Lexus GX 460 Gets a Face..... Lift?

3 minutes ago, surreal1272 said:

And SMK will use the “old isn’t reliable” remark as long as it can’t be used against Mercedes. See how that works while you whine about “hypocrisy”. LMAO that you even went there. The fact is, and this has been pointed out my multiple people here, is that the average Lexus buyer isn’t as concerned about horsepower as much as they are reliability. You and SMK have sidestepped that little face throughout this whole thread while trying to pick apart everyone else or just move the bar entirely. Boo freakin hoo. 

Lexus (overall as a brand) makes the most reliable cars compared to any other brand.  They are the reliability champion, no one does it better.  That has little to do the dated ass engine in the GX, because the LS, LC, NX and RX Hybrid are reliable and they have newer engines.    The Avalon, errrr ES350 has a newer engine.   

And Lexus buyers DO care about fuel economy, as Toyota preaches fuel economy until the cows come home.  The GX460 has awful fuel economy, and the fact they haven't really updated GX since like 2003 other than some front facia revisions is embarrassing.  I gave Toyota the Finger of Shame for not making the Tundra more competitive, this is another Finger of Shame to Toyota for letting this monstrosity go on sale.  

And you probably think the GX460 is better than the XT6 because the GX is more reliable and has "V8 power."

Since when did talking about a Lexus product become soooo....passionate?

1 minute ago, oldshurst442 said:

 

Since when did talking about a Lexus product become soooo....passionate?

 

Ever since the Passionate Pursuit of Perfection.

22 minutes ago, surreal1272 said:

And SMK will use the “old isn’t reliable” remark as long as it can’t be used against Mercedes. See how that works while you whine about “hypocrisy”. LMAO that you even went there. The fact is, and this has been pointed out my multiple people here, is that the average Lexus buyer isn’t as concerned about horsepower as much as they are reliability. You and SMK have sidestepped that little face throughout this whole thread while trying to pick apart everyone else or just move the bar entirely. Boo freakin hoo. 

“Fact” not “face”. Good grief autocorrect and fat thumbs lol! 

1 minute ago, smk4565 said:

Ever since the Passionate Pursuit of Perfection.

Not with that drivetrain...

But...ya'll gotta admit.  The average Lexus owner does not care about that stuff.

While the drivetrain is antiquated, the average Lexus owner believes in this mantra:  "If it aint broke, dont fix it."

Reliable?  I dont know enough about Toyota SUV products to comment on that.  But I do know that there are certain SUVs from Toyota that are bullet proof.  

Again...the same mantra goes for reliability regarding Lexus owners:  "If it aint broke, dont fix it."

So...while we can argue about passionately about Lexus products...their business model is passionless...and it works just fine for them.

What I find Lexus is missing the mark, is they want to infuse a little bit of passion in their designs and Predator Face just falls flat... 

18 minutes ago, smk4565 said:

Lexus (overall as a brand) makes the most reliable cars compared to any other brand.  They are the reliability champion, no one does it better.  That has little to do the dated ass engine in the GX, because the LS, LC, NX and RX Hybrid are reliable and they have newer engines.    The Avalon, errrr ES350 has a newer engine.   

And Lexus buyers DO care about fuel economy, as Toyota preaches fuel economy until the cows come home.  The GX460 has awful fuel economy, and the fact they haven't really updated GX since like 2003 other than some front facia revisions is embarrassing.  I gave Toyota the Finger of Shame for not making the Tundra more competitive, this is another Finger of Shame to Toyota for letting this monstrosity go on sale.  

And you probably think the GX460 is better than the XT6 because the GX is more reliable and has "V8 power."

Yet you sidestepped that whole reliability part at the beginning with your “old isn’t reliable” remark which is what I pointed out from the get go. Only today have you actually acknowledged what everyone else already knew. 

And I don’t think anything in the slightest as far those two are concerned other than, once again, the GX is probably the more reliable of the two. Your assumptions here are unfounded nonsense. 

And, errrr, the GX shares its bones with the 4 Runner which explains why its doesn’t have a newer engine unlike the much newer CUVs mentioned. Duh. They did change the engine from the 4.7 to the 4.6 so you are not correct on your “since 2003” remark which means that they changed it about as often as Mercedes changed the G-Wagon. 

A some folks cry about hypocrisy. 

1 hour ago, surreal1272 said:

Yet you sidestepped that whole reliability part at the beginning with your “old isn’t reliable” remark which is what I pointed out from the get go. Only today have you actually acknowledged what everyone else already knew. 

 

And I don’t think anything in the slightest as far those two are concerned other than, once again, the GX is probably the more reliable of the two. Your assumptions here are unfounded nonsense. 

 

And, errrr, the GX shares its bones with the 4 Runner which explains why its doesn’t have a newer engine unlike the much newer CUVs mentioned. Duh. They did change the engine from the 4.7 to the 4.6 so you are not correct on your “since 2003” remark which means that they changed it about as often as Mercedes changed the G-Wagon. 

 

A some folks cry about hypocrisy. 

Old doesn't make it reliable.  How is a GX more reliable than an RX350 or ES350?

That 4.7 was from the 90s Tundra I think.  Even that 4.6 V8 was dated when it launched, it was among the least powerful V8s in the luxury segment in 2009 and 10 years later they are still making it.

The G-wagen used 3 V8's (not counting AMG) from 2006 to 2017.  That is why it made 302 hp in 2006 and 416 in 2016.And the G-wagen hit an all time sales record in 2016 and beat that record in 2017 and I believe is the #1 selling vehicle over $125,000.  When the Lexus GX has rising sales and is #1  selling vehicle over $50,000 then I will give them a pass on crap engines.

Yet the G-Wagon was the one that had mismatched screws on the auto show floor.Poor fit n finish, Yea, that is what I would expect from a $100,000 plus SUV. 🙄

I love how many people here mentioned "average Lexus owner"

I guess most people buying Lexus are looking for somewhat luxurious and reliable transportation with the an image that is at least somewhat a step up from the "common" brands.

But I have to say 99.9% of people I know buying the German big three, doing so ONLY because of the LOGO on the front of the car.  Most of them could care less, which wheel drive their car/crossover has, is it turbo four or six or eight cylinder, how much torque the engine has and at what RPM, etc.  They only care about the BADGE and the perceived STATUS.  And people who can't afford to buy these German brands but would like to, only desire to have the BADGE.

We can argue here for another 10 pages about engines and locking differentials but honestly 99% of people could care less.

1 hour ago, ykX said:

I love how many people here mentioned "average Lexus owner"

I guess most people buying Lexus are looking for somewhat luxurious and reliable transportation with the an image that is at least somewhat a step up from the "common" brands.

But I have to say 99.9% of people I know buying the German big three, doing so ONLY because of the LOGO on the front of the car.  Most of them could care less, which wheel drive their car/crossover has, is it turbo four or six or eight cylinder, how much torque the engine has and at what RPM, etc.  They only care about the BADGE and the perceived STATUS.  And people who can't afford to buy these German brands but would like to, only desire to have the BADGE.

We can argue here for another 10 pages about engines and locking differentials but honestly 99% of people could care less.

All that you said above...is a big...

YUP!!!

The thing is...( warning: anecdote up ahead)

I too, talk to Toyoya/Lexus owners.

"Reliability" and how "reliable" their cars are ALWAYS comes up when they talk about their Toyotas and Lexuses. 

They almost always never talk about powertrain numbers, but how smooth and "reliable" their engines run.

They talk about how quiet Lexus cars are.  The driving wheels almost never comes up in the conversations. Most Quebec drivers are concerned not to get "stuck" in the winter (in the snow).  So Im guessing the Lexus salespeople push Lexus CUVs and AWD unto those folk...

When I talk to German car owners...

Engineering comes up.

Although some of them dont care about horsepower and torque and all that, most of them ARE knowledgeable and seem to want to have more of that then the next guy...

Its true, some of them dont know the difference between  AWD and 4 wheel drive.  But most of them DO want AWD instead of RWD so they do NOT get "stuck" in the winter.   German car owners, save for maybe the Audi folk, do know that RWD is standard on their cars. They are aware...

So...in MY experiences talking to different people,  most Quebecois are like Lexus owners, and are like you said

1 hour ago, ykX said:

We can argue here for another 10 pages about engines and locking differentials but honestly 99% of people could care less.

But...

When talking to German car owners, in MY experience in Montreal, they are like you said...

1 hour ago, ykX said:

They only care about the BADGE and the perceived STATUS.  And people who can't afford to buy these German brands but would like to, only desire to have the BADGE.

However, they tend to be more knowledgeable and aware about different stats and they DO care about them. 

A cut above the rest being the enthusiast car owners. the Mustang, Corvette, and Camaro, Porsche, Tesla, AMG, M from BMW, S from Audi, Subaru, Mazda guys...etc.

Yes...Subaru and Mazda guys, in Quebec, are very keen about performance stats...

German car guys, for the most part,  (The AMG, M and S owners) DO want their cars to outperform the competition.

The 3 Series/5 Series, C Class/E Class Audi A3/A4  regular trimmed owners, and the CUV people from those makes even if those CUVs are AMG, M and S,  are clueless just like the 99% of the population...including the Lexus car owners. 

This is the difference between Lexus and Audi/Mercedes/BMW...is that with the German manufacturers, there is a subset of owners that are aware and are enthusiasts and horsepower and the latest tech IS important to them. 

Subaru guys are enthusiasts because of AWD.

Mazda guys are enthusiasts because Mazda cars ARE more fun to drive then the mundane appliances that GM/Ford/Honda/Toyota sell us...

THIS is my take on it... 

@oldshurst442 Your experience differs from mine.  Everyone I know who owns German cars (except high performance versions) or desires one only care about the badge and the prestige.  Lexus is for people who want luxury, badge but still want to have reliability of their Camry they started with.

I think people that buy M and Audi's RS cars in majority are knowledgeable and enthusiastic, however from what I have seen majority of AMG owners buy AMG only because it is the most expensive and powerful Merc they can get, and most of them are pompous asses

12 hours ago, dfelt said:

Yet the G-Wagon was the one that had mismatched screws on the auto show floor.Poor fit n finish, Yea, that is what I would expect from a $100,000 plus SUV. 🙄

People buying them obviously don't care just like GX owners don't care about anything about their vehicle, just reliability, apparently. 

8 minutes ago, ykX said:

@oldshurst442 Your experience differs from mine.  Everyone I know who owns German cars (except high performance versions) or desires one only care about the badge and the prestige.  Lexus is for people who want luxury, badge but still want to have reliability of their Camry they started with.

I think people that buy M and Audi's RS cars in majority are knowledgeable and enthusiastic, however from what I have seen majority of AMG owners buy AMG only because it is the most expensive and powerful Merc they can get, and most of them are pompous asses

I would have to agree that what you have experienced is what I have experienced. Only difference is that all the German performance fans seem to be pompous Asses and while knowledgeable to a point worry more about the badge and how people see them.

2 minutes ago, ccap41 said:

People buying them obviously don't care just like GX owners don't care about anything about their vehicle, just reliability, apparently. 

So True, the Kardashians could care less about anything of reality other than the Badge and if your looking at them and their big butt!  

AMG and M have both been watered down by making them mid-level trim packages. 

Anyway, back to the GX.  I see this just and an "old money" purchase for people who just want another Lexus SUV that can go anywhere. 

Random GX anecdote..a Swiss friend in Denver back in the mid 00s had an Envoy XL and his wife a GX as family trawlers...their kids were infants then.  The Envoy is long gone, they still have the GX with over 350k miles now.  (they now have teenagers, and have a late model Escalade and Volvo XC90 now). 

1 hour ago, Robert Hall said:

Random GX anecdote..a Swiss friend in Denver back in the mid 00s had an Envoy XL and his wife a GX as family trawlers...their kids were infants then.  The Envoy is long gone, they still have the GX with over 350k miles now.  (they now have teenagers, and have a late model Escalade and Volvo XC90 now). 

Some people don’t see that though. All they see is a SUV that uses an “ancient” powertrain and doesn’t get 30 MPGs everyday. They have a hard time fathoming that some folks actually don’t care as long their SUV is trouble free. 

2 hours ago, ccap41 said:

People buying them obviously don't care just like GX owners don't care about anything about their vehicle, just reliability, apparently. 

Yeah who would have thought that reliability was such a big deal for some folks. I mean who wouldn’t want to have all the great new tech that ends up needing unnecessary service but $h! breaks. We are only talking about a formula that has worked for Toyota and Lexus for three decades now. 

I guess everything new they're pumping out must be unreliable.. Lexus/Toyota couldn't possibly make a replacement as reliable. 

36 minutes ago, surreal1272 said:

Some people don’t see that though. All they see is a SUV that uses an “ancient” powertrain and doesn’t get 30 MPGs everyday. They have a hard time fathoming that some folks actually don’t care as long their SUV is trouble free.  

I like reliability, but couldn't imagine 30 mpg with a SUV... I'm content getting 20 or 25 on a road trip. 

24 minutes ago, Robert Hall said:

I like reliability, but couldn't imagine 30 mpg with a SUV... I'm content getting 20 or 25 on a road trip. 

The “30 mpg” remark was meant as a joke because the way some have complained on here you’d think that was the new norm with CUVs and SUVs. 

34 minutes ago, ccap41 said:

I guess everything new they're pumping out must be unreliable.. Lexus/Toyota couldn't possibly make a replacement as reliable. 

No ccap. It’s just not always necessary. What you also have not considered that clearly the GX is not a high priority right now for Lexus. Their core market clearly prefers car based CUVs. However, that does not take away from the fact that this ancient model is still very reliable and fills a certain niche even though it is butt ugly. The looks are clearly the big issue here because their sales are weak while it’s 4Runner platform twin still sells like hot cakes and it is running on a similar ancient powertrain (just in V6 form). Trying to sell at as an off-road champ hurts it as well but most Lexus buyers just aren’t into that kind of thing and those that are would probably just opt for a loaded and proven 4 Runner. This was made clear from the get go but you took it a completely different route while you so busy defending SMK. 

Why worry about buying new when https://cartoys.com/ can get you that backup camera, Android / Apple Play Radio system much cheaper than a new auto would cost.

16 minutes ago, surreal1272 said:

The “30 mpg” remark was meant as a joke because the way some have complained on here you’d think that was the new norm with CUVs and SUVs. 

Heh-heh..I haven't seen over 30 mpg in 30 years, since I drove a diesel Ford Escort that got 55 mpg.    20-25 is more than enough for me. 

5 minutes ago, dfelt said:

Why worry about buying new when https://cartoys.com/ can get you that backup camera, Android / Apple Play Radio system much cheaper than a new auto would cost.

I have the backup camera, but would like Android/Apple Play though.  

6 minutes ago, dfelt said:

Why worry about buying new when https://cartoys.com/ can get you that backup camera, Android / Apple Play Radio system much cheaper than a new auto would cost.

But but, that gas mileage! What about the gas mileage dfelt? It’s 2019!

LMAO!

2 minutes ago, Robert Hall said:

Heh-heh..I haven't seen over 30 mpg in 30 years, since I drove a diesel Ford Escort that got 55 mpg.    20-25 is more than enough for me. 

 

I have the backup camera, but would like Android/Apple Play though.  

Yeah the last car I had with great MPGs was my first new car which was a ‘92 Tercel. Got mid 30s in town and about 45 mpg on the freeway. 

2 minutes ago, surreal1272 said:

But but, that gas mileage! What about the gas mileage dfelt? It’s 2019!

 

LMAO!

If I worried about gas mileage, I would not own all SUV's that guzzle it!

Maybe my next new one will be an EV Cadillac if it is done right. Right now leaning towards Rivian.

My 1.4T Encore barely gets over 30mpg