SPY SHOTS! 2008 Honda Accord sedan

[turbo200]

the bottom line is hoping that Toyota and Honda will suddenly have a downspell in reliability is a bad strategy... for GM.

[Drew Dowdell]

Hey Oldsmoboi, when you mention the sludge problems and the Honda transmissions, don't forget to mention the Ford 3.8 gasket problem, the notorious 6 cyl Chrysler transmissions, the ever present missing headlight bulb on Chevy trucks, the unreliable Quad 2.2 engines, etc etc.....

All of those GM and Ford problems are well known.... CR and the rest of the mainstream media has made sure of that.

Who, outside of the fanboys, knows about the Toyota sludge and Honda transmission problems? THAT is where my issue is.... it never gets published.

[Drew Dowdell]

we can say with certainty that based on the past records, Toyota and Honda will continue to make bullet proof products, barring miniscule cases all seemingly revolved around the C&G universe.

Minuscule cases?!? Bullet proof prodcuts?!

Toyota's major sludge problems?

Honda Oddessys, Acura TLs, and Honda Accords with transmission failure rates that would make a Chrysler blush?

4Runners with wheels that fall off?

Toyota disabling the passenger airbag in their trucks because they don't wish to conform to US safety standards?

Do I need to remind you that in 2006 Toyota recalled more vehicles in the US than they SOLD in all of 2006?

And before you bring up any issue with any domestic.... you're the one who said Toyota and Honda make bullet proof products when they clearly don't.

Minuscule indeed....

Bullet proof indeed.....

[Oracle of Delphi]

Minuscule cases?!? Bullet proof prodcuts?!

Toyota's major sludge problems?

Honda Oddessys, Acura TLs, and Honda Accords with transmission failure rates that would make a Chrysler blush?

4Runners with wheels that fall off?

Toyota disabling the passenger airbag in their trucks because they don't wish to conform to US safety standards?

Do I need to remind you that in 2006 Toyota recalled more vehicles in the US than they SOLD in all of 2006?

And before you bring up any issue with any domestic.... you're the one who said Toyota and Honda make bullet proof products when they clearly don't.

Minuscule indeed....

Bullet proof indeed.....

Oh sing it Oldsmoboi!

[regfootball]

Oh this should be good.....

I've always been curious why Toyota's sludge problems and Honda's automatic transmission problems seem to go unreported by CR.

lots and lots of money under the table?

i'm glad all the folks out there who think people who like domestic cars tend to be xenophobes actually are the worst stereotypers. they lump all japanese brands together because 'those asians are really smart and are all good engineers'.

you know, all asians lack any sort of emotion and personality, they just militantly turn out perfect cars for us whiteys in the western hemisphere. that's so nice of them to just shut up and work diligently to make that lexus we can put in our garage. like good little asians. Yet, i don't see those same folks singing the virtues of Asian artists or moviemakers or advertising and marketing experts.

that's why people in the US have this embedded stereotype of Asians being able to make better stuff than we can. 'their kids go to school so much more and get better grades'.

Edited May 22, 2007 by regfootball

[91z4me]

We cannot agree, I guess if you won't concede this, that Honda and Toyota are known for reliable cars that don't break down and in general give less problems than the competition from GM, in the past, and that in this present time we do not know enough about the reliability of GM's newest products to quantify them with anything, but we can say with certainty that based on the past records, Toyota and Honda will continue to make bullet proof products, barring miniscule cases all seemingly revolved around the C&G universe. If you cannot agree with these statements I've made then you are disavowing the fact of so many buyers have migrated from American cars to other makes, and why they have applied the "reliability formula" to all Japanese cars, as inherently superior than what us Americans can make.

I won't concede that because I don't believe it to be true. I have a 97 MC Z34. Arguably one of the least reliable engines that GM has ever made. And guess what it has never left me stranded. It has had problems, alternator and O2, sensor but that is nothing to be shocked of seeing on a then 8 year old car. The interior while filled with hard plastic doesn't have any cracks or fitment issues, the paint is in good shape except where it has been dinged. I have ridden in several ES300s/Camrys from around 2000 and none of them were perfect. Sure it is individual results and is not statistically relevent but I can't ignore my own eyes and ears.

The JD Power thing was for initial quality only, I can make a car with great initial quality even. Give me long term reliability reports and you will have my ear, that is what people care about and why they left GM/Ford/Chrysler in the first place.

I don't know how to find those long term reports but if you find them be sure to post. Even if they 'prove' me wrong.

People left GM/Ford/Chrysler because they made sub-par products at various points in the 70s/80s/90s. Each company had a bad period. GM's 80s cars pretty much sucked (especially the early ones). Ford had reoccuring paint problems in the 80s-90s as well as various engine problems and couldn't make an automatic transmission to save a baby. Chrysler cheaped out on lots of small things that make me not consider any of their 90s models despite the nice interiors/exteriors. But Toyota has made crap also. It is just that those 'anomolies' are forgotten because people believe what is reported as truth (rarely the case).