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Sooooo..... new Cherokee

ocnblu

By ocnblu
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Robert Hall Veteran

Robert Hall

Posted
Posted (edited)

linky? I haven't seen anything but vague disguised spy pics a while back...

Edit--found the pics on Autoblog and Allpar. Hmmm...not sure what I think yet...definitely different. Something unusual going on w/ the front lighting and grille...

Edited by Cubical-aka-Moltar
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Blake Noble Newbie

Blake Noble

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Well, I don't mean to honk my own horn, but I've pretty much been warning everyone not to expect the new KL Cherokee to be a revival of the classic XJ model for sometime now.

Because of its questionable off-road capability, polarizing styling, and the lofty expectations the Cherokee name carries, this will certainly be the one new car release from Marchionne-run Chrysler to keep watch on. I've definitely been keeping tabs on this car in particular because I really do think it's a model that could really make or break Jeep and could even have an effect on the company as a whole.

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ocnblu Newbie

ocnblu

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I sent a couple of photos of the blue one to my cousin who has had a Cherokee and 2 Liberties... she messaged back... "It's pretty! How is the gas mileage?"

I have a strong feeling this will sell like hotcakes. I'm still stunned and shocked by it myself.

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Blake Noble Newbie

Blake Noble

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Posted (edited)

I have a strong feeling this will sell like hotcakes.

I wouldn't bet my money on that just yet. The design has grown on a few people since yesterday, but from what I've seen, negative opinions are still far outweighing positive ones overall.

Also, I'm hearing over at Allpar that Chrysler's PR team had to take the Cherokee press release off of Jeep's Facebook page due to an overwhelming amount of negative comments.

Like I said, this will be the one new car from Chrysler to keep watch on.

Edited by black-knight
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Lamar Newbie

Lamar

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It seems like Jeep designers have lost the script on brand identity..first they put Chrysler headlights on the '14 Grand Cherokee, ruining it's front end appearance, now this...

Seems to me that got lost with the Compass...

What he said.

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David Grand Master

David

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Polarizing as a Love Hate relationship would be and just could end up being a smash hit.

I asked my son who bought a 2012 Liberty and he said he would pass as
it does not have the traditional Jeep look that he loves and why he got
the Liberty, yet his girl friend said she loves it and always thought
Alex's Liberty was old looking.

Again, this is the Y generation, both 25 years old, so I think they
will be successful but to the youth martket more than the older market.

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Blake Noble Newbie

Blake Noble

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Posted (edited)

One thing I missed in the writeups--the hardware..is this just a FWD/AWD CUV or is it a RWD/AWD SUV?

The KL is CUSW (read: Dart) based, so base models will be front-wheel drive and probably feature some variation of the Tigershark four-cylinder, I believe. Upmarket versions will feature the 3.2 liter version of the Pentastar six, and will be all-wheel drive. I've heard from one source the all-wheel drive models may feature some form of an actual transfer case.

Edited by black-knight
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Camino LS6 Newbie

Camino LS6

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One thing I missed in the writeups--the hardware..is this just a FWD/AWD CUV or is it a RWD/AWD SUV?

The KL is CUSW (read: Dart) based, so base models will be front-wheel drive and probably feature some variation of the Tigershark four-cylinder, I believe. Upmarket versions will feature the 3.2 liter version of the Pentastar six, and will be all-wheel drive. I've heard from one source the all-wheel drive models may feature some form of an actual transfer case.

Wow, that's just awful news.

Makes this thing one big pile of suck.

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Lamar Newbie

Lamar

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Posted

One thing I missed in the writeups--the hardware..is this just a FWD/AWD CUV or is it a RWD/AWD SUV?

The KL is CUSW (read: Dart) based, so base models will be front-wheel drive and probably feature some variation of the Tigershark four-cylinder, I believe. Upmarket versions will feature the 3.2 liter version of the Pentastar six, and will be all-wheel drive. I've heard from one source the all-wheel drive models may feature some form of an actual transfer case.

Wow, that's just awful news.

Makes this thing one big pile of suck.

As I recall, the last gen small CUVs from Jeep (Patriot and Compass) coexisted because of results from focus groups. Women preferred the styling of the Compass, while men preferred the Patriot. Also, at launch, only the Patriot was "Trail Rated." So Jeep decided to make both to please everybody.

The Cherokee appears to be a fusion of the two... that went terribly, horribly wrong.

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Blake Noble Newbie

Blake Noble

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I would think two cute utes already (Compass, Patriot) would have been enough, but noooo....sad to see Jeep continue to be diluted.

To be fair here, the Compass and Patriot will essentially be "merged" into one model for 2015, so with the introduction of the KL Cherokee you're not really gaining a third crossover going forward. There will be one entry-level compact crossover and one mid-range mid-sized crossover from this point on.

The next-generation Compass — which may or may not keep that name, considering Marchionne seems to have a thing for "heritage" names — is interesting in the fact that I've heard that it may actually retain a more traditional Jeep-like appearance similar to the current Patriot. I'm taking a skeptic's approach here considering how the KL Cherokee turned out versus what I had heard; it's not that the rumors were necessarily wrong mind you, just the descriptions didn't equal up to what I had pictured at all. Of course, there won't be any added capability for the NG Compass, not that it's really a big deal here.

Personally, the real issue I have with the new KL Cherokee isn't the pretentious styling or even the fact it's essentially a Dart wagon clad in hiking boots and packing a little something extra in its pants (read: a jacked-up Dart wagon with a transfer case). It's the name I take issue with.

With the KL you seem to have a certain three-way split between those who outright loathe the damn thing: you have one camp who hates it because it doesn't look like a Jeep; you have one camp who hates it because it doesn't function like a Jeep; and you have the last camp who hates it because it shouldn't wear Cherokee badges. While I do agree with the first two camps, I'm firmly in the last one, as are a lot of people who dislike it. If Marchionne, Manley and company decided to brand the KL with a new name, such as Renegade or Jeepster, or even kept the Liberty name, I tend to think fewer people would be inclined to even so much as bat an eye at it. You'd have a few folks bemoaning its appearance and front-drive platform, but everyone would move on pretty quick. No one would care so much; I would've cared maybe a little less.

The Cherokee name, however, carries lofty expectations and generally good connotations. The XJ is known for being rugged, efficient, and dependable. When XJs were new, they were also fairly inexpensive. It checks off the correct boxes, especially for a Jeep. It also didn't take long for people to start saying, "Man, I wish Jeep still made the old Cherokee," after Wolfganag Bernhard and those peons from Daimler pulled the plug on the XJ and botched the hell out of the KJ Liberty. Dedicated Jeepers and fair weather buyers who may have had an old Cherokee or two alike have all but outright begged Jeep to bring back the Cherokee for almost a decade now. The KL is a rather insulting answer to many of those people. That's where most of the disappointment stems from, I think. I don't think anyone, myself included, expected Jeep to literally dust off the tooling and dies and build XJs again, but I know I expected something that would've been a modern equivalent to the XJ that would've at least exceeded the KK Liberty in capability and value.

Just so there isn't any misunderstanding, I have no issue with Jeep building a soft-roader or two so that it can pay the bills to keep developing more hardcore and traditional models like the Wrangler and Grand Cherokee. It's a necessary evil for an SUV-focused brand given the current political climate, federal standards, and market conditions here in America. Even Hummer would've had to cave in to this too somehow if it continued (which is actually why I'm glad GM pulled the plug).

However, for those in charge of the Jeep brand to allow that necessary evil to further permeate and dilute the core values of the brand, while seemingly perverting the history of the brand, is concerning at the very least. With the introduction of the KL, it is becoming clear that those in charge at Jeep now seem to be tending to focus less on making all models adhere to one strict "Trail Rated" standard. Instead, there will be more lax model-specific standards. It's also clear now that completely respecting the associations and heritage behind a heritage name isn't really a priority if it might add an extra sale or two.

Like I said before, the KL is the one vehicle that could stand to make or break Jeep and could stand to have a significant effect on Chrysler as a whole if it doesn't pan out as expected. This is the model to keep watch on. Marchionne said previously on 60 Minutes that Chrysler could afford to completely screw one car up. If this is that car, then whatever comes out afterwards will have to atone for the KL's mistakes, as melodramatic as that might sound.

Edited by black-knight
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Delta Force79 Newbie

Delta Force79

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Posted

I'm a huge fan of the old XJ Cherokee, we had a few in the family and this new one is totally wrong with the name Cherokee. I always saw the Patriot as more of a Cherokee than even the Liberty. The radical front on this Cherokee has grown on me slightly but it's not what I wanted for the Cherokee's big return. But given how well Fiat has turned Chrysler around, I'm willing to accept not eveythign they do will be a homerun, I just hope this sells.

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Blake Noble Newbie

Blake Noble

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At this point, I'm really hoping the "new" Chrysler doesn't screw up the next Jeep Wrangler :o

It will probably be a FWD/AWD CUV based on the Fiat 500... :)

Well, considering Mike Manley has said that sometime down the road the Wrangler may change to a unibody platform, that sadly may not be too far from the truth.

I will be vocal about Manley; he is a tried-and-true marketing guy and his statements about Jeep tend to show that he's either slightly ignorant about the core values of the brand or simply doesn't care about them. At the end of the day, he seems to only care about maximizing profits. That's all well and good, sure, but when the decisions you make alienate your core enthusiasts, it ultimately will not reflect well on the brand. I like to think the brand's sustainability is due in part to dedicated Jeepers over the years showing to their friends and family how rugged and durable their Jeeps were. If you turn those buyers away — if those essential buyers aren't recommending Jeeps, talking about Jeeps, and buying Jeeps — then the brand will eventually start to wither.

Chrysler and Marchionne needs to promote a long-time Jeep engineer to the position of Jeep CEO. That's the remedy to the situation: shiit-can Manley and put someone in charge who has been a dedicated Jeep engineer for 30 years. For the most part, marketing guys simply do not understand cars, let alone something like a Jeep. Hell, most of the time they can barely sell a car they've been tasked to design a campaign for. Someone like that does not need to be in charge of managing a brand.

Edited by black-knight
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daves87rs Collaborator

daves87rs

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I don't think this new Cherokee can be called "cute". If any Jeep went too far toward "cute", it was the first, chipmunk-cheeked Compass.

To me, the Cherokee looks like a future version of the Aztek, if that is even possible. A giant wagon on wheels. This makes the compass look real good. I can easily predict failure with this one....it's pretty much written on the walls....

This needed a classic jeep look, period. People could have looked over a few things if it had rugged handsome looks.

It looks like it has a better chance again an MDX or something like that.....

who the hell is going to take that off road?

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Blake Noble Newbie

Blake Noble

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This needed a classic jeep look, period. People could have looked over a few things if it had rugged handsome looks.

That's pretty much one reason why the Patriot has consistently outsold the Compass — it looks like a Jeep. It wasn't until the 2011 refresh the Compass actually began to keep a steady pace almost equal to the Patriot.

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daves87rs Collaborator

daves87rs

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This needed a classic jeep look, period. People could have looked over a few things if it had rugged handsome looks.

That's pretty much one reason why the Patriot has consistently outsold the Compass — it looks like a Jeep. It wasn't until the 2011 refresh the Compass actually began to keep a steady pace almost equal to the Patriot.

Exactly-So when you put the name cherokee on something, it should like a jeep, not art.....

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Blake Noble Newbie

Blake Noble

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One thing is they will help to hold up the value of old Cherokees that are in good shape still. :P

Sadly, as absurd and backward as that might sound, there will be folks out there who will see the KL as justification to further bloat the price of a decent XJ. There will also be people dumb enough to buy one, too. Trashed examples with 200,000 miles plus can still bring over a solid grand where I'm at, which I think is completely asinine.

You would think that because people still buy XJs in such poor condition, someone running Jeep would notice and go, "Hmmm ... maybe we should start building a cheap and capable steel-roofed Jeep again." It doesn't have to be as capable as the JK and JK Unlimited. The XJ wasn't as capable as the contemporary YJ and TJ Wranglers of its era, either.

I'm going to play armchair CEO here for a few minutes, so bear with me. If Jeep were being lead by someone smart enough to actually manage the brand, they would recognize the distinct need for three platforms to be used within the brand: one that could support efficient crossovers like the MK twins and the KL Cherokee; one that could support capable flagship models like the Grand Cherokee and upcoming Wagoneer; and one that could support capable traditional models like the Wrangler and a "new" new Cherokee.

The idea isn't worlds away from what is currently unfolding at Jeep. Use Fiat-sourced platforms for the crossovers so that there's a decent scale of economy at work. CUSW is fine, but at least modify the suspension and powertrain (I think CUSW can be easily modified to accept rear-drive with a little work) hardware to be worthy of the Jeep brand. Like I've said before, there isn't anything wrong with an "efficient" Jeep — hell, that was the name of the game with the original XJ. Develop and improve the capabilities of the next-generation WK2 platform (Grand Cherokee/Wagoneer) to exceed that of a Range Rover while also focusing on making it supple and luxurious. Also, share it to build a (less capable) SUV or two for Ram or Dodge (i.e. Durango), and maybe even a new smaller Ram truck. Finally, make the next-generation Wrangler architecture flexible enough to support the Wrangler, a new J10 truck, and a new Cherokee (the 2009 Trailhawk concept was based on the JK Unlimited, so it isn't a far-fetched idea, either). Since it would be a Jeep-exclusive platform, this would be the best way to get decent "mileage" out of the platform. The recent Moab 2012 concepts show that the Wrangler platform has potential to support more than just an open-top off-roader.

It's not that hard to do, really.

Edited by black-knight
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Blake Noble Newbie

Blake Noble

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Posted

This needed a classic jeep look, period. People could have looked over a few things if it had rugged handsome looks.

That's pretty much one reason why the Patriot has consistently outsold the Compass — it looks like a Jeep. It wasn't until the 2011 refresh the Compass actually began to keep a steady pace almost equal to the Patriot.

Exactly-So when you put the name cherokee on something, it should like a jeep, not art.....

Took the words right out of my mouth.

I will make one guilty admission about the new Cherokee, though. I see one heritage cue in the entire design and I sort of appreciate its interpretation. That kinked seven-slot grille was sort of there on the earlier XJs and the YJ Wrangler. That element on its own would be fine if the surrounding details on the KL were better and more traditional.

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Robert Hall Veteran

Robert Hall

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Took the words right out of my mouth.

I will make one guilty admission about the new Cherokee, though. I see one heritage cue in the entire design and I sort of appreciate its interpretation. That kinked seven-slot grille was sort of there on the earlier XJs and the YJ Wrangler. That element on its own would be fine if the surrounding details on the KL were better and more traditional.

I made the connection on the grille also... I like the grille...it's the lighting I find horrific. If it had lighting similar to the current Compass and Grand Cherokee (or the Patriot's round lights), I'd find a lot more to like about the design..instead, it seems like they are trying to emulate the Juke with it's similarly weird lighting arrangement.

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David Grand Master

David

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The more I look at this CUV, the more I think the Compass and Juke went behind the track and got it on and this is the result!

post-12-0-50598000-1362119465.gif

Just put it out of it's misery!

post-12-0-56620600-1362119567.gif

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FUTURE_OF_GM Newbie

FUTURE_OF_GM

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I like it....

Is it polarizing? Yes!

Is it the same plain-jane vanilla $h! that virtually every automaker is shoving down our throats now? No! And that's why I like it.

Need I remind you guys that 1) People incessantly bitched about the awesome looking Terrain when it first debuted. It's now, rightfully, a super star. And 2) People still buy a lot of ugly Toyotas: cars that look WORSE than this.

That said, I do think Jeep needs to cool it a little bit with the weird styling... I don't really care for the new Grand Cherokee update, and I can definitely see where the Cherokee might be a step in the wrong direction.

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NeonLX Newbie

NeonLX

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Unless it gets the ol' 4.0L inline six under the hood, I absolutely hate it. But if it gets the inliner, I'll tolerate it (barely).

Funny thing--I actually like the Compass. It's not offensive-looking (kinda pretty from the front) and it's light enough to be zippy with the 2.4L four/CVT.

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