Short lived GM Engines

[Drew Dowdell]

I'll get the easy ones out of the way first.

8-6-4

ShortStar

DOHC 3.2 V6 <Cadillac CTS>

4100 - "ran" for 4 years... not short enough in my opinion

[vonVeezelsnider]

3800 Series III Supercharged 2004-2007

[Robert Hall]

There were various small (under 300 CID) versions of GM V8s that were short lived from the mid '70s-early '80s.

Chevy 262 (75-76)

Chevy 267 (79-82)

Pontiac: 265 (80-81)

Olds: 260 (75-82)

Edited March 27, 2008 by moltar

[Robert Hall]

Buick apparently had a 300 from '64-67 and a 340 from '66-67.

[SuperSport623]

DZ code 302 from the 67-69 Camaro Z28... i LOVE this motor!

[z28luvr01]

The DOHC 3.4: 91-97

Vortec 8100: 01-06

[Robert Hall]

Vortec 8100: 01-06

The Vortec 8100 was a derivative of the old BBC (427, 454,etc), I think? So is it dead now? No more big blocks?

[schuby87]

LT5

[SuperSport623]

LT4!

and of course, the 3800...

oh...wait

[Hudson]

4100 - "ran" for 4 years... not short enough in my opinion

But didn't the 4100 remain in production (notice how I avoided "ran") from 1982 through 1988?

[Robert Hall]

But didn't the 4100 remain in production (notice how I avoided "ran") from 1982 through 1988?

Ya, then became a 4.5 then later a 4.9 until '95.

Interesting factoids about the HT 4100 from Wikipedia:

"The HT4100 may not have been the most successful engine to sit under the hood of a Cadillac, (some people called it Hook and Tow), but customers were no more satisfied with the other two engines available at the time, the V8-6-4 and the Oldsmobile 5.9L Diesel. Kits were sold to retrofit the cars with Chevrolet engines (Buick and Oldsmobile V6s would also fit, but were much harder to install)."

Apparently, the engine block was porous and oil would leak through it...wierd.

[toesuf94]

Buick 364 Nailhead - 57 - 59.

Buick 322 Nailhead - 53 - 56

Blocks, heads and hardparts do not mix between ANY of the nailhead lines due to width and displacement changes. Fun to find parts, let me tell you!

Oh, and the GNx Grand national 3.8 Turbo

[chevelle454]

4.3 Turbo in the Syclone/Typhoon

Olds 215 Turbo v-8

Pontiac 265 and 301

Pontiac OHC six

Turbo 1.8/2.0 in the J car

[ehaase]

There was a Buick 4.1L V6 from 1980 to 1984, I think. There was also a 3.2L Buick V6 in the late 1970's and a 3.3L Chevrolet V6 in the same time frame. All were weak performers.

[Drew Dowdell]

But didn't the 4100 remain in production (notice how I avoided "ran") from 1982 through 1988?

my mistake, I thought it ended in '86 and became the 4.5 in '87. Two years longer than four too many.

[Drew Dowdell]

There was a 4.3 litre V6 diesel, transverse mounted in the A-bodies if I recall. Apparently they got amazing gas mileage but didn't suffer the same problems the 350d had. They just suffered from it's reputation.

[Drew Dowdell]

Ya, then became a 4.5 then later a 4.9 until '95.

Interesting factoids about the HT 4100 from Wikipedia:

"The HT4100 may not have been the most successful engine to sit under the hood of a Cadillac, (some people called it Hook and Tow), but customers were no more satisfied with the other two engines available at the time, the V8-6-4 and the Oldsmobile 5.9L Diesel. Kits were sold to retrofit the cars with Chevrolet engines (Buick and Oldsmobile V6s would also fit, but were much harder to install)."

Apparently, the engine block was porous and oil would leak through it...wierd.

Technically, with the exception of hearse and livery service, the 8-6-4 and 4100 were never sold at the same time.

[gmpartsgirl]

The DOHC 3.4: 91-97

Dammit, you beat me to it. What a scary engine, I only know one guy whos willing to even try to work on one.

[balthazar]

>>"Buick 364 Nailhead - 57 - 59"<<

364 ran thru '61.

Chevy Copper-Cooled 4 : '23

Chevy ZL-1 427 : '69

[chevelle454]

Chevy also made a 3.8 v6 It was 229 Cubic inches instead of 231 like the Buick

Chevette Diesel engine(made by Isuzu)

6.0 Lq4 with Iron heads, I think it was only made in 99

2.3 Quad OHC from the 90's

3.1 Turbo

3.4 RWD in 4th Gen F-body

Chevy 409 61-65

427 Version of the 409

Pontiac Turbo 301

[SuperSport623]

IIRC, the Pontiac 4 cylinder (194?) that was in the IRS pre 64 tempest...

[loki]

technically all concept engines fit this. production... <10 for sure.

[Drew Dowdell]

Dammit, you beat me to it. What a scary engine, I only know one guy whos willing to even try to work on one.

I am another one of those guys. I actually like that engine. And it was a 215hp DOHC V6 in a time where V6s were hot if they even got close to 200hp.

Some of it's contemporaries:

Ford Mustang - 4.9 litre 215hp V8

BMW 5-series - 3.0 litre 215hp V8

Toyota Avalon - 3.0 litre 192hp V6

Ford Taurus SHO - 3.0 litre 220hp V6 - and this is where I get to point out to SHO fans that while the Cutlass supreme coupe has 5 less HP, it also weighs 200lbs less.

[gmpartsgirl]

It was a bad boy for it's time no doubt. Loved it, but if you still own one and can't work on it yourself, it could be a financial nightmare. We've had to resurrect a few that were almost destroyed by independent mechanics who shouldn't have touched it.

[Drew Dowdell]

It was a bad boy for it's time no doubt. Loved it, but if you still own one and can't work on it yourself, it could be a financial nightmare. We've had to resurrect a few that were almost destroyed by independent mechanics who shouldn't have touched it.

Luckily for me, I know enough about the engine that even if I can't work on it myself, I know what questions to ask of any would-be mechanic.

I did own one a while back.... and I probably will again.

[Hudson]

There was also a 3.2L Buick V6 in the late 1970's and a 3.3L Chevrolet V6 in the same time frame. All were weak performers.

If my memory serves me, I think you have those engines backwards. The 3.2L was a Chevrolet V6 while the 3.3L was a version of the 3.8L Buick engine.

One rare powertrain combination I always wanted was the Oldsmobile Cutlass Supreme with the 260cid V8 diesel (there's a rare engine for you) mated to a 5-speed manual....they built them but I've never heard of anyone having one.

[Drew Dowdell]

One rare powertrain combination I always wanted was the Oldsmobile Cutlass Supreme with the 260cid V8 diesel (there's a rare engine for you) mated to a 5-speed manual....they built them but I've never heard of anyone having one.

I can't imagine why.

[Hudson]

I can't imagine why.

Why I'd want one...or why I'd never seen one?

[Robert Hall]

If my memory serves me, I think you have those engines backwards. The 3.2L was a Chevrolet V6 while the 3.3L was a version of the 3.8L Buick engine.

One rare powertrain combination I always wanted was the Oldsmobile Cutlass Supreme with the 260cid V8 diesel (there's a rare engine for you) mated to a 5-speed manual....they built them but I've never heard of anyone having one.

I remember Car and Driver or Motor Trend doing a road test of one of those back in the day...don't think I've ever seen one, though.

[Drew Dowdell]

Why I'd want one...or why I'd never seen one?

uh.... both. :AH-HA_wink:

[chevelle454]

If my memory serves me, I think you have those engines backwards. The 3.2L was a Chevrolet V6 while the 3.3L was a version of the 3.8L Buick engine.

One rare powertrain combination I always wanted was the Oldsmobile Cutlass Supreme with the 260cid V8 diesel (there's a rare engine for you) mated to a 5-speed manual....they built them but I've never heard of anyone having one.

There was a buick 3.2 v6 in the 70's, a buick 3.0 in the mid 80's and a buick 3.3 in the early 90's, and of course the 4.1 4bbl version of the 80s. All based on the 3.8

Chevy also made a 3.3 in 78 and 79. I had one in my 78 Malibu Coupe. It ran much better without all that emissions junk on it. The dual jet carb sucked though. It was a cut down Quadrajet with the secondaries removed. Therliest ones were even used the quadrajet casting.

Edited March 29, 2008 by chevelle454

[Cory Wolfe]

While still in production, it seems like it's going to die having never been used outside of GMT360s... The Atlas I6.

[ehaase]

There was a buick 3.2 v6 in the 70's, a buick 3.0 in the mid 80's and a buick 3.3 in the early 90's, and of course the 4.1 4bbl version of the 80s. All based on the 3.8

Chevy also made a 3.3 in 78 and 79.

This is exactly what I remember. I remember driving a Malibu with the 3.3 when I was getting driving lessons as a teenager I told the driving instructor that the car was too slow, and he said it's fast enough.

[PurdueGuy]

Saturn LK0 - 1.9L TBI SOHC: '91-'94

(Linda doesn't count, though, due to it being basically the same engine as the L24 MPFI SOHC used from '95-'02, as well as sharing a lot of parts with the LL0 DOHC.)

Could get into the 3.0L V6 used by Saturn in the L-Series and Vue, which was somewhat short lived *in this market.* ('00-'05 in the L, '02-'03? in the Vue)

[Sixty8panther]

Olds Turbo-BOP-215 V8 is one of those holy grails I'd love to have!

(I'd drop it in a '59 Buick or mabe a '30s Chevy hot rod)

How about the198 cu. in. fireball V6 that my '62 Buick had...

[Satty]

Could get into the 3.0L V6 used by Saturn in the L-Series and Vue, which was somewhat short lived *in this market.* ('00-'05 in the L, '02-'03? in the Vue)

Also used in the Catera and 9-5, I believe.

[PurdueGuy]

Also used in the Catera and 9-5, I believe.

Ah, that sounds right (at least the Catera, I don't know Saabs very well at all). I used to think the L-Series & the Catera were on the same platform, because they used the same engine and were both rebadged european cars (both opels? Vectra & ??). Then someone pointed out that the Catera was RWD... oops.

[Drew Dowdell]

Saturn LK0 - 1.9L TBI SOHC: '91-'94

(Linda doesn't count, though, due to it being basically the same engine as the L24 MPFI SOHC used from '95-'02, as well as sharing a lot of parts with the LL0 DOHC.)

Could get into the 3.0L V6 used by Saturn in the L-Series and Vue, which was somewhat short lived *in this market.* ('00-'05 in the L, '02-'03? in the Vue)

The 3.0 was also used in the Catera for it's entire run. It's an obscure engine, but not a short lived one.

[balthazar]

>>"Olds Turbo-BOP-215 V8 is one of those holy grails I'd love to have! (I'd drop it in a '59 Buick...)"<<

You'd replace a 325 HP motor for a 215-HP unit ??? {Where's the cuckoo clock emoticon?!?} :wink:

[Camino LS6]

Two important engines have been missed here so far.

The very first Chevy smallblock: the 1955/56 265

and

The 1970 450 HP LS6 454 (a detuned LS6 was available in the '71 Vette)

[SuperSport623]

a beast of a motor i love!:

1970-1972 LT-1!

Solid lifters, factory holley carb, 11:1 compression.....

[Hudson]

There was a buick 3.2 v6 in the 70's, a buick 3.0 in the mid 80's and a buick 3.3 in the early 90's, and of course the 4.1 4bbl version of the 80s. All based on the 3.8

Chevy also made a 3.3 in 78 and 79. I had one in my 78 Malibu Coupe. It ran much better without all that emissions junk on it. The dual jet carb sucked though. It was a cut down Quadrajet with the secondaries removed. Therliest ones were even used the quadrajet casting.

I think I was confusing the old 3.2L V6 offered in the Monza (which must have been Buick-derived). When I looked it up, there was a 3.3L (200cid) version of the small block-based V6 in addition to the 3.8L (229cid) and long-lived 4.3L (262cid) engines.

[traumadog]

There was a 4.3 litre V6 diesel, transverse mounted in the A-bodies if I recall. Apparently they got amazing gas mileage but didn't suffer the same problems the 350d had. They just suffered from it's reputation.

Hey - the 350 diesel only lasted a few years too. Makes me wonder how hard it'll be if I'll have to scrounge for parts.

[toesuf94]

Hey - the 350 diesel only lasted a few years too. Makes me wonder how hard it'll be if I'll have to scrounge for parts.

I have a guy who is a huge 350 Diesel fan - everything he has to drive had one in it - including a Cutlass Supreme with FACTORY T-tops! Anywho, he bought the last three crate engines that he could get his hands on to keep his fleet running and was told that GM pushed the rest of them into a shredder somewhere. So your scrounging may be confined to fist sized chunks if his story was true. This was about 6-7 years ago. Anyone have any more on this?

And I wonder how many 1981 Cutlass Supreme Diesels were equiped with t-tops!

[traumadog]

Dunno - but I do know they only made 11,765 Eldorados with the diesel that year, so I'm in pretty rare company already. I also have a spare block in my garage, too. I'm just hoping I don't have to take it off the road anytime soon.

[Drew Dowdell]

If you can get yourself one of the later GM Goodwrench replacement engines... snag it. They have all of the upgrades that the engine should have gotten at the beginning and are fairly bullet proof.

[traumadog]

If you can get yourself one of the later GM Goodwrench replacement engines... snag it. They have all of the upgrades that the engine should have gotten at the beginning and are fairly bullet proof.

IIRC, the two blocks I have are both DX blocks, so I should be good there. Big thing I guess is to find some ARP hardware to replace the head bolts, though that's not a priority for me ATM.

Edited March 31, 2008 by traumadog

[Hudson]

Hey - the 350 diesel only lasted a few years too. Makes me wonder how hard it'll be if I'll have to scrounge for parts.

They produced the 350 diesel from 1978 through 1985, as I recall.

[chevelle454]

Dont forget the 1969 ZL-1 All aluminum 427. Rated a ridiculously low 430 hP, but dyno tests show it closer to 560 hp with the headers that would com in the trunk of the car.

1965 396/425 HP

Then there was stuff like the GMC 305 v6 in the 60's

[cletus8269]

lest we forget the hemi-slaying L79's in the 66 nova's?