The Fleetwood...

[GMTruckGuy74]

I'm about 60% sure I want to sell it... a lot of factors are working this thought process, but the main issue is the fact I really do want to drive a new vehicle on an everyday basis.

Of course I have to see what is out there that I want AND can afford. Once I know the answer to that question then I will ponder if I can keep the Fleetwood as a "toy". If I can afford a new daily driver but not the "toy", then I have my answer.

Should I sell-out for a new car? I've had 5 new vehicles in 10 years (not counting the wife's 3 contributions that I got to co-drive too), so with the impending lease-end arriving soon am I just going through new car purchase time withdrawl? I love the Caddy and have always wanted one, but I'm not sure it's what I want as a daily driver.

Should I return the lease and try the Caddy out for a month? Maybe 30 days of daily driving are all I need.

I knew I had a stigma about buying "used", and I thought by getting a car I've always wanted I could beat it. Not true, so I need advice/comment/opinion here.

And yes, I am being serious before someone asks if this is a joke!

[Drew Dowdell]

Get out of the car-payment finance cycle.... especially if you have something as great as a Fleetwood Brougham to cruise around in.

What will feel better in the long run? A new car that you're likely going to have to compromise on in some way... or an extra $400 a month in your pocket. If your wallet gets too thick... don't worry, the Cadillac has very soft seats.

Edit: If it takes going to a therapist for 12 months to get over the used car stigma, it'll still be cheaper for you in the long run.

[NINETY EIGHT REGENCY]

Keep the Fleetwood.

[Drew Dowdell]

Furthermore.... you have a Fleetwood and an Aura.... yet you're driving the Aura every day? Srsly?

[Justin Bimmer]

Didn't you take out a loan to get the Fleetwood? I don't think you would be able to sell it for as much as you bought it for, unless you are willing to be very patient.

I would suggest keeping the Cadillac and saving the car payment and if you have to repair or replace something, it will be way cheaper in the long run.

Just imagine not having a 400 a month car payment = 4,800 a year in savings!

[GMTruckGuy74]

Furthermore.... you have a Fleetwood and an Aura.... yet you're driving the Aura every day? Srsly?

Yeah, I know how that seems but when I bought the FWB I still had three more payments on the AURA lease (last payment was made yesterday!), and I have plenty of unused miles left, so I figured I'd continue using the Saturn. The Caddy needs new tires and I'm not comfortable driving the car with the tires it currently has, especially in the rain. Kuhmo and Kelley tires have been recommended to me, so if I'm keeping the car as a DD then I will be dealing with this issue soon. The car needs some TLC on the interior and I have yet made the time to tackle this; with the warmer weather coming at the end of the week, I may just jump into this too. A new problem developed with the car mechanically yesterday, so that will be drawing my attention soon too.

A lot is going on in my mind with my driving needs, but I do love driving this Caddy (I've been driving it 2-3 times a week, though it has been more like 1-2 lately). And I can definitely see the financial benefit of having no car payment once the small loan I took out gets repaid by the summer. I guess with my non-existent mechanical skills/abilities I've begun to rethink my decision on buying an older car. The biggest detractor though is my wife - as usual she didn't take me seriously when I said I wanted to buy this car (in her defense, I've said that a million times since we've been together and never actually bought anything). When I got the loan approval and made the arrangements, she was too late to stop the process. She has not warmed up to the car yet, and has made life regarding the FWB difficult. She knows I don't have the mechanical skill needed for repairs, and with money tight right now I don't have the option for a repair shop for any other unexpected problems. She's just waiting for the moment for the car to strand us somewhere to drive her point all the way home; that right there is my fear with an older used car. I've fooled myself into thinking I could make do with an older car, but unlike others here (balthazar, camino, sixty8, dodgefan, oldsmoboi, etc) I just don't have the skills and tools to work on my own ride. I've always joked that I'm the guy that keeps repair shops in business, and I guess it really is a very true statement.

Sorry for the "therapy" session, but this is the only place for me to turn to about my concerns.

Edited October 20, 2009 by GMTruckGuy74

[Drew Dowdell]

Unless you start dumping over $400 into the FWB every month in repairs, your wife doesn't have a leg to stand on with regard to new car reliability. Even a new car can break down.

Remember how Avanti recommended a G6 or Malibu (one of the Epsilons) to friends of his and it broke down on the way home from the dealer?

There might be a few teething issues for the FWB, but again, not over $400 a month for 12 months worth.

Find a reputable, local, mechanic not at a dealership who will take the time to get to know you and know the car. Take the car there for everything. He'll be able to give you a heads up if he sees any mechanical trouble down the road. Buy a good set of Michelins, have them rotated regularly and they'll last you 80k miles. There isn't a single thing on this car that cannot be repaired or serviced by Joe's Gas -n- Garage.

After you've paid off the loan for the car, simply consider any repairs and maintenance as your monthly car payment. You'll find that some months you'll have no payment at all. PUT THAT MONEY AWAY FOR A RAINY DAY. If money is tight right now, how is tying yourself to a car loan for the next 36 months going to help your situation?

If your wife continues to fuss about it. You can sell her this way; "Honey, just think. Once the Fleetwood is paid off, we'll be able to afford an even nicer car for you the next time around. Remember that Enclave you liked?". or "I'm trying to save money for the kids' education. THINK OF THE CHILDREN!!!"

[Justin Bimmer]

I would look for a mechanic who knows about B-bodies and B-body cadillacs in particular. He will be able to tell you whats wrong from just basic explanations.

With my pontiac, i take it to a guy who worked at the pontiac dealer and he has the problem diagnosed before i can even shut the hood on the car.

[tmp]

I vote keep the Fleetwood. As far as costs go, the price of the new car payments and other payments (like the insurance- a new car under lease will have to have full coverage) will be a lot more than just keeping the old one.

As far as the wife goes, a nice "date night" dinner out and a movie once a month with some of the money you aren't shelling out to GMAC and GEICO might ameliorate the whole used-car thing for her.

[Drew Dowdell]

GMT, remember, with the Fleetwood, you'll have $400 a month to do preventative shop visits to MAKE SURE the car never strands her. Comparatively speaking, once you're done with the shakedown, the Fleetwood should end up being the most reliable car your family has ever owned.

[Camino LS6]

I'm with the crowd here, make the Fleetwood right and your problems will go away.

Beats the hell out of a new monthly payment.

[Intrepidation]

You just bought the things and took out a loan to do so. trying to get rid of it after like what, a couple months? That's not a smart financial move. Since caddycruiser wehelped you out with the buying process I'm sure he would know if it was a potential money pit. Unless your entire drive-train craps the bed multiple times, it'll cost way less to operate than monthly payments on a new car. I would keep it and save for a while.

As far as mechanical skills go...pick up a Haynes or even better, a FSM for the car and read up on it. Basic maintenance is just that. Oil changes, belts, tire rotation etc. are stuff that can be done without any real mechanical skill. For anything else (or even those things) just find a trust worthy mechanic and have him service it. As pointed out by Olds, dealers will just price gouge you.

[ocnblu]

Why throw money into an older car, even one as wicked nice as this Fleetwood, if it is not worth much? Repairs on any car are not cheap if you have to pay someone to do them, and you could ring up more than the value of the car in repair bills over an unspecified period of time. Heaven forbid, but if a loved one were only kept breathing on life support, would you, after careful, heart-wrenching consideration, keep the machines going or do you think it best to let them go and hold onto your good memories?

If you can afford to keep the Cadillac as a toy and you and your wife don't mind having it sitting in the driveway unused except on weekends, etc., then by all means keep it. It is not fit as a daily driver in its present state. If you cannot afford a new car as a DD while keeping the FB... then a sacrifice must be made.

It's one thing if you are a mechanic and can do your own repairs and maintenance... you could keep it forever, but you are not. Paying someone to keep it going will get expensive, quickly.

[Intrepidation]

So does making payments on new cars. Example: even if I paid the mechanic to do all over the mechanical work to my car over the last 3 years it would add up to $77.91 per month. That includes oil changes, the engine, belts, oil sending switch, crankshaft position sensor, timing belt, and that fuel pump gasket. Yes I'm counting labor. In fact all of the big things were paid for to be done. Had I done it myself I'd be about $1,100 up.

This is with a car that has nearly 200,000 miles on it. All it currently needs is the right outer tie rod.

If I take into consideration next year's a/c revamp, I'm looking at about 1,000 in the 4th year. That'll still keep my monthly costs around 80 a month.

[gm4life]

Tough choice. If money is tight the best option is to keep the Fleetwood. Those B-bodies with 350's should run forever. The car is in such great shape, stick some money in it to keep it running and get it up to par. (You won't be sorry you did.) I would save your money and wait until times are better for you/your family to take on another car payment. (Wonder why I had a 1990 GP as a daily driver in my fleet until 2008? Because it was way cheaper than getting something new.) I think sticking money into a well cared for used car when money is tight makes more sense than another payment. Keep the Fleetwood as a daily until you feel comfortable and your situation is such you can take on a payment, no problem. Then enjoy it for a toy and get a new GM car. Sorry, a new car would be great I know, but that doesn't make any sense for you, in my view. (Nor me.) Best of luck with your choice.

Edited October 21, 2009 by gm4life

[daves87rs]

I'm with the guys. Keep it, unless it looks like many issues coming up.

And don't forget, you have all of us to help you out.

I've been going out of my way to learn as much about cars as I can. It's really amazing how much you can learn.

I just made my Mom's Astro repair much cheaper....

[daves87rs]

You just bought the things and took out a loan to do so. trying to get rid of it after like what, a couple months? That's not a smart financial move. Since caddycruiser wehelped you out with the buying process I'm sure he would know if it was a potential money pit. Unless your entire drive-train craps the bed multiple times, it'll cost way less to operate than monthly payments on a new car. I would keep it and save for a while.

As far as mechanical skills go...pick up a Haynes or even better, a FSM for the car and read up on it. Basic maintenance is just that. Oil changes, belts, tire rotation etc. are stuff that can be done without any real mechanical skill. For anything else (or even those things) just find a trust worthy mechanic and have him service it. As pointed out by Olds, dealers will just price gouge you.

What DF said.

Even if you can't fix it yourself, just knowing more about your car will really help....

[Blake Noble]

Keep it. Learn how to fix the little things, study how to fix some of the bigger ones and apply what you've learned if you're confident in your abilities. You can find parts fairly easy for a B-Body (I know around here you can, at least). There's a sense of pride in knowing you own a car that you really like; that you don't owe one red cent on it to anyone or any bank. Triple that if you work or attempt to work on that car and are successful at repairing or maintaining what you know how to repair or maintain.

You, by no means, have wound up in the mess I wound up in after buying my Monte. That car wound up going from what seemed to be a nice, solid old DD candidate to tired old '80s car once I started digging into it and trying to find non-existent, extremely rare, or extremely overpriced parts with my expendable cash almost dried up (I suppose it's ironic, or strange at the least, that my finances literally improved after I rid myself of that car after fretting about buying parts; the turd who totaled the Firebird paid off that very next day).

Edited October 22, 2009 by whiteknight

[caddycruiser]

Keep it. Learn how to fix the little things, study how to fix some of the bigger ones and apply what you've learned if you're confident in your abilities. You can find parts fairly easy for a B-Body (I know around here you can, at least). There's a sense of pride in knowing you own a car that you really like; that you don't owe one red cent on it to anyone or any bank. Triple that if you work or attempt to work on that car and are successful at repairing or maintaining what you know how to repair or maintain.

You, by no means, have wound up in the mess I wound up in after buying my Monte. That car wound up going from what seemed to be a nice, solid old DD candidate to tired old '80s car once I started digging into it and trying to find non-existent, extremely rare, or extremely overpriced parts with my expendable cash almost dried up (I suppose it's ironic, or strange at the least, that my finances literally improved after I rid myself of that car after fretting about buying parts; the turd who totaled the Firebird paid off that very next day).

Sorry I've been out of contact for so long Roger...^^this post is pretty much dead on, and as I've said before, going from being used to new cars to something 10 years old and used is a big change, but knowing these cars well & having owned 2, yours is about as good as they get today and a very solid car. I completely understand where you're coming from with this (I am the one who VERY cheaply got rid of my great '95 FWB to have a new car and still wished I had it), but it all depends on your own situation. Good thing you started a thread about this, really, for better discussion :AH-HA_wink: We'll chat, at some point, soon again.

[GMTruckGuy74]

Soory, I just needed to take one of these:

The problem started when I realized more things had to be done to the car than what I was told or realized when I bought it (not saying the seller neglected to tell me things, but in the two months I've had it more things popped up). The big cause to the 'wanting to sell' mindset was the latest issue to unfold - a non-operating car. Originally I thought it was the battery, but it still gave power to the lights, RKE, radio, etc. So my neighbor thought it was a weakened battery and tried to jump it with no luck. It now appears that the starter has gone and the car is no longer operating. Factor in the annoying non-operating passenger side windows (especially the rear that likes to fall open on its own), the power antenna that doesn't power up and limits radio reception, an interior smell that can get annoying in a short amount of time, some additional rust/trim damage/interior rips I've recently found, the TEMP idiot light coming on after a short time of driving, and the possibility of a leaky gasket getting the trunk wet all compiled together and made me want to get rid of the car for something new.

Not the worse that could happen, but enough to make me regret the decision to buy it for daily driver usage. I've gotten over that now and will put some money I have on hand into it very soon to start correcting the major of these issues (I still need caddycruiser for the window fixes). I love the design of the car and the 'hugeness' of it compared to everything else on the road. So that has never waivered or faltered. I just got upset over some unexpected things, plus with my lease coming up soon I am going to miss going through the 'new car buying experience' (my family & friends think I'm weird because I actually enjoy going through the process to buy a new vehicle). Couple that with Terrains arriving at dealerships (the #1 choice for the AURA replacement prior to the lay-off/financial mess) and the few remaining Pontiac G8s that are tempting me before they disappear and I can no longer buy the Pontiac I would have.

So thanks for the support and knocking this knucklehead with some common sense.

[Drew Dowdell]

None of those things would cause me to junk the car.

The starter is a trip to the local garage.

The trunk gasket is a call to J.C. Whitney (or a click from the C&G front page) + an hour of time with a flathead screwdriver.

The power antenna is a super easy fix you could do yourself. You can buy the NOS antenna on ebay. Don't get the "universal fit" ones from Pepboys.

The temp light could be a thermostat.

The interior smell is just a good strong interior detail which includes shampooing the rugs.

The rear window problem is well documented and the Impala guys have a detailed fix for it.

Just make them small day projects and enjoy doing them.

If I'm right about my diagnoses, you're out no more than $600 if you do everything but the starter and thermostat yourself.

How many car payments is that for you?

[ocnblu]

In a lot of cases though with older cars, that list continues in an open-ended fashion.

The guy I posted about with the Lincoln LS he was absolutely in love with (despite its own growing list of little things) dropped it off with us on Thursday with a broken window regulator... before we could get the part and install it, he had it traded to us on a used Zephyr.

[Intrepidation]

This can be the case, but a lot of cases are such as that once the initial problems are corrected it will give you many happy miles. Friend of mine bought a `01 2.7 Intrepid for $300 which teh owner said that the engine had a knock and was no good.

The problem was a bad harmonic balancer pulley. He replaced it, changed the fluids, and now has a daily driver. The thing is in amazing shape. Paint has no blemishes or dings, not even swirls. Was talking to him yesterday and he was telling me he had every confidence in the world about taking it across country right now (was telling him about my trip).

Honestly, the only big issue you have is the starter. The other stuff is easy (unless GM riveted the regulators in like Ford did, then it's a bit of a PITA but not hard...just time consuming).

Make little weekend projects out of the other things. You'll find it very rewarding to do your own work. Post pics too!

[Drew Dowdell]

In a lot of cases though with older cars, that list continues in an open-ended fashion.

The guy I posted about with the Lincoln LS he was absolutely in love with (despite its own growing list of little things) dropped it off with us on Thursday with a broken window regulator... before we could get the part and install it, he had it traded to us on a used Zephyr.

Absolutely true, but the B-bodies tend to be extra reliable once you get the kinks worked out.

[Blake Noble]

Absolutely true, but the B-bodies tend to be extra reliable once you get the kinks worked out.

This.

There are well documented cases of B-Bodies with well over 350,000 miles on them still running like a top.

[Camino LS6]

Something tells me that Roger has gotten the message...

[GMTruckGuy74]

He has, though that *% right rear passenger door window is now pushing back.

With rain the window has a tendacy to fall down (I guess the water makes it slippery in the tracks). I had parked the car in the driveway in the last rain storm so the window wouldn't open on it's own, on the slope, which seemed to help. Since the starter went in that time, the car has still been in the driveway. Well yesterday was a rainy day and late last night when I went to park the AURA in the driveway as I walk by the Caddy, FWUMP! down goes the window, now off-track. So before I could just pull up the glass and close it, now it's off-center & won't go past the half-way mark. I had no choice but to put a garbage bag over the door and duct-tape it to the glass. Rain all night, and will rain throughout the day today - this is going to be a mess. I can't wait to get home from work and have to deal with this

But yes, I plan to keep the car and get work down soon by a professional. It's a shame though I do not have the tools or the know-how to do a lot of the work myself. caddycruiser has the parts needed and the experience to fix the window problem, but he lives 2.5 hours south of me and it's not easy for him to find the time to help me. The starter has to get fixed soon - or I will have a problem with the battery too (I'm sure its suffering just sitting out there). Unfortunately I do not have friends that are shade tree mechanics, otherwise I could ask them. So it will be interesting how I'm going to get stuff done, on the cheap, myself. I'm not giving up the fight, but I will have to use the one thing I do have to my advantage - my brain! - to figure this out and soon.

[Blake Noble]

EDIT: Nevermind. I saw the link Olds gave you. Most of the tools needed, save for the door panel tool (which isn't expensive anyway), should be laying around your garage. Trust me, you can do this job if you just take your time and follow all of the steps.

If it was the power window motor, that would be different. Riveting in a new motor is a big PITA.

Edited October 28, 2009 by whiteknight

[Justin Bimmer]

get some cardboard and fold it up and put it in between the inside of the window and the window jam. That should help keep the window from rolling down. I did that with my Pontiac. I have replaced 5 regulators in that thing.

[SAmadei]

get some cardboard and fold it up and put it in between the inside of the window and the window jam. That should help keep the window from rolling down. I did that with my Pontiac. I have replaced 5 regulators in that thing.

Even better are those little rubber door chocks. I used a couple of those on one car for nearly a year before I got the correct part to fix the window.

[ocnblu]

ooo... classy.:AH-HA_wink: Edited October 28, 2009 by ocnblu

[Intrepidation]

So does GM rivet or bolt the regulators into the doors? If it bolts its an easy job. If its rivets it is a bit og a PITA. Ford riveted them regulators in the GM. What a Pain that was...took like 2 hours just to get it out. The Prizm's were bolted in and took a but a half hour to replace the driver's door regulator.

[SAmadei]

So does GM rivet or bolt the regulators into the doors? If it bolts its an easy job. If its rivets it is a bit og a PITA. Ford riveted them regulators in the GM. What a Pain that was...took like 2 hours just to get it out. The Prizm's were bolted in and took a but a half hour to replace the driver's door regulator.

It depends on the car... When I get home, I can check the FSM for the '95 B-bods.

Some cars have the rivets and they have to be replaced with rivets... some have provisions so that the replacement unit can be screwed in with self tapping screws.

If you have a grinder, the rivet heads come right off.

When I did the '91 Firebird, the job is crazy hard... the regulator is riveted and the glass heavy... plus there is little access to get the unit out... it took me about 2 hours getting it untangled and out of the door. IIRC, the replacement needed to be riveted in, but I had a hell of a time getting the rivets in place without knocking them off while putting the regulator back in place... same went for small bolts. I finally got some clip-on fender nuts of various sizes and put them on the regulator... put it in place and threaded the bolt into the door... easy peasy.

The B-bods have lots of room and I would bet the unit it bolted in.

[Intrepidation]

If it is bolted in all he needs is a socket set and screwdrivers. I dunno if there's a special technique on B-Bodies for removing door panels, but on all my cars its unscrew a few screws and pull. Hate doing it on the Intrepid because every time a stupid plastic fastener brakes and I have to get another....but that's besides the point.

Really all he would need help wise would be someone to hold up the window. Makes it easier (if its just bolts).

[ocnblu]

Sounds like caddycruiser has it memorized. I'd offer help, but it's been so long since I've seen one apart, I forget how they are.

[Blake Noble]

So does GM rivet or bolt the regulators into the doors? If it bolts its an easy job. If its rivets it is a bit og a PITA. Ford riveted them regulators in the GM. What a Pain that was...took like 2 hours just to get it out. The Prizm's were bolted in and took a but a half hour to replace the driver's door regulator.

GM typically rivets their regulators into the doors, yep.

It's worse on a fourth-gen Firebird. The doors are fiberglass, of course, so if you fuck up on installing one, you can fuck up pretty bad.

[caddycruiser]

Sounds like caddycruiser has it memorized. I'd offer help, but it's been so long since I've seen one apart, I forget how they are.

Yep. It's NEVER the actual regulators on these cars, what it is are the rectangular/thin plastic "sliders" GM originally designed to hold the pins of the regulator in the tracks but then break. The new design replacement part is a small plastic ring, alone, which no thin spots to break and it just rolls along like a wheel--if you buy one of these cars, consider it something that will need to be done. The window & track just aren't holding onto the regulator arms right now, which looks & sounds bad, but the fix is laughable it's so simple--well, as long as you have small hands or don't mind getting your hands a little chewed up. Here's a complex version of it:

http://www.impalassforum.com/vBulletin/sho...ad.php?t=232364

When I first bought my '95, I drove it home and basically parked it for a month and a half and went back to school. Came home for a vacation and to drive it and the FIRST time I did, it got me to the bank and then was dead--what a great feeling. My intention of only having the trans fluid & filter changed that week at the local GM dealer turned into a $1500 repair bill (labor...parts) of not only that, but replacing the fuel pump, entire sending unit & wiring harness (all was fried...when I picked it up, it was on E and that didn't help matters--it would run if having sat cool but otherwise, would be dead as the dealer then found out), the EGR valve & harness replaced (the last owner had the harness somehow cut & the EGR bypassed, which the dealer just thought to replace while searching out the dead/no star condition), and finally replacing the window rollers in the driver's door--because, of course, the first time they pulled it into the shop "your window fell down in the door...".

Totally unexpected, and expensive because I didn't have the time or space to farm it out elsewhere, etc., but after that I went 2.5 years until I sold it without any other repairs aside from a few more window rollers and recharging the A/C. I continually kept worrying it was going to have problems, going to leave me somewhere, etc. but cruising 2.5 hours to school and back and around school everyday the last 2 years and then work, nothing, just a big tank.

It's the perpetual worry of something going wrong or "just wanting new..." that made me sell it, and is what Roger is going through right now, I think, but it's a shame. I wish I actually had just kept it and put the few grand into improving it like the friend I sold it to did, instead of taking on a $30k+ loan...but alas. I'm never happy, even with that latest G8...11k miles, $$$$ of mods and personalization and I could always go for something new again. It's a cycle.

Roger...emailed you...lots of teething issues, for sure, and we can discuss, etc. I can't physically take care of some of the bigger ones, and still haven't had time to look into a few of the oddballs like the Temp light, etc., but some of the things like windows we should be able to tangle with (though, honestly, I know how to get in there & what to do/how it works, but never physically did my own :AH-HA_wink: ). If all else fails, we can touch up a few of the small things and it could always be sold to another fan elsewhere, for the same or more than you originally paid...it's a coveted combo and I still say an extremely solid/well kept example--it's just an old car, at the core, really old.

Edited October 29, 2009 by caddycruiser

[trinacriabob]

Whatever "pencils out" as keeping more money in your, and your family's, pocket. Especially in these tough times.

[Blake Noble]

I nominate to nickname the Fleetwood "Mac."

[Robert Hall]

Even better are those little rubber door chocks. I used a couple of those on one car for nearly a year before I got the correct part to fix the window.

For a rear window, I'd use superglue and glue the window in place. I almost never put them down...

[SAmadei]

For a rear window, I'd use superglue and glue the window in place. I almost never put them down...

Ironically, on that particular B-body coupe, the rear windows are permanent.

On the '99 Bonne, I have a bum rear window... it works, but not from the driver's seat. I've never fixed it as the only window I ever roll down is the driver's window... and only at ATMs, gas-ups and drive-thrus. Lets here it for A/C!

If I was in a similar situation, I wouldn't use superglue... but I'd pull the door panel and put a self-tapping screw just under the window glass to hold it up.

Did you guys ever see the old drag cars? They would remove the regulator and run a seatbelt-like ribbon under the window and out the sill... then there were two buttons to clip the ribbon on... one at the top, for when the window was down and one at the bottom for when the window is up.

[ocnblu]

I think caddycruiser is talking about those little orange oval slider things or the whitish wheel things that slide along on the regulator as it operates. Shoot, we used to keep those in stock all the time.

[A Horse With No Name]

Absolutely true, but the B-bodies tend to be extra reliable once you get the kinks worked out.

Bingo!

Chris

[caddycruiser]

I think caddycruiser is talking about those little orange oval slider things or the whitish wheel things that slide along on the regulator as it operates. Shoot, we used to keep those in stock all the time.

EXACTLY. On a B/D body it's 99% never a regulator, it's always the simple little slider vs. roller. Ah, if only they had never used such a stupid thing in there...there wouldn't be so many people having to buy these cars and always learn about it so soon, if not already taken care of.

Such small pieces of plastic can cause such havoc :AH-HA_wink:

Then again, that's actually the story with a lot of B/D-body things...aggravation initially, an "are you kidding me?" simple in the end. Think of them like nice looking, very comfortable, very roomy, generally luxurious tractors--that's how I always described them. Old tractor or, more so, Chevy truck simple and mechanical in large basic to luxury car clothing.

Note: One of the best parts of a Fleetwood like this? You can--well, most people can--comfortably stand inside the front end, between the bumper and radiator. I did it more than once when tinkering--just careful not to kick anything on your way in/out.