2010 Camaro Mule in Production Body

[hyperv6]

Here are some facts on the Camaro from F bodfather. These are facts you can take to the bank.

F bodfather Scott Settlmire speaks:

Finally -- a word about the recent blogs out there --

Yes-- the Camaro will have a key. (versus pushbutton start)

Yes -- it will be a model year 2010 -- but we have not moved the 'start-up' date. We'll start building Camaros in the 4th quarter of 2008 -- and they'll be in dealerships in the first quarter of 2009.

Yes - the new Camaro will have a B-pillar. BUT - it isn't noticable from the outside. Think of a first gen with the rear window in the up position. The rear window will cover the B-pillar and there will be a weatherstrip attached. The B-pillar is necessary for several reasons -- the most important being:

>reduction of mass

>structural rigidity

.....and, I think we're safe in saying this: The production car is so close to the concept -- that if we were driving down the road in a production Camaro coupe in Silver -- and you passed us going the other way -- you'd swear it was the Silver concept.

The Future just keeps getting brighter and brighter!

Ed Well born showing some love to one of his children. This photo is on Fastlane blog of Ed hugging the 2010 Test mule in production sheetmetal. This is the same car Lutz drove and told us about.

Yes there will be 2 V6 engines the first year as well as 1 V8. 1 V6 is for the buget minded price buyer and the other is a economical performance car. Yes this second V6 will rival the last gens V8. The V8 is the LS3 [like it was a big seceret].

I spoke to Scott on the V6 and he said they found many buyers wanted a lower performing economical V6 just has the Mustang sells in great numbers. They find many of the Female drivers don't care for a lot of power and just was a good running sporty looking car. He said many are intimidated by high HP. [must not have spoken to my wife]. Agree or not this V6 formula is the biggest selling model for the Mustang and is what the 4th gen lacked.

Edited October 17, 2007 by hyperv6

[hyperv6]

By the way these photo's are planned releases to counter the release of the Challanger pictures.

GM does not do thinks like this my accident! Note how well posed this photo was to cover some details. You have to leave them wanting more.

Expect more in the near future to counter any news on the Challanger.

The gates of info are just starting to open, so enjoy the ride.

Edited October 17, 2007 by hyperv6

[Sixty8panther]

B-pillar of any sort =

You want to SCCA race your 2010 Camaro Z/28?

Put in a f@#kin' rollcage.

You want a cheap assed 2dr post Musclecar? Buy a $hitty Mustang.

[Camino LS6]

Things should get pretty interesting from here on in.

[CaddyXLR-V]

I want a convertible anyway, so I don't have to worry about the b pillar.

[hyperv6]

B-pillar of any sort =

You want to SCCA race your 2010 Camaro Z/28?

Put in a f@#kin' rollcage.

You want a cheap assed 2dr post Musclecar? Buy a $hitty Mustang.

Has nothing to do with racing.

It has more to do with the Ralph Nadar type lawyers of the world.

[ocnblu]

This is going to be one hot mother f*c*er. I can see the instrument cluster nacelles... it appears to have something near the concept's interior, as well. Hold onto your hats!

[PurdueGuy]

B-pillar of any sort =

You want to SCCA race your 2010 Camaro Z/28?

Put in a f@#kin' rollcage.

You want a cheap assed 2dr post Musclecar? Buy a $hitty Mustang.

[hyperv6]

Contrary to what some have posted in other threads this car is going to be as close to the concept as the Solstice was to it's concept. Unless they are side by side only some small differances will show.

Keep an eye out for post from Scott as he is giving some info now and what ever he says is good as gold.

I still think we may see a preproduction bodied car with some custom tricks at Detroit. I have heard nothing offical but I can't see them not giving us a teaser. That is not like GM to pass it up with only the Impala.

Note the starting date is still late 08 and Scott told me a few weeks back we should be good yet to see the car in dealers by Feb 09 baring any future delays. The earlier post of production starting in Feb 09 were bogus.

By the way your B pillar will be something like this. The Bumble Bee Camaro is a good indicator of what to expect.

Edited October 17, 2007 by hyperv6

[Ravenfreak13]

those mirrors grew....alot.

[CMG]

Here are some facts on the Camaro from F bodfather. These are facts you can take to the bank.

F bodfather Scott Settlmire speaks:

.....and, I think we're safe in saying this: The production car is so close to the concept -- that if we were driving down the road in a production Camaro coupe in Silver -- and you passed us going the other way -- you'd swear it was the Silver

Ask Scott if the bumpers will change, if the roof will raise, and if the concept Camaro had room for functional front suspension....

:AH-HA_wink:

[Derek77]

those mirrors grew....alot.

Well, now you can actually SEE something in it, thus making them useful.

Will the Camaro be tested at The Ring, or will it be tested in the land of Oz?

[FAPTurbo]

I'm still upset about the lack of a midline V8, but if that V6 is as great as they say, then I suppose I could stand to lose two cylinders.

[pow]

Hi-po V6 Camaro sounds intriguing... that's definitely good planning, considering the price of gas these days. It makes the Camaro more of a broad-appeal modern performance car than purely a muscle car (Challenger). The current 3.6 DI makes 304 hp; retuning it for more revs and more power would easily make it competitive with a 335i or G37. Except the Camaro will be a lot better looking...

Edited October 17, 2007 by empowah

[CMG]

Hi-po V6 Camaro sounds intriguing... that's definitely good planning, considering the price of gas these days. It makes the Camaro more of a broad-appeal modern performance car than purely a muscle car (Challenger).

Challenger will have V6 models too. As does the Mustang.

[hyperv6]

Challenger will have V6 models too. As does the Mustang.

Neither are what I would term Hi perfromance.

The numbers I was told are north of 300 HP for the higher V6. At one time I heard 320 HP may be possible. Neither the Challanger or Mustang offer anything like that.

Good gas mileage, lower price, lower insurance and maybe lower weight? will make this a appealing option to those who can afford the V8. Also it make for a good daily driver.

Keep in mind folks how much power the Grand National made was below what we are expecting for this optional package. It looks like the middle ground Camaro will be as good as the last SS was.

[hyperv6]

Ask Scott if the bumpers will change, if the roof will raise, and if the concept Camaro had room for functional front suspension....

:AH-HA_wink:

Look at the picture and you have your roof answer already.

[FAPTurbo]

Challenger will have V6 models too. As does the Mustang.

Yeah, but it sounds like this V6 is looking to tie or exceed the Mustang's 4.6L V8. Hell, maybe it'll be out hunting the HEMI 5.7L .

[Z-06]

Hi-po V6 Camaro sounds intriguing... that's definitely good planning, considering the price of gas these days. It makes the Camaro more of a broad-appeal modern performance car than purely a muscle car (Challenger). The current 3.6 DI makes 304 hp; retuning it for more revs and more power would easily make it competitive with a 335i or G37. Except the Camaro will be a lot better looking...

This thing should be about 200-250lb lighter than the Zeta G8 (smaller body). It should weigh around 3600-3700lb. With that Hi-Po V-6, it can kick some serious butt. GM can make very good handling cars, so yes I expect to see it at the Ring. I still think, they should have that 4.5l V-8 315hp+ Du-Di in it as an option. That will blow serious balls out.

[CMG]

Neither are what I would term Hi perfromance.

The numbers I was told are north of 300 HP for the higher V6. At one time I heard 320 HP may be possible. Neither the Challanger or Mustang offer anything like that.

The Challenger doesn't offer anything. It isn't out yet..?

The Challenger is slated to get the 4.0 V6 Phoenix engine. Have you read up on it? No slouch by any means....

[CMG]

Look at the picture and you have your roof answer already.

LOL

I looked up, either that guy is a midget or indeed the car is taller now! Looks like shoulder height almost...

[loki]

Keep in mind folks how much power the Grand National made was below what we are expecting for this optional package. It looks like the middle ground Camaro will be as good as the last SS was.

but remember the ('87) GN made .. say 250 hp... but "more" than 300 ft lbs....that makes some nice HP lower in the range.

the gnx was "rated" at "276 hp (206 kW) and a very substantial 360 lb-ft (488 N·m) of torque"-wikipedia

the hi-po v6, i bet, will come close to the last SS, it'd be sad if it did though.. for the 4th gen.

what would everyone think of a turbo camaro? would a twinforce mustang happen to counter said camaro?

[K.C.]

:rotflmao:

[K.C.]

Why does Ed Wellburn get to have sex with the Camaro before I do?

He's nowhere near the tailpipe if that floats your boat.

I love those wheels! I hope to see a pic of the whole car soon.

[Oracle of Delphi]

Why does Ed Wellburn get to have sex with the Camaro before I do?

Rank has its privilege! What you don't like sloppy seconds?

[Cory Wolfe]

Intriguing.

[balthazar]

>>"the gnx was "rated" at "276 hp"<<

Actual output was 345 HP.

[Northstar]

Production does not start in 4th quarter 2008. Perhaps non-saleable test units will be built, but not saleable units. Saleable units start in February 2009. If you don't believe me, look at this thread (if you haven't already): http://www.cheersandgears.com/forums/index...showtopic=20432

2 V6s and the LS3, as I posted a week ago. I didn't know for sure if the 3.5 was going in the Camaro, but I knew it was going in either the Impala or both.

[Sixty8panther]

Well, now you can actually SEE something in it, thus making them useful.

See, there you go. I can understand increasing the size of the mirrors.

That's a PRACTICAL safety concern, the concept's mirrors were like 2.5" x 4"

in terms of glass surface area, not exactly realistic.

But a B-pillar is way more of a lame cop out. At least in my opinion.

Also the b-pillar will LIMIT visability. THUS DECREASING safety.

[hyperv6]

Production does not start in 4th quarter 2008. Perhaps non-saleable test units will be built, but not saleable units. Saleable units start in February 2009. If you don't believe me, look at this thread (if you haven't already): http://www.cheersandgears.com/forums/index...showtopic=20432

2 V6s and the LS3, as I posted a week ago. I didn't know for sure if the 3.5 was going in the Camaro, but I knew it was going in either the Impala or both.

I saw your post

On Sept 15 GM's Scott Settlmire told me in person that the production line would start up in the 4th quarter 08. He also in person told me that the cars would be expected in the dealers by Feb 09 as 2010 models not just starting production. He restated this same info yesterday on Camaroz28.com

It is not a point of if I believe you or not as I have no idea where your info came from And I know you often have good info. But Scott has been spot on on his info for the last few years on the Camaro . Being the general manager of the Chevy Show division and the past manager of the F body program gives him a good chance of knowing what is up. Sorry this time I tend to go with the info with a name tied to it of a creditable GM offical.

He also is the one who clued me in on the 2 V6 and 1 V8 engines I posted about 6-8 months ago. Your post was more a confirmation that nothing had changed since my first post of this info.

Scott did say nothing in the plant has been changed over yet and there always can be a delay but the time line stands for now. In the end we both could be off and the car may not come in till May if there are problems.

Per Scott The cars built in late 08 will be pilot cars with a slow transition to production. He said this will be a slow start up as they want it right the first time.

As for the engines I was told last spring all three were not in any production cars yet. At that time the LS3 was not out and the 3.6 DI was not out. This leaves the base engine up for grabs? I am not so sure it is the 3.5 or it could be some other updated version. I was told to expect around 240HP on the base engine and last spring the 320 HP V6 was quoted as being a real possibility. I have not heard that number anywhere else but considering the scource I will trust it.

I was also told most of the first cars will be V8 models so I will expect SS models will be the first ones to roll out and a slow roll in of the V6 will soon follow.

Scott said a great deal of importants is being placed on the V6 Camaro's so I expect both will offer different things to different buyers.

Lets just sit back and see what happens.

[eldiablobanshee]

does any body know the difference in weight between the LS3 and the 3.6 DI?

[Intrepidation]

I think the Challenger starts wit the same powertrains as the Charger did when it started... 3.5 v6, 5.7 v8, 6.1 v8. however Chrysler is in the process of updating it's engine lineup...so I expect to the Phoenix V6 to replace the 3.5 eventually, an the updated Hemis to come in when they are available.

[BowTieFarmer]

Is there any chance that the Atlas inline-6 from the fading GMT360 might find a home in Zeta? It's always been a magnificent engine begging for a decent chassis.

[Intrepidation]

It would be nice to see the Atlas put to use.

Anyway, it's nice to finally see a prototype with production body panels on it...looks great.

[Sixty8panther]

Is there any chance that the Atlas inline-6 from the fading GMT360 might find a home in Zeta? It's always been a magnificent engine begging for a decent chassis.

Don't get me started.... Iniline sixes are a billion times better than V6s.

I had a whole thread about this like three years ago.

The 4.2 atlas should be the Camaro's base motor and a bi-turbo variant

should be offered as a sort of poor-man's Nissan Skyline GT-R. (R34)

[Z-06]

does any body know the difference in weight between the LS3 and the 3.6 DI?

The LS3 weighs about 435lbs.

I did not find any information about the 3.6DI (LLT), but the 3.6 (LY7) is about 370lbs.

So the LS3 is about 60-70lb heavier than the LTT

[Sixty8panther]

That's a pretty stupid statement.

If a pillarless hardtop with a full steel roof is unsafe than what the F&%$ do you call a ragtop?

By your logic:

=

=

[mikef]

This thing should be about 200-250lb lighter than the Zeta G8 (smaller body). It should weigh around 3600-3700lb. With that Hi-Po V-6, it can kick some serious butt. GM can make very good handling cars, so yes I expect to see it at the Ring. I still think, they should have that 4.5l V-8 315hp+ Du-Di in it as an option. That will blow serious balls out.

This car is too big, too heavy and way too late. This car should weigh no more than 3500 lbs., anything else is not going to work. This car will bomb.

[AAS]

This car is too big, too heavy and way too late. This car should weigh no more than 3500 lbs., anything else is not going to work. This car will bomb.

I know... That's why I haven't sold my SS. I can't wait to anybody with a new Camaro!

[Sixty8panther]

Modern cars are heavy... air bags, computers and emissions B.S. are not made of helium.

[toesuf94]

If you look at who is taking the photo of ed posing with his baby, I think you will see it is none other than Maximum Bob Lutz.

And I bet that this car will not bomb...way too sexy for that to happen. I personally cannot wait to blow my kid's college fund on this thing.

[Windy-57]

Yeah, I don't see this car bombing at all. The vast majority of potential Camaro buyers won't notice the B pillar and wouldn't be able to tell the difference in weight anyhow. The car will still look badass inside and out, will still go fast and feel like a muscle car, and will have the growl of a muscle car too. In short, the image will be in tact. And, in the auto industry, image is what matters. Why else do so many more people buy Priuses rather than Camry hybrids??

[Flybrian]

In the same vein as the b-pillar issue, did anyone refuse to buy a 3rd or 4th-generation F-body simply because it was a hatchback? This car is still destined to kick ass and take names whilst doing so.

[Chris_Doane]

Is there any chance that the Atlas inline-6 from the fading GMT360 might find a home in Zeta? It's always been a magnificent engine begging for a decent chassis.

No chance of that.

[hyperv6]

In lines are nice but they are difficult to package in many different cars where a V6 will fit in all of them front wheel drive or rear wheel drive.

It becomes more a case of economics.

[azulSKY]

Is the production model debuting in Detroit this January?

[SS22]

I see some of us are still upset that the b-pillar will be present I have to agree , however I still think this camaro is beautifull. And its been gone way too long! Chevy needs a sporty car right now! its got cobalt and corvette thats it! I truly beleive that those at GM fought with the proverbial bean counters to keep the car a hardtop. I grew up loving the last three generations of camaro with t-tops. A camaro without t-tops (I used to think) was not a camaro. When I first heard of a camaro concept I did not expect one so heavily based on the 69. What I saw was a thouroughly modern car that was still reminescent of early camaro. The downside was apparent pretty soon that this car was not likely to feature t-tops. Very disapointing ! The only band aid on my wound was the idea that the production car would be a hardtop and we know now whats come of that so im pretty disapointed. And for those who insist on stating that a convertible doesnt have pillars so it some how is relevant to a hardtop conversation please respect the fact that the beauty of t-tops and of a hardtop is that you get the sculpted beauty of a coupe open air fun! That said this car is great and can not hit the streets fast enough. I only hope it comes in a bright blue.

[hyperv6]

Is the production model debuting in Detroit this January?

Offically at this point nothing has been said.

It has been mentioned but the Impala concept will be there.

I just have a gut feeling we might see a production based custom. Think along the lined of the 02 G Force GP. It was stock body panels but with bigger wheel flairs, spoilers and such.

But again nothing offical has been said yet. Just note we are on the brink of a media war between the Challanger and Camaro. With the new Dodge coming to Chicago and SEMA I suspect Chevy will not let it go unchallanged.

As for the B pilllar it is time to move on as it is there and it is not the end of the world. We all knew it had a 90% chance of being there. GM had to make a tough choice between cost and weight vs pillar and they made the right choice for the majority.

You can't please everyone. I could see the negitive posts if this car came in at 4100 pounds and well into the 30K price range for a V6. The post would far out number the few that are not willing to accept the B pillar.

If it could have been done easily and cheaply it would have been done but even large companies like GM can't always pull the rabbit out of the hat.

As for the B pillar the case is closed and it is time to move on.

[gm4life]

How come I can't see the photos? I am at work but when I click on the first black one it says something about signing up.

[6t5frlane]

This car is too big, too heavy and way too late. This car should weigh no more than 3500 lbs., anything else is not going to work. This car will bomb.

Well your correct sir. Lets not forgewt that oil barrells today are pushing towards $90.00 and expect to go up. Chevy is late to the party again. Not only that but the Mustang and Challenger are better looking cars. I like the looks of the Camaro from the rear but thats it. I would have to buy a droptop for sure. They look much better then the B coupe. If gas goes $ 4.00 and beyond the lots will be filled with them and any other car that uses a lot of fuel. How many Mustangs will have been sold by 2010?