Jump to content
  • Greetings Guest!

    CheersandGears.com was founded in 2001 and is one of the oldest continuously operating automotive forums out there.  Come see why we have users who visit nearly every day for the past 16+ years. Signup is fast and free, or you can opt for a premium subscription to view the site ad-free.

William Maley

Lincoln News: Under Consideration: Lincoln May Return to Actual Names

Recommended Posts

If you take an established successful name already on a successful product the name helps but the model has already made the name. 

Now if Lincoln slapped the Continental name on the MKJ it would not do a thing to help that situation.

 

The names we have today that resonate well are all on products that well define the name.

 

Cars are like people you can slap the name Einstein to anyone but it will not make them a genius.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

What you fail to consider is that both names you post here are ones with long continued production and continuation. Pulling a name out that was last used on a car that tarnished it or a name that has not been in use still has to re establish its self and only then if the product is good does it thrive.

 

The 500 failed as it was a poor car. The Taurus was bases on the 500 but it had many of the issues fixed. Fords mistake was to try to make a larger Passat.

 

I know many people like to romanticize some of the old times and legacy but that only works till the person gets behind the wheel of the new car then it has to prove itself.

 

Today you can look at the Colorado. The truck is being judged by what it is today not what it was 20 years ago. If the truck was a rolling piece of crap the name was not going to do a thing for it.  

Edited by hyperv6

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

What you fail to consider is that both names you post here are ones with long continued production and continuation. Pulling a name out that was last used on a car that tarnished it or a name that has not been in use still has to re establish its self and only then if the product is good does it thrive.

 

The 500 failed as it was a poor car. The Taurus was bases on the 500 but it had many of the issues fixed. Fords mistake was to try to make a larger Passat.

 

I know many people like to romanticize some of the old times and legacy but that only works till the person gets behind the wheel of the new car then it has to prove itself.

 

Today you can look at the Colorado. The truck is being judged by what it is today not what it was 20 years ago. If the truck was a rolling piece of crap the name was not going to do a thing for it.  

 

yeah, but they could have called the Colorado an S-10 and it would have actually had some heritage behind it.   Same with the CT6... they didn't have to call it a Classic name, but giving it a better name than it got would have been an improvement. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hard to say there as the Monte was a much better car than the previous Lumina Coupe.  Was it the name or was it because it was a much better looking car? Hard to prove there but I am willing to bet the styling has a lot more to do with it than the name.

 

The fact is they tried to put a like Monte Carlo Coupe styling with the long hood and short deck lid giving the car a much better look. The car still lacked the real Monte trait of V8 and RWD so I feel it was the styling. 

 

Even the Lumina sedan had better sales with improved styling.

 

Like I asked before who here bought a car based just on the name?

 

I would NOT buy a car based on the name ... any year MC or Impala case in point.

As for the mc/Lumina debacle, definitely hard to prove since looks are subjective.

 

 

I also agree with Drew & smk about the names.  Reminds me a little bit of that article I wrote for C&G:

http://www.cheersandgears.com/page/index.html/_/articles/editorials/stop-re-naming-my-car-r487

 
 
Cort :) www.oldcarsstronghearts.com
1979 & 1989 Caprice Classics | pigValve, paceMaker, cowValve
"Don't look now, things just got worse" __ Dog's Eye View __ 'Everything Falls Apart'

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

 

A good name can't help a bad car, but a bad name can hurt a good car.

 

 

Concisely said to the point. GM of past had habit of changing the name to hide a bad product. The CTS and ATS have brand value and excellent product, why ruin them with the CT-# nomenclature? What is wrong to NOT be a conformist? F$ck Germans and their asinine nomenclature mockery.

  • Upvote 1
  • Downvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I bet in the 2020s Cadillac goes back to word names and goes back to the heritage.  Once they piss away what little equity they have with CTS and ATS for possibly even lower selling CT3 and CT5, and the CT6 disappears in the higher end of the luxury market, they will go for another change.  By 2020 Johan's naming experiment will have failed, and GM will do what GM does and go with new product and a new name to make people forget about the last product that didn't sell.  I predict Fleetwood, Eldorado, Seville, and maybe even Deville are back in business by 2025.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

They could have called the Colorado an El Paso and it would have sold all the same because it is a good truck  no matter what you call it.  People buy trucks not names. Besides the Colorado has continuity here so you did not have to start over with marketing anyways.

 

As for the CT6 if the car is the best in the class the name should not matter. Style it right, Equip it right and market right and you can let the car define the name or in this case number.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Lest you forget that Cadillac used numbers so very long ago and did not use names till much later.

 

They used names like Model 30 and model A 113 years ago. No names just numbers or letters. They later progress with the numbers and then put a descriptive name on the car but yet not a model name. It took them almost 50 years to add a name to the model number they still were covered by.

 

Some think it is just the Germans but in the past most companies just offered model numbers or letters and then tagged it a coupe, sedan or town car..

I have not seen what CT6 means but I ponder if it is based on the old number system like Cadillac Type 62  as they once used. There may be more heritage there than you think.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

For the 50 years Cadillac was the sales leader, they had Fleetwood, Deville and Eldorado pretty much the whole time.  They are a 5th or 6th place luxury brand now with their alphabet soup and the Escalade is what keeps that brand alive.  And how exciting can advertising be for "CT6" and I can see consumers confusing it with "CTS" which for years was an entry level model.  Good luck to Cadillac trying to convince people the CT6 is on par with the big Germans.   At least "Fleetwood" and "Eldorado" have some weight to them and they might be able to draw on heritage a bit in the advertising.

 

Lincoln is in the same boat.  Their cars are lousy, and the alphabet soup names are forgetable and easily confused with an Acura MDX.  If they had Continental, at least it is a memorable name and would stand out.  Cadillac and Lincoln need to draw people into the showrooms and you need recognizable products to get traffic in the door. 

  • Downvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The theory that people are going to lay in a sensory-deprivation chamber, only hearing the names of potential autos and them deciding which to purchase, is most hilarious.

 

One could make the same 'point' thusly : Good luck to audi trying to convince people their "8" is on par with the big german "550" and "750" models.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The A8 has some track record.  The 7-series and S-class have 30-40 years of name recognition and history to fall back on.  People know what an A8 is, they know what an S-class is.  The CT6 is new, so people don't know what it is.   The number in it doesn't matter, the name just sounds like CTS, I think people will think it is just a bigger or longer CTS or worse a V6 CTS, that should be $50k, but will be shocked when it costs $75k. 

 

I still stand by if Cadillac really believed that alpha-numerics were the best thing, then Escalade needs to be renamed XT8, for continuity.  The fact that they won't rename the Escalade proves that Cadillac doesn't even believe in their own naming scheme.  Johan preaches that CT5, CT6, CT7, etc is what is needed, but their #1 product has a word name, why don't all products take the Escalade's lead?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

'Continuity' drives homogenization. Look at the kindergarten-level naming & styling schemes audi & BMW have bored everyone with.

 

Remember when Ford announced it was going to name all future cars beginning with 'F'?… then they remembered they had this lil moneymaker called the 'M'ustang?

 

I would hope Cadillac is above such grotesque simplification. Buyers should be smarter than kindergarten-aged children.

In other words, except for the psych ward and Gymboree demographics, it's totally fine to go with a proper name and an alpha-numeric.

 

That said, I hate 'CT6' emphatically. I don't believe people will be confused, but it just doesn't roll off the tongue at all. At least 'CTS' does.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Again if you build a car right it matters little what you call it. A car makes the name or number not the other way around.

 

A great car can save a bad name but a great name will never save a bad car.

 

Let the product define the name no the other way around. The problem with the old Cadillac names is they no longer hold the weight they once did with the public. Fleetwood means rebodied Caprice to many today or grandpas car.

the Eldorado is the car the pimp Guido drove in what ever dozen movies it was done in.

 

The past names mean much to the enthusiast here but out in the real world they have lost their luster with several decades of product that was lacking.

 

There was a time 3 series meant nothing as did 300SL or any other number or name. But these cars defined what these number or names meant and no matter how you spin it if GM builds it right it matter little what they call it.

 

You could have rebadged the Aztek as a Chevy Nomad and it would have done nothing but damage the name.

 

People trust what they see and feel. Buying a car is an emotional thing. It is much like a guy meeting a girl names Ethel that looks like a super model. He will have strong feelings alone on what he sees. Now you can name a old hag Tawny or what other center fold name you can think off and yet once he gets an eyeful the name means little. And if there are any ladies reading just do the same with a mans name. I mean no disrespect.

Human nature takes control of our wants and needs and most effected is our eyesight. Next is feel be it driving or interior add in some ego for the status the first two give and you have a strong product recognition.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Your content will need to be approved by a moderator

Guest
You are commenting as a guest. If you have an account, please sign in.
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


  • Who's Online   1 Member, 0 Anonymous, 12 Guests (See full list)



  • Similar Content

    • By William Maley
      Lincoln has been slowing transitioning their nomenclature system from three letter (MK_) to actual names - MKX to Nautilus for example. The next-generation MKC, due in 2020 as a 2021 model will see its name change to Corsair.
      Automotive News reports the name was announced last month to Ford and Lincoln dealers at a conference held in Orlando according to those who attended the meeting. Corsair, the name of a pirate ship and a World War II fighter plane first came to light last year when Ford filed a trademark on. The name was last used on a badge engineered model between Ford and Nissan for Australia.
      Sources at Ford said the name isn't final and could change before the model goes into production.
      Dealers at the meeting were also shown the next-generation Ford Escape, Explorer, Mach 1 EV crossover, and the Lincoln Continental with suicide doors.
      Source: Automotive News (Subscription Required)

      View full article
    • By William Maley
      Lincoln has been slowing transitioning their nomenclature system from three letter (MK_) to actual names - MKX to Nautilus for example. The next-generation MKC, due in 2020 as a 2021 model will see its name change to Corsair.
      Automotive News reports the name was announced last month to Ford and Lincoln dealers at a conference held in Orlando according to those who attended the meeting. Corsair, the name of a pirate ship and a World War II fighter plane first came to light last year when Ford filed a trademark on. The name was last used on a badge engineered model between Ford and Nissan for Australia.
      Sources at Ford said the name isn't final and could change before the model goes into production.
      Dealers at the meeting were also shown the next-generation Ford Escape, Explorer, Mach 1 EV crossover, and the Lincoln Continental with suicide doors.
      Source: Automotive News (Subscription Required)
    • By William Maley
      F-Series Posts Best April Results In 18 Years While New Expedition Climbs 26 Percent At Retail; New Navigator Retail Sales Jump 135 Percent

    • By William Maley
      Ever since Ford announced that it would cutting most of their passenger car lineup, questions arose as to what would happen to the subsequent Lincoln models. The Contiental and MKZ share platforms with Ford models that will be cut - Fusion and Taurus.
      Thankfully, we have gotten an answer to this. A Lincoln spokesperson told Automobile Magazine they are "committed" to both the Contiental and MKZ. No other information was provided.
      But there arises the question as to how long Lincoln is "committed" to both models. The MKZ has seen sales decline from 34,009 in 2014 (the year it was redesigned) to 27,387 units last year. The Continental hasn't been faring any better with only 12,012 units sold in 2017. The Cadillac XTS outsold it by 4,263 units.
      As we reported last month in the rumorpile, plans for a next-generation Continental have been canned.
      Source: Automobile Magazine

      View full article
    • By William Maley
      Ever since Ford announced that it would cutting most of their passenger car lineup, questions arose as to what would happen to the subsequent Lincoln models. The Contiental and MKZ share platforms with Ford models that will be cut - Fusion and Taurus.
      Thankfully, we have gotten an answer to this. A Lincoln spokesperson told Automobile Magazine they are "committed" to both the Contiental and MKZ. No other information was provided.
      But there arises the question as to how long Lincoln is "committed" to both models. The MKZ has seen sales decline from 34,009 in 2014 (the year it was redesigned) to 27,387 units last year. The Continental hasn't been faring any better with only 12,012 units sold in 2017. The Cadillac XTS outsold it by 4,263 units.
      As we reported last month in the rumorpile, plans for a next-generation Continental have been canned.
      Source: Automobile Magazine
  • My Clubs

  • Recently Browsing

    No registered users viewing this page.

  • Reader Rides

About us

CheersandGears.com - Founded 2001

We ♥ Cars

Get in touch

Follow us

Recent tweets

facebook

×

Important Information

We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.