Cadillac News: Cadillac To Replace Three Sedans With One

[A Horse With No Name]

1 minute ago, Cubical-aka-Moltar said:

Speaking of old pickup trucks, my only experience with full-size trucks were the ones my Dad and brother had, all 70s models..the 70s pickups had a lot of charm, clean simple styling.   My Dad had a '79 Dodge Power Wagon 4x4, short bed. Very bouncy ride and numb steering, learned to drive in it and drove it a fair bit over a few years.   In the late 80s my brother had a '74 Ford F100  longbed, 300 six and manual, and a '75 Chevy C10 short bed step side, 350...both 2wd...fun vehicles.. all very stripped by 2017 standards.

That is the era of trucks I like...late 70's dodge 4WD truck at the gas station this morning when I was getting a cup of Coffee....loved the look of that Truck....

70's Ford square body look is one of the best looks ever on a pickup truck IMHO!

[Robert Hall]

The Dodge was silver green w/ a matching interior...bench seat w/ a cloth insert, 318 w/ automatic.  The Ford was dark gray w/ a black interior.  The Chevy was bright yellow, with Tweety Bird decals, tube grille, Cragar SS mags..kind of a 70s street machine look, low in the front, high in the rear. 

Since this was 30 years ago, I don't have any digital pics of them, but googled and found similar..the first green Dodge pic is the right color and the right wheels (my Dad put the white wagon spoke ones on his), the 2nd pic the right bodystyle and year (but a brighter green). 

Edited July 31, 2017 by Cubical-aka-Moltar

[A Horse With No Name]

1 minute ago, Cubical-aka-Moltar said:

The Dodge was silver green w/ a matching interior...bench seat w/ a cloth insert, 318 w/ automatic.  The Ford was dark gray w/ a black interior.  The Chevy was bright yellow, with Tweety Bird decals, tube grille, Cragar SS mags..kind of a 70s street machine look, low in the front, high in the rear. 

Dodge trucks of the era were lookers also, and that 318 was a decent V8.

[smk4565]

3 hours ago, Cubical-aka-Moltar said:

That's heresy for an M-B fan boy like you to call the B-class a 'bad car' isn't it?   The B-class predates the EV version, it was available as a normal engined car before the EV version came along.  

As far as the unorthodox shape/styling of the Bolt and i3, my theory is it's part of the philosophy that alternative powertrain models by normal car companies have to be distinctive looking to sell--i.e. look at the Prius, Mirai, Leaf, i-Mev....all have unconventional styling. The i3 and Bolt follow that thinking, the Volt to a lesser extent.

Very true...bigger people and people with more stuff...need space to haul stuff.  Though nowadays most of my stuff arrives at the front door via UPS, USPS, FedEx, Amazon... I still do buy some stuff from physical locations. like to have room in my SUV to haul said stuff.

The Electric B-class is a bad car.  The gas B-class I imagine is fine for an entry level people mover but I still don't like the body style.  A GLA even looks better and does the same thing as a B-class, they have a GLB coming which could be cool, the current B-class I think they should dump world wide.

A lot of the funky looking EV's don't sell but the Tesla Model S sells partly because it is a good looking sedan.  I think if you want to sell an EV you make it a sedan or crossover.

The Bolt is the size and shape of a Honda Fit, that isn't a winning formula.  I would prefer that GM made the Bolt a Cruze or Malibu size sedan, but they didn't since they have the Volt.  

I wouldn't mind seeing Cadillac go all EV and making the CT5 a mid size sedan that did 0-60 in 5.5 seconds with 250 mile range and $45,000 price point and do a CT4 small sedan at $35k with a 200 mile range, rear drive on both.

[balthazar]

1 hour ago, smk4565 said:

A lot of the funky looking EV's don't sell but the Tesla Model S sells partly because it is a good looking sedan.  I think if you want to sell an EV you make it a sedan or crossover.

The Bolt is the size and shape of a Honda Fit, that isn't a winning formula.

• Fit outsells the entire brand of Tesla year to date. Nothing wrong with that stat, right?
• Bolt is a 'hot hatch'- something people have badgered GM to build. The shape is very nice- a good blend of compact hatch and slightly funky EV-ness necessary to stand out. It's already killing the i3 over 2:1. Nothing wrong with that stat, right?
• Bolt has a good chance -with expanded distribution- to move to #3 in the segment by the end of the year. What's fantastic for Chevrolet is all the free advertising- just about every article on the Model 3 mentions the Bolt! It's advertising and implied cross shopping. Getting the Bolt out first was a stroke of genius knowing the Model 3 was coming- got 2 rounds of publicity and a head start on sales in the segment.

[smk4565]

The optimism for the Bolt is reminiscent of how the ATS and CTS were going to challenge the Germans and take them down.  And here were are with ATS and CTS going to the grave, and the Germans still going strong.

[A Horse With No Name]

2 hours ago, balthazar said:

• Fit outsells the entire brand of Tesla year to date. Nothing wrong with that stat, right?
• Bolt is a 'hot hatch'- something people have badgered GM to build. The shape is very nice- a good blend of compact hatch and slightly funky EV-ness necessary to stand out. It's already killing the i3 over 2:1. Nothing wrong with that stat, right?
• Bolt has a good chance -with expanded distribution- to move to #3 in the segment by the end of the year. What's fantastic for Chevrolet is all the free advertising- just about every article on the Model 3 mentions the Bolt! It's advertising and implied cross shopping. Getting the Bolt out first was a stroke of genius knowing the Model 3 was coming- got 2 rounds of publicity and a head start on sales in the segment.

Plus the Bolt is arguably a better car.  Also, GM is eleven billion times more financially stable than Musk and his house of cards.

1 hour ago, smk4565 said:

The optimism for the Bolt is reminiscent of how the ATS and CTS were going to challenge the Germans and take them down.  And here were are with ATS and CTS going to the grave, and the Germans still going strong.

ATS and CTS are doing just fine.

3 hours ago, smk4565 said:

The Electric B-class is a bad car.  The gas B-class I imagine is fine for an entry level people mover but I still don't like the body style.  A GLA even looks better and does the same thing as a B-class, they have a GLB coming which could be cool, the current B-class I think they should dump world wide.

A lot of the funky looking EV's don't sell but the Tesla Model S sells partly because it is a good looking sedan.  I think if you want to sell an EV you make it a sedan or crossover.

The Bolt is the size and shape of a Honda Fit, that isn't a winning formula.  I would prefer that GM made the Bolt a Cruze or Malibu size sedan, but they didn't since they have the Volt.  

I wouldn't mind seeing Cadillac go all EV and making the CT5 a mid size sedan that did 0-60 in 5.5 seconds with 250 mile range and $45,000 price point and do a CT4 small sedan at $35k with a 200 mile range, rear drive on both.

Cadillac going all EV would disenfranchise the buyers who still want traditional cars.

[oldshurst442]

Ive had a change of heart....so I decided to omit the original message.

Edited August 1, 2017 by oldshurst442

[A Horse With No Name]

13 minutes ago, oldshurst442 said:

Ive had a change of heart....so I decided to omit the original message.

If you honestly disagree with me say so!  I do not have a vagina made of glass like some other guys who post here.

Edited August 1, 2017 by A Horse With No Name

[oldshurst442]

Just now, A Horse With No Name said:

If you honestly disagree with me say so!  I do not have a vagina made of glass like some other guy who post here.

No...that was not it.

It was a trolly remark that did not represent my opinion and it would probably do more damage than good.

It was meant for cheap laughs while making a statement but a statement that I wont back up either so...

Its best to just leave it as a blank!

 

[A Horse With No Name]

4 minutes ago, oldshurst442 said:

No...that was not it.

It was a trolly remark that did not represent my opinion and it would probably do more damage than good.

It was meant for cheap laughs while making a statement but a statement that I wont back up either so...

Its best to just leave it as a blank!

 

I will still respect you in the morning if you are sarcastic.  Lord knows I am at times myself!

[smk4565]

32 minutes ago, A Horse With No Name said:

Plus the Bolt is arguably a better car.  Also, GM is eleven billion times more financially stable than Musk and his house of cards.

ATS and CTS are doing just fine.

Cadillac going all EV would disenfranchise the buyers who still want traditional cars.

ATS and CTS are getting killed off.  That isn't doing just fine.  And we know nothing about the CT5 yet, so we don't know if it is an upgrade or how that will play out.

Musk's house of cards is worth more than all of GM, it could crumble, but if the Model 3 is a hit, he is on his way.  The one thing Tesla has going for it, is a passionate leader.  GM is run by finance people and accountants that are care takers of a shrinking empire.  Musk is relentless and takes this all personally.  

[A Horse With No Name]

Just now, smk4565 said:

ATS and CTS are getting killed off.  That isn't doing just fine.  And we know nothing about the CT5 yet, so we don't know if it is an upgrade or how that will play out.

Musk's house of cards is worth more than all of GM, it could crumble, but if the Model 3 is a hit, he is on his way.  The one thing Tesla has going for it, is a passionate leader.  GM is run by finance people and accountants that are care takers of a shrinking empire.  Musk is relentless and takes this all personally.  

They are getting refreshed and re named.

Musk is relentless but his company is wildly over valued in terms of his stock price.

He is not even remotely close to turning a profit.

I wish him well..but he will need more than good vibes from me here in Columbus!

Also, I have faith in Ms Barra.

[smk4565]

6 minutes ago, A Horse With No Name said:

They are getting refreshed and re named.

Musk is relentless but his company is wildly over valued in terms of his stock price.

He is not even remotely close to turning a profit.

I wish him well..but he will need more than good vibes from me here in Columbus!

Also, I have faith in Ms Barra.

Amazon had almost no total profit their first 10 years, most years they had losses.   Now retail powerhouses like Sears, JC Penny, Macy's, are going out of business and even Wal-Mart is hurting.   If Tesla becomes the Amazon of cars, then they aren't over valued at all, they'll put half the brands out of business.

[balthazar]

Amazon only has a virtual warehouse of other's goods - their overhead could not have been anything like Sears with physical stores and manufacturing/deliveries. Tesla is 'Sears' here, not Amazon.

[A Horse With No Name]

5 minutes ago, balthazar said:

Amazon only has a virtual warehouse of other's goods - their overhead could not have been anything like Sears with physical stores and manufacturing/deliveries. Tesla is 'Sears' here, not Amazon.

And both Sears and Amazon have had positive cash flow, Tesla has not.

[surreal1272]

3 hours ago, smk4565 said:

ATS and CTS are getting killed off.  That isn't doing just fine.  And we know nothing about the CT5 yet, so we don't know if it is an upgrade or how that will play out.

Musk's house of cards is worth more than all of GM, it could crumble, but if the Model 3 is a hit, he is on his way.  The one thing Tesla has going for it, is a passionate leader.  GM is run by finance people and accountants that are care takers of a shrinking empire.  Musk is relentless and takes this all personally.  

Tesla is also worth more than Mercedes but we will just gloss over that little fact for now. 

[daves87rs]

1 hour ago, balthazar said:

Amazon only has a virtual warehouse of other's goods - their overhead could not have been anything like Sears with physical stores and manufacturing/deliveries. Tesla is 'Sears' here, not Amazon.

Yep...

With with the giant ego-Telsa is still a bit player. If say Honda or GM needed to get serious about the EV thing, Telsa would not stand a chance.

Telsa reminds me how trendy can get you somewhere, like the iphone.

Can also bite you hard in the butt as well.....

3 hours ago, smk4565 said:

ATS and CTS are getting killed off.  That isn't doing just fine.  And we know nothing about the CT5 yet, so we don't know if it is an upgrade or how that will play out.

Musk's house of cards is worth more than all of GM, it could crumble, but if the Model 3 is a hit, he is on his way.  The one thing Tesla has going for it, is a passionate leader.  GM is run by finance people and accountants that are care takers of a shrinking empire.  Musk is relentless and takes this all personally.  

You are confusing passion with his ego. I can tend you that in me dealing with the company.

He will get hits on some things, but still knows jack about cars.......

[surreal1272]

3 hours ago, smk4565 said:

ATS and CTS are getting killed off.  That isn't doing just fine.  And we know nothing about the CT5 yet, so we don't know if it is an upgrade or how that will play out.

Musk's house of cards is worth more than all of GM, it could crumble, but if the Model 3 is a hit, he is on his way.  The one thing Tesla has going for it, is a passionate leader.  GM is run by finance people and accountants that are care takers of a shrinking empire.  Musk is relentless and takes this all personally.  

ATS=CT4

CTS=CT5

 

That is not being killed off. The name change has been in the works for years now. Mercedes has pulled a similar deal with some of their models but I'm sure you wouldn't call them being "killed off". 

GLK=GLC

[oldshurst442]

6 hours ago, surreal1272 said:

ATS=CT4

CTS=CT5

Not quite

CT(#)= Audi A3 fighter

ATS+CTS=CT5

CT6=CT6 but with a bigger role to fulfill as it probably will fulfill the void and represent what the XTS offered to folk that wants the ΧΤS and be Cadillac's flagship sedan at the highest trim level.

[oldshurst442]

7 hours ago, daves87rs said:

Telsa reminds me how trendy can get you somewhere, like the iphone.

On Tesla and on the iPhone

• Apple was laughed at not having a physical keyboard...so much so that there was still defiance and some tried to offer a physical keyboard with their touch screen
• Apple was laughed at for even having a touch screen in the first place
• Apple was laughed at for controlling the touch screen with your fingers in funky ways reminiscent of a fantasy futuristic Tom Cruise movie
• Apple was laughed at for trying to push connectivity and calling it "smart phone"
• Apple was laughed at for iTunes and people paying for "apps"
• From selling ZERO phones...to becoming a MAJOR player displacing the inventor of the satellite phone Motorola and the darling leader of the 1990s Nokia and dismantling the early 2000s technology filled leader Blackberry
• Apple was also laughed at for creating a "bigger iPhone" and saying that tablets will replace laptops...laptops did not die yet but are not as healthy as before as tablets have pushed their way to be an actual viable computer platform alternative

Tesla made it possible to sell the idea that EVs ARE the future that people actually want to own and COUNTRIES all over the world are waiting impatiently for the tech to be on par with oil driven vehicles...

Some COUNTRIES of the world have set a time and date and HAVE BANNED internal combustion engines. In 15-20 years, only alternative energy cars will be able to be bought in these countries...will it be EVs? WHo knows??? Tesla started this wave!!!

 Not trendy...TREND SETTING

BIG DIFFERENCE. I suggest you folk stop  verbally beating up on Tesla or Apple...

Apple was supposed to die sometime in the 1980s by haters and 'experts' alike.

Tesla may not survive as building and selling cars is a very expensive and task requiring BILLIONS every year and automotive consumers are the most fickle, most demanding, most hardest to make them stay loyal as the competition is the FIERCEST in any domain...being as it may, Tesla already has changed the course of automobile history for the future even if Tesla  ceases to exist 4:00 PM Eastern time today and it is currently 8:00 AM Eastern time as I type this...

Edited August 1, 2017 by oldshurst442

[oldshurst442]

10 hours ago, A Horse With No Name said:

I will still respect you in the morning if you are sarcastic.  Lord knows I am at times myself!

OK....

This was the intent of that post. Without the trolling and the controversial pics.

1. Seriously? What is up with all the kissing of GM's ass? GM went bankrupt in 2008 because they had a negative cash flow WORSE than Tesla's.   HELLO!!! THEY WENT BANKRUPT!!!  (I dont necessarily agree with all that I just said...just playing Devil's advocate to stir up shyte)
2. At least governments and countries as a whole are willing to give Tesla a chance...in 2008 and 2009, people were fed up of GM's bullshyte! Some Americans were willing to let "whats good for GM is good for the country" be flushed down the toilet like a giant turd that it was!!! (I dont necessarily agree with all that I just said...just playing Devil's advocate to stir up shyte and to defend SMK as he does make valid points....but just as he glances over some facts to promote his agenda, some pro-GM`mers glance over facts to cover up GM's huge flaws)
3. Although I LOVE GM myself....it makes me sick to my stomach knowing how shyte GM can get and we have the cojones to defend that shyte! So stop the useless defending of GM (this one is real...I do stand by that statement!!!)

 

 

 

[A Horse With No Name]

43 minutes ago, oldshurst442 said:

OK....

This was the intent of that post. Without the trolling and the controversial pics.

1. Seriously? What is up with all the kissing of GM's ass? GM went bankrupt in 2008 because they had a negative cash flow WORSE than Tesla's.   HELLO!!! THEY WENT BANKRUPT!!!  (I dont necessarily agree with all that I just said...just playing Devil's advocate to stir up shyte)
2. At least governments and countries as a whole are willing to give Tesla a chance...in 2008 and 2009, people were fed up of GM's bullshyte! Some Americans were willing to let "whats good for GM is good for the country" be flushed down the toilet like a giant turd that it was!!! (I dont necessarily agree with all that I just said...just playing Devil's advocate to stir up shyte and to defend SMK as he does make valid points....but just as he glances over some facts to promote his agenda, some pro-GM`mers glance over facts to cover up GM's huge flaws)
3. Although I LOVE GM myself....it makes me sick to my stomach knowing how shyte GM can get and we have the cojones to defend that shyte! So stop the useless defending of GM (this one is real...I do stand by that statement!!!)

 

 

 

Didn't really think I was mindlessly defending GM...and if I was...thank you for pointing that out.
GM has at least had positive cash flow in the past...something Tesla might not ever achieve.

In terms of holding GM accountable, being critical of GM is like fishing in a barrel...2.8 V6, headliners that did not stay put over the course of 25 or 30 years, eleventy billion other issues...

Would like to think I throw everybody under the bus from time to time...

[oldshurst442]

@A Horse With No Name

yes but....you did not say if you were gonna still love me tomorrow...

[A Horse With No Name]

37 minutes ago, oldshurst442 said:

@A Horse With No Name

yes but....you did not say if you were gonna still love me tomorrow...

You said something about owning a restaurant...depends on how well you feed me the night before...

[surreal1272]

1 hour ago, A Horse With No Name said:

Didn't really think I was mindlessly defending GM...and if I was...thank you for pointing that out.
GM has at least had positive cash flow in the past...something Tesla might not ever achieve.

In terms of holding GM accountable, being critical of GM is like fishing in a barrel...2.8 V6, headliners that did not stay put over the course of 25 or 30 years, eleventy billion other issues...

Would like to think I throw everybody under the bus from time to time...

It wasn't mindless defending. It was shooting down the usual BS by the usual suspects and presenting simple facts. It's that simple. I like Tesla and I like a fair portion of GM but I'm not blind to simple facts and when the same trolls keep spewing the same bar moving nonsense, over and over again, I'm going to call them out on it. 

Edited August 1, 2017 by surreal1272

[David]

2 hours ago, oldshurst442 said:

On Tesla and on the iPhone

• Apple was laughed at not having a physical keyboard...so much so that there was still defiance and some tried to offer a physical keyboard with their touch screen
• Apple was laughed at for even having a touch screen in the first place
• Apple was laughed at for controlling the touch screen with your fingers in funky ways reminiscent of a fantasy futuristic Tom Cruise movie
• Apple was laughed at for trying to push connectivity and calling it "smart phone"
• Apple was laughed at for iTunes and people paying for "apps"
• From selling ZERO phones...to becoming a MAJOR player displacing the inventor of the satellite phone Motorola and the darling leader of the 1990s Nokia and dismantling the early 2000s technology filled leader Blackberry
• Apple was also laughed at for creating a "bigger iPhone" and saying that tablets will replace laptops...laptops did not die yet but are not as healthy as before as tablets have pushed their way to be an actual viable computer platform alternative

Tesla made it possible to sell the idea that EVs ARE the future that people actually want to own and COUNTRIES all over the world are waiting impatiently for the tech to be on par with oil driven vehicles...

Some COUNTRIES of the world have set a time and date and HAVE BANNED internal combustion engines. In 15-20 years, only alternative energy cars will be able to be bought in these countries...will it be EVs? WHo knows??? Tesla started this wave!!!

 Not trendy...TREND SETTING

BIG DIFFERENCE. I suggest you folk stop  verbally beating up on Tesla or Apple...

Apple was supposed to die sometime in the 1980s by haters and 'experts' alike.

Tesla may not survive as building and selling cars is a very expensive and task requiring BILLIONS every year and automotive consumers are the most fickle, most demanding, most hardest to make them stay loyal as the competition is the FIERCEST in any domain...being as it may, Tesla already has changed the course of automobile history for the future even if Tesla  ceases to exist 4:00 PM Eastern time today and it is currently 8:00 AM Eastern time as I type this...

I still laugh at Apple.  They are not an Enterprise company but a Trendy Graphics design company that also sells products that people like that have limited options compared to Engineers who like to fiddle and tweak.

Android versus Apple.

Windows versus Linux versus Linux Apple. Different strokes for different folks.

Tesla of today will still be here tomorrow and in 10 to 20 years, might not be the same company as of today, but will still be here. Same with Apple.

Personally, I am excited to see where Cadillac goes over the next 10 years. I do hope it goes in the right direction but am not a fan nor have I ever been of the Idiot leading Cadillac or this BS naming CT / XT crap. 

America has awesome names and should stay with it, we do not need minimalist naming like moron Germany or the rest of the lemming companies.

Consider the Following:

NOUN

escalade (plural noun)

1.  

   the scaling of fortified walls using ladders, as a form of military attack.

    

   Sooooooo, Why not have the following line of SUV / CUV's

    

   Escalade Top of the line SUV (7-9) passenger depending on configuration

   Ascend CUV 3 row (6-7) passengers depending on configuration

   Aspire CUV 2 row (5-6) passengers depending on configuration

   Arise CUV 2 row (4-5) passengers depending on configuration

    

   Escalate Cadillac's new 4 door truck!

    

   We have plenty of cool names for cars I am just focusing on the SUV/CUV/Truck line that Cadillac should have!  

1 hour ago, oldshurst442 said:

@A Horse With No Name

yes but....you did not say if you were gonna still love me tomorrow...

 

36 minutes ago, A Horse With No Name said:

You said something about owning a restaurant...depends on how well you feed me the night before...

Do not forget Drinks Guys, I can bring some nice Wine if I know what good food will be there to eat! 

I have no problem inviting myself to the trough of eating as I love to share wine!  

[riviera74]

dfelt, while I agree that Cadillac should have names rather than alphanumeric designations, all other luxury marques have them so that they can sell their wares worldwide.  Unfortunately, the era where GM can only sell Cadillac in North America and ignore the rest of the world is long gone.  It is a competitiveness thing, nothing more.

[A Horse With No Name]

9 minutes ago, riviera74 said:

dfelt, while I agree that Cadillac should have names rather than alphanumeric designations, all other luxury marques have them so that they can sell their wares worldwide.  Unfortunately, the era where GM can only sell Cadillac in North America and ignore the rest of the world is long gone.  It is a competitiveness thing, nothing more.

Agreed!

[David]

5 hours ago, riviera74 said:

dfelt, while I agree that Cadillac should have names rather than alphanumeric designations, all other luxury marques have them so that they can sell their wares worldwide.  Unfortunately, the era where GM can only sell Cadillac in North America and ignore the rest of the world is long gone.  It is a competitiveness thing, nothing more.

I totally get that and understand that and if you take the names I have used and run them through translation software, they are all positive words that could and should be used to sell the auto's world wide.

Alphanumerics are a Lemmings / Lazy Ass way to deal with global auto sales.

People will buy named auto's as long as the book work is done to make sure the translation of the word does not insult or be negative in another's native tongue.

[smk4565]

11 hours ago, surreal1272 said:

Tesla is also worth more than Mercedes but we will just gloss over that little fact for now. 

Daimler is worth $64 billion and Tesla is worth $53 billon.

[oldshurst442]

1 hour ago, A Horse With No Name said:

You said something about owning a restaurant...depends on how well you feed me the night before...

Eh oh!

Ill trow a coupl-a burgers down your troat!

 

Thank-you!

Thank-you very much!

[A Horse With No Name]

15 minutes ago, smk4565 said:

Daimler is worth $64 billion and Tesla is worth $53 billon.

Except that Daimler is actually worth the 64 billion...Tesla is worth maybe ten cents on the dollar of what its market value is.

[oldshurst442]

1 hour ago, dfelt said:

America has awesome names and should stay with it, we do not need minimalist naming like moron Germany or the rest of the lemming companies.

[surreal1272]

1 hour ago, smk4565 said:

Daimler is worth $64 billion and Tesla is worth $53 billon.

My mistake however Tesla is claiming while Daimler has been relatively stagnant. In six months (at its current rate of gain), they will surpass Daimler. Where your argument move to at that point since you use it as a negative against GM?

https://www.google.com/amp/s/seekingalpha.com/amp/article/4062035-tesla-set-become-second-biggest-global-carmaker-market-cap-next-year

[A Horse With No Name]

3 minutes ago, surreal1272 said:

My mistake however Tesla is claiming while Daimler has been relatively stagnant. In six months (at its current rate of gain), they will surpass Daimler. Where your argument move to at that point since you use it as a negative against GM?

https://www.google.com/amp/s/seekingalpha.com/amp/article/4062035-tesla-set-become-second-biggest-global-carmaker-market-cap-next-year

GM is probably under valued, even with the horrendous sales figures last month...

[surreal1272]

9 minutes ago, A Horse With No Name said:

GM is probably under valued, even with the horrendous sales figures last month...

Possibly. However my main point was that SMK is ragging on GM for being worth "less" than Tesla when Daimler is not far from being passed by Tesla themselves, thus exposing his double standard because he wouldn't dare bring up that fact as a negative against Daimler like he is trying to do against GM. 

[A Horse With No Name]

2 minutes ago, surreal1272 said:

Possibly. However my main point was that SMK is ragging on GM for being worth "less" than Tesla when Daimler is not far from being passed by Tesla themselves, thus exposing his double standard because he wouldn't dare bring up that fact as a negative against Daimler like he is trying to do against GM. 

Ohhh I got your pain point....my point was that GM stock is probably under valued.  Aimed at the rational in the conversation, not members who wish to deny reality.

[balthazar]

ANother context: Tesla sold 46K vehicles last year and didn't make a dime of profit, yet it's that close to Daimler selling 3 million vehicles making a decent profit.

To channel SMK : 'There might not be a Daimler / Mercedes in another 10 years, after Tesla puts them out of business.'

[David]

27 minutes ago, balthazar said:

ANother context: Tesla sold 46K vehicles last year and didn't make a dime of profit, yet it's that close to Daimler selling 3 million vehicles making a decent profit.

To channel SMK : 'There might not be a Daimler / Mercedes in another 10 years, after Tesla puts them out of business.'

Maybe Tesla might Buy MB and make them a division of Tesla once Tesla stock surpasses MB!   

NOT, Musk would never own an ICE company as he is all about the Solar / EV!  

[smk4565]

4 hours ago, surreal1272 said:

Possibly. However my main point was that SMK is ragging on GM for being worth "less" than Tesla when Daimler is not far from being passed by Tesla themselves, thus exposing his double standard because he wouldn't dare bring up that fact as a negative against Daimler like he is trying to do against GM. 

I am not ragging on GM, I am pointing out that Tesla has a high value, they are worth more than adore too and they might pass Daimler in a couple years.  

Tesla is selling a lifestyle, they car the solar roof, the in home battery pack, etc.  if they keep growing and are way ahead of the EV curve then they could take huge chunks of market share.  They also don't have the legacy costs of GM or Ford.  

Ford and GM have so much overhead they need to sell millions of cars or they go bust, as what happened in 2008 when the SAAR was 8 or 9 million units, they collapsed.

[A Horse With No Name]

1 hour ago, balthazar said:

ANother context: Tesla sold 46K vehicles last year and didn't make a dime of profit, yet it's that close to Daimler selling 3 million vehicles making a decent profit.

To channel SMK : 'There might not be a Daimler / Mercedes in another 10 years, after Tesla puts them out of business.'

Hell...a full nuclear war would put everyone out of business.

21 minutes ago, smk4565 said:

I am not ragging on GM, I am pointing out that Tesla has a high value, they are worth more than adore too and they might pass Daimler in a couple years.  

Tesla is selling a lifestyle, they car the solar roof, the in home battery pack, etc.  if they keep growing and are way ahead of the EV curve then they could take huge chunks of market share.  They also don't have the legacy costs of GM or Ford.  

Ford and GM have so much overhead they need to sell millions of cars or they go bust, as what happened in 2008 when the SAAR was 8 or 9 million units, they collapsed.

I might move from autocrossing to driving in the Daytona 500...all kinds of things might happen...

51 minutes ago, dfelt said:

Maybe Tesla might Buy MB and make them a division of Tesla once Tesla stock surpasses MB!   

NOT, Musk would never own an ICE company as he is all about the Solar / EV!  

Maybe Musk might enjoy boxed Macaroni and cheese and PB and J sandwiches after everything goes bust.

[A Horse With No Name]

You know...I owe you all an apology...I have been doing these Cadillac threads wrong...

Apparently one makes an unsubstantiated claim about Cadillac and then comes up with an irrational lunatic fringe solution.  So here goes!

Cadillac cars are horribly unreliable and Cadillac has no owner loyalty...so they should Target someone who has lots of loyalty...say Ford..

And since all GM companies are by nature bottom feeders...they should Target the ecosport...because Cadillac needs youth...

Besides... people only buy crossover vehicles anyways.

[A Horse With No Name]

GM never had an original idea in it's hundred years of experience..

So maybe it should start here...

Instead of making their crossover egg shape like the ecosport, they should make it a perfect sphere.

Because an in perfect sphere would remind people of Saturn the planet...and we know what an embarrassment Saturn the car brand was for GM...they cannot handle any more embarrassment....

[A Horse With No Name]

You really would not want to remind people of Jupiter...because GM Cadillac are bloated like Jupiter...not sleek like a Benz, a Panzerwagen, or a Reliant Robin...

Maybe Uranus... because a lot of the critique of Cadillac here comes right out of Uranus....

Anyways, Cadillac supercalifragilisticexpialidocious Ecosport fighter...Sphere shaped...

Cadillac should really do a sphere shaped car..it is very space efficient and everyone loves crossover vehicles for space efficiency...

[A Horse With No Name]

Besides, if you are going to be the standard of the world the car brand should look like...well...the world!

Anyway, Cadillac should not paint them black, because most S class are black and you don't want new car buyers regretting the seventy grand extra they didn't spend down the street at a Benz dealer.

They need to make the selves distinct in the market... Cadillac should paint all of their Sphere shaped Ecosport fighter models orange...

...and they can make rubber different colors...make the tires orange too...

But don't add any chrome...

[A Horse With No Name]

Because chrome will just remind people of the days when Cadillac was just third behind Benz and Lincoln...not like today when they are behind Tata, Trabant, Tesla, Toyota, Tucker, and Tonka Trucks....

And everyone knows what gross polluters the Cadillac cars off the fifties, sixties and seventies were..and also the eighties, ninties, and today...

Cadillac needs to up it's green image, like Tesla...besides, next Tuesday Cadillac will be the only people on the planet selling fossil fueled cars

[A Horse With No Name]

So to up it's green cred they should make the seats shaped like seeds...and give it gull wing doors.

Yes, I know Benz had gull wing doors in the fifties but over sixty years has passed so Cadillac can respectfully follow Benz.

[Robert Hall]

2 minutes ago, A Horse With No Name said:

So to up it's green cred they should make the seats shaped like seeds...and give it gull wing doors.

Yes, I know Benz had gull wing doors in the fifties but over sixty years has passed so Cadillac can respectfully follow Benz.

They had gull wing door also a few years ago w/ the SLS.

[A Horse With No Name]

Besides, Cadillac should not live by style alone, but by copying everything that comes from Sir Lord Musk..and Tesla uses gull wing doors...

Just now, Cubical-aka-Moltar said:

They had gull wing door also a few years ago w/ the SLS.

Dammit...they have to wait another sixty years to show proper respect to our Germanic betters!

Anyhow....this is obviously sarcasm.