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Say goodbye to the Dodge Dart and Chrysler 200

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And nothing of value was lost.....

 

the 200 is a pretty decent car, it's one of my favorites in the segment.  People like Reg don't like it because they are shopping for the most cubic feet of interior room per dollar. If you just need a sedan to get you to work and back with little concern for the back seat passengers, there are definitely worse choices out there. The 200 is also unique in that it is the only V6 with AWD mid-size family car that I can think of outside of a top end Subaru Legacy.   I also happen to like the interior better than most of its direct competition. 

 

don't put words in my mouth, i like the 200.  the v6 AWD is a great option in the class.  I think of the 200 more as a personal sedan rather than a family sedan, and the 200 / Sebring was never a big car either.  The Intrepid was always Chryslers room and space car.

Edited by regfootball

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And we wonder why GM just laughed when he said we should join together...

 

 

But with all these DA moves..makes you wonder if he's prepping FCA to sell to GM? Makes you wonder....

 

 

Like most said-these cars just needed tweaks and a nice long warranty to inspire....

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I think the 200 is appealing as well.  Not sure I would buy one to own, but on a clearance lease deal for the AWD less than $300 a month, (similar to how Caddy cleared out a glut of ATS and Acura did the same for the TLX SH AWD last fall in Canada, under both under $400 a month with 0 down), why not..

Edited by frogger

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^ I get what they are trying to be funny, but I just do not see him as funny to me.

 

This is a good Bye Bye Video and it is a Chrysler!

 

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Guest VenSeattle

I never saw the 200 as anything special. It's not an appropriate sibling to the 300. They look like they're built by two completely different manufacturers and for the price, you can get a well equipped 300 for the price of a well equipped 200. The lower trim levels of the 200 have this dull charcoal colored interior and matte finished plastic where the wood would be surrounding the instrument pod on the upper trim levels. It just looked low rent. I saw several 200s at AVIS, Hertz, and Enterprise. I can believe the dealers' argument that FCA were inflating sales numbers. For comparison, the current Regal is nicer than the 200 and it's about to be replaced.

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I never saw the 200 as anything special. It's not an appropriate sibling to the 300. They look like they're built by two completely different manufacturers. One is a generic jelly bean and the other is a brick. And for the price, you can get a well equipped 300 for the price of a well equipped 200. The lower trim levels of the 200 have this dull charcoal colored interior and matte finished plastic where the wood would be surrounding the instrument pod on the upper trim levels. It just looked low rent. I saw several 200s at AVIS, Hertz, and Enterprise. I can believe the dealers' argument that FCA were inflating sales numbers. For comparison, the current Regal is nicer than the 200 and it's about to be replaced.

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I rented a 300 last April and a 200 last August.  The 300 was wonderful in every way, and the 200, even with 4 cylinder, had good power, but poor visibility and an unsettled transmission. 

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don't put words in my mouth, i like the 200.  the v6 AWD is a great option in the class.  I think of the 200 more as a personal sedan rather than a family sedan, and the 200 / Sebring was never a big car either.  The Intrepid was always Chryslers room and space car.

 

Uh, the Intrepid has been gone for over decade...the 300 and Charger have been their big cars since the mid 00s...

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I never saw the 200 as anything special. It's not an appropriate sibling to the 300. They look like they're built by two completely different manufacturers. One is a generic jelly bean and the other is a brick. And for the price, you can get a well equipped 300 for the price of a well equipped 200. The lower trim levels of the 200 have this dull charcoal colored interior and matte finished plastic where the wood would be surrounding the instrument pod on the upper trim levels. It just looked low rent. I saw several 200s at AVIS, Hertz, and Enterprise. I can believe the dealers' argument that FCA were inflating sales numbers. For comparison, the current Regal is nicer than the 200 and it's about to be replaced.

 

yeah, I've driven the rental grade 200, and it's nothing special... but neither is the rental grade anything from any brand.  The 200 does do better in S or C trims, and particularly with the 3.6 V6.  It's like a whole different car. 

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don't put words in my mouth, i like the 200.  the v6 AWD is a great option in the class.  I think of the 200 more as a personal sedan rather than a family sedan, and the 200 / Sebring was never a big car either.  The Intrepid was always Chryslers room and space car.

 

Uh, the Intrepid has been gone for over decade...the 300 and Charger have been their big cars since the mid 00s...

 

 

oh i know that, but the 300 and Charger are not mid size segment cars.  The Intrepid and Concorde set the bar with the cab forward styling and packaging that wrote the book on how sedans should be packaged for mass market.  The 300 and Charger were a step into the RWD foray, and their packaging, while large, is inefficient, regressive and not of the mainstream FWD chassis ilk.  

Aside from being a Chrysler, the Intrepid had the chance to set the benchmark for family sedans.  Dubious Chrysler engineering and quality was their setback.  The styling and packaging made all the sense.  The GM cars of the same time period were embarrassing  from a packaging standpoint in comparison.

Edited by regfootball
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don't put words in my mouth, i like the 200.  the v6 AWD is a great option in the class.  I think of the 200 more as a personal sedan rather than a family sedan, and the 200 / Sebring was never a big car either.  The Intrepid was always Chryslers room and space car.

 

Uh, the Intrepid has been gone for over decade...the 300 and Charger have been their big cars since the mid 00s...

 

 

oh i know that, but the 300 and Charger are not mid size segment cars.  The Intrepid and Concorde set the bar with the cab forward styling and packaging that wrote the book on how sedans should be packaged for mass market.  The 300 and Charger were a step into the RWD foray, and their packaging, while large, is inefficient, regressive and not of the mainstream FWD chassis ilk.  

Aside from being a Chrysler, the Intrepid had the chance to set the benchmark for family sedans.  Dubious Chrysler engineering and quality was their setback.  The styling and packaging made all the sense.  The GM cars of the same time period were embarrassing  from a packaging standpoint in comparison.

 

I didn't say the 300/Charger were midsize...the Concorde and Intrepid were the full size segment cars, the Sebring/Stratus were the mid size cars..over 10 years ago.  Not sure what you are going on about...you seem to be confusing midsize and fullsize segments.

 

The 300 and Charger being RWD is a distinction amongst mainstream full size cars today, which are otherwise FWD  (Impala, Taurus, Avalon, Maxima, etc)

Edited by Cubical-aka-Moltar

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the sebring and stratus were tweeners.  

 

at least as far as markets, the intrepid still tried to cover the mainstream price segment.  actually, the strategy chrysler had was to cover it with the two cars.

 

Nowadays, you pretty much have to nail the size of the car right on to be in the mainstream volume sedan segment.  That is what chevy finally figured out with the new malibu.

 

Note how Nissan (is a good example).  You can cover the volume segment with the Altima but be damn sure its the right size.  The new Maxima is actually quite small, but then it becomes the luxury model.

 

I think the 200 sort of tries to catch some folks that may be looking at a Regal, a CC, or a Maxima.  Since Chrysler and Dodge don't have any other cars in the mainstream segment, then, the 200 sort of is Chryslers defacto, even if by covering it its more of a tweener......its good for the Chrysler brand.  But if this were a Dodge branded car it would need to match Accord / Altima / Passat size.

 

Passat is a great example of how size matters.  A better price plus a better size and it sold way more than it did when it was small back in 2009-2010 whatever.

Edited by regfootball

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I can't quite follow or agree with you on most of that Reg.  The Intrepid and Concord were packaged great yes. Mechanically, they were fine as long as you didn't get the 2.7 V6.   The Sebring and Stratus weren't tweeners in size, they were cheap, but they were right there in size with the Camry/Accord of the day. The Malibu was the tweener at the time, being 4 inches shorter than the Stratus.  (2006 stats used)

 

As for the GM cars, the H-Body and G-Body cars that stacked up against the LH cars (except the LHS which got a trunk extension but is otherwise identical inside to the Intrepid) almost exactly.  No interior dimension is off by more than an inch except hip-room where the GM cars are a little over an inch wider.   If you're thinking W-body Impala/Lumina maybe... but back when the LH cars were first out, their main competition via price was the Bonneville, Eighty-Eight, LeSabre and Park Ave.  While some low-end Dodge Intrepids were sold as loss leaders, the Concord, Vision, Bonneville, and 88 were less than $150 difference in price.  New Yorker, Park Ave, and Ninety-Eight were all about $27k. 

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the 2.7 was a terrible motor.  when i was doing my selling gig, those cars with that motor were either traded in when they were about to blow up, or they blew up right after they got sold.  the book value of the sebring and stratus in particular were abysmal.  if you had to get someone approved for a sale who had bad credit, a lot of times one of the few choices you had were to find a sebring or stratus that was newer and low miles because the loan to value was always a problem.  It was mostly due to the 2.7 being a steaming pile of turd.  The used Intrepids were boomerangs too if they had the 2.7.

Edited by regfootball

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I can see get getting rid of the Dart... It probably would have been better as a Chrysler to begin with..

 

but the 200 is little bit of a head scratcher.

 

And for some reason their sales of the 200 were good in the last couple months, and then they recently tanked, especially for the 4th quarter?

 

I'm sure it was mentioned before, but why?

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I can see get getting rid of the Dart... It probably would have been better as a Chrysler to begin with..

 

but the 200 is little bit of a head scratcher.

 

And for some reason their sales of the 200 were good in the last couple months, and then they recently tanked, especially for the 4th quarter?

 

I'm sure it was mentioned before, but why?

 

It wasn't that they tanked... it was that December the year prior was abnormally high. 

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Ahh, tanked relative to the year prior.

 

That's not good.

 

The hallmarks of resurgent sales are continued growth year-over-year.

 

But it petering out means there's a real issue.

 

Chrysler has always been a brand about its sedans and minivans.

 

To only have that number to dwindle to two is worrisome.

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Ahh, tanked relative to the year prior.

 

That's not good.

 

The hallmarks of resurgent sales are continued growth year-over-year.

 

But it petering out means there's a real issue.

 

Chrysler has always been a brand about its sedans and minivans.

 

To only have that number to dwindle to two is worrisome.

 

... no.. again, Dec '14 was an unusually large sales gain for the 200. They basically ran a sale and moved a whole bunch of extra metal (and probably dumped the previous bodystyle into fleets).  Dec '15 was a return to norm.  It looks like a big drop, but it is really just a return to normal.  For the entire year, the 200 was up 52%. http://www.cheersandgears.com/topic/86233-december-2015-fca-us-llc/

 

December '13 - 5,652

December '14 - 16,229  (fleeting and big discounts on old model)

December '15 - 8,759 (and up 52% for the year)

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Ahh, tanked relative to the year prior.

 

That's not good.

 

The hallmarks of resurgent sales are continued growth year-over-year.

 

But it petering out means there's a real issue.

 

Chrysler has always been a brand about its sedans and minivans.

 

To only have that number to dwindle to two is worrisome.

 

... no.. again, Dec '14 was an unusually large sales gain for the 200. They basically ran a sale and moved a whole bunch of extra metal (and probably dumped the previous bodystyle into fleets).  Dec '15 was a return to norm.  It looks like a big drop, but it is really just a return to normal.  For the entire year, the 200 was up 52%. http://www.cheersandgears.com/topic/86233-december-2015-fca-us-llc/

 

December '13 - 5,652

December '14 - 16,229  (fleeting and big discounts on old model)

December '15 - 8,759 (and up 52% for the year)

 

 

 

Jan 2016 - 5200 units

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Oh sorry Drew, I thought the last year the sales mix was heavily the new gen, I didn't realize they cleared out a lot of glut of the old 200.

 

 

Well, if this is the normal sales level... I don't know why they went into this new generation, only to see it gone within the product cycle. I mean, I think it's a solid product...

 

But I'm not sure if it has the substance if you don't go for the higher trims. I would go towards Chevy or Hyundai Sonata Eco or Accord Sport if I wanted an excellent mid-size sedan that is more affordable.

 

The top-end is where the 200 was really supposed to shine, and it does... but I just can't get how the selling point was the really well done interior. You lost some interior space, and now with the refreshed entries, you don't have to compromise...

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