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Mercury will compliment Lincoln


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Ford Motor Co. will reposition Mercury as an entry-level premium brand that will support Lincoln, according to senior executives.

Lincoln will no longer get any smaller vehicles, as had been planned, while Mercury will only get smaller cars and crossovers, said Derrick Kuzak, Ford's global product chief.

"Mercury and Lincoln will complement each other," Kuzak told The Detroit News Thursday. "Lincoln will start with midsized sedans and move up from there."

http://www.detnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/artic.../807260344/1148

This explains why the Sable will not be returning with the 2010 Taurus and why the Mountaineer has been left for dead.

For the sake of sales, I would hope they still keep a Milan midsize and then move the MKZ further upmarket. Or, if they develop a midsize RWD platform in the future, put the MKZ on it and give Lincoln a true CTS/3-series/C-class competitor.

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wow, great plan. GM, you listening?

"Mercury brings a younger, more female customer than the Ford brand," Kuzak said during a briefing with reporters earlier Thursday. "We're focusing (Mercury) very much on small, fuel-efficient products."

exactly! have i not said this already? its always about women buys! and women don't want a 'ford'. and lincoln was too gray for them too.

women are always about image and the superficial. to keep lincoln and Jill means now ford has some outlet for this bunch.

If Saturn had a clue this is what they would do with themselves......pitch to women. women don't want a 'chevy'. that's also why you just can't have chevy and cadillac only. women will never just want a chevy. they're too shallow, no matter how good you make the product.

Edited by regfootball
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"Mercury brings a younger, more female customer than the Ford brand," Kuzak said during a briefing with reporters earlier Thursday. "We're focusing (Mercury) very much on small, fuel-efficient products."

Wow...

How many times have I said this on these boards?

Looks like Ford has it's sh*t together... If only GM we so decisive.

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Arent you bashing GM for bringing more FWD, 4cyl, smaller cars to the market at the expense of RWD, V8 powered cars? So FOrd has its $h! together, but GM doesn't, even though they have similar plans, Ford just has fewer brands to cover, which makes it a hell of a lot easier.

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So I guess Mercury will become the higher volume partner of the Lincoln-Mercury combo now? Just a few months ago, Ford was claiming that Mercury would be downplayed in order to push Lincoln into the limelight and higher volume. I still think that Lincoln could handle the entire premium segment on its own, but at least this plan is much better than the current setup. With Mercury becoming a small premium car specialist to complement Lincoln's role as midsize-to-large premium car specialist, Mercury will at last be relevant once again and no longer an in-house competitor or cannibalizer of Ford Division sales. The results of this plan should prove to be very interesting and exciting.

Although I don't fully agree with the plan, it still seems like Ford is finally starting to get its act together. I have high hopes for their future.

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Arent you bashing GM for bringing more FWD, 4cyl, smaller cars to the market at the expense of RWD, V8 powered cars? So FOrd has its $h! together, but GM doesn't, even though they have similar plans, Ford just has fewer brands to cover, which makes it a hell of a lot easier.

I never said anything about GM bringing FWD cars to market at the expense of RWD cars. I want both Zeta and Epsilon (as I have expressed numerous times) not just Epsilon.

I am not a diehard BOF RWD V8 fan. I just want the option of having a V8 RWD car. I never said anything about offering less FWD cars (In fact, I was championing the G3 in the Pontiac section.)

Edited by FUTURE_OF_GM
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so will merc loose the sable again? i guess merc will keep the milan? so the mountaineer will be axed...and grand marquis

just milan, mariner and something smaller will survive? ..ala buick, but smaller. lol

this does make lots of sense.

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Milan and Mariner sell huge to women who can not stomach a Ford name on their car.

To add a compact Mercury is brilliant as you can sell that to the same anti Ford women.

I would not have killed the Sable. Oh well.

I think Mercury will need some sort of coupe or roadster in this scenario. I would get them a unique 3 row vehicle also.

Mercury will need one 'brand defining' vehicle....that is what i see missing here, unfortunately.

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Maybe declaring a premium stance justifies bringing Euro Fords here as Mercurys.

Can a Capri or a Cougar come of it is my question....

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In the next 5 years or so, I can see Mercury having a Mariner (Ecosport or Kuga?), Milan, C-Max, Euro Focus, and a small coupe (like that Capri sketch that was shown a while ago).

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I just don't get the excitement. Mercury and Lincoln are the most boring brands ever.

When I see that Lincoln MKZ I just cringe. How to destroy a luxury brand.

It looks like a tarted up Mazda. Think of it!...a Mazda Lincoln!....what the hell has happened

to the great American car?!

And Mercury, well, I bet it will continue on as rebadged whatever and die a slow death.

It hasn't been anything close to unique since the early 60s and the original Cougar...

why does anyone think that will change?

I don't even know what a Mercury is. What is a Mercury? It conjures up nothing. Ford

destoryed the differences between Ford and Mercury a long time ago. And sales have

steadily declined as a result.

Here in Canada, Mercury has been gone since 1999 with the exception of the Grand Marquis

which is badged a Mercury but sold as a Ford.

Ford is the Ford F-150. Cars hasn't been their thing since they destroyed the Taurus. Now Ford

is getting all innovative with all these new plans. Remains to be seen. Ford has had many plans

that have amounted to nothing. This better work or they are in deeper $h!.

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To me, the upcoming revised relationship between Mercury and Lincoln would be very different from what it is today. Mercury will be given exclusive vehicles that will not directly overlap with Ford Division's mainstream, volume products, or Lincoln's midsize-large premium products.

Here's what I see happening with the current Mercury lineup:

* Sable: Discontinued when the 2010 Ford Taurus reaches the market. No replacement planned since it would overlap with the MKS and be out of step with the future premium small car role the corporation assigned to Mercury.

* Mountaineer: Discontinued when the next gen unibody Explorer reaches the market. The truck/SUV market is shrinking and Ford is more than capable of handling this segment on its own. Besides, the Mountaineer is a midsize SUV and Mercury will focus on compact class or smaller products.

* Grand Marquis: Discontinued. This ancient product should have been retired years ago. A full size RWD sedan will not be in Mercury's future since this product would be out of step with the division's new premium small car role in the revised Lincoln-Mercury combo division.

* Milan: Will survive as a midsize sedan until the next gen Fusion/MKZ go into production for the 2012 model year. The next generation will shrink to compact size to slot below the next generation MKZ in Lincoln-Mercury's combined lineup and be based on the C1 platform. I would like to see them continue to use the Milan name for this downsized vehicle.

* Mariner: Will survive in its current form until a C1 based premium compact crossover can be developed and produced for the combined Lincoln-Mercury division. This crossover would be more premium than the current Mariner and would slot below the MKX in Lincoln-Mercury's crossover lineup. I do hope that the Mariner name is retained for the next generation C1 based product.

I think the future Lincoln-Mercury lineup would look something like this:

* Mercury Lynx: Premium subcompact 3-door/5-door/wagon on the B3 platform ("New Mercury small car in 2010"?).

* Mercury Tracer: Premium subcompact crossover on B3 platform.

* Mercury Milan: Premium compact sedan/coupe-cabrio/wagon on the C1 platform.

* Mercury Mariner: Premium compact crossover on C1 platform.

* Mercury Capri: Premium RWD retractable hardtop roadster on the Mazda MX-5 platform.

* Mercury Cougar: Premium RWD coupe-cabrio based on an IRS version of the Mustang D2C platform.

* Lincoln MKZ: Premium midsize sedan/coupe-cabrio/wagon on the EUCD platform.

* Lincoln MKX: Premium midsize crossover on the EUCD platform.

* Lincoln MKS: Premium large sedan on the D3 platform.

* Lincoln MKC: Premium large crossover on the D4 platform ("New Lincoln 7-passenger crossover in mid-2009"?). Styling based on the MKT Concept.

* Lincoln MK9: Premium Flagship RWD 4 door coupe based on the MKR Concept.

Note: I added wagons to the Lynx, Milan, and MKZ lines in case Ford still plans on expanding Lincoln-Mercury beyond the U.S. market.

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I just don't get the excitement. Mercury and Lincoln are the most boring brands ever.

When I see that Lincoln MKZ I just cringe. How to destroy a luxury brand.

It looks like a tarted up Mazda. Think of it!...a Mazda Lincoln!....what the hell has happened

to the great American car?!

And Mercury, well, I bet it will continue on as rebadged whatever and die a slow death.

It hasn't been anything close to unique since the early 60s and the original Cougar...

why does anyone think that will change?

I don't even know what a Mercury is. What is a Mercury? It conjures up nothing. Ford

destoryed the differences between Ford and Mercury a long time ago. And sales have

steadily declined as a result.

Here in Canada, Mercury has been gone since 1999 with the exception of the Grand Marquis

which is badged a Mercury but sold as a Ford.

Ford is the Ford F-150. Cars hasn't been their thing since they destroyed the Taurus. Now Ford

is getting all innovative with all these new plans. Remains to be seen. Ford has had many plans

that have amounted to nothing. This better work or they are in deeper $h!.

Harley, I don't think you're giving Ford credit where it is due, especially when it comes to the cars. Mustang, Fusion, Five Hundred/Taurus are all excellent vehicles; the Taurus' big problem is its looks, but mechanically it is probably one of the best built vehicles Ford has produced in decades. And the 2010 Taurus / Taurus SHO could be like 1986 all over again.

Ford's plans for Mercury include no more rebadging of Ford NA vehicles; for example, they will get the Euro Focus while Ford will keep the cheaper Focus. I've also heard they will have their own unique models, which is what we have been clamoring for. I don't know why so many people want this brand to die, because once it's gone it will never come back like Oldsmobile. Mercury has been lost in the shuffle the last few years, but Mulally plan is sound and will bring back both Ford and Lincoln. It's just going to take time.

I don't even know what a Mercury is. What is a Mercury? It conjures up nothing.

That is exactly what will save this brand. It has no baggage.

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You know, I keep spotting Mercury Milans being driven by Mercury's self described target market; The mid-20s, stylish, woman, not yet married, who 5 years ago would have ended up in a Jetta and would gag on the prospect of driving a Ford.

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Trust me on this....I don't want Mercury to die. I want Plymouth back. AMC. Oldsmobile.

I was stating some realities of Ford's neglect of Mercury. If they actually make this brand

relevent, I'll applaud them. I'm all for American companies to compete and succeed wildly.

Ford has had a few of these public announcements of upcoming plans that haven't come

to fruition. I'll believe it when I see it. I'm not hopeful about Mercury. Ford just loves

rebadging. I mean look at the ridiculous Lincoln pickup. Can it be anymore obvious this

is a Ford F-150?

I wish them well. I want them to succeed and Chrysler too.

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Ford just loves

rebadging. I mean look at the ridiculous Lincoln pickup. Can it be anymore obvious this

is a Ford F-150?

I've read that that turd is being dropped..(Mark LT). Was a bit more successful than it's equally lame predecessor, the Blackwood. The F150 Platinum replaces it. The idea of luxury pickups still seems a bit absurd to me.

Edited by moltar
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I've read that that turd is being dropped..(Mark LT). Was a bit more successful than it's equally lame predecessor, the Blackwood. The F150 Platinum replaces it. The idea of luxury pickups still seems a bit absurd to me.

It made sense when the Blackwood came out. People were buying trucks and luxury SUVs in droves, it seemed logical that there would be a market for a luxury pickup. The Blackwood failed because it was RWD only and had a carpeted bed that wasn't very practical. Cadillac did it much better with the Escalade EXT.

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Trust me on this....I don't want Mercury to die. I want Plymouth back. AMC. Oldsmobile.

Bringing back a brand (Plymouth, Olds, DeSoto) is one thing. It's all but impossible to bring back a whole company (AMC, Studebaker)...the only people capable these days are the Chinese.

I was stating some realities of Ford's neglect of Mercury. If they actually make this brand

relevent, I'll applaud them.

It's not too late. They have plenty of options, if they have the cash (and care).

I'm all for American companies to compete and succeed wildly.

Ford has had a few of these public announcements of upcoming plans that haven't come

to fruition. I'll believe it when I see it. I'm not hopeful about Mercury. Ford just loves

rebadging. I mean look at the ridiculous Lincoln pickup. Can it be anymore obvious this

is a Ford F-150?

I wish them well. I want them to succeed and Chrysler too.

Unlike a lot of folks who would seemingly be happy if the Detroit three went the way of the British companies (bought out by every other country if not folded) while they chug along pissing away our money to Japan (Honda, Toyota) and Germany (BMW, Mercedes). And you're right, same-market badge engineering does us no favors. Pontiacs that are Chevys with a red arrowhead gotta go too.

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I never said anything about GM bringing FWD cars to market at the expense of RWD cars. I want both Zeta and Epsilon (as I have expressed numerous times) not just Epsilon.

I am not a diehard BOF RWD V8 fan. I just want the option of having a V8 RWD car. I never said anything about offering less FWD cars (In fact, I was the G3 in the Pontiac section.)

RWD cars have been a small niche at GM for over a decade...FWD V6 models have been their mainstay as far as cars..but I can see more FWD cars for GM at the expense of RWD/4wd trucks and SUVs, which was their other mainstay over the last decade.

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Cars and trucks are not boxes of laundry detergent.

This is not just a business, and these aren't just products.

It's much more than that. They are an emotional thing,

have become a part of us. It's like they become part

of our personna. Soap doesn't do that for me.

So I don't want to see a Pontiac grill insert on a Cobalt

and call it a day. It's a very cynical act.

Just say no to rebadging.

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I just don't get the excitement. Mercury and Lincoln are the most boring brands ever.

When I see that Lincoln MKZ I just cringe. How to destroy a luxury brand.

It looks like a tarted up Mazda. Think of it!...a Mazda Lincoln!....what the hell has happened

to the great American car?!

And Mercury, well, I bet it will continue on as rebadged whatever and die a slow death.

It hasn't been anything close to unique since the early 60s and the original Cougar...

why does anyone think that will change?

I don't even know what a Mercury is. What is a Mercury? It conjures up nothing. Ford

destoryed the differences between Ford and Mercury a long time ago. And sales have

steadily declined as a result.

Here in Canada, Mercury has been gone since 1999 with the exception of the Grand Marquis

which is badged a Mercury but sold as a Ford.

Ford is the Ford F-150. Cars hasn't been their thing since they destroyed the Taurus. Now Ford

is getting all innovative with all these new plans. Remains to be seen. Ford has had many plans

that have amounted to nothing. This better work or they are in deeper $h!.

oh geez. ford has DIRECTION. GM does not. who's in deeper $h!?

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Cars and trucks are not boxes of laundry detergent.

This is not just a business, and these aren't just products.

It's much more than that. They are an emotional thing,

have become a part of us. It's like they become part

of our personna. Soap doesn't do that for me.

So I don't want to see a Pontiac grill insert on a Cobalt

and call it a day. It's a very cynical act.

Just say no to rebadging.

toyota hyundai subaru kia etc.

yeah, they aren't just 'products'.

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RWD cars have been a small niche at GM for over a decade...FWD V6 models have been their mainstay as far as cars..but I can see more FWD cars for GM at the expense of RWD/4wd trucks and SUVs, which was their other mainstay over the last decade.

FWD 4 cylinder cars and small crossovers are the new mainstream.

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I don't want to see a Pontiac grill insert on a Cobalt

and call it a day. It's a very cynical act.

Just say no to rebadging.

Yeah, at least give it a front and rear end treatment that looked like you cared, if not greenhouse and interior tweaks. Just putting arrowheads, ribbons, or waterfalls where bowties, ram faces, or blue ovals once were is pathetic.

FWD 4 cylinder cars and small crossovers are the new mainstream.

Drive wheels don't matter so much as general efficiency and bang-for-the-buck.

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Cars and trucks are not boxes of laundry detergent.

This is not just a business, and these aren't just products.

It's much more than that. They are an emotional thing,

have become a part of us. It's like they become part

of our personna. Soap doesn't do that for me.

I just read an interesting post on the Ivory Snow forums where they were reminiscing over the death of the Salvo Soap drop in pellets. :mind-blowing:

Mercury has gone this European car import route before and failed. These are different times, however. It should be interesting.

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Mercury has gone this European car import route before and failed. These are different times, however. It should be interesting.

Those cars weren't badged Ford, Mercury, or Lincoln. Folks might have responded differently if the cars came here as Ford (or Mercury) Sapphire and Lincoln Scorpio.

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Mercury needs to make the Premier trim package the base for their cars, so their base model is like the loaded Ford. The Milan should be their biggest vehicle, discontinue the big stuff. Mercury could be the outlet for the Kuga, C-Max and/or Euro Focus. They'll put the Fiesta at Ford dealerships. Small to midsize with a well made interior, good gas mileage and handling that feels solid and secure could attract women of all ages.

The Milan/Fusion hybrid should be strong sellers, they will get about 9 mpg city more than the Malibu/Aura hybrid.

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I think this is a great idea. One of the biggest problems, it seems to me, that the big three have is a lack of distinct space between brands. They are called divisions after all.

GM has this obsession to give every brand a full, "traditional" line-up with a car in every possible niche and style. The differences have to be more than even different sheetmetal. Each brand has to truly stand for something, and the brand image must be absolute. Even if some Bavarian decided that it would be neat to do a FWD BMW, it would never happen because the company knows that it wouldn't fit in with the brand image. Ferrari is never going to do a small, economical hatchback. American brands need to cater to a specific brand image and stick to it unflinchingly.

I love these companies, and I complain because I care. It frustrates me that even I can see the potential that is there in brands that some deem hopless, but instead of truly striving to become great they make cars only caring about trying to make a decent profit.

Sorry about ranting a bit there, but I like cars.

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wow, great plan. GM, you listening?

exactly! have i not said this already? its always about women buys! and women don't want a 'ford'. and lincoln was too gray for them too.

women are always about image and the superficial. to keep lincoln and Jill means now ford has some outlet for this bunch.

If Saturn had a clue this is what they would do with themselves......pitch to women. women don't want a 'chevy'. that's also why you just can't have chevy and cadillac only. women will never just want a chevy. they're too shallow, no matter how good you make the product.

Wow................ interesting view of women, you have there.

Just like not all men are penis's with legs, not all women are always about image and the superficial.

Based on your image of women, all you would need, to sell cars to women, is have them all come with 25 free pairs of shoes. :rolleyes:

Sorry to call you on it, but I HATE stereotypes, and being stereotyped.

That said, I think this plan that Ford has looks like a good one. Please let Mulally stick around long enough to see it through. All the naysayers need to sit back and watch. Let Fords actions speak for themselves. To say that they can't change, is to say that the Domestic auto industry is doomed to mediocrity............ so why bother. I expect my 6-year-old to be able to walk into his local Ford or Chevy store and have his choice of vehicles, when the time comes.............. so they had better make it. There is no choice.

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So Mercury is the women's division.

Ford is the men's.

Where does that leave Lincoln?

Most of the Lincolns I see are driven by older guys, although I'm starting to see a lot more younger, twenty and thirtysomething females behind the wheel (especially for the MKX).

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nice try

o CMON its not like Mercury's whole marketing message the last few years hasnt already been to pander to the woman buyer

What does that have to do with the price of tea in China???

In other words, what does the Mercury marketing have to do with "all women are about the image and the superficial?"

Then there are these gems:

women will never just want a chevy. they're too shallow, no matter how good you make the product.
Milan and Mariner sell huge to women who can not stomach a Ford name on their car

You must have had a bunch of great women role models in your life.

Excuse me now, I have to hit the mall to buy a few grand worth of clothes that I will never wear, to add to my collection of 300 pairs of shoes. I won't be able to post tomorrow, as I have to color my hair to get the gray out, get waxed, get botoxed, and have a bit of lipo. After that, I am planning on maxing out some more credit cards on my way to picking up my new "crystaled" blackburry and Iphone. Then I will have a big discussion with my girlfriends, about what totally impressive vehicular nameplate I should buy next.............. since I just cannot be seen in my Ford or Chevy for a moment longer............. while eating massive amounts of way overpriced food that I will need to barf out to maintain my size 00 physique.

Damn, its going to be a busy day. It is tiring being so shallow.

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So Mercury is the women's division.

Ford is the men's.

Where does that leave Lincoln?

With the MKX loaded to the max with bulk packages of Depends, a straw hat on the rear bench, and a "Happy Grandparents Day!" card in the console right next to the Metamucil.

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Excuse me now, I have to hit the mall to buy a few grand worth of clothes that I will never wear, to add to my collection of 300 pairs of shoes. I won't be able to post tomorrow, as I have to color my hair to get the gray out, get waxed, get botoxed, and have a bit of lipo. After that, I am planning on maxing out some more credit cards on my way to picking up my new "crystaled" blackburry and Iphone. Then I will have a big discussion with my girlfriends, about what totally impressive vehicular nameplate I should buy next.............. since I just cannot be seen in my Ford or Chevy for a moment longer............. while eating massive amounts of way overpriced food that I will need to barf out to maintain my size 00 physique.

Damn, its going to be a busy day. It is tiring being so shallow.

Just don't get hit with another DUI while picking your kid up from school.

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What does that have to do with the price of tea in China???

In other words, what does the Mercury marketing have to do with "all women are about the image and the superficial?"

Then there are these gems:

You must have had a bunch of great women role models in your life.

Excuse me now, I have to hit the mall to buy a few grand worth of clothes that I will never wear, to add to my collection of 300 pairs of shoes. I won't be able to post tomorrow, as I have to color my hair to get the gray out, get waxed, get botoxed, and have a bit of lipo. After that, I am planning on maxing out some more credit cards on my way to picking up my new "crystaled" blackburry and Iphone. Then I will have a big discussion with my girlfriends, about what totally impressive vehicular nameplate I should buy next.............. since I just cannot be seen in my Ford or Chevy for a moment longer............. while eating massive amounts of way overpriced food that I will need to barf out to maintain my size 00 physique.

Damn, its going to be a busy day. It is tiring being so shallow.

You're taking this the wrong way. Mercury isn't saying "all women are about the image and the superficial". Mercury is saying "We want to target our ads to women who ARE all about the image and the superficial." There is nothing wrong with identifying a target market.

I have to say, it does seem to be working. I regularly see Milans and Mariners being driven by younger, stylish, professional women.... the sort who stereotypically ended up in Jettas and Passats 5 years ago. The Sable seems to have caught on with older versions of the same type.

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You're taking this the wrong way. Mercury isn't saying "all women are about the image and the superficial". Mercury is saying "We want to target our ads to women who ARE all about the image and the superficial." There is nothing wrong with identifying a target market.

I have to say, it does seem to be working. I regularly see Milans and Mariners being driven by younger, stylish, professional women.... the sort who stereotypically ended up in Jettas and Passats 5 years ago. The Sable seems to have caught on with older versions of the same type.

exactly. again, women who would not be caught dead driving a 'simple' ford. throw another name on it. give it some voga leather. put lipstick in the console and take a picture of it.

not sayin all women are shallow. that was probably the wrong terminology. 'motivated by different factors other than functional utility' maybe was where i was going with it. there has to be a certain level of superficiality in any product that is marketed to women these days. Women refuse to settle for plain. There always has to be an angle.

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Actually reg, since most women are not passionate about driving, they have a tendency to buy based primarily on functional utility.

If they did not, minivans would have never had the sales they had. I just can't see a bunch of guys sitting around a 6-pack, watching the game................. and talking about "stow and go" seating.

Yes there are some shallow, self obsessed women out there................. and yes I am embarassed to be associated with them. However, I by no means think that they are the majority.

Where you got in trouble, was when you painted all women with the same brush. While I am far from the normal woman (love cars/trucks, working on cars/trucks, buying car/truck stuff, hate shopping, and only buy clothes that I absolutally need), I do actually know quite a few women like me.

Now you have to excuse me................. I am off to see the plastic surgeon. We need to talk my latest breast implants (the current ones don't look enough like oversized upside down soup bowls, and DD's are a necessity when you are petitie), my rhinoplasty, chin implants, cheek implants, fat injections, and buttock implants. Yeppers, just another busy day in the life of the shallow female. :) (if someone takes this seriously, I will find you and hurt you)

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Actually reg, since most women are not passionate about driving, they have a tendency to buy based primarily on functional utility.

If they did not, minivans would have never had the sales they had. I just can't see a bunch of guys sitting around a 6-pack, watching the game................. and talking about "stow and go" seating.

Yes there are some shallow, self obsessed women out there................. and yes I am embarassed to be associated with them. However, I by no means think that they are the majority.

Where you got in trouble, was when you painted all women with the same brush. While I am far from the normal woman (love cars/trucks, working on cars/trucks, buying car/truck stuff, hate shopping, and only buy clothes that I absolutally need), I do actually know quite a few women like me.

Now you have to excuse me................. I am off to see the plastic surgeon. We need to talk my latest breast implants (the current ones don't look enough like oversized upside down soup bowls, and DD's are a necessity when you are petitie), my rhinoplasty, chin implants, cheek implants, fat injections, and buttock implants. Yeppers, just another busy day in the life of the shallow female. :) (if someone takes this seriously, I will find you and hurt you)

I think I love you.

Anyhow, Ford seems to have been very successful based on what I see in our service dept. I would guess 70% of our Milan sales have been to women, Mariners even higher. I hope that Mulally's plan works... my job depends on it.

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I think I love you.

Anyhow, Ford seems to have been very successful based on what I see in our service dept. I would guess 70% of our Milan sales have been to women, Mariners even higher. I hope that Mulally's plan works... my job depends on it.

On a side not, hey grandmarquis, how the heck do you get headlights off of a `93 Marquis?

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Now you have to excuse me................. I am off to see the plastic surgeon. We need to talk my latest breast implants (the current ones don't look enough like oversized upside down soup bowls, and DD's are a necessity when you are petitie), my rhinoplasty, chin implants, cheek implants, fat injections, and buttock implants. Yeppers, just another busy day in the life of the shallow female. :) (if someone takes this seriously, I will find you and hurt you)

Hey bimbo, you forgot about your anal and vaginal bleaching appointments.

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Pardon Reg, he's special, and likes to generalize...A LOT.

i am actually thinking i would enjoy chatting w/ lightninggal A LOT. maybe we can get together and talk about SVT's sometime............she'd likely find I'm not exactly the cut and dried all or nothing I purport to be on these message boards, i like to sensationalize for shock value, its just my schtick.

and the best women are the ones who are natural in nearly every way. Its just i see too many these days that aren't happy being themselves or seem to want to buy all the satisfaction in their lives.

We could talk fords all day.

"you had me at buttock implants"

LMAO

While bleaching your anus for the first time we suggest you do it under supervision. You need to be very particular about the quantity of cream and activator you mix. A little in excess might lead to the appearance of rashes or burn the area.
Edited by regfootball
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Wow. I am really impressed! No matter what happens to GM, if Ford keeps using their noggin they will always be around.

+1

Chris

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You know, I keep spotting Mercury Milans being driven by Mercury's self described target market; The mid-20s, stylish, woman, not yet married, who 5 years ago would have ended up in a Jetta and would gag on the prospect of driving a Ford.

Oldsmoboi, I've noticed the exact same thing.

Chris

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I've read that that turd is being dropped..(Mark LT). Was a bit more successful than it's equally lame predecessor, the Blackwood. The F150 Platinum replaces it. The idea of luxury pickups still seems a bit absurd to me.

Yes and no.... the Escalade EXT pulled it off perfectly,

effortlessly, but both the Blackwood and that new

F150 monstrosity with a Lincoln grille are lame.

Edited by Sixty8panther
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Cars and trucks are not boxes of laundry detergent.

This is not just a business, and these aren't just products.

It's much more than that. They are an emotional thing,

have become a part of us. It's like they become part

of our personna. Soap doesn't do that for me.

So I don't want to see a Pontiac grill insert on a Cobalt

and call it a day. It's a very cynical act.

Just say no to rebadging.

I agree 100% H.E.

I'm sick to death with the "can't, won't, impossible, it's not 1963 anymore..." mentality.

Not only is that kind of mediocre mentality prevalent in the world

but here on what is supposed to be a GM enthusiasts' forum I

just can not sit back and listen to the feel-good bullcrap about

how "oh well, winds of change, wht can you do, etc..."

----

P.S. Here in mASS I do see a lot of chicks driving Milans & Mariners.

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As I'm a happily married woman (met my husband in the 4wheeler chatroom, talking trucks), I don't usually look to see if men or women are buying or driving anything. I do, generally, look at age groups, however.............. as I find that interesting. I also make a point to see who is driving 6-cyl Mustangs, since everyone refers to them as "chick" cars. I will admit, I do tend to look at who is driving Dodge trucks. For some reason, they are some of the biggest d*cks on the road. When they wanted to "race" me in my Tribute............... with the little boy in back............. just to prove to me that yes, they have a hemi (like I care). Frankly, what I would like to ask them is "do you have a penis?? Or, is your truck your substitute??"

Wanting to know what women want when they buy cars, is like looking at what men want............... or what anyone wants. It is as individual as the people themselves.

I realize that I am far from the typical woman............. however, my first criteria is: What am I buying this vehicle for?? In other words, what will be its purpose. Once I have determined that, and determined my budget, my next major criteria is: Is this vehicle fun to drive?? That is WAY high on the list. I do not drive boring transportation appliances............... frankly, I would rather be lobotomized. I usually have a pretty good idea of my "possibles" list. It gets narrowed down to the top 2, based on 1) Fun to drive 2) Utility 3) Price and features. I will not even consider a vehicle that I do not feel is reliable. I don't give a crap what CR says. I base my "opinions" on actual owners, and known problems with said vehicles.

When I had to buy my "mommy mobile" I pretty much knew that it was between the Escape and the Tribute. The Tribute was just so much more fun to drive. I don't care if the Escape had the softer ride............... soft ride is a detriment in my book. Handling is king. The Tribute was not as common, had a better warranty, and in my opinion, was better looking than the Escape also. Thus, I bought a Tribute.

The thought of a minivan never even entered the equation. I consider them to be a lobotomy on wheels.

I can see where the Mercury would have more appeal to women than the Ford. It has nothing to do with the badge, and everything to do with the value. Mercury versions, generally speaking, have more features, yet cost little more. They have a better warranty, which is huge. You deal with, again generally speaking, nicer dealerships. Thus, this all appeals to a womans practical side.

You have to remember that the majority of the womens automotive purchases is based on the practical. Unfortunately, passionate rarely enters into it.

In my opinion, why have a long standing "relationship" with a vehicle, if there is no passion.

Now, mind you, I have not covered the "shallow" woman here. I can't, because I cannot relate to her in any way. Just as I cannot relate to the shallow "metrosexual" male. What a pathetic existance, in either case.

BTW, I live in a small forest community. You will find that, unlike the city, the majority of the women do not have perfectly round perky breasts (the most stupid thing I have ever seen in my life). They also, frequently, do not wear makeup............ or much even when they do (I do eyes only......... I wouldn't know how to buy "foundation" if my life depended on it). Its more about the outdoors here, nature, the quality of life, and family............... and much less about "stuff." Thats probably why I love living here. I certainly wasn't a "city girl" even when I lived in the big city.

Reg, I am more than happy to discuss SVT, Ford, cars, trucks, wrenching, 4wheeling, rockcrawling, etc., any time. This is my hobby and my passion. The biggest mistake I made in my life, was selling my 1994 Lightning, when I was pregnant. It did not have the 3rd seat. A gentleman flew from Atlanta GA, to buy my one owner, never abused, never wrecked, high mile Lightning.............. and drove it home. I miss that truck every day of my life (I sold it in early 2002). The 2001 Lightning we had just was not the same (did not have the handling "edge" that the 1994 had). Handling is my passion.

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If I could find a relatively low mile, Toreador Red or Tropic Green (I think I have that right), 2000 SVT Contour............ that has not been used and abused.............. it will be in my driveway. I know all of their known issues.............. and how GREAT they drive.

Where I live, great twisty roads are everywhere. When I used to get mad at my X husband (very often, as he was bipolar), I would take my '91 Mustang GT, that I built, and head out on a road trip. I would go up through Superior and Globe, through the Salt River Canyon, through Pinetop, Lakeside, Springerville, and Alpine.............. and go up to Hannigans Meadow for lunch. That is about 4.5 hours one way. You started in the desert, and ended up having lunch at 10K feet. Boy, that would sure calm me down. I built my Mustang for handling. She could pull over 1G on the skidpad. Slalom speed was over 70mph, and she could brake from 60 in under 115ft (with no antilock). I miss that car too. LOL

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Speaking of dicks, Mustang driver's are some of the biggest assholes ever. Not all of course, but so many drive around and act like their car is the greatest thing evar. There's a guy who owns a flat black Mustang II in the area who is the perfect example of this. Of course I've seen a lot of Jeep driver's who are dicks too, but at least they have creative slogans on their vehicles!

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Speaking of dicks, Mustang driver's are some of the biggest assholes ever. Not all of course, but so many drive around and act like their car is the greatest thing evar. There's a guy who owns a flat black Mustang II in the area who is the perfect example of this. Of course I've seen a lot of Jeep driver's who are dicks too, but at least they have creative slogans on their vehicles!

BMW drivers are often a-holes also. For 7+ years, I owned a Mustang GT, BMW M3, and a Jeep Grand Cherokee...I worked hard to avoid the stereotypes.. :)

My goal in a few years is to have the Jeep, a Mustang GT convertible, and a Cadillac CTS. 1 from each of the Big 3.

Edited by moltar
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Here in AZ, there are a lot of trucks. That is where my observation of Dodge truck drivers (usually the 1/2 tons) comes from. Now, usually its not the older guys who suffer from penile extension syndrome. Its always the 20-somethings (coincidentally, these same 20-somethings are the ones who think they know everything about everything).

I swear to God, one more of them tries to shove their truck up my ass................... I'm going to lock the hubs on the SuperDuty and drive over them............... the whole while, with the 6-year-old in the back watching the DVD player. LOL

Hey, a girl can dream, can't she???

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BMW drivers are often a-holes also. For 7+ years, I owned a Mustang GT, BMW M3, and a Jeep Grand Cherokee...I worked hard to avoid the stereotypes.. :)

My goal in a few years is to have the Jeep, a Mustang GT convertible, and a Cadillac CTS. 1 from each of the Big 3.

I agree about the BMW drivers, ,sometimes Audis and rarely Mercedes.

Speaking of Jeeps, I was in stop-and-go traffic (what else is new) on my way home fromw ork a few weeks ago, and behind me was a last gen Grand Cherokee with a bug gaurd on the front fascia. It had words that were upside down and backwards. Since we weren't moving I had a chance to read it. Took a couple minutes...it said"If you can read this please roll me over"

Jeep owners are nothing if not creative with their slogans. :lol: I'm pretty sure they must be pretty damn loyal to the brand too. Are you planning to buy another Moltar?

Edited by Dodgefan
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I agree about the BMW drivers, ,sometimes Audis and rarely Mercedes.

Speaking of Jeeps, I was in stop-and-go traffic (what else is new) on my way home fromw ork a few weeks ago, and behind me was a last gen Grand Cherokee with a bug gaurd on the front fascia. It had words that were upside down and backwards. Since we weren't moving I had a chance to read it. Took a couple minutes...it said"If you can read this please roll me over"

Jeep owners are nothing if not creative with their slogans. :lol: I'm pretty sure they must be pretty damn loyal to the brand too. Are you planning to buy another Moltar?

Maybe.... thinking about a GC diesel eventually, esp. if I spend winters in Colorado and summers in AZ...(though that seems backwards). I wouldn't mind having a Rubicon at some point also. I need to get a clever Jeep-ish decal for mine...all I have now on the back of mine is a U of Michigan license plate frame, U2 decal, Apple Mac decal, Obama '08 sticker, and a Colorado Rockies decal.

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I once saw a Liberty completely covered in mud on the highway, the people driving/riding in it wrote "please wash me" on the windows.

A GC diesel would be sweet.

I myself really like the new Liberty, as well as the Wrangler Unlimited. Both of those could use diesels.

Edited by Dodgefan
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Here in AZ, there are a lot of trucks. That is where my observation of Dodge truck drivers (usually the 1/2 tons) comes from. Now, usually its not the older guys who suffer from penile extension syndrome. Its always the 20-somethings (coincidentally, these same 20-somethings are the ones who think they know everything about everything).

I swear to God, one more of them tries to shove their truck up my ass................... I'm going to lock the hubs on the SuperDuty and drive over them............... the whole while, with the 6-year-old in the back watching the DVD player. LOL

Hey, a girl can dream, can't she???

get video, cuz I want to see that!

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I swear to God, one more of them tries to shove their truck up my ass................... I'm going to lock the hubs on the SuperDuty and drive over them............... the whole while, with the 6-year-old in the back watching the DVD player. LOL

Hey, a girl can dream, can't she???

There is a scene in the movie "Fried Green Tomatoes" where a middle aged woman in full size Ford sedan gets mad at some young ladies who steal her parking space in their VW convertabile. She repeatedly smashes into their car after they get out to do their shopping.

here's a good taste of it

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There is a scene in the movie "Fried Green Tomatoes" where a middle aged woman in full size Ford sedan gets mad at some young ladies who steal her parking space in their VW convertabile. She repeatedly smashes into their car after they get out to do their shopping.

here's a good taste of it

Lesson there: don't be a douchebag.

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Here in AZ, there are a lot of trucks. That is where my observation of Dodge truck drivers (usually the 1/2 tons) comes from. Now, usually its not the older guys who suffer from penile extension syndrome. Its always the 20-somethings (coincidentally, these same 20-somethings are the ones who think they know everything about everything).

I swear to God, one more of them tries to shove their truck up my ass................... I'm going to lock the hubs on the SuperDuty and drive over them............... the whole while, with the 6-year-old in the back watching the DVD player. LOL

Hey, a girl can dream, can't she???

I've noticed that...there are a lot of trucks here..reminds me of Texas...lots of 4x4s that are lifted on monster tires, which seem absurd in the city and suburbs. And a lot of 2wd SUVs.

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When I was heavily into 4wheeling, there was a Dick Cepek store (which became a 4wheel parts, which became...........) that used to have truck shows in the parking lot. I would take my rockcrawling Explorer to the show. I would clean it all up (white hides the desert pinstriping pretty good) while there, and put out pics of my actual rockcrawling, for people to see. I would pretty much always win a trophy.

The majority of the trucks that would show up, are what I called "cookie cutter Chevy's." These are extended cab, 4wd, 1/2 ton Chevy trucks with lifts. They would be various different colors, all have similar lifts and oversize tires.............. and not one of them would have a scratch on it anywhere.

Today I would call them faux 4wheel drives (since they never go off road). My Mazda Tribute saw more off road than any of those trucks ever pretended to.

They were not amused when I would win a trophy, with my lovely collection of trail souveniers all over my truck............ scuffed and gouged wheels............... and heavily scratched paint.

The funny thing, moltar, is that even with the price of fuel, they still drive these things everywhere. They come through Payson every weekend. Flooring it off the line, darting in and out of traffic, and speeding everywhere. It hasn't changed. They probably get worse mileage in their 1/2 tons, than I get in my 7000lb+ 3/4ton V10.

Reg, while you never have your camcorder with you when you really need it, my phone does take pictures.............. so I promise, if I ever lose it like that (it is amazing how much you have to censor yourself around your child. The other day, when it was pouring rain, and I was going wide to pull into a parking spot, to go to my sons guitar lesson.............. an idiot in an old truck tried to accelerate, and drive through on the inside of my turn. Instead of screaming at him what I really wanted to scream (my truck was 2 weeks old), I just yelled at him "what kind of stupid are you?"), that I will take pictures of the drivers face, and what is left of their vehicle. I really don't think my 10-ply's will mind. A solid front axle is your friend. :)

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the SVT contour had great handling.

That was a car!

My friend David has an SVT Focus...That is a sweet car also.

Chris

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I agree 100% H.E.

I'm sick to death with the "can't, won't, impossible, it's not 1963 anymore..." mentality.

Not only is that kind of mediocre mentality prevalent in the world

but here on what is supposed to be a GM enthusiasts' forum I

just can not sit back and listen to the feel-good bullcrap about

how "oh well, winds of change, wht can you do, etc..."

----

P.S. Here in mASS I do see a lot of chicks driving Milans & Mariners.

Sounds like your an unfunded one man army trying to get carmakers to build cars with ideas/features the general public doesn't want anymore and hasn't wanted for a long time.

Get back to us in about ten years and let us know how it went.

Chris

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When I was heavily into 4wheeling, there was a Dick Cepek store (which became a 4wheel parts, which became...........) that used to have truck shows in the parking lot. I would take my rockcrawling Explorer to the show. I would clean it all up (white hides the desert pinstriping pretty good) while there, and put out pics of my actual rockcrawling, for people to see. I would pretty much always win a trophy.

The majority of the trucks that would show up, are what I called "cookie cutter Chevy's." These are extended cab, 4wd, 1/2 ton Chevy trucks with lifts. They would be various different colors, all have similar lifts and oversize tires.............. and not one of them would have a scratch on it anywhere.

Today I would call them faux 4wheel drives (since they never go off road). My Mazda Tribute saw more off road than any of those trucks ever pretended to.

They were not amused when I would win a trophy, with my lovely collection of trail souveniers all over my truck............ scuffed and gouged wheels............... and heavily scratched paint.

The funny thing, moltar, is that even with the price of fuel, they still drive these things everywhere. They come through Payson every weekend. Flooring it off the line, darting in and out of traffic, and speeding everywhere. It hasn't changed. They probably get worse mileage in their 1/2 tons, than I get in my 7000lb+ 3/4ton V10.

Reg, while you never have your camcorder with you when you really need it, my phone does take pictures.............. so I promise, if I ever lose it like that (it is amazing how much you have to censor yourself around your child. The other day, when it was pouring rain, and I was going wide to pull into a parking spot, to go to my sons guitar lesson.............. an idiot in an old truck tried to accelerate, and drive through on the inside of my turn. Instead of screaming at him what I really wanted to scream (my truck was 2 weeks old), I just yelled at him "what kind of stupid are you?"), that I will take pictures of the drivers face, and what is left of their vehicle. I really don't think my 10-ply's will mind. A solid front axle is your friend. :)

As the Former owner of a rather rusty 69 Ford Bronco, I am a huge fan of rigs that actually go offroad.

Sounds like you had lots of fun with yours.

Chris

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I've noticed that...there are a lot of trucks here..reminds me of Texas...lots of 4x4s that are lifted on monster tires, which seem absurd in the city and suburbs. And a lot of 2wd SUVs.

A lot of the western US is extreme sports country. Surfing, boarding, off-roading, skateboarding. Whipping lifted trucks fits their image.

When I was heavily into 4wheeling, there was a Dick Cepek store (which became a 4wheel parts, which became...........) that used to have truck shows in the parking lot. I would take my rockcrawling Explorer to the show. I would clean it all up (white hides the desert pinstriping pretty good) while there, and put out pics of my actual rockcrawling, for people to see. I would pretty much always win a trophy.

The majority of the trucks that would show up, are what I called "cookie cutter Chevy's." These are extended cab, 4wd, 1/2 ton Chevy trucks with lifts. They would be various different colors, all have similar lifts and oversize tires.............. and not one of them would have a scratch on it anywhere.

Trailer queens.

In general, Chevy is a go-to, no-brainer brand. Huge aftermarket, doesn't require much thought and searching.

Today I would call them faux 4wheel drives (since they never go off road). My Mazda Tribute saw more off road than any of those trucks ever pretended to.

They were not amused when I would win a trophy, with my lovely collection of trail souveniers all over my truck............ scuffed and gouged wheels............... and heavily scratched paint.

The funny thing, moltar, is that even with the price of fuel, they still drive these things everywhere. They come through Payson every weekend. Flooring it off the line, darting in and out of traffic, and speeding everywhere. It hasn't changed. They probably get worse mileage in their 1/2 tons, than I get in my 7000lb+ 3/4ton V10.

They're probably stuck with them. Same posers that would be in a Prius or Civic Hybrid today if they could afford to lose money on a big truck no dealer will take. But they keep them fairly unbeat so that they retain resale value, LOL.

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Ditto on the Chevy as a no thought brand for 4WD.

Have a guy I know from work building a solid Axle non IFS 92 Chevy.

You can get EVERYTHING for those rigs.

Chris

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