Why so many problems witha NEW car

[6t5frlane]

I was looking over at Camaro5 site. I cannot beleive how many problems the new Camaros are having. I really figured since the General took so long to release it Quality would be at the top of the list. Sure new cars have problems but some of this stuff would really piss me off if it were my car. Leaking engines, transmissions, interior issues. body fit all kinds of noises etc. This is the last thing Chevy needs and I hope somebody is listening at GM before the general public finds out

[PurdueGuy]

I was looking over at Camaro5 site. I cannot beleive how many problems the new Camaros are having. I really figured since the General took so long to release it Quality would be at the top of the list. Sure new cars have problems but some of this stuff would really piss me off if it were my car. Leaking engines, transmissions, interior issues. body fit all kinds of noises etc. This is the last thing Chevy needs and I hope somebody is listening at GM before the general public finds out

Are these common problems, or a few isolated cases?

[Camino LS6]

I've heard of no widespread problems such as this.

[deftonesfan867]

I've heard of no widespread problems such as this.

Same here.

[FAPTurbo]

Can we get a few links to these problems?

Glitches often occur in the first year of production anyways, and get ironed out afterwards. I haven't heard of anything widespread, but hopefully GM is taking notice.

[Daryl Z71]

As with any new model vehicle their are always problems. Thats why it's best to wait a while before buying.

[intrigued]

Here is a short list that were all the problems I could find in the last ten days on Camaro5, which is a pro Camaro site.

"my month old car broke already"

http://camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=29893

"anyone else having transmission issues"

http://camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=30415

"launch control = epic fail"

http://camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=30226

"l99 owners with slow car issues"

http://camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=29948

"so we get stuck with the low end tremec??"

http://camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=30370

"transmission clicking"

http://camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=30184

"tranmission clicking when accelerating"

http://camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=29206

"report on my broken SS"

http://camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=30120

"my trunk wont open"

http://camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=29767

"tranmission output shaft problem"

http://camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=29989

"i have no power!"

http://camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=26635

"tranmission clicking noise"

http://camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=28696

"bad paint on new ss"

http://camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=28641

"more bad paint on cars held in QC"

http://camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=29737

"whining noise from transmission"

http://camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=29202

"24 hours old back in the shop!"

http://camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=29758

"trunk opening issue"

http://camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=29559

"interior is starting to fall apart?"

http://camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=28686

"interior panel issues"

http://camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=27588

"power steering went out and trunk not opening"

http://camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=28471

"7 day old car wont start!"

http://camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=28096

"engine keeps dying"

http://camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=25608

Some of these are really terrible issues and this is just a small cross section of complaints I've read online. The new Camaro has been disapointing to me so far.

The most common "really really bad" issue is the manual tranny sh!tting the bed, with broken halfshafts amoung other things when launched, especially in conjunction with GMs launch control.

[Intrepidation]

Wow.

[Camino LS6]

interesting.

Not enough meaningful information to make any real assessments though.

Except that some transmission castings were bad.

[Intrepidation]

You know about 13 Tundras had camshaft failures and we made the biggest deal over it.

In either case, that warrants a recall in my book.

[FAPTurbo]

Some of those are really bad. I was a bit amused with the ones regarding the paint, and how people were telling the dude to go to a shop to get it done just so he can keep the low VIN. I think the last thing on my mind in a situation like that would be what order the car came out of the plant.

[A Horse With No Name]

Meh...methinks minor teething pains.

My next car may well be a MINI Cooper S...and it took them about two years of production to get them out of EPIC-FAIL mode.

You don't want a 2002 or 2003 Cooper...

GM is having MUCH better luck than BMW did with the MINI. Methinks they will get it sorted out.

Chris

[longtooth]

Reading between the lines, in some cases, these are inexperienced 'children', with an expensive toy, hammering the $h! out of them.

Additionally: It's the Internet where 'truth' is spoken 24 hours-a-day. You never can be certain of anything.

[A Horse With No Name]

...and sadly, longtooth...GM buys back some of these cars, which were perfectly good when they left GM...as lemons...

...and I think GM crushes all of their lemon buybacks.

So some of these perfectly good Camaro SS's will go to the crusher just because the owners were idiots.

Chris

[Chevy Nick]

Here's my answer to "I Have NO POWER!". When I bought my '06 GTO with automatic tranny, I took it to the track and was getting beat by stock LS1 f-bodies (great cars by the way). This didn't seem right to me, I sent the PCM to a tuner to have restrictions such as torque management removed. I took it back to the track, I dropped .8 seconds in the 1/4 mile, and was now beating ls1 f-bodies.

[Drew Dowdell]

I'd rather be seen sitting in a broken down Camaro SS because I dumped the clutch than seen driving a Hyundai Scoupe.

[Daryl Z71]

I'd rather be seen sitting in a broken down Camaro SS because I dumped the clutch than seen driving a Hyundai Scoupe.

Lmao! So true...

[regfootball]

I'd rather be seen sitting in a broken down Camaro SS because I dumped the clutch than seen driving a Hyundai Scoupe.

genesiscoupe?

[ShadowDog]

Interesting how so many of them attribute these problems to a first-year model and brush it off. Major part problems / failures, trunk latches and paint issues? Now, I know I'm comparing apples and oranges; however, with how much people have against a foreign car, my wife's first year Optra5 came overseas in a boat from Korea through GMDAT and it didn't have anything as significant wrong with it in the last five years of owning it.

[CaddyXLR-V]

Reading between the lines, in some cases, these are inexperienced 'children', with an expensive toy, hammering the $h! out of them.

Additionally: It's the Internet where 'truth' is spoken 24 hours-a-day. You never can be certain of anything.

In other words, it's the owners fault, just like the Camry sludge issues were?

[Camino LS6]

The bottom line here is that we don't have enough information to make any judgement of value.

We should also remember that this car is under a microscope like no other - we will be examining every aspect of it far more than any other car on the market for some time yet.

Hell, each of these problems is being tracked by VIN, and not just by GM - but by enthusiasts on the web!

What counts here is the outcome of each issue and the level of satisfaction of buyers with that outcome.

[Z-06]

Genesis itself is having many problems too, according to the fans. It is a combination of first model year and operator enthusiasm aided with lack of common sense.

[Intrepidation]

I haven't really been keeping track, has the Challenger had a lot of first year or otherwise problems?

[CaddyXLR-V]

I've had problems with the transmission in my GTO, so I wouldn't completely dismiss any of this as first year problems.

[toesuf94]

It's the suppliers fault. Hell, works for Toyota!

I, too, am dismayed by these reports. The L99 and the tranny's that are having issues are not NEW engines and transmissions...why the problems? Oil leaks on an LS3 - should NOT be happening...that engine has been in the Corvette now for how long? Have not heard this over on the Vette forums. I could maybe see issues with the rear end or some newer sub assemblies, but to have issues with the KNOWN components really bothers me. The LSx engines have been really reliable and bulletproof from what I have seen.

I have been itching to buy one, but have decided to hold off due to the issues everyone is experiencing. I have enough cars in the 'fleet' now, and really do not need another payment in this economy anyway.

And Dodgefan, not heard anything about the Challenger, however - I spend NO TIME in those forums.

[SoCalCTS]

I'm gonna call "bull spit" on this. A lot of the evidence that you post is from people with fewer than 25 posts or its nit-picky stuff that only a gearhead would ever complain about.

[6t5frlane]

I'm gonna call "bull spit" on this. A lot of the evidence that you post is from people with fewer than 25 posts or its nit-picky stuff that only a gearhead would ever complain about.

Well sure if I but a new Camaro I look for a site dedicated to the car. So these guys are probably new to the site since they just got the car. In any case these issues should be addressed by GM PDQ

[CaddyXLR-V]

I'm gonna call "bull spit" on this. A lot of the evidence that you post is from people with fewer than 25 posts or its nit-picky stuff that only a gearhead would ever complain about.

Broken output shafts in the transmission is nit-picky stuff?

[Drew Dowdell]

Broken output shafts in the transmission is nit-picky stuff?

When an idiot dumps the clutch once in a 400+ hp car it shouldn't break. I'll give you that.

What you don't know is how many times he was trying to do wheelies.

I had a sloppy universal joint in the Avalanche. The truck only had about 60k miles on it at the time. *GASP* GM IS TEH SUXORS@@!@@@

oh yeah, it started after I hauled a pallet of bricks, nearly 1 ton, in a 1/2 ton pickup.

[regfootball]

its pretty easy these days for someone to launch a coordinated smear campaign. just like all that we post each day, there is no way to verify the truth of a lot of this stuff.

and people who buy a camaro are going to be gnats ass picky. maybe some to the point of unreasonable.

but engines and trannies should not have issues. not for awhile.

a lot of the idiots like those who waited to get their solstice and then racked it up on the freeway because of probably overzealous driving and partial intoxication have no excuse for if its starts to fall apart.

this can happen to any carmaker. like the latest gen camry and tundra, FJ etc.

[CaddyXLR-V]

When an idiot dumps the clutch once in a 400+ hp car it shouldn't break. I'll give you that.

What you don't know is how many times he was trying to do wheelies.

I had a sloppy universal joint in the Avalanche. The truck only had about 60k miles on it at the time. *GASP* GM IS TEH SUXORS@@!@@@

oh yeah, it started after I hauled a pallet of bricks, nearly 1 ton, in a 1/2 ton pickup.

So someone should never take a Camaro to a race track, because they might break an output shaft. Would it be ok if a Vette did the same? 400hp Camaros should be built to handle some track time, and therefore, some abuse. I didn't buy my GTO to drive it like im 90 years old and I doubt people buying Camaros are going to drive it like that either. If I wanted a car like that, I would have bought a Buick.

[Justin Bimmer]

I thought new cars came with warranties? Do they not anymore?

[CaddyXLR-V]

I thought new cars came with warranties? Do they not anymore?

Warranty or not, would you want a mechanical failure on your brand new $35,000 car?

[Drew Dowdell]

So someone should never take a Camaro to a race track, because they might break an output shaft. Would it be ok if a Vette did the same? 400hp Camaros should be built to handle some track time, and therefore, some abuse. I didn't buy my GTO to drive it like im 90 years old and I doubt people buying Camaros are going to drive it like that either. If I wanted a car like that, I would have bought a Buick.

Did I say that? Take the Camaro to the race track. Take it to the Nurgburgring. I'm sure it'll do fine......

...... as long as you're not an idiot about it.

Using a car is one thing.

Abusing a car is another.

People are going to buy this car and then immediately beat the snot out of it in ways that you and I can't even imagine. I'm surprised we haven't heard more stories of breakage.... but I won't be surprised if we do. Some of those stories even admit the abuse right there. Ok, he broke a transmission linkage the first time he dumped the clutch... or maybe it was the 4th time... oh hell he'd been doing it all week.

[Drew Dowdell]

Warranty or not, would you want a mechanical failure on your brand new $35,000 car?

Where is the personal responsibility of the owners?

[Drew Dowdell]

I'd love a new CTS-V.... but if I blow out the differential because I'm being an asshole... I'm not going to blame GM for it.

The difference with many of these Camaro situations and the Tundra or Camry situations is that the Tundra and Camry broke during the normal operation of the vehicle. On the Tundra, the camshafts exploded at speeds below redline. Still high, but still within operational range. The Camry forgot about 2nd and 6th gears under normal operation... it wasn't that the Camry drivers were out trying to piss off ricers by doing burnouts.

With these Camaro situations many of these cars are being pushed to (and apparently beyond) their operational limits because Bubba is out there seeing how many donuts he can do before the tires fall off.

Big difference.

[CaddyXLR-V]

I'd love a new CTS-V.... but if I blow out the differential because I'm being an asshole... I'm not going to blame GM for it.

The difference with many of these Camaro situations and the Tundra or Camry situations is that the Tundra and Camry broke during the normal operation of the vehicle. On the Tundra, the camshafts exploded at speeds below redline. Still high, but still within operational range. The Camry forgot about 2nd and 6th gears under normal operation... it wasn't that the Camry drivers were out trying to piss off ricers by doing burnouts.

With these Camaro situations many of these cars are being pushed to (and apparently beyond) their operational limits because Bubba is out there seeing how many donuts he can do before the tires fall off.

Big difference.

Ok fair point. But if any of these are breaking just during hard driving, and are not due to excessive abuse, then I would still blame GM. In the thread I read about the output shaft breaking, something was said about an output shaft not being hardened correctly. Whether it's true or not I don't know, but GM no longer gets the benefit of the doubt with me.

[Drew Dowdell]

Ok, so I'm going through each and every link posted earlier

1. Oil pressure varies, drove it hard, check engine light came on, was loose gas cap

2. 2SS in the shop with transmission issues, no further details

3. Idiot dumping a clutch on a 2SS at 4200rpm

4. Camaro is slow, high knock retard, easily remedied with a PCM flash

5. Complaint about the Tremac transmission only being rated for 430 ft/lbs... except that it's rated for 700 ft/lbs. </fail>

6. Complaint of a very faint clicking sound.

7. Complaint of a very faint clicking sound, turned out to be stickers on some moving parts.

8. Cracked transmission shaft - there is a dealership notice out about it, replacing the whole transmission.

9. Trunk not opening with fob. Turns out the trunk wasn't closed all the way and couldn't release properly.

10. Another transmission shaft snap.

11. Another slow Camaro, would be fixed with a PCM flash

12. Another clicking Camaro

13. Paint issues on a Camaro that sounds like it was in a hail storm.

14. Issues with clearcoat. GM will compound, wax, and buff your car for you and looks perfect.

15. Whining noise, was just an AC belt

16. barely comprehensible rant

17. Trunk issue again

18. Broken interior clip. 30 second dealer fix

19. Broken interior clip. 30 second dealer fix

20. bad steering box and the trunk issue again

21. Car won't start. Plastic clip that holds the power onto the starter wasn't pushed on all the way. Fixed

22. Car dies. Dealer flashed computer, hasn't happened again.

This doesn't look like a list to get worked up over guy. If this is as bad as it gets for the Camaro, this is a rock star launch.

[Drew Dowdell]

Ok fair point. But if any of these are breaking just during hard driving, and are not due to excessive abuse, then I would still blame GM. In the thread I read about the output shaft breaking, something was said about an output shaft not being hardened correctly. Whether it's true or not I don't know, but GM no longer gets the benefit of the doubt with me.

Well GM doesn't manufacture the transmission.... so what then?

[eldiablobanshee]

Ok, so I'm going through each and every link posted earlier

1. Oil pressure varies, drove it hard, check engine light came on, was loose gas cap

2. 2SS in the shop with transmission issues, no further details

3. Idiot dumping a clutch on a 2SS at 4200rpm

4. Camaro is slow, high knock retard, easily remedied with a PCM flash

5. Complaint about the Tremac transmission only being rated for 430 ft/lbs... except that it's rated for 700 ft/lbs. </fail>

6. Complaint of a very faint clicking sound.

7. Complaint of a very faint clicking sound, turned out to be stickers on some moving parts.

8. Cracked transmission shaft - there is a dealership notice out about it, replacing the whole transmission.

9. Trunk not opening with fob. Turns out the trunk wasn't closed all the way and couldn't release properly.

10. Another transmission shaft snap.

11. Another slow Camaro, would be fixed with a PCM flash

12. Another clicking Camaro

13. Paint issues on a Camaro that sounds like it was in a hail storm.

14. Issues with clearcoat. GM will compound, wax, and buff your car for you and looks perfect.

15. Whining noise, was just an AC belt

16. barely comprehensible rant

17. Trunk issue again

18. Broken interior clip. 30 second dealer fix

19. Broken interior clip. 30 second dealer fix

20. bad steering box and the trunk issue again

21. Car won't start. Plastic clip that holds the power onto the starter wasn't pushed on all the way. Fixed

22. Car dies. Dealer flashed computer, hasn't happened again.

This doesn't look like a list to get worked up over guy. If this is as bad as it gets for the Camaro, this is a rock star launch.

Thanks for that list that saved me alot of time. :camarosmile:

[intrigued]

The tranny is supposed to take those hard launches since it has the "launch control" feature.

[Drew Dowdell]

The tranny is supposed to take those hard launches since it has the "launch control" feature.

There was only one such failure listed.. and again we don't know how hard he had been beating on it before it failed. The other transmission failures seem to be a metallurgical defect in a batch of transmissions.

my point remains... this is a short list for a car that is brand new and getting the snot beat out of it straight off the dealer's lot.

[A Horse With No Name]

I agree with Oldsmoboi...read my earlier remarks about the MINI.

This is "rock star" good for a new car, seriously.

Esp. one that is going to get beaten on like a red headed step child.

Chris

[Drew Dowdell]

You know about 13 Tundras had camshaft failures and we made the biggest deal over it.

In either case, that warrants a recall in my book.

13 Tundras had camshaft failures below redline.

Aren't DOHC motors suppose to be able to spin fast?

[Daryl Z71]

13 Tundras had camshaft failures below redline.

Aren't DOHC motors suppose to be able to spin fast?

Oh the Tundras are DOHC's?

[Z-06]

Oh the Tundras are DOHC's?

Hot off Toyota's Own Website:

5.7L DOHC 32V i-FORCE V8 with dual independent Variable Valve Timing with intelligence (VVT-i), Horsepower: 381 hp @ 5600 rpm; Torque: 401 lb.-ft @ 3600 rpm; aluminum block with aluminum heads, Acoustically Controlled Induction System (ACIS) -- dual stage intake manifold, Compression ratio: 10.2:1, Emissions: ULEV II

[longtooth]

In other words, it's the owners fault, just like the Camry sludge issues were?

Sludge is the least of Camaro's perceived issues.

I know Camaro looks good just sitting still.

Flogging them w/o mercy is only inviting trouble.

Further, kids typically aren't out hot-rodding Camrys. That could be the next phase of tuning though.

Plus it is the 'Gospel Truth' Internet after all. Grain of salt.

[regfootball]

camaro is holding up fairly well by looking at that list if folks have been thrashing them as hard as nissan gt-r's......

[trinacriabob]

body fit

This is the last thing Chevy needs

While I wouldn't be a Camaro buyer, I am hoping it does well. I've seen some around and think it looks best in silver and worst in yellow.

On the day before the 4th of July, I rented a car up north and was offered an upgrade to a Camaro. I declined because I only needed to get to and from the airport.

While getting into my compact, I went over to a Camaro and opened the passenger door to check out the interior. The layout is nice. HOWEVER, there was something not quite right with both the fit and the way the passenger door closed. Maybe it's because I am now used to doors with frames around the windows. Unless that rental unit had been hit and in the body shop, that door should not have felt that way upon opening it and closing it.

It's a nice looking sports car. However, I am troubled that the roof rails are as thick as they are compared to the late 60s version it's patterned after (the Malibu has the same unwanted thickness in the roof rails for my taste).