is here in the CLA 35 as well.

    Power is rated for 302 hp at 5800 RPM and 295 lb-ft of torque between 3,000 and 4,000 rpm from the 2.0 liter twin scroll turbocharged engine. 4Matic all-wheel drive is standard and can run in front-wheel drive mode or an even 50-50 split front to rear. 

    Like the A 35, the CLA also gets body reinforcements to help with torsional rigidity (which makes us wonder about the non-AMG cars - DD). The interior gets an update to the MBUX system that allows you to say "Hey Mercedes!" to control certain in-car functions.

    You can read more about the A 35 AMG  here.

    The Mercedes-AMG CLA 35 will officially debut at the New York Auto Show on April 17th at 10:15 eastern.  Stay tuned for more coverage from the show.

    Mercedes press release on page 2


    Sporty, stylish, intelligent and dynamic: The new CLA 35 is the latest point of entry to the world of Mercedes-AMG. The four- door coupe shares the progressive technology with the A-Class, but is even bolder with its iconic design and the intelligent MBUX interior assistant. The high torque 2.0L Inline-4 turbo engine delivers 302 hp, distributed to all four wheels via the 7-speed dual-clutch transmission and variable all- wheel drive. Sporty driving performance (acceleration from 0-60 mph in 4.6 seconds est.) is combined with a range of versatile driving experiences - from very sporty to refined and comfortable on long journeys.

    "With its iconic design and agile driving dynamics, the new CLA 35 is an attractive offer for a young, active and lifestyle-conscious target group. These customers define their requirements very clearly: They expect exciting design from their vehicle alongside superior performance and inspiring handling characteristics. The new CLA 35 embodies just this attitude to life – and  enables stepping in to the fascinating world of AMG Driving Performance in a particularly emotional way,"says Tobias Moers, CEO of Mercedes-AMG GmbH.

    Icon with a sporty design: the exterior

    The unique design of the CLA Coupe is one of the new model's key purchase reasons. The AMG designers therefore aimed to maintain its basic form with wide wheel arches and a slim profile. The two power domes on the hood were also adopted as sporty details. The new radiator grille with classic twin louvers and an AMG front bumper with flics on the air inlets are distinctive features of the CLA 35. Other distinguishing characteristics include silver chrome trim elements in the outer air inlets. From a side view, the aerodynamically optimized 18-inch light-alloy wheels in twin-spoke design (19-inch wheels are optionally available) and the accentuated side sills catch the eye. The rear bumper with a new diffuser insert, the small spoiler lip on the trunk and the two round tailpipes on the left and right dominate the rear view. The two-piece, narrow tail lamps and the license plate housing placed low in the bumper add to the CLA's wide rear appearance.

    Sporty interior featuring MBUX infotainment system

    Frameless doors open to an interior with a high-tech ambience, where quality and elegance meet digital displays. The interior scene can be catered to specific tastes thanks to the standard 64 color ambient lighting. The distinctive interior design is evident with the available MB-Tex and microfiber DINAMICA in black with red contrasting stitching and red seat belts, as well as in the available combination of MB-Tex in black/digital grey. Red piping on the microfiber DINAMICA trim elements and ventilation outlets with a red ring are additional unique accents.

    The combination of a sporty design with sophisticated details is also evident in the MBUX infotainment system with its innovative operation and display. In the new CLA 35, MBUX replaces the previous COMAND systems and creates an even closer connection between the vehicle, driver and passengers.
    Appealing presentations underline the clear control structure and feature brilliant maximum-resolution 3D graphics. Visually, the two displays under one shared glass cover blend into a Widescreen Cockpit, and consequently emphasize the horizontal orientation of the interior design.

    With the newly available MBUX interior assistant, select infotainment functions can be operated without touch, along with switching the reading light on or off. The assistant differentiates between driver and passenger interaction and recognizes certain hand positions and movements. The interaction area for the MBUX interior assistant is in front of the media display up to the center console, including the touchpad between the driver and front-seat passenger.

    The MBUX interior assistant recognizes movement toward the various operating elements of the infotainment system. The operator's seat is enlarged on the media display if one's hand moves toward the touchscreen. The most suitable operating elements are automatically pre-selected. In the radio and media menu, the MBUX interior assistant reduces the number of operating steps. In the navigation menu, the system fades in the display as soon as the hand moves to operate the touchscreen or touchpad, so that a symbol is selected directly. When displaying the camera image, as soon as the hand moves toward the touchscreen the MBUX interior assistant enables the four camera operating symbols from the 360-degree camera to be faded in. This means that the front, rear, right or left camera view can be selected directly.

    The CLA 35 also comes with our new trailblazing voice control, activated with the words "Hey Mercedes". Thanks to artificial intelligence, MBUX recognizes and understands nearly all sentences from the fields of infotainment and  vehicle operation, even if they are expressed indirectly.

    Fully digital instrument cluster with three AMG display styles

    Customers can choose between three AMG display styles for the instrument cluster: "Classic", "Sport"and "Supersport". The "Supersport"mode is particularly striking, with a central, round rev counter and additional information presented in the form of bars to the left and right. Via the AMG menu, the driver can call up various special displays such as Warm-up, Set-up, G-Force and Engine Data.

    Touchscreen multimedia display and new center console

    The 10.25 inch touchscreen multimedia display also emphasizes the dynamic character with individual AMG displays, such as visualization of the driving programs, AMG TRACK PACE and telemetry data.

    The AMG-specific center console in piano black finish with standard touchpad has additional buttons that control the functions of ESP®, manual transmission mode and the Adaptive Damping System. When combined with the optional leather package, it also features a silver chrome surround.

    New AMG steering wheel generation with optional steering wheel buttons

    The next generation of AMG steering wheels provide the perfect link between the driver and the vehicle. The steering wheel rim with a flat-bottom, perforated leather in the grip area and red contrasting topstitching is both attractive and pleasant to the touch. The galvanized steering wheel gearshift paddles allow an even sportier driving style with manual gear shifting.

    The built-in Touch Control buttons, familiar from some of our other models, are a new feature. The Active Distance Assist DISTRONIC and cruise control can be adjusted on the control panels on the left. The control panels on the right activate the voice control and telephone, and regulate the sound volume, music selection and other functions of the infotainment system.

    The steering wheel with innovative AMG steering wheel buttons is available as an option. These consist of a round controller with an integrated display beneath the right-hand steering-wheel spoke, plus two vertically positioned color display buttons with switches beneath the left-hand steering-wheel spoke. The AMG drive programs are actuated directly via the controller. With the two configurable display buttons and the additional switches, further AMG functions can be controlled within easy reach directly on the steering wheel.

    Reinforced body-in-white with increased torsional rigidity

    Specific measures to strengthen the front section of the bodyshell help enable the precise turn-in ability and the toe and camber stability of the chassis, even when driving at speed. A "shear panel", a bolted aluminum plate under the engine, also increases the torsional stiffness of the front section of the CLA 35. Two additional diagonal braces at the front of the underbody also reduce torsion and increase rigidity.

    New four-cylinder turbo engine with 302 hp

    The 2.0L Inline-4 turbo engine is a new development and is based on the M260 four-cylinder engine in the new A-Class. The new drive boasts a quick response to accelerator pedal commands, high torque (295 lb-ft max. torque from 3,000 rpm), a lively response and an emotional engine sound. The crankcase made of high-strength, lightweight die-cast aluminum reduces the vehicle weight where it matters most for driving dynamics.

    The twin-scroll turbocharger combines optimum responsiveness at low engine speeds with a significant power increase at higher engine speeds. The housing of the twin-scroll turbocharger is divided into two parallel ducts. Together with two separate ducts in the exhaust manifold, this makes it possible to channel the exhaust gases separately on the turbine wheel.

    This results in a further advantage of twin-scroll technology -- minimization of the mutually adverse effects of the individual cylinders on the gas cycle. The exhaust gas backpressure is reduced and gas exchange and engine  efficiency are improved.

    Numerous engine measures increase efficiency

    The high technological standards of the new four-cylinder engine are also underscored by numerous efficiency-enhancing measures. These include CAMTRONIC variable valve control, intelligent thermal management for engine and oil, high-precision piezo injectors and multi-spark ignition. In production,  the patented CONICSHAPE® cylinder honing reduces internal engine friction and also increases efficiency.

    Agile gear ratios: AMG SPEEDSHIFT DCT 7-Speed Transmission

    The AMG SPEEDSHIFT DCT 7-Speed Transmission also contributes to the agile and dynamic character of the new CLA 35. The gear ratios are configured so that the driver experiences very responsive acceleration in all speed ranges, combined with fast shifting and optimum connections when upshifting.

    The standard RACE-START function allows maximum acceleration from a stationary position and is a high performance experience. The functions of the AMG SPEEDSHIFT DCT 7-Speed transmission also include a temporary manual shift mode activated by operating the steering wheel shift paddles in any driving mode, and with the manual transmission mode "M"for manual gear changes with the shift paddles.

    AMG Performance 4MATIC variable all-wheel drive

    Dynamism, agility and performance – these three attributes characterize the standard all-wheel drive of the new Mercedes-AMG CLA 35. The variable AMG 4MATIC+ combines the best possible traction with driving pleasure. The torque distribution is variable to suit the dynamic handling requirements. The spectrum ranges from front-wheel drive only to a 50:50 percent distribution to the front and rear axles.

    A multi-disc clutch that is integrated in the  rear  axle  transmission is responsible for the variable torque distribution between the  front  and  rear axles. It is controlled electro-mechanically. The influencing factors for torque distribution are the driving speed, the lateral and longitudinal acceleration and the steering angle, and the difference in  rotational  speed  between  the individual wheels, the gear selected and the accelerator position.

    The main advantages of electro-mechanical control over an electro-hydraulic system relate to more refined driving dynamics – primarily due to the significantly faster response and speed-independent actuation of the discs over the entire adjustment range.

    As long as ESP® is activated, the 4MATIC+ system stays in "Comfort"mode. As soon as the driver presses the "ESP® SPORT Handling"or "ESP® OFF"button, the 4MATIC+ system switches to "Sport"mode – for even more agile handling and even higher stability limits.

    Five driving programs: vehicle characteristics with a wide spread

    The five AMG DYNAMIC SELECT drive programs "Slippery,""Comfort,""Sport,""Sport +"and "Individual"enable a wide range of vehicle characteristics from comfortable to dynamic. They change relevant parameters, such as the responsiveness of the engine and transmission.

    The new "Slippery"drive program is optimized for low-grip, icy road conditions, with reduced power and a flat torque curve. Smooth gear changes and earlier upshifts support a more stable driving character.

    The "Comfort"program stands for comfortable and fuel-efficient driving, for example, thanks to early upshifts. Suspension and steering are set up for an emphasis on comfort.

    "Sport"and "Sport+"place the focus on agility and driving pleasure with sporty engine and transmission tuning. The sound of the  turbo  engine  is  more striking. "Sport+"is particularly exciting with double-declutching during downshifts and partial cylinder cut-off via a brief and precisely defined retardation of ignition and injection at full load.

    The "Individual"drive program enables specific parameters to be selected and saved according to personal preferences. In addition, the gliding function is available in the "Reduced"and "Moderate"drive settings.

    AMG DYNAMICS: more agility with high stability

    As a new feature in the AMG DYNAMIC SELECT drive programs, the new CLA 35 comes with AMG DYNAMICS. This integrated dynamic handling control system extends the stabilizing functions of ESP® with responsive interventions according to the driver's wishes. During dynamic cornering, imperceptible braking intervention on the rear inside wheel creates a defined yawing moment about the vertical axis. The effect: the CLA 35 steers quickly and very precisely.

    The different modes of AMG DYNAMICS are called "Basic"and "Advanced."When a drive program is selected on the multimedia display, the new AMG DYNAMICS symbol is displayed with the corresponding additional information.

    • "Basic"is assigned to the "Slippery"and "Comfort"drive programs. In this case, the CLA 35 shows very stable handling with a high damping of the yaw rate.
    • "Advanced"is activated in the programs "Sport"and "Sport+."The CLA 35 remains neutrally balanced. The lower yaw damping, lower steering angle requirement and enhanced agility support dynamic maneuvers, such as driving on winding country roads.

    In the "Individual"drive program the driver can set the AMG DYNAMICS levels individually.

    AMG RIDE CONTROL suspension

    The layout of the AMG RIDE CONTROL suspension provides solid straight-line stability and highly dynamic cornering performance. The longitudinal and transverse dynamics are optimally coordinated.

    A McPherson strut construction is fitted on the front axle. The suspension is comprised of one wishbone below the wheel center, one spring strut and one tie rod. The special axle geometry reduces the influence of the drive on the steering – for high comfort and agile handling. The new wishbone in aluminum reduces unsprung mass, enabling a more sensitive response from the springs. The AMG-specific front steering knuckle has a radially bolted brake calliper – a technology originating from motorsport.

    The 4-link rear axle is connected with the body via a subframe. Three transverse arms and the trailing arm, the wheel carrier and the bearings from the proven A 45 are used on each rear wheel. This ensures maximum driving stability and agility.

    Adaptive damping system with three modes

    The optional Adaptive Damping System enables the driver to choose between three different suspension control modes. The spectrum ranges from comfort- focused to sporty. The system operates fully automatically, adapting the damping forces for each wheel according to the driving situation and road conditions. This happens within milliseconds and is infinitely variable, with a wide spread of damping characteristics. The result is that ride comfort and agility are both enhanced.

    Robust high-performance brake system

    The high-performance braking system enables fade-resistant deceleration and short braking distances. The front axle is fitted with new 4-piston monoblock fixed callipers and 13.8 inch brake discs, while the rear axle is equipped with 1-piston sliding callipers and 13.0 inch brake discs. The discs are ventilated   and perforated to dissipate heat and reduce brake fading, even with heavy use. The silver-painted brake callipers have black AMG lettering.

    Steering with special rack and variable ratio

    The speed-sensitive, electro-mechanical power steering supports a sporty driving style with its direct turn-in ability. It has a special rack with variable ratio and two characteristic curves: depending on the drive program the driver has selected, it provides taut and sporty or more comfortable steering feedback. The rigid mounting in the integral carrier connects the steering with the body and thus increases steering precision.

    AMG exhaust system with exhaust flap for sound modulation

    The exhaust system features an automatically controlled exhaust flap as standard. Depending on the drive program selected, it modulates the sound from balanced to powerful.

    AMG TRACK PACE data log

    AMG TRACK PACE is also available as an option for the new CLA 35. The virtual race engineer is part of the MBUX infotainment system and permanently records more than 80 vehicle-specific data measures (e.g. speed, acceleration). On top of this, lap and sector times are displayed, as well as the respective difference to a reference time. Because specific display elements are shown in green or red, the driver is able to see at a glance without reading numbers whether they are currently faster or slower than the best time.

    After putting in some fast laps, the driver can use the data to analyze and, if necessary, improve their driving skills. In addition, acceleration and deceleration values (e.g. 0-60 mph, ¼ mile, 60-0 mph) can be measured and saved. Thanks to a newly developed algorithm which determines the vehicle position as precisely as possible, AMG TRACK PACE even detects when the track has been left or if it has been shortened. This is possible using GPS data as well as the sensors available in the vehicle (acceleration, gyroscope, steering angle, wheel speeds).

    The logged data is displayed on the multimedia display, in the instrument cluster and on the optional head-up display. Well-known racetracks like, for example, the Nürburgring or Spa Francorchamps, are already stored.
    Furthermore, it is also possible to record one's own circuits. The map display can be switched from 2D to 3D and be updated online.

    The MBUX Augmented Reality function also allows the ideal line of a stored racetrack to be displayed on the multimedia display or on the optional head-up display, allowing the driver to improve lap times with a virtual instructor on board.

    World premiere and market launch

    The new Mercedes-AMG CLA 35 celebrates its world premiere as part of the New York International Auto Show on April 16, 2019 and will be available in U.S. dealerships starting late 2019.

    Data at a glance

     

    2020 Mercedes-AMG CLA 35

    Engine

    2.0L Inline-4 turbo

    Displacement

    1991 cc

    Max. output

    302 hp at 5800 rpm

    Peak torque

    295 lb-ft at 3000-4000 rpm

    Drive system

    AMG 4MATIC+ all-wheel drive

    Transmission

    AMG SPEEDSHIFT DCT 7-Speed Transmission

    Acceleration 0-60 mph

    4.6 s est

    Top speed

    TBA*

    * electronically limited

    User Feedback

    Recommended Comments



    What GM needs is a "high output" version of the 2.7T 4-cylinder. A simple G25-550, or like sized turbo, with air-to-water intercooling will effortlessly make 420 hp @ ~ 5300 rpm and 420 lb-ft @ ~2200 to ~5200 rpm. That, for all intents and purposes, is enough. Boost levels will be no higher than on the LTG. Compression will be in the 9.0~9.5:1 range. It'll be perfect for the CT4-V, the Camaro or any of the crossover V or SS trim cars.

    If you don't mind some extra lag (like you'll find on the AMG M133 2.0T engine) you can easily make about 480 hp @ ~5500 rpm and 500 lb-ft @ ~3500 rpm. Same turbo and CR, but more boost. We are not even straddling the line here... the turbo itself is capable of supporting about 550 hp with low enough compression and if you don't care about linearity.

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    On 4/11/2019 at 12:54 PM, Drew Dowdell said:

    I dunno... even 6-speed to 6-speed between the Regal and the prior generation Lacrosse, the LaX was just giant a rocketship.  I'll give you that the Pentastar is probably smoother, but in terms of big cruisers, a LaX and 300C are pretty dern close in capability and comfort. 

    I think the pentastar in the Pacifica is a revised version of what might be still in the 300C, but i will check into that.

     

    I will agree, pre-2018, the regal 2.0 was not really as good as the last gen LaCrosse.  I recall driving a LaCrosse in that 2013 time frame where the motor seemed quite zippy.

    9 hours ago, Cmicasa the Great said:

    Why do people always say this? 9X outta 10 they have never driven a 3.6L in GM vehicle. In the Camaro it pushes the RS to 60 in 5 seconds.. in the BLAZER.. 6 seconds. This is me in a CT6 3.6L a few months ago. It in no way felt slow:

     

     

    Blazer i drove recently, despite being quick in numbers had a klunky drivetrain, wasn't smooth, seemed a bit unrefined.  Just not a good time.  then i drove a Ct6 3.6 and it was smooth as glass.  I don't get GM.

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    4 minutes ago, regfootball said:

    I think the pentastar in the Pacifica is a revised version of what might be still in the 300C, but i will check into that.

    I will agree, pre-2018, the regal 2.0 was not really as good as the last gen LaCrosse.  I recall driving a LaCrosse in that 2013 time frame where the motor seemed quite zippy.

    The Pentastar is more refined than the LF1, LLT or LFX engines because Pentastars are NOT Direct Injected. It's as simple as that. Direct injection is the biggest step backwards in engine refinement in the last several deecades until the advent of the Start-Stop nonsense.

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    You know, GM could just build engines like Lexus did with its V8 for years:  Port and Direct injection.  GM could also build new pushrod I4 and V6 engines, but doing both would require buying a clue first.  No need to emulate questionable Mercedes Benz engineering.  Horsepower is nice, but torque is a requirement.  Too many DOHCs are weak on torque.

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    12 minutes ago, dwightlooi said:

    The Pentastar is more refined than the LF1, LLT or LFX engines because Pentastars are NOT Direct Injected. It's as simple as that. Direct injection is the biggest step backwards in engine refinement in the last several deecades until the advent of the Start-Stop nonsense.

    http://media.fcanorthamerica.com/newsrelease.do?id=17218&mid=

     

    I have to admit, i had forgotten that the pentastar was still not direct injection.  I know they added EGR for the 2017+ Pacifica.  It accelerates smoothly without fuss and racket.

    The Pacifica 9 speed is good, not great, but it does take advantage of the torque band of the engine fairly well.  I feel like the newer GM's with the 3.6 the powertrain is tuned in a way that just doesn't make the 3.6 feel smooth.  I felt that way with the Regal GS. 

    Edited by regfootball
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    26 minutes ago, riviera74 said:

    You know, GM could just build engines like Lexus did with its V8 for years:  Port and Direct injection.  GM could also build new pushrod I4 and V6 engines, but doing both would require buying a clue first.  No need to emulate questionable Mercedes Benz engineering.  Horsepower is nice, but torque is a requirement.  Too many DOHCs are weak on torque.

    That is more of a cam profile issue than a valve train layout issue. To get high rpm breathing, it is necessary to have high lift and long duration cam grinds. These will have poor aspiration and low intake velocities at lower rpms, and hence reduced low end torque and probably lower peak torque as well. To have high tumble or swirl from high intake velocities, and minimal overlap induced back flow, loss of effective compression or early loss of the power stroke you MUST use a short duration cam grind with low lifts. The means toqur will fall off at high rpms and the engine wont make much power.

    Unless you have a camswitching system or a variable lift system, you can have one or the other or a compromise between the two,, but you cannot have both. Even with switching, there will be a step jump in the engine character when the switching occurs. This is true of pushrod engines and it is true of DOHC 4-valve/5-valve engines.

    The laughable thing which most people don't get is that 2-valves per cylinder is fully capable of supporting the airflow requirements for a power peak at or around 6000 rpm. Any engine that makes its maximum horsepower at or around 6000 rpm -- which includes most Toyota and Honda DOHC engines -- do not their DOHC valve train and do not benefit from the added friction, complexity and cost associated with them. For a DOHC 4-valve cylinder head to serve a useful purpose, the engine must make its peak power at or above about 7000 rpm. Then, and only then, do you need or benefit from the freer flowing DOHC heads.

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    I mean, it's a cool little car, but in typical Mercedes fashion, it will be expensive for what it is. It's coming to the scene with current Golf R power levels, and price tag that is sure to be 5-6K more. Just as the Mk8 Golf in a year's time will see the GTI almost reach this power level, and the R climb to ~350hp. With nigh equal levels of refinement and build quality.

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    2 hours ago, Frisky Dingo said:

    I mean, it's a cool little car, but in typical Mercedes fashion, it will be expensive for what it is. It's coming to the scene with current Golf R power levels, and price tag that is sure to be 5-6K more. Just as the Mk8 Golf in a year's time will see the GTI almost reach this power level, and the R climb to ~350hp. With nigh equal levels of refinement and build quality.

    Well, Mercedes has a lot more brand kudos and image than Volkswagen, Most people will pay $6K more to have a Mercedes over a Volkswagen even if both cars have identical performance, equipment and quality. That's reality.

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    On 4/13/2019 at 11:38 AM, dwightlooi said:

    Well, Mercedes has a lot more brand kudos and image than Volkswagen, Most people will pay $6K more to have a Mercedes over a Volkswagen even if both cars have identical performance, equipment and quality. That's reality.

     

    Actually, in this segment- hot hatches/sport compacts- I think you'd be surprised how many won't. 

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    13 minutes ago, Frisky Dingo said:

     

    Actually, in this segment- hot hatches/sport compacts- I think you'd be surprised how many won't. 

    Badge snobs will be badge snobs and pay even though they could get a superior auto for less from another OEM. With that said, you are right, I do believe many will look at the MB offer and then at others and go with others.

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    1 minute ago, dfelt said:

    Badge snobs will be badge snobs and pay even though they could get a superior auto for less from another OEM. With that said, you are right, I do believe many will look at the MB offer and then at others and go with others.

    Badge snobs will be badge snobs, but badge snobs don't buy hatchbacks. This sedan might do ok, just because it's 'conventional'. 

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    47 minutes ago, Frisky Dingo said:

    Badge snobs will be badge snobs, but badge snobs don't buy hatchbacks. This sedan might do ok, just because it's 'conventional'. 

    That might be true here in the US, but seems to be a very different thing in the Asian rim as well as Europe.

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    1 hour ago, Frisky Dingo said:

    Badge snobs will be badge snobs, but badge snobs don't buy hatchbacks. This sedan might do ok, just because it's 'conventional'. 

    You can call them that, but I will call them "STATUS REALISTS". The same kind of people who buy a Rolex never mind that watches costing 1/10th as much often have as good a movement or finish. They are realists because (1) a Rolex is recognizable by everyone and that is half the reason to spend $10K on a stainless steel watch, and (2) a Rolex actually GOES UP IN VALUE year after year. They are the same kind of realists who will buy a home with a hole in the roof and mold in the walls BECAUSE OF THE ZIP CODE. It is you who is arrogant and ignorant when you think that people do not, or should not, buy a car (or anything) based on the prestige and status its badge confers.

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    8 minutes ago, dwightlooi said:

    The same kind of people who buy a Rolex never mind that watches costing 1/10th as much often have as good a movement or finish.

    Those mass produced movements aren't near as high quality as an in-house movement from a company like Rolex. They also don't hold their value whereas there are plenty of Rolexes in high enough demand you can pay MSRP and make money off them. Those 1/10th priced watches lose 75% of their value as soon as you look at it. 

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    Watches are interesting as jewelry, but have no purpose in the era of cell phones...haven't worn one in at least 10 years...though I have a few.  With dead batteries. 

    Edited by Robert Hall
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    18 minutes ago, ccap41 said:

    Those mass produced movements aren't near as high quality as an in-house movement from a company like Rolex. They also don't hold their value whereas there are plenty of Rolexes in high enough demand you can pay MSRP and make money off them. Those 1/10th priced watches lose 75% of their value as soon as you look at it. 

    LOL... The first Rolex Daytona is basically a Zenith movement. Also, a well regulated ETA-2892-A2 will perform as well as any Rolex 3100-series and was used in everything from IWCs to Omegas to Breguets to a gazillion independents. Rolex doesn't even really "finish" their movements since they don't use glass backs and didn't think it matters. The only reason so many "high end" makers do their own movements these days is because Swatch Group is refusing to sell them their ETA movements. In house movements are more expensive but they are frequently less reliable and less accurate than proven, mass produced, calibers from ETA. For in-house movements to actually be better you'll need to be spending 20K or more.

    Anyway, that's besides the point. The point is that irrespective of any of that, BRANDS and the PRESTIGE AND STATUS associated with them MATTERS A LOT. That is true of all tertiary goods including but not limited to cars. Realists understand that and pay for that.

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    55 minutes ago, dwightlooi said:

    You can call them that, but I will call them "STATUS REALISTS". The same kind of people who buy a Rolex never mind that watches costing 1/10th as much often have as good a movement or finish. They are realists because (1) a Rolex is recognizable by everyone and that is half the reason to spend $10K on a stainless steel watch, and (2) a Rolex actually GOES UP IN VALUE year after year. They are the same kind of realists who will buy a home with a hole in the roof and mold in the walls BECAUSE OF THE ZIP CODE. It is you who is arrogant and ignorant when you think that people do not, or should not, buy a car (or anything) based on the prestige and status its badge confers.

     

    Not as ignorant and arrogant that you think you know more on this subject in regards to automobiles and a given market segment than I do. You know, since I am actually in the car business and all, and you write articles. 😉

    47 minutes ago, ccap41 said:

    Those mass produced movements aren't near as high quality as an in-house movement from a company like Rolex. They also don't hold their value whereas there are plenty of Rolexes in high enough demand you can pay MSRP and make money off them. Those 1/10th priced watches lose 75% of their value as soon as you look at it. 

    Yeah, I wasn't even going to touch the absurdity that is the rest of his argument. Comparing cars in general to watches or home values. 🙄

     

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    8 minutes ago, Frisky Dingo said:

    Yeah, I wasn't even going to touch the absurdity that is the rest of his argument. Comparing cars in general to watches or home values. 🙄

    Yeah, depreciating asset vs maintaining/appreciating in value.. 

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    Some people aspire to own (or at least lease) a Mercedes Benz to impress their friends and neighbors and co-workers and their clients.  The rest of us need not indulge and will get the best for what we can afford.  The truly wealthy rarely (if ever) buy a Mercedes Benz, let alone a Bentley or a Rolls-Royce.

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    ^ I don't think that last statement is accurate, but 'truly wealthy' would need definition.
    I have a number of clients I would put into that basket, and tho there is no 'automatic' vehicle class choice tethered to wealth, my observation is that it skews heavily toward 'luxury brands' (mostly BMW tho).

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    1 hour ago, balthazar said:

    ^ I don't think that last statement is accurate, but 'truly wealthy' would need definition.
    I have a number of clients I would put into that basket, and tho there is no 'automatic' vehicle class choice tethered to wealth, my observation is that it skews heavily toward 'luxury brands' (mostly BMW tho).

    Truly wealthy would be somebody listed in the Forbes 400.  Or at least could get there.

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    4 hours ago, riviera74 said:

    Truly wealthy would be somebody listed in the Forbes 400.  Or at least could get there.

    Let's just say Mercedes, BMW, Audi and Lexus have 99% of the market share of the top 1%.

    To be in the top 1% you need to be making $421K a year in family income -- which is really not that much. That is about what you need to make to buy a home in California and still have money for a car... with a 1200 sq-ft 50 year old single family home in a middle income neighborhood pushing $1.7 million and taxes pushing 40% (State/Fed combined)... LOL!

    Edited by dwightlooi
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    The problem I have with the A, CLA, GLA, is that they are "fake" Mercedes. They aren't the real thing.  C-Class at minimum to get a real Benz.  Same goes for the X2 over at BMW.... It's just a Mini-Cooper in BMW guise. 

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    6 minutes ago, Drew Dowdell said:

    The problem I have with the A, CLA, GLA, is that they are "fake" Mercedes. They aren't the real thing.  C-Class at minimum to get a real Benz.  Same goes for the X2 over at BMW.... It's just a Mini-Cooper in BMW guise. 

    Yes, 'fake' because of the generic FWD/AWD transverse engine platforms.  'Real' M-Bs and BMWs are on proper RWD platforms.

    Edited by Robert Hall
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    Just now, Robert Hall said:

    Yes, 'fake' because of the low, common FWD/AWD transverse engine platforms.  'Real' M-Bs and BMWs are on proper RWD platforms.

    It's not just that. They simply don't feel as well built, as nice materials. Not what I expect with a Merc badge.  They feel like what they are... economy Euro cars with a fancy badge.  You'd be just as well getting a Jetta. It even comes with the big screen cockpit display if you want. 

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    13 minutes ago, Drew Dowdell said:

    It's not just that. They simply don't feel as well built, as nice materials. Not what I expect with a Merc badge.  They feel like what they are... economy Euro cars with a fancy badge.  You'd be just as well getting a Jetta. It even comes with the big screen cockpit display if you want. 

    Building to a price point no doubt resulted in cheapening of materials.   

    Edited by Robert Hall
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