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surreal1272 replied to Random Thoughts Thread.


19 hours ago, smk4565 said:

But Tesla is up 53%, so they obviously aren't being crushed by supply chain since they are mostly vertically integrated.

You obviously haven't kept up with their recent issues.

https://qz.com/2157289/supply-chain-challenges-finally-caught-up-to-tesla/

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trinacriabob replied to Random Thoughts Thread.


Wishing all our members a safe and happy Fourth of July. 

It's but a few hours away.

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smk4565 replied to Random Thoughts Thread.


4 hours ago, David said:

Look forward to hearing about how the Auction goes Robert. Wishing your sister and you all the best.

If you have not figured it out why we are laughing is that the down numbers mean little to nothing right now as the overall industry is hurting with supply chain issues and as each OEM brings certain manufacturing back in house rather than rely on China or other Asian rim production, we will see things return to more normal situation as is expected.

GM is one of the first that is expected to get back to normal by the start of 2023 as they reacted early on to looking at what would be affected and bring back to North America production of critical components. Ford started following at well and I expect them to both bounce and surpass Asian and European auto companies as they move forward in their change over from ICE to EV.

GM Has 95,000 Cars To Sell, But It Can’t – 24/7 Wall St. (247wallst.com)

This story is a perfect example as to why they had a 15% drop. 

Unless one is in a Must Have to Buy situation, it makes no sense to buy an auto now especially an ICE one that has to have parts added after manufacturing. The big thing about this is that it will push a surplus of auto's back onto the lots to sell of ICE and EVs but then smooth back out to a JIT system once production of the electronics gets going here again in North America.

But Tesla is up 53%, so they obviously aren't being crushed by supply chain since they are mostly vertically integrated.

Whoever can crack the supply chain problem first (or maybe 2nd and 3rd too) and get EV production booming is going to win, the ones that don't will lose, probably get consolidated into another car company as very few actually go out of business.  And that might be GM, it is like a big reset button right now.  There is an estimated 3-4 million units of pent up demand right now, whoever stocks their dealer lots first could get massive market share.  There is very large Chevy dealer near me, they have 3 new vehicles in stock.  The Mercedes dealer across the street has 81.  GM or any other car company can't have dealers with 3 cars in stock, they should have over 100, if they had 300 cars in stock they'd probably sell them in a month given how much demand is out there.  Whoever gets the inventory first wins, and I'd say EV inventory as well, because if you order a Tesla is still about a 6 month wait on average, some models are a 1 year wait, if the rivals had cars in stock you could get today, they could beat Tesla.

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trinacriabob replied to Random Thoughts Thread.


It seems like there is a shark attack is making the news on a daily basis ... in Monterey Bay, CA, on Florida's Gulf Side, on Long Island (a lifeguard), and faraway places like South Africa and Sharm-El Sheik, Egypt.  This is horrible.

In oceans and seas where the surf was minimal, I used to swim out to where I couldn't even touch or see the bottom.  I haven't done that in 1 or 2 decades.  The teenage girl in the Florida attack at Keaton Beach was in 5 feet of water.  

Don't do it.  Find another place to swim.  Encourage your loved ones and friends to stay very close to the shoreline.  Just work on your tan or something.

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David replied to June Car Spotting Thread.


@trinacriabob @oldshurst442

Awesome pictures, thank you for snapping and sharing. That 442 that I know Olds would love got me thinking about the future of auto's and while Oldsmobile is a dead brand and I just finished watching Demolition Man where you see a supposedly 23rd Century modern electric Olds Dealership and then the Demolition man in a old 442 with Sandra Bullock smashes out the store front had me thinking of a GM modern 442 electric version.

So originally the 442 stood for 4 barrel, 4 speed transmission, and dual exhaust. 1965 is when Olds broke GM's internal rule about mid-size auto's having V8's biger than 330 cubic inches in size and the Olds 442 changed to represent 400 cubic inches, 4 speed transmission and dual exhaust.

1968-72 Oldsmobile 442 values are holding steady, for now - Hagerty Media

I now wonder if GM could not make a modern 21st century EV as a 442 which would be 4 electric motors, 4 doors and dual roof panels as a modern performance sedan to compete against Tesla Platinum and other performance luxury sedans.

Thoughts?

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David replied to Random Thoughts Thread.


19 hours ago, Robert Hall said:

From March 2020 through Jan of this year, I drove very little w/ the COVID hibernation and working from home...did.like 1250 miles in all of 2020 and maybe 5000 last year.  But this year i've been driving 180-200 mile round trips 4-5 times a week since Feb--almost 10,000 miles added since Feb (9653 as of today).   My 3.6 Grand Cherokee gets a respectable 23-25 mpg in mixed freeway and rural backroad driving...  after next Saturday, I should go back to a more normal 10-50 miles per week...

Look forward to hearing about how the Auction goes Robert. Wishing your sister and you all the best.

On 7/1/2022 at 3:09 PM, smk4565 said:

2022 Q2 sales volume came out today, GM down 15%, Honda down 50%, Toyota down 22%, Stellantis down 15%, Hyundai-Kia down 19%, BMW down 20%, Nissan down 39%, Mazda down 42% Subaru down 18%.  Ford was up 5%, VW group up 2% so those 2 are treading water, the rest are tanking.

Tesla is expected to be up 53%

GM has sold 20,253 EV's in 2022, Tesla is at 228,700 estimated (final numbers not out).   Tesla is rolling right now, at even half their current growth rate they will be at 1.1 million units a year in the USA in 2026, 2.7 million units in 2030.  I am not saying it will happen, but look at the beating the other guys are taking.  And how long will it take for the legacy OEMs to not have 1 EV in the product line, but 5 or 6 all of which are built in volume and in stock on dealer lots.

Probably the only way the other guys can beat Tesla is to #1 undercut the price, and #2 have rows of EV's sitting on dealer lots, because with a Tesla you are still ordering online and waiting 6 months to get it.    My local Mercedes dealer has 82 cars in stock, but 51 are GLC's and zero are EQS.  If a car company can put 50 EV's on the lot, that is how you beat Tesla.

If you have not figured it out why we are laughing is that the down numbers mean little to nothing right now as the overall industry is hurting with supply chain issues and as each OEM brings certain manufacturing back in house rather than rely on China or other Asian rim production, we will see things return to more normal situation as is expected.

GM is one of the first that is expected to get back to normal by the start of 2023 as they reacted early on to looking at what would be affected and bring back to North America production of critical components. Ford started following at well and I expect them to both bounce and surpass Asian and European auto companies as they move forward in their change over from ICE to EV.

GM Has 95,000 Cars To Sell, But It Can’t – 24/7 Wall St. (247wallst.com)

This story is a perfect example as to why they had a 15% drop. 

Unless one is in a Must Have to Buy situation, it makes no sense to buy an auto now especially an ICE one that has to have parts added after manufacturing. The big thing about this is that it will push a surplus of auto's back onto the lots to sell of ICE and EVs but then smooth back out to a JIT system once production of the electronics gets going here again in North America.

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David replied to July Car Spotting Thread.


Just got back from a run to Costco and was surprised to see at the Bank of America in rat rod fashion running a very cool Chevy and I found what I think was the year or general era. late 1930's Chevy like this one that I found online.

Some times I really wish my eyes could also be a camera to snap a picture and store it to share. Hopefully I will see it again and not be in crazy holiday traffic.

image.png

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Robert Hall replied to Random Thoughts Thread.


On 7/1/2022 at 12:16 PM, ccap41 said:

What kind of fuel economy do you get in that thing? I thought you didn't drive a whole lot? Maybe I'm mixing you and @Robert Hallup here. 

From March 2020 through Jan of this year, I drove very little w/ the COVID hibernation and working from home...did.like 1250 miles in all of 2020 and maybe 5000 last year.  But this year i've been driving 180-200 mile round trips 4-5 times a week since Feb--almost 10,000 miles added since Feb (9653 as of today).   My 3.6 Grand Cherokee gets a respectable 23-25 mpg in mixed freeway and rural backroad driving...  after next Saturday, I should go back to a more normal 10-50 miles per week...

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smk4565 replied to Random Thoughts Thread.


17 hours ago, David said:

How is that any different than the Pickup Failure Benz did of just Badge Engineering the Navero built by Nissan?

Mercedes has their FWD appliance autos to compete against so many basic entry-level autos, badged autos by others and the list is long for their failures as much as their wins.

You also are showing your ignorance as while Genesis does not sell their Ubber 6 figure luxury auto's here, they do in the asian rim and have plans as an EV to sell them Globally.

I know others have posted about this and I know I have posted in the past. 

Just like Mercedes makes and sells select autos in the US, same with every other auto company.

G90 Long Wheelbase is their competitor to the S-Class and offers just as much customization and can go well beyond $150,000 dollars depending on how the 1% crowd chooses to customize it.

image.png

Genesis G90 Design | GENESIS

Here is a basic config I did of things I liked and it came out to $140,563 US dollars.

image.png

Conversion rates aren’t the same, in China direct conversion an S-class is like $200k.  And $140k US is not even a loaded S580, let alone a Maybach or AMG.  You can find used S-classes for over $200k, same goes fir G-wagon and several other AMG models.  Genesis will never make a $200,000 car and never have a collector car or museum car.

The Mercedes 300SLR coupe sold for $143 million at auction this year.  So there is the standard.  When Genesis sells a car for $143 million they can be in Mercedes league.

 

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riviera74 replied to Random Thoughts Thread.


On 7/1/2022 at 6:18 PM, smk4565 said:

Sure, Genesis has more prestige than Mercedes.  They don't make a single model over $100k.  They make a nice little effort, at least, they went rear drive rather than just badge jobbing a Hyundai and making front drive crossovers like Lincoln does.  But Genesis is basically what Infiniti was 15 years ago, with the G35, M35, Q56, and the FX45 crossover that were all rear drive, performance oriented, nicer than a Nissan ,but not as nice as a German car, but cheaper than a German car.  Infiniti fumbled that strategy, because Nissan as a company has no direction, but basically Genesis is Infiniti of 15 years ago.  

Nissan has not figured out whether Infiniti is premium or luxury.  (I have no idea why Nissan or Infiniti even exist anymore.)  Acura is premium, while Lexus is luxury.  Genesis is discounted luxury, at least compared to the Germans.  That strategy has worked for Lexus ever since the original 1990 LS400.

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trinacriabob replied to June Car Spotting Thread.


This was seen last week.  I had gone in to get something to eat somewhere and, by the time I exited, there was obviously a car show in the parking lot.

KIMG1608.thumb.JPG.0df30e8fbc2c0d8b4356593f1c25ddd5.JPG

a

KIMG1610.thumb.JPG.c0c868ba2043706479864d217067d5a0.JPG

b

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c

KIMG1612.thumb.JPG.9c78de52059d42ffcc72b0b13c81418f.JPG

d

The above, IIRC, is (a) a '53 Chevy. You can (b) touch every spark plug of this inline 6 and the air cleaner assembly looks like a tea kettle.  You can (c) see all that room in the engine bay.  And you can also (d) see that only one belt does everything - water pump, crank, and alternator.  So, there are no belts for power steering, air conditioning, and an air pump.

KIMG1615.thumb.JPG.9e343ea4bdd33033755e87e362c56e5e.JPG

a

KIMG1637-inked.thumb.jpg.88f8aa3c506872bf7d89cb30be7f1fe4.jpg

b

KIMG1640.thumb.JPG.2f57f8888505fb9d07d5bb33a21927c5.JPG

c

I approached this car thinking it was a kit on a Mazda Miata.  It was not. The front end (a) looks like one.  The rear end (b) looks less like one. The owner explained it all to me and it's a Fiat product.  The rear badging (c) indicates it's a Fiat 124

KIMG1619.thumb.JPG.8ea8fa0041dc17351c17ba33966373e5.JPG

a

KIMG1618.thumb.JPG.9f6c1551cee7cdea95ef0e530014abdf.JPG

b

KIMG1621.thumb.JPG.1de2820fcf34a1d93e79f3fa9e12242b.JPG

c

This is a Chevy Bel Air ... possibly a 1957, but I'm not certain.  You can see that it's (a) a convertible, that (b) it has the very durable and popular 283 V8, but no power steering, and that (c) it has an automatic, but it's a 2 speed automatic unit

KIMG1625.thumb.JPG.f0b5da47b487422233f9078366c83358.JPG

a

KIMG1636.thumb.JPG.925e466c8f051439600f41977a213234.JPG

b

KIMG1623.thumb.JPG.f086ec4864dc49805309e4c95582eaf9.JPG

c

KIMG1627.thumb.JPG.0497b68e875f8eb614a5a66371c70c31.JPG

d

KIMG1633.thumb.JPG.fc12241969dca97d972ee8a75b6d4d14.JPG

e

And here's an (a) @oldshurst442 vehicle from 1972 ... I didn't look at the taillamps, but the owner told me.  The fender badging (b) told me this wasn't any ordinary Cutlass.  The engine (c) is an Olds Rocket 350, and the layout of the belts and attachments looks like an Olds V8i.  The owner almost seemed apologetic that it didn't have a 455!  It has a (d) manual transmission and gauges that were added to supplant what were probably just idiot lights on the dash, and the door panels have manual window cranks.  Finally, it does not have A/C, per the climate control panel (e) ... so look at the cheesy plastic applique up top and center to mimic as if air conditioning vents had been there!  That was the funniest thing about this car.

- - - - -

I know a small few who like and go to small car shows like this.  I only check out a few cars if I stumble in on one and move on quickly.

Some people are really nice and want to talk about their cars, and cars in general.  Others are basically cliques of D-listers who routinely show up at these get togethers, have known each other for a long time, and throw out some reverse snobbery to anyone who is well spoken and they detect has some polish.  

I overheard some talk in the restaurant by some attendees that was really off the mark.  I like dirty and politically incorrect jokes just fine.  However, the talk I overheard was more mean spirited in its tone and not as funny as they thought they were.  Since car shows are often popular with people without a lot of Klass, that's probably why I just keep on driving.

Anyway, I hope you enjoy (some of) the photos and, especially you, @oldshurst442

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David replied to Random Thoughts Thread.


Happy 4th of July Weekend Everyone!!! 

Season 3 Netflix GIF by Stranger Things

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surreal1272 replied to Random Thoughts Thread.


12 hours ago, smk4565 said:

True but it is still a Ford.  Lincoln makes nothing of their own, just fancy Fords.

Two things:

You keep saying that like it means anything yet at least one of those “fancy Fords”, competes very well against Benz (Navigator) and another (Aviator) isn’t a slouch against them either but you wouldn’t acknowledge that anyway.

 

And this wasn’t about Lincoln in the first place. It was about Genesis being preferred over the likes of your precious Mercedes Benz. Your constant need to deflect from anything negative about them is obvious and quite frankly, old. 
 

Point being, you have been burned for your rather pathetic stance on Cadillac and Lincoln and their platform sharing so unless you just like visiting the burn unit, maybe you should argue on merits instead of fanboy snobbery. Your owning a now 14 year Benz does nothing to help you here. 

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Robert Hall replied to Random Thoughts Thread.


Random thoughts related to recent posts..

Had my first $100 fillup this week...yay.  Usually have 2-3 $80-90 fillups most weeks lately.   

Those Ford door keypads are neat..several of my folks '80s-90s Fords and Lincolns had them.  None of my 80s Fords had them, though.   I could see them very useful for when I go to the beach..I always have to make sure to take out my keys and put them in my beach chair pocket before going in the water..

As far as cupholders, everything I've had made since '00 has had cupholders, and I've used aftermarket ones in older vehicles.  I never leave home without bottled water, so a cupholder is essential...and for coffee in the morning.  

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David replied to Bought a new minivan.


2 hours ago, 2QuickZ's said:

Wow.  It's been a year since I have updated this.  We still have the van and it is still going strong.  No real issues since the last update.  The suspension creaking is back but you only hear it at low speeds so not that big of a deal.  The only other issue is that the start/stop battery needs replaced again.  It hasn't actually died like last time but it almost never has enough charge to work.  I'd guess for a lot of you this would be ideal but I am one of the few oddballs that actually likes stop/start.  It feels so wasteful to me to sit at a light with the engine still running.  I'll likely wind up spending the $100 for a new one soon and yes, I know I will never get my money back from the gas I save, even at current gas prices 😄

Anyway, it is up to 44k miles now.  The wife and I still both work from home so it went from having 32k miles put on it in the first 22 months of ownership to having only 12k miles put on it in the next 26 months of ownership.  That includes another trip to Florida we did back in March.  I did have to buy a new set of tires.  I went with Firestone Destination LE3 tires and they are working out pretty well.  They are quiet and smooth riding tires but have a little less wet traction than I was hoping based on the reviews.  Still not bad, though.

That's about it really.  I did pull the camper with it again (200 mile round trip) a month or so ago even though I have a Canyon now.  The Canyon was busy at the time.  The trans temp is always steady and the brakes are more than adequate to stop our 2000 lb pop up.

The thought is we will likely keep this another year.  Its a bit tricky because we would like to take advantage of the ridiculous used car market, especially since it will show two accidents on a Carfax but at the same time what is the difference if we wind up just spending that extra money and then some on a new vehicle with no real discounts.

Have you considered instead of the OEM battery, an upgrade of a Lithium-ion auto battery that will last much longer and give a better performance response to the system? I have them in my autos and other coworkers have them and they work great.

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David replied to Random Thoughts Thread.


3 hours ago, smk4565 said:

True but it is still a Ford.  Lincoln makes nothing of their own, just fancy Fords.

How is that any different than the Pickup Failure Benz did of just Badge Engineering the Navero built by Nissan?

Mercedes has their FWD appliance autos to compete against so many basic entry-level autos, badged autos by others and the list is long for their failures as much as their wins.

You also are showing your ignorance as while Genesis does not sell their Ubber 6 figure luxury auto's here, they do in the asian rim and have plans as an EV to sell them Globally.

I know others have posted about this and I know I have posted in the past. 

Just like Mercedes makes and sells select autos in the US, same with every other auto company.

G90 Long Wheelbase is their competitor to the S-Class and offers just as much customization and can go well beyond $150,000 dollars depending on how the 1% crowd chooses to customize it.

image.png

Genesis G90 Design | GENESIS

Here is a basic config I did of things I liked and it came out to $140,563 US dollars.

image.png

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2QuickZ's replied to And the new ride is....


Update on the Canyon.  Still going strong.  No real issues to speak of.  I thought I had an annoying rattle on the rear sliding window pop up but it turned out the gaskets on the tri-fold tonneau cover compressed enough over time to allow it to shift slightly and one of the plastic clips was tapping on the back window.  That was a 5 minute fix to loosen it up, reposition it and re-tighten.

Fuel economy was pretty abysmal over the winter.  To the point where I wonder if a V8 full size would have done any worse.  A lot of it had to do with the fact that I am still working from home so with no commute, most of my trips are short and the engine barely had time to get warm.  Still, I think I had one tank come in at 14.9 mpg.  That was a bit of an outlier and most were in the high 15's or low 16's.  Now that it is warm, it is generally averaging low to mid 17's and any longer trips I have taken with it have been more in the 21-22 mpg range.

It still annoys the crap out of me that a Denali does not have a Homelink garage door opener built in.  I also continued to be annoyed by actually having to get the keys out of my pocket to unlock the doors and start it.  I know that may sound ridiculous but once you have a number of cars in a row that have passive entry and push button start, its annoying to live with out.  Call me spoiled. haha

I do wonder if I would have been better off with a full size truck.  What appealed to me most about the Canyon (its size) is also my biggest problem with it.  The front seats are fine but my long legged son is not too comfortable in the back seat.  We also have a dog we take with us on our camping trips and it doesn't work very well for her.  She's a bit of a nervous traveler so the floor is the best spot for her but there is no room there in the truck so she has to sit on someone's lap.  That said, while those areas would be better in a full size, I know my wife would hate parking one.  I also know since it stays parked in the driveway, I would have had to make my driveway a little wider to make it easier to get the other vehicles in and out of the garage and while I would have liked the interior room in the full size much better, the Canyon overall just fits us better.

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2QuickZ's replied to Bought a new minivan.


Wow.  It's been a year since I have updated this.  We still have the van and it is still going strong.  No real issues since the last update.  The suspension creaking is back but you only hear it at low speeds so not that big of a deal.  The only other issue is that the start/stop battery needs replaced again.  It hasn't actually died like last time but it almost never has enough charge to work.  I'd guess for a lot of you this would be ideal but I am one of the few oddballs that actually likes stop/start.  It feels so wasteful to me to sit at a light with the engine still running.  I'll likely wind up spending the $100 for a new one soon and yes, I know I will never get my money back from the gas I save, even at current gas prices 😄

Anyway, it is up to 44k miles now.  The wife and I still both work from home so it went from having 32k miles put on it in the first 22 months of ownership to having only 12k miles put on it in the next 26 months of ownership.  That includes another trip to Florida we did back in March.  I did have to buy a new set of tires.  I went with Firestone Destination LE3 tires and they are working out pretty well.  They are quiet and smooth riding tires but have a little less wet traction than I was hoping based on the reviews.  Still not bad, though.

That's about it really.  I did pull the camper with it again (200 mile round trip) a month or so ago even though I have a Canyon now.  The Canyon was busy at the time.  The trans temp is always steady and the brakes are more than adequate to stop our 2000 lb pop up.

The thought is we will likely keep this another year.  Its a bit tricky because we would like to take advantage of the ridiculous used car market, especially since it will show two accidents on a Carfax but at the same time what is the difference if we wind up just spending that extra money and then some on a new vehicle with no real discounts.

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smk4565 replied to Random Thoughts Thread.


40 minutes ago, surreal1272 said:

The Aviator CUV is rear wheel drive and that is a dumb argument anyway given the FWD appliances in the Benz stable. 

True but it is still a Ford.  Lincoln makes nothing of their own, just fancy Fords.

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surreal1272 replied to Random Thoughts Thread.


1 hour ago, smk4565 said:

making front drive crossovers like Lincoln does.

The Aviator CUV is rear wheel drive and that is a dumb argument anyway given the FWD appliances in the Benz stable. 

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smk4565 replied to Random Thoughts Thread.


23 minutes ago, David said:

Seems the Germans are no longer the standard of Luxury Auto's. Koreans have taken the lead.

Specifically, Genesis leads as the best Luxury line of auto's according to the J.D. Powers survey.

https://www.linkedin.com/posts/jd-power-and-associates_jdpowerawards-activity-6947586440616665089-8Hta?utm_source=linkedin_share&utm_medium=android_app

Sure, Genesis has more prestige than Mercedes.  They don't make a single model over $100k.  They make a nice little effort, at least, they went rear drive rather than just badge jobbing a Hyundai and making front drive crossovers like Lincoln does.  But Genesis is basically what Infiniti was 15 years ago, with the G35, M35, Q56, and the FX45 crossover that were all rear drive, performance oriented, nicer than a Nissan ,but not as nice as a German car, but cheaper than a German car.  Infiniti fumbled that strategy, because Nissan as a company has no direction, but basically Genesis is Infiniti of 15 years ago.  

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smk4565 replied to Random Thoughts Thread.


4 hours ago, ccap41 said:

Right now they are bringing the fight. The other OEMs haven't caught and beaten but they are bringing it right now with everything that's rolling out this year and within the next five years. It seems like every OEM has at least one EV rolling out this year (or last year) with a handful more on the way. 

2022 Q2 sales volume came out today, GM down 15%, Honda down 50%, Toyota down 22%, Stellantis down 15%, Hyundai-Kia down 19%, BMW down 20%, Nissan down 39%, Mazda down 42% Subaru down 18%.  Ford was up 5%, VW group up 2% so those 2 are treading water, the rest are tanking.

Tesla is expected to be up 53%

GM has sold 20,253 EV's in 2022, Tesla is at 228,700 estimated (final numbers not out).   Tesla is rolling right now, at even half their current growth rate they will be at 1.1 million units a year in the USA in 2026, 2.7 million units in 2030.  I am not saying it will happen, but look at the beating the other guys are taking.  And how long will it take for the legacy OEMs to not have 1 EV in the product line, but 5 or 6 all of which are built in volume and in stock on dealer lots.

Probably the only way the other guys can beat Tesla is to #1 undercut the price, and #2 have rows of EV's sitting on dealer lots, because with a Tesla you are still ordering online and waiting 6 months to get it.    My local Mercedes dealer has 82 cars in stock, but 51 are GLC's and zero are EQS.  If a car company can put 50 EV's on the lot, that is how you beat Tesla.

    • Haha 2
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David replied to Random Thoughts Thread.


Seems the Germans are no longer the standard of Luxury Auto's. Koreans have taken the lead.

Specifically, Genesis leads as the best Luxury line of auto's according to the J.D. Powers survey.

https://www.linkedin.com/posts/jd-power-and-associates_jdpowerawards-activity-6947586440616665089-8Hta?utm_source=linkedin_share&utm_medium=android_app

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surreal1272 replied to Random Thoughts Thread.


1 hour ago, smk4565 said:

True on the lack of competition.  But Tesla still outsells all other EV’s combined.  The traditional OEM’s need to bring the fight, they aren’t yet.

So basically you’re just repeating what I just said. Thanks lol. 

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