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On 11/27/2020 at 7:48 AM, A Horse With No Name said:

....and an advanced 4WD system could help you navagate Michigan's notoriously $h!ty roads. I always know when I go from Ohio to Michigan, because the pavement looks like something one would find in a bombed out jungle in Laos or a dirt path one would find in Tibet. 

Apparently Michigan has as much trouble playing football as they do maintaining roads, as Michigan is really having an off year. I say this not to run you or Michigan down, but because I want big ten football to stand up and represent. I normally cheer for any big ten team over any non big ten team, exept for Penn State, because I despise Penn State football. 

We judge/compete with Penn State in debate, and every time I write a win for a pen state debater, I hAve to remind the students that jsut because they won the round....it doesn't mean I like their football team.

Then again an Ox and Cart might be cheaper, and you wouldn't have to put up with the inevitable C and G electric vs. ICE debate. You would have your own alternative fuel powertrain!

Hope you had a Great thanksgiving. 

 

I did, hope you did as well.

Yeah, and when I cross into Ohio (either on 75 or 23) the roads become much, much better. Bunch of construction though! I had to get each one of the tires on my Cobalt repaired last winter....that was pretty nuts!

Seems Michigan as no defense at all this year. Can’t stop it in the air or the run. Same issue as the Lions it seems. I get the feeling it will get worse. Also found that our QB is playing hurt....but still.....

Milwaukee, 1936 :

10 minutes ago, balthazar said:

Kokomo IN, 1952 :

Love the fastback style of the car on the far left. Awesome old pictures.

Kokomo IN, 1952 :

This is actually one of the better ones you have posted up. I loved the precision driving and the photography. Plus I am a sucker for black cars...esp a black Olds.

Explosion....

1 hour ago, balthazar said:

Sure, but obviously 20 internal combustion engines operated by 20 operators over 10 years may involve a 1000 variables all affecting those outcomes. I expect all 20 -sans accidents- to still be operating. This, tho the OEM only basically guarantees it to work for 3 years.

I was merely saying that in the most stress-less scenario like I outlined, a L-I battery should be able to perform to it's maximum potential & advertised lifespan. Or at least 90% of that. It's a controlled demonstration cycle.

And battery life is a huge concern. Would actually love to own a model 3 but if you ever have to replace a battery pack...yowzers.

And yeah...I have replaced a bunch of those detectors that didn't last ten years 

1 hour ago, A Horse With No Name said:

Point is made though. Although I bet if you pulled the history of the ten Rangers built right before mine and the ten Rangers built right after mine...and did it in ten years...there would be a wide wide variety of natural life spans for that Ecoboost four cylinder motor.

Sure, but obviously 20 internal combustion engines operated by 20 operators over 10 years may involve a 1000 variables all affecting those outcomes. I expect all 20 -sans accidents- to still be operating. This, tho the OEM only basically guarantees it to work for 3 years.

I was merely saying that in the most stress-less scenario like I outlined, a L-I battery should be able to perform to it's maximum potential & advertised lifespan. Or at least 90% of that. It's a controlled demonstration cycle.

Don't do it

Huge difference between a four dollar nine volt battery and a twenty thousand dollar Tesla battery.

Point is made though. Although I bet if you pulled the history of the ten Rangers built right before mine and the ten Rangers built right after mine...and did it in ten years...there would be a wide wide variety of natural life spans for that Ecoboost four cylinder motor.

18 minutes ago, balthazar said:

No 9V replaceable batteries are sold with a claimed 10-yr operating lifespan.

This is why I only use internal combustion smoke detectors in my home. Those extra pipes through my roof aren't vent stacks for plumbing they are exhaust stacks for the detectors.

Getting a little tired of running around the house with a small oil can trying to keep them fueled.

23 hours ago, oldshurst442 said:

 

Canadians are awesome

2 hours ago, oldshurst442 said:

I know.  The guys are from Ontario somewheres.  I dont know where in Ontario as I dont follow them. But I have listened to quite a few of their reviews.  On my own or linked videos from posters at CheersandGears much like how you have posted this video.  And I appreciate your content, BTW.  

But I cant help  being  giddy when I see anything from Quebec on video content. Especially on a global level like this.  These guys are pretty popular regarding car reviews I take it.  I understand that the Escalade was registered and insured in Quebec hence the plates.  There is a however though...    Every time I visit the States, I soooooo do NOT want to see other Quebec license plates near me.  I wanna get away from them. LOL  Hence me traveling outside of Quebec for vacation...

I feel the same way about Ohio.

On 11/27/2020 at 6:31 PM, balthazar said:

...this sealed lithium battery unit...

No 9V replaceable batteries are sold with a claimed 10-yr operating lifespan.

I have seen from name brand 9V to generic 9V batteries live a wide range of life. For smoke detectors, habit is every XMAS, Replace the 9V no matter what to insure it is fresh and strong. Cheap insurance I think that way.

^ Agreed, but I have seen this commonly with detectors and LED (and CFL) bulbs. Enough to determine it’s likely not an anomaly. 
 

Good deal on BEV certification; that’s as it should be.

5 hours ago, A Horse With No Name said:

These reviews are done by Canadian folk.

I know.  The guys are from Ontario somewheres.  I dont know where in Ontario as I dont follow them. But I have listened to quite a few of their reviews.  On my own or linked videos from posters at CheersandGears much like how you have posted this video.  And I appreciate your content, BTW.  

But I cant help  being  giddy when I see anything from Quebec on video content. Especially on a global level like this.  These guys are pretty popular regarding car reviews I take it.  I understand that the Escalade was registered and insured in Quebec hence the plates.  There is a however though...    Every time I visit the States, I soooooo do NOT want to see other Quebec license plates near me.  I wanna get away from them. LOL  Hence me traveling outside of Quebec for vacation...

1 hour ago, balthazar said:

It was a battery-ONLY unit; power grid fluctuations are irrelevant.

Okay. That clarifies that. My last one was hard wired with a lithium battery backup. Ran for six years before I moved back to NC. One thing to consider is the maker of said smoke detector and who sources their batteries. Thing is that all of that irrelevant because EV batteries will have a unified standard applied (if not already) unlike smoke detector batteries. There will be more reliable and consistent references and guides for this. Smoke detector batteries will not be subject to the same standards. Your one example doesn't mean there is a widespread issue either without more research.

My example is an extremely-controlled test. No recharges, no ambient temp changes, no power grid connection, designed/spec’d by segment-leading manufacturer for that unit.

Only reached 67% of claimed battery life.
 

I can’t imagine many factors of EV use that would significantly extend the advertised claims; there are more that would lower it than extend it.

4 hours ago, balthazar said:

No- they don't "affect" real world usage, but they give one a window of expectation. It's generally a median.

My question is; are battery ratings a median or a maximum... sometimes?

Why doesn't a sealed, constant-draw battery meet it's claimed lifespan? Why doesn't a minimum-draw LED bulb meet it's? IS it a lack of certification to get these claims to be more realistic?

Remember when Porsche was dialed back from 400 miles of range to 308? (I think I have those numbers right) - Porsche's internal testing / planned marketing was pulled back from the unrealistic.

It is very interesting to see what is posted by leaders of various battery companies.

EV focused writeups on EV battery life, but they seem to deal with the same key details as every other type of battery.

How Long Should An Electric Car’s Battery Last? (myev.com)

Just How Long Will An EV Battery Last? (insideevs.com)

Battery Lifetime: How Long Can Electric Vehicle Batteries Last? (cleantechnica.com)

Electric Car Battery Life, Cost of Replacement, Recycling & Leasing | EDF (edfenergy.com)

From hearing aids to laptop batteries there are a variety of interesting  responses, but the consistent thread I read is that depending on consistency of charging, power surges, extreme use versus a consistent use will all affect battery life.

Course cheaper designed batteries tend to not last as long as higher quality batteries.

Life Expectancy of Unused Batteries Tom Begley Batteries 424 (audiologyonline.com) CEO of Ray o Vac batteries talking about hearing aid batteries.

This is solid from Trip Lite, read for the details, but this is consistent.

1. Ambient Temperature

2. Number of Discharges

3. Age

4. Load Sizing

5. Maintenance

5 Factors that will Shorten the Life of Your UPS Battery (tripplite.com)

APC, one of the worlds largest UPS builders and sellers has the following on their battery for life expectancy.

What is the expected life of my APC UPS battery?

Environment:
All Three Phase and Single Phase UPS Models 


Cause / Resolution:
Most APC batteries should last three to five years. There are many factors which affect Battery life including environment and number of discharges. Below are some guidelines to ensure optimum life expectancy:

1. Operating Temperature: The optimum operating temperature for a lead-acid battery is 20-25° C (68-77° F). Elevated temperature reduces longevity. As a guideline, every 8° C (15° F) rise in temperature will cut the battery life in half. A battery which would last for 4 years at 25° C (77° F), will only be good for 2 years if operated at 33° C (95° F). Keep in mind that the battery temperature inside your UPS will always be warmer than the ambient temperature of the location where the UPS is installed.

2. Battery Calibration and Deep Discharge: Only perform runtime calibrations on your UPS one or two times a year, if necessary. Some of our customers want to check their systems to verify that their runtime is sufficient. However, consistently performing these calibrations can significantly decrease the life expectancy of your APC battery.  It is also important to remember that a UPS is not designed for constant deep discharges. We do not reccomend using your APC Smart-UPS/Back-UPS as a portable power supply that is repeatedly discharged/recharged (like on a portable equipment cart). These units are designed for emergency use during unexpected power outages or momentary loss of power. 

3. Storage: Do not store APC batteries for extended periods of time. New batteries/units should be stored for no more than 6 months from date of purchase, as they ship from the factory at approximately 80% charge. After this period, the battery should be used or it will lose a great deal of its charge . It is not advisable to store batteries that have already been in use. Extended storage without periodic charging can result in shortened life expectancy and erratic battery performance.

Temperature also plays a large part in battery degradation during storage:

• If the ambient temperature during storage is - 15°C to + 30°C (+ 5°F to + 86°F), perform a full recharge cycle at least every six months.
• In environments where the ambient temperature is + 30°C to + 45°C (+ 86°F to + 113°F), perform a full recharge cycle at least every three months.

4.  Load: As the load increases on your UPS, the runtime decreases. It is not recommended that the load exceed 80 percent of the UPS unit’s rated capacity. In the event of a power failure, a UPS loaded to full capacity will discharge the battery very quickly and there is a potential that the life expectancy of the battery will be significantly reduced.

13 minutes ago, surreal1272 said:

Random power outages (or surges) over the course of the 79 months (you stated), will 100% affect that battery. Thats one way to kill a battery prematurely. 

It was a battery-ONLY unit; power grid fluctuations are irrelevant.

4 hours ago, balthazar said:

No- they don't "affect" real world usage, but they give one a window of expectation. It's generally a median.

My question is; are battery ratings a median or a maximum... sometimes?

Why doesn't a sealed, constant-draw battery meet it's claimed lifespan? Why doesn't a minimum-draw LED bulb meet it's? IS it a lack of certification to get these claims to be more realistic?

Remember when Porsche was dialed back from 400 miles of range to 308? (I think I have those numbers right) - Porsche's internal testing / planned marketing was pulled back from the unrealistic.

Random power outages (or surges) over the course of the 79 months (you stated), will 100% affect that battery. Thats one way to kill a battery prematurely. 

And Porsche dialing back that battery range (from their marketing range) is no different than companies that dial back MPGs for the same reason. Just my opinion though. 

^ I can agree with that for the most part.

1 hour ago, Robert Hall said:

Woo hoo...beautiful sunny day, hit the 50k mark.  Jeep is running great.

 

Good to know. I didn't know they had such a high trailering capacity. 6200 pounds IIRC. Ironically just turned 50k on the Aveo when I went to pick up a chainsaw.