Cadillac BLS In Depth

[Cory Wolfe]

Well... I like it. Then again... I also like the 9-3 and I am into smaller sized cars... oh... and FWD is fine with me as long as it's fun.

[Flybrian]

The problem I see in bringing the BLS stateside is that it'll sell because its simply a cheap Cadillac and we all know the kind that type of car attracts - landau tops and vogue wheels.

As it is, as said, a fine car...for foreigners.

[Sixty8panther]

So I'm being unreasonable, okay perhaps.

But the original reason given by one member for the BLS being a better fit for Europe was that the CTS was too wide... yet the CTS is narrower tha both the 5 and 3 series.... so who's picking and choosing their arguments?

Narrow streets require a narrow car? No money to develop RWD architecture? CTS's interior is no on par wiht the BMW? WhyTF develop/adapt Saab Opel Mechanicals and make a FWD BLS when for MUCH less money the CTs' s interioor could have been redesigned and a true world class RWD car could be had in the USA and Europe?

Answer me that?!?!?!?!

Ohh, and BTW how come the last Euro-rebadge Caddy (Catera) is such a POS to you guys but this new disproportioned econobox is a hit?

I actaully think the Catera was a decent car... it lacked a manual (auto only BMW figters don't work) and a twin turbo induction setup could/would have helped its lackluster performance but at least it was RWD so it had potential.

P.S. and c'mon the name is absolute hogwash... it's even wrose than the Focus ZiTS. BuLlShit indeed.

Edited March 8, 2006 by Sixty8panther

[Flybrian]

Well, I'm not going to change your minds and vice-versa certainly will not happen either so I'll just quit now.

[pow]

Well, I'm not going to change your minds and vice-versa certainly will not happen either so I'll just quit now.

Yes, with ten question marks, four exclamation marks, an eye-rolling smiley, and three expletives.

[4gm]

The only thing really right with this Caddy is the interior. Everything else needs work. It needs to be RWD. And the exterior needs a redesign. GM was just plain lazy on this one. With great designs like the Aura, Camaro concept and Sky, I refuse to believe this is the best BLS GM could come up with. Cadillac needs first rate designs to establish itself in Europe and this isn't one of them. Even the Astra looks 10x better than the BLS. If GM couldn't get it right, they shouldn't have bothered at all.

[Drew Dowdell]

The problem I see in bringing the BLS stateside is that it'll sell because its simply a cheap Cadillac and we all know the kind that type of car attracts - landau tops and vogue wheels.

As it is, as said, a fine car...for foreigners.

The type it attracts? Like the type of people that bought an X-type, TSX, last gen IS, C-class coupe or G20?

You'll come back at me and say "Well none of them except the TSX sold very well".

True, but they were poorly executed cars. <again, exept the TSX>. The BLS could sell ok if it was executed right. It's just what the expectations are set at. If they forcast for and built 30,000 of them they'd probably sell each and every one. 15,000 in the states, 10,000 in China, and 5,000 in Europe.

Besides, they've obviously already bought the tooling for them. What's the problem with sticking them on a boat and seeing if you can move a few over here.

[Drew Dowdell]

So I'm being unreasonable, okay perhaps.

But the original reason given by one member for the BLS being a better fit for Europe was that the CTS was too wide... yet the CTS is narrower tha both the 5 and 3 series.... so who's picking and choosing their arguments?

Narrow streets require a narrow car? No money to develop RWD architecture? CTS's interior is no on par wiht the BMW? WhyTF develop/adapt Saab Opel Mechanicals and make a FWD BLS when for MUCH less money the CTs' s interioor could have been redesigned and a true world class RWD car could be had in the USA and Europe?

Answer me that?!?!?!?!

Um... because they are already redesigning the interior. If the NG CTS is an '08 we have about an 18 month wait till we see it. If it's anything like the renderings I've seen, every wish you have about the CTS's interior has been granted.

Ohh, and BTW how come the last Euro-rebadge Caddy (Catera) is such a POS to you guys but this new disproportioned econobox is a hit?

I actaully think the Catera was a decent car... it lacked a manual (auto only BMW figters don't work) and a twin turbo induction setup could/would have helped its lackluster performance but at least it was RWD so it had potential.

P.S. and c'mon the name is absolute hogwash... it's even wrose than the Focus ZiTS. BuLlShit indeed.

The Catera was a decent car. I liked it especially after it's facelift.

Cadillac needs a 3-series fighter. The BLS <should be BTS>, would be a good start assuming they can put an AWD system in it. Audi fights BMW just fine without rear wheel drive.

The 9-3 is an econobox?

[ZL-1]

I read the 1st BLS review from a Portuguese magazine yesterday:

1. Very positive review in terms of interior quality (materials and assembly), as well as standard/optional equipment.

2. Positive review in terms of driving experience, even though they write that the car is tuned more for "comfort" than for "excitement": it doesn't have the directional effect in the rear suspension (unlike the 9-3), and has different spring/shock tuning than the 9-3.

3. Car tested was a 1.9L diesel and they said that there is more chassis than engine in that version, which I think it's quite positive considering the 2.8L turbo has 105hp more than the 150hp diesel.

I'm guessing nr. 2 is the reason why it's called BLS and not BTS, i.e., it's intentionally geared to offering a balance of comfort and driving dynamics over pure performance.

[Sixty8panther]

Again I ask.... why BLS?

Who came up with this stupid name?

[David]

BRING IT TO THE STATES, MY SISTER IN LAW WOULD LOVE IT. MANY PEOPLE WOULD LIKE A SMALLER 4 DOOR THAN THE CTS. IT WOULD SELL I THINK

[Drew Dowdell]

Again I ask.... why BLS?

Who came up with this stupid name?

B series

L uxury

S edan

X series

L uxury

R oadster

S series

L uxury

S edan

S series

T ouring

S edan

E ldorado <or E series hopefully in the future>

T ouring

C oupe

Edited March 10, 2006 by Oldsmoboi

[Flybrian]

Again I ask.... why BLS?

Who came up with this stupid name?

There's an Exxon up ahead. Better pull in, 'cause your argument is running on empty.

[mark_s_686]

I agree with Sixty8panther. I know the "L" in BLS would have made sense a few years ago, but as of late Caddy is just been using "TS" for sedans. I don't know why they would change that for this one sedan. What makes this car "L"uxary and not "T"ouring? ....well its not like most people even know the meanings anyway. If it ever comes here, it should be BTS....if they don't, average people may think they are just throwing random letters down. Consistancey=good.

Edited March 11, 2006 by mark_s_686

[MyerShift]

I do like its styling and the interior is way better than a CTS, but it is front drive, and that's not "okay" for Cadillac anymore despite the fact that the DTS is still around but that seems to be okay for now anyway, and the BLS is a fine differentiation from the 9-3.

Shouldn't the name be BTS? That would go much better with the, oh, CTS, STS, and DTS sedans.

[MyerShift]

I agree with Sixty8panther. I know the "L" in BLS would have made sense a few years ago, but as of late Caddy is just been using "TS" for sedans.  I don't know why they would change that for this one sedan.  What makes this car "L"uxary and not "T"ouring?  ....well its not like most people even know the meanings anyway.  If it ever comes here, it should be BTS....if they don't, average people may think they are just throwing random letters down.  Consistancey=good.

Oh, hehe. Should've read this before replying.

[Sixty8panther]

There's an Exxon up ahead. Better pull in, 'cause your argument is running on empty.

I dropped it, why can't you? Nice moderating.

Olbsmoboi:

S-series? No Actaully it was "Seville Touring Sedan" & "Seville Luxury Sedan".

I own one.

ETC is and always will be "Eldorado Touring Coupe". Otehr wise wouldn't a EXT be an E-series too like the Eldo?

The reasons you gave make as much sense as why Hyundai named thier $27K Rolls Royce a XG350. B-series? C'mon that's retarded. BLS is just lame and weak. Even Series-62 was better than that.

[Drew Dowdell]

I dropped it, why can't you? Nice moderating.   

Olbsmoboi:

S-series? No Actaully it was "Seville Touring Sedan" & "Seville Luxury Sedan".

I own one.

ETC is and always will be "Eldorado Touring Coupe". Otehr wise wouldn't a EXT be an E-series too like the Eldo? 

The reasons you gave make as much sense as why Hyundai named thier $27K Rolls Royce a XG350. B-series? C'mon that's retarded. BLS is just lame and weak. Even Series-62 was better than that.

Face it 68, you're stuck in 1969. Cadillac has mostly moved away from names. All future Cadillacs will be a letter combination. EXT is a trim level of the escalade because it's never listed at EXT by itself. Welcome to 2003.

[Flybrian]

I dropped it, why can't you? Nice moderating.   

I never said I'd drop it. You did. And you keep posting about it.

As I said, you don't like the car, fine. But some people do and you exaggerating and browbeating the damn thing into the ground won't stop it from being built.

[Dsuupr]

Not bad, but if GM wants Cadillac to a top tier luxury maker then they have to cut the ties with the other GM divisions. It just doesn't cut it.

[Croc]

S-series? No Actaully it was "Seville Touring Sedan" & "Seville Luxury Sedan".

I own one.

Yes, S-Series. That is officially what it means now. Just like CTS is C-Series Touring Sedan, not Catera, not Cadillac, but C-Series.

[ltm_awake]

so its not DEVILLE touring sedan, SEVILLE touring sedan, and CATERA touring Sedan? wouldn't the BLS be Biarritz (sp?) Luxury Sedan?

[Croc]

so its not DEVILLE touring sedan, SEVILLE touring sedan, and CATERA  touring Sedan? wouldn't the BLS be Biarritz (sp?) Luxury Sedan?

No, as I just posted before, Cadillac officially calls it the B-Series Luxury Sedan, the C-Series Touring Sedan, S-Series Touring Sedan, D-Series Touring Sedan and X-Series Luxury Roadster.

"Biarritz" is an unwieldy name that was last used on the Eldorado of the late 70s/early 80s.

[bobo]

Biarritz went away with model year 1991, which was the last year of the mini-Eldorado. The "Needle" Eldorado debuted the following year.

[ltm_awake]

ok, just couldn't think of any other B names besides brougham...which most definitely does NOT apply to the BLS.

[Sixty8panther]

ok, just couldn't think of any other B names besides brougham...which most definitely does NOT apply to the BLS.

See.... exactly!!!

The fact that when you think of "B" names in relationship to Cadillac you think of Biaritz and Brougham is a perfect example of why the name BLS makes no damn sense for a &#036;h&#33;ty little FWDer.

and I think you guys are wrong about this whole C/S/D series thing. That's bull&#036;h&#33; and pretty much can not be verified. In any case to millions of Cadillac fans DTS will always be a Deville etc., plain & simple.

[Croc]

and I think you guys are wrong about this whole C/S/D series thing. That's bull&#036;h&#33; and pretty much can not be verified.

Except Cadillac has gone on record with it, not only in the press, but when specificaally asked this question in their Vision magazine.

[Flybrian]

The fact that when you think of "B" names in relationship to Cadillac you think of Biaritz and Brougham is a perfect example of why the name BLS makes no damn sense for a &#036;h&#33;ty little FWDer...In any case to millions of Cadillac fans DTS will always be a Deville etc., plain & simple.

This is because recent letter iterations of Cadillacs have been successors to named models (Seville - STS; DeVille - DTS). They're called DeVille and Seville out of famiiliarity. Furthermore, as you pointed out, STS and DTS were trim designations on these full-named cars, solidifing that connection. You can't say the 'C' in CTS conjures up 'Catera' with any more authority than you can "B conjures up Brougham, and this car ain't no Brougham." It makes no sense.

and I think you guys are wrong about this whole C/S/D series thing. That's bull&#036;h&#33; and pretty much can not be verified.

Replace those words with 'know', 'right', 'factual' and omit 'not' and you're 100% correct!

Even the name is, as Cadillac admits, "a sea change" for one of America's luxury brands, because CTS isn't a word. Rather, CTS stands for Cadillac's new C-series touring sedan.

"Customers in other parts of the world are accustomed to alphanumeric names for their vehicles, and eventually all our vehicles will have names that reflect our global nature," said Mark LaNeve, Cadillac general manager.

In other words, get used to it as more names like this are coming from Cadillac.

--Ann Job, CTS Review, MSN Autos

Pinned on the crest of the newest Cadillac are some serious expectations. Speaking to a group of journalists gathered at the New York Auto Show, GM Chairman Bob Lutz said, " The CTS looks like the rebirth of Cadillac." The Product Development Head went on to predict that Cadillac would once again become the "Standard of the World", and that the that the first miles down that road would be logged by the new, Cadillac C-series Touring Sedan or CTS, for short.

--Dan Lyons, 2003 CTS review, Autobytel

The first letter of the CTS name identifies the series of the vehicle, while the second and third letters describe the body style. "CTS" stands for a Cadillac C-series touring sedan.

--Staff, 2003 CTS Review, Autonet.ca

The SRX is the latest model to express Cadillac's bold new design form vo-cabulary. It echoes the crisp, creased look of its concept vehicle predecessor, Vizón (2001) and is the first of Cadillac's S-series.

--Cadillac SRX Release, 9.1.03, GM MEDIA <----Aw, snap!!

Oh...wait for it...wait for it...

I've sent a letter to a Cadillac official a year ago and received the following answer:

Hello,

Thank you for your interest in learning what our abbreviations mean. As you will notice, there is a strategy behind the structure...

Our nomenclature breaks down as follows:

XLR: X-series luxury roadster

CTS: C-series touring sedan

SRX: S-series reconfigurable crossover

STS: S-series touring sedan

DeVille DHS: DeVille high-luxury sedan

DeVille DTS: DeVille touring sedan

Escalade SUV: Sport utility vehicle

Escalade ESV: Escalade stretch vehicle

Escalade EXT: Escalade crossover truck

V-Series: High performance vehicles

I hope this helps. Let me know if you have any other questions.

Nekeidra Shegog

Cadillac Communications

313.667.8985

313.268.8371 cell

--Posted by Rauf, Cadillacforums.com (Click here to view)

^^AW SNAPxELEVENTYBILLION!!^^

I bet Nekidra is totally pulling it out of his or her ass though.

Sixty8, face it, you don't like the car because it FWD. In fact you hate all* FWD cars. Fine, whatever. But you keep beating and bashing and murdering this poor damn thing to death and your latest reason is 'because it makes me think of a random trim name on a car last produced 15 years ago'?

C'mon...

(*All being defined as 'every FWD vehicle except the ones I like, meaning I just like arguing.')

[Drew Dowdell]

[Croc]

So true. Loves it!

[CaddyXLR-V]

I dont like the BLS. Mostly because it's FWD, and I don't think it fits Cadillacs image, or where they are trying to take Cadillacs image. Yes, Acura may make FWD luxury cars, and Lexus has the ES. But lets face it, the IS, 3 series, and G35 are the standards that Cadillac will be competing against. The BLS just wont cut it. It may be fine for Europe, which I wont comment on because I know nothing about that market, but I think it would be a step in the wrong direction if brought here. We all know if brought here it would be subject to face offs in the mags with the 3 series, IS, and G35. And in the handling tests it will just be destroyed. The cars are supposed to get softer as they get more expensive and bigger, not the other way around.

[Drew Dowdell]

We all know if brought here it would be subject to face offs in the mags with the 3 series, IS, and G35.

Only because the Auto mags are stupid. This is a competitor to the TSX, Zephyr, ES, 9-3 and X-type.

Not *everything* has to be compaired to the 3-series ya know.

[97regalGS]

Only because the Auto mags are stupid. This is a competitor to the TSX, Zephyr, ES, 9-3 and X-type.

Not *everything* has to be compaired to the 3-series ya know.

should Cadillac really be trying to compete with those cars? personally, I don't think so.

[Robert Hall]

The reasons you gave make as much sense as why Hyundai named thier $27K Rolls Royce a XG350. B-series? C'mon that's retarded. BLS is just lame and weak. Even Series-62 was better than that.

B is below C...

[The O.C.]

Ironically, I think the BLS would probably do better here in the U.S. where people might be attracted to its mini-CTS looks.

When I was in Frankfurt in September, the BLS display was deserted. The car seemed to get no attention or notice at all......not a good sign for a car that was developed for Europe...

[CaddyXLR-V]

Only because the Auto mags are stupid. This is a competitor to the TSX, Zephyr, ES, 9-3 and X-type.

Not *everything* has to be compaired to the 3-series ya know.

Since when should Cadillac be competing with Saab?

And whether you like it or not, all the cars you listed are second tier compared to the 3 series, g35, and IS. Does Cadillac want to be second tier too?

[corvette_dude729]

To be honest if I had not read multiple "we need to bring this to the USA" responses about this car in the past few months I would have probably left this thread alone.

I think it's a very bad idea to brign this to our shores... and even in other markets it's a sad state of affairs when this si the car that Cadillac will be judged by.

Next to a Mercedes and/or BMW it will be a pathetic and soul-less product that willm just ruin Cadillac's standard of the world rep. like Packard's image was ruined with the Studebaker rebadges in the 1950s.

The diesle powerplant is a great idea for Europe but makes even more sense in the CTS chassis. WTF develop a car the size and price fo the CTS if only ot make it inferior to the CTS????

I could not agree more, the minute this car is over here it would get criticized by the press for not being luxurious enough, even though that's what it's designed for, they would still find someway to rip on its "lowerclassness"

[pow]

Since when should Cadillac be competing with Saab?

And whether you like it or not, all the cars you listed are second tier compared to the 3 series, g35, and IS. Does Cadillac want to be second tier too?

Even tier-one luxury brands make cars below their "3-series", notably the A3, 1-series, and A-class.

[Sixty8panther]

We'll see.

Time will tell. Some of you know it alls waere the same clueless jerks who in the mid-1990s INSISTED that Cadillac would NEVER EVER in a million years go back to primarily RWD.

Bold Prediction:

By the time my daughter is of drivig age (14-16 years form now) I'

m DEAD certain Cadillac will be back to REAL names again.

Fu*k thic CTS/DTS/STS/EXT/SRX/XLR stuff. It has no soul.

Audi, Acura, Scion and Infiniti have NO real history. They have no storied or treasured names that have been etched into people's subconsious and therefore pussy out to names like xB, xA, tC, RSX, NSX, A4, A6, A8, S6, Q45, QX4, G35.... at least a few like "TT" have meaning.

Names are names, they MEAN something. Even the &#036;h&#33;ty ones like Cavalier, Cobalt, Corsica and Chevette still sound better than G6, RDX, A8 or whatevcer... esp. when some executive tries to sell some snakeoil bull&#036;h&#33; about how CTS stands for C-series Touring Sedan... but irronically it repalaced the Catera.

I honestly think you guys are trying to convince yourselves and not me. :wink:

[pow]

We'll see.

Time will tell. Some of you know it alls waere the same clueless jerks who in the mid-1990s INSISTED that Cadillac would NEVER EVER in a million years go back to primarily RWD.

Bold Prediction:

By the time my daughter is of drivig age (14-16 years form now) I'

m DEAD certain Cadillac will be back to REAL names again.

Fu*k thic CTS/DTS/STS/EXT/SRX/XLR stuff. It has no soul.

Audi, Acura, Scion and Infiniti have NO real history. They have no storied or treasured names that have been etched into people's subconsious and therefore pussy out to names like xB, xA, tC, RSX, NSX, A4, A6, A8, S6, Q45, QX4, G35.... at least a few like "TT" have meaning.

Names are names, they MEAN something. Even the &#036;h&#33;ty ones like Cavalier, Cobalt, Corsica and Chevette still sound better than G6, RDX, A8 or whatevcer... esp. when some executive tries to sell some snakeoil bull&#036;h&#33; about how CTS stands for C-series Touring Sedan... but irronically it repalaced the Catera.

I honestly think you guys are trying to convince yourselves and not me. :wink:

I'm willing to hazard a guess that "GTO", "SS", "Z28", or "GTI" has more soul and recognition and nostalgia than "Corsica" or "Cobalt". Just give "STS" or whatever some time.

[Flybrian]

Time will tell. Some of you know it alls waere the same clueless jerks who in the mid-1990s INSISTED that Cadillac would NEVER EVER in a million years go back to primarily RWD.

Audi, Acura, Scion and Infiniti have NO real history.

I can't believe you just made that statement. Its not like Audi dates back to 1899 and encompasses the histories of NSU and Auto Union. Audi also doesn't make offroad performance and rally cars. Does the word 'Quattro' mean anything to you? It does to alot of people.

esp. when some executive tries to sell some snakeoil bull&#036;h&#33; about how CTS stands for C-series Touring Sedan... but irronically it repalaced the Catera.

Yet the facts are presented to you right before your eyes. It doesn't agree with your opinions, so its 'bull&#036;h&#33;.'

I honestly think you guys are trying to convince yourselves and not me. :wink:

Yeah. Keep believing that.

That said, I think the more we ignore those long-winded empty diatribes, the better we all feel.

[Drew Dowdell]

should Cadillac really be trying to compete with those cars?  personally, I don't think so.

As much as Buick wants to, they are not playing in the same league as the ES, Zephyr, and X-type. Cadillac has a car... now... that would positively KILL the Zephyr and X-type, and give ES drivers something a little more sporty then their current car.

As for the 9-3.... Saab isn't doing a very good job competing with anyone right now are they?

[Drew Dowdell]

I'm willing to hazard a guess that "GTO", "SS", "Z28", or "GTI" has more soul and recognition and nostalgia than "Corsica" or "Cobalt". Just give "STS" or whatever some time.

88

300C

98

F-85

442

and uhm..... J1000

[Drew Dowdell]

Every 68 post:

"FWD sucks! Manuals rule! no more alpha numerics!"

*user posted image*

*user posted image*

*user posted image*

*user posted image*

*user posted image*

*user posted image*

*user posted image*

edit: Sorry, they're all Camaro burn-out pics.

Edited March 13, 2006 by Oldsmoboi

[Turbojett]

Im confused as to why nobody's made a Black Label Society wisecrack.

As far as the rest of this thread...I just wasted ten minutes of my life reading it. I want them back.

[Sixty8panther]

Well, looks like Oldsmoboi will be trading in his CTS soon adn paying about $4,000 too much for a SAAB with A&S styling.

Fly:

Up here in my neck fo the woods Audi's reputation is mostly one of buildig cars with horrible electronics throughout the 80s and early 1990s. I'm a fan of Audi but their rep. in the USA is stil tarnished and short lived. Most people who own Audis probablty have NO clue about Auto Union, or any of their accomplishments in the 1930s or whatever.

Just as Cadillac's history does not mean much to Europeans.

[Flybrian]

Fly:

Up here in my neck fo the woods Audi's reputation is mostly one of buildig cars with horrible electronics throughout the 80s and early 1990s. I'm a fan of Audi but their rep. in the USA is stil tarnished and short lived. Most people who own Audis probablty have NO clue about Auto Union, or any of their accomplishments in the 1930s or whatever.

Just as Cadillac's history does not mean much to Europeans.

You remarked that Audi had "no" history analogous to spinoff brands dating back no more than twenty years. This is clearly a false statement. I'm not referring to reputation (which is hardly as poor as you falsely claim, 60 minutes smeer campaign notwithstanding) and your assumptions regarding the education of their owners. And as others will quickly point out, Audi's history is relevant today in their AWD Quattro cars. Heard of Pike's Peak?

[z28luvr01]

Names are names, they MEAN something. Even the &#036;h&#33;ty ones like Cavalier, Cobalt, Corsica and Chevette.....

And let that be a lesson to you.

[pow]

Well, looks like Oldsmoboi will be trading in his CTS soon adn paying about $4,000 too much for a SAAB with A&S styling.

The BLS Business 2.0t costs £1170 less than a similarly equipped 9-3 Linear 2.0t. Next.

[Sixty8panther]

You remarked that Audi had "no" history analogous to spinoff brands dating back no more than twenty years. This is clearly a false statement.

Of course I was referring more to Acura/Honda/Infiniti who also use alphanumerice names....

I'm not referring to reputation (which is hardly as poor as you falsely claim, 60 minutes smeer campaign notwithstanding) and your assumptions regarding the education of their owners. And as others will quickly point out, Audi's history is relevant today in their AWD Quattro cars. Heard of Pike's Peak?

Actaully I'm not basing that on 60-minutes AT ALL. More like everyone I've ever known or talked to at carshows, and the fact that about 1/5 Audis, from ANY era even the brand new ones I se on the road have a light out or malfunctioning.

If I spend $30,000 on a TT or A4 my brake lights should NOT be burned out/malfunctioning before my car reaches a year old!!!