Jump to content
dfelt

Is FWD Dead? VW says Yes!

Recommended Posts

image.png

To quote Christian Buhlmann of Volkswagen product line communications for e-mobility: "It doesn't make much sense because if you think of the starting torque that you have and the dynamic weight distribution, the weight is lifted from the front axle towards the rear axle," he said. "That's exactly where you need the torque to be in your acceleration moment. Therefore, it physically doesn't make sense to use only the front axle if you have the vehicle that offers a lot of torque right from the start. "

This was his response in regards to the question of FWD or RWD for electric vehicles and why?

With the ease of ability to package the motors front, rear, or AWD and running a few cables, it really boils down to the efficiency of where the motor makes the most sense. As such, EVs will be moving to RWD / AWD and with the lower cost of powertrain components, AWD is an easy profitable upgrade. VW like Tesla and all other OEMs has stated, the most expensive part of an EV is the battery pack. VW has admitted that the tradeoff in lower-cost vehicles that need efficiency with a lower cost is why FWD became the rage but those days are over as the dynamics favor the superior driving dynamics of RWD with electric powertrains.

image.png

Is it a superior looking car over Tesla?

image.png

 

Motor Trend Story

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Makes sense.  However, most people are used by now to FWD driving dynamics.  First heavy rain or snow storm, and there will be a lot crashes and people in the ditch with the new RWD electric vehicles.

  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, ykX said:

Makes sense.  However, most people are used by now to FWD driving dynamics.  First heavy rain or snow storm, and there will be a lot crashes and people in the ditch with the new RWD electric vehicles.

They do that now in their AWD crossovers... 

  • Haha 1
  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Been saying this for years. Even wrote something here about "in the wake of AWD as an option how is RWD or FWD needed or superior? " That was  when the XTS concept debuted I think in '09. I was speaking of Luxury then.. but this seems to want to go all the way.. This is what I wrote:

AWD is the real hero of luxury.. and being able to augment that AWD is even more so.. Cadillac's Sport mode and U get a 20/80 front/rear split, Tour gets 40/60, and Snow mode splits it right down the middle. I love that. In fact I wouldn't be surprised one bit if the reason why AWD is standard in almost all iterations of the CT6 is because Cadillac decided to profitably package an upgrade in that cost them little, but offered a justifiable reason to charge more for the product. The silliness of people talking about a 204 inch, 122 WB large luxury car in the same terms as they would a RWD Camaro is ridiculous. The same goes for the HIGH UP vehicles..aka CUVs. Having a weee bit more power in the XT5 and XT4 as an option is 100.. but the chassis for at leats the XT5, as I haven't driven the XT4 yet, is perfect for 100% of the people buying them. 

 AWD is a luxury. Offering AWD all the time is offering a luxury ALL THE TIME. 

For some reason I find, more often than not, on these forums, that many forum goers feel that limitation of choice is the desire of most Luxury buyers. As a luxury buyer I whole-heartedly would like to disagree with that notion. Marketing should certainly steer buyers in the direction of the AWD version for profit reasons, not to mention performance credibility. While the segment does not demand super performance, having a car this large, a large saloon, being capable of great handling is a plus. The CT6, still imo, is offering AWD for marketing purposes, not to mention built in profit. That is the absolute only reason the Audi A8 sells AWD-only here, yet offers a FWD version in Europe. With this car the absence of the weight penalty usually associated with AWD allows Cadillac to sell an AWD model at 95% of the line-up and still be lighter than many of the single drive competitors

  • Upvote 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think in EV vehicles, which wheels drive matters less because the weight balance of the car is so different.   FWD was "better in snow" because you had all the weight of the engine on the front tires to help with adhesion.  In a pure EV that isn't based off an IC car, the weight can be wherever they want it to be.. front, back, middle... doesn't matter.

Put the motor and a stack of batteries in the rear of an EV and it'll go in snow just as well as any FWD. 

  • Like 2
  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I honestly can see having inexpensive RWD commuter EVs and then you step up into AWD EVs and Luxury / Performance having AWD with Torque vectoring.

OEMs can then also have a single set of Controller boards and a customer if later on has the money and wants more power can go online, pay the OEM for the power upgrade and it gets pushed down to the auto to unlock performance improvements, luxury add-ons, etc.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, dfelt said:

I honestly can see having inexpensive RWD commuter EVs and then you step up into AWD EVs and Luxury / Performance having AWD with Torque vectoring.

OEMs can then also have a single set of Controller boards and a customer if later on has the money and wants more power can go online, pay the OEM for the power upgrade and it gets pushed down to the auto to unlock performance improvements, luxury add-ons, etc.

I think with EVs having AWD will be easier and less expensive than with ICE vehicles.  And even now when the AWD optional, it is about a $2k option on regular cars.   With EV, it is probably only extra couple motors on the front and different software.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You are posting as a guest. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.




  • Social Stream

  • Similar Content

    • By Drew Dowdell
      Volkswagen has release the pricing on the redesigned 2020 Passat and now it is roughly $2300 cheaper than the 2019 model.  It also becomes one of the least expensive midsize sedans you can buy, clocking in just $250 more expensive than the least expensive 2020 Subaru Legacy. 
      Some of that cost savings comes from carrying over a bunch of the bones of the car from 2019.  The platform is the same, not updated to the new MQB platform like China is getting with their version.  The 2.0-liter Turbo carries over as well, albeit with some improvement to the torque. Horsepower remains the same at 174 hp, while torque jumps 22 lb.-ft to 206.  The transmission remains a 6-speed automatic driving only the front wheels. 
      The 2020 Passat gets and exterior and interior refresh with new materials in the cabin and an updated instrument cluster. 
      The trims will be S, SE, R-Line, and SEL.  The cheapest S model still comes with forward collision warning with pedestrian detection and emergency braking, blind spot monitoring, and rear cross traffic alert. The SE, which starts at $26,765, gets additional chrome trim, keyless entry, push-button ignition, leather wrapped steering wheel, leatherette over the headed front seats, dual zone climate control, rain-sensing wipers, adaptive cruise, and lane keep assist.  The R-Line, which starts at $29,565, comes with all of the above, plus a standard sunroof, alarm, 19-inch alloy wheels, a body kit, and paddle shifter.  The top of the line SEL, at $32,015, comes with high beam assist, leather seats, heated rear seats, navigation, parking sensors, and a Fender audio system. 
      The 2020 Passat will continue to be manufactured in Chattanooga, TN and arrives in dealers in the next few weeks. 

      View full article
    • By Drew Dowdell
      Volkswagen has release the pricing on the redesigned 2020 Passat and now it is roughly $2300 cheaper than the 2019 model.  It also becomes one of the least expensive midsize sedans you can buy, clocking in just $250 more expensive than the least expensive 2020 Subaru Legacy. 
      Some of that cost savings comes from carrying over a bunch of the bones of the car from 2019.  The platform is the same, not updated to the new MQB platform like China is getting with their version.  The 2.0-liter Turbo carries over as well, albeit with some improvement to the torque. Horsepower remains the same at 174 hp, while torque jumps 22 lb.-ft to 206.  The transmission remains a 6-speed automatic driving only the front wheels. 
      The 2020 Passat gets and exterior and interior refresh with new materials in the cabin and an updated instrument cluster. 
      The trims will be S, SE, R-Line, and SEL.  The cheapest S model still comes with forward collision warning with pedestrian detection and emergency braking, blind spot monitoring, and rear cross traffic alert. The SE, which starts at $26,765, gets additional chrome trim, keyless entry, push-button ignition, leather wrapped steering wheel, leatherette over the headed front seats, dual zone climate control, rain-sensing wipers, adaptive cruise, and lane keep assist.  The R-Line, which starts at $29,565, comes with all of the above, plus a standard sunroof, alarm, 19-inch alloy wheels, a body kit, and paddle shifter.  The top of the line SEL, at $32,015, comes with high beam assist, leather seats, heated rear seats, navigation, parking sensors, and a Fender audio system. 
      The 2020 Passat will continue to be manufactured in Chattanooga, TN and arrives in dealers in the next few weeks. 
    • By Drew Dowdell
      Volkswagen of America October 2019 Sales
        Oct. 19
      Oct. 18
      Yr/Yr% 
      change
      Oct. 19 YTD
      Oct. 18 YTD
      Yr/Yr% 
      change
       Golf
       338 
       390 
      -13% 
      5,012 
      6,061 
      -17%   GTI
       723 
       1,293 
      -44% 
      10,139 
      14,594  -31%   Golf R
       435 
       144 
      202% 
      3,473 
      3,264  6.4%   e-Golf
       637 
      62 
      927% 
      4,233 
      902  369%   Golf SportWagen
       830 
       1,116 
      -26% 
      9,119 
      12,537  -27%   Total Golf Family
      2,963  
       3,005  
      -1.4% 
      31,976  
      37,358   -14%   Jetta Sedan
      8,582 
      10,148 
      -15% 
      83,323 
      71,266  17%   Jetta SportWagen      
       (now Golf  SportWagen)


               N/A 
      -  71 
      N/A 
       Total Jetta
      8,582  
       10,148  
      -15% 
      83,323  
      71,337   17%  Beetle Coupe
      437 
       458 
      -4.6% 
      6,997 
      7,843  -11%   Beetle  Convertible
      530 
       338 
      57% 
      8,716 
      5,103  71% 
       Total Beetle
      967  
      796  
      21% 
      15,713  
      12,946   21%   Passat
      211 
       2,602 
      -92% 
      13,181  36,129  -64%   CC

       30 
      -93% 
      52 
      439 
      -88%   Arteon
      366  N/A  N/A  1,849  N/A  N/A   Tiguan Limited
      11 
       489 
      -98% 
      389 
      13,084  -97%   Tiguan
       8,322 
       7,097 
      17% 
      93,240 
      74,329  25%   Total Tiguan
      8,333  
      7,586  
      9.8% 
      93,629  
      87,413  
      7.1%  
       Touareg

       108 
      -99% 
      152 
      1,879 
      -92%   Atlas
       6,647 
       4,725 
      41% 
      66,352 
      47,727 
      39%   Total Car
      13,091  
      16,581  
      -21% 
      146,094  
      158,209  
      -7.7%  
       Total SUV
      14,981  
      12,419  
      21% 
      160,133  
      137,019  
      17%  
       TOTAL 
      28,072  
       29,000  
      -3.2% 
      306,227  
      295,228  
      3.7%  
    • By Drew Dowdell
      Volkswagen unveiled one of the loosest kept secrets in the automotive industry, the Atlas Cross Sport.  The 5-seater mid-size features a more rakish back glass to give a coupe like appearance. 
      While the Atlas Cross Sport is 2.8 inches shorter, it still rides on the same 117.3 inch wheelbase and boasts almost as much cargo space (77.8 cu. ft.) as the bigger Atlas (96.8 cu. ft.) with the seats folded.  The Cross Sport is also 2.3 inches lower to the ground adding to its racier profile.
      Inside there are a few upgrades over the Atlas with a new steering wheel with more intuitive controls, available stitching accents on the doors and seats, and available wireless charging for mobile devices. The Atlas already comes with a suite of safety technology including Forward Collision Warning with Autonomous Braking, Blind Spot Monitoring, and Rear Traffic alert. Available on upper trims are Adaptive Cruise control and Park Distance Control.  The Cross Sport also adds available Traffic Jam Assist that helps maintain distances front and back, and on Cross Sports with Navigation, the system will display relevant traffic signs like speed limits, no passing zones, school zones, and work zones. 
      Powering the Cross Sport will be a selection of two engines. The 267 horsepower V6 and a 235 horsepower turbocharged 4-cylinder.  Either engine routes power to the wheels through an 8-speed automatic and available 4-motion All-Wheel Drive. When equipped with the V6, the Cross Sport can tow up to a rated 5,000 lbs when equipped with the towing package.
      There will be eight trim levels: S, SE, SE w/Tech, SE w/Tech R-Line, SEL, SEL R-Line, SEL Premium, and SEL Premium R-Line. More details and pricing will be announced ahead of the launch in the Spring of 2020.
       
       
    • By Drew Dowdell
      Volkswagen unveiled one of the loosest kept secrets in the automotive industry, the Atlas Cross Sport.  The 5-seater mid-size features a more rakish back glass to give a coupe like appearance. 
      While the Atlas Cross Sport is 2.8 inches shorter, it still rides on the same 117.3 inch wheelbase and boasts almost as much cargo space (77.8 cu. ft.) as the bigger Atlas (96.8 cu. ft.) with the seats folded.  The Cross Sport is also 2.3 inches lower to the ground adding to its racier profile.
      Inside there are a few upgrades over the Atlas with a new steering wheel with more intuitive controls, available stitching accents on the doors and seats, and available wireless charging for mobile devices. The Atlas already comes with a suite of safety technology including Forward Collision Warning with Autonomous Braking, Blind Spot Monitoring, and Rear Traffic alert. Available on upper trims are Adaptive Cruise control and Park Distance Control.  The Cross Sport also adds available Traffic Jam Assist that helps maintain distances front and back, and on Cross Sports with Navigation, the system will display relevant traffic signs like speed limits, no passing zones, school zones, and work zones. 
      Powering the Cross Sport will be a selection of two engines. The 267 horsepower V6 and a 235 horsepower turbocharged 4-cylinder.  Either engine routes power to the wheels through an 8-speed automatic and available 4-motion All-Wheel Drive. When equipped with the V6, the Cross Sport can tow up to a rated 5,000 lbs when equipped with the towing package.
      There will be eight trim levels: S, SE, SE w/Tech, SE w/Tech R-Line, SEL, SEL R-Line, SEL Premium, and SEL Premium R-Line. More details and pricing will be announced ahead of the launch in the Spring of 2020.
       
       

      View full article
  • Recent Status Updates

  • Reader Rides

About us

CheersandGears.com - Founded 2001

We ♥ Cars

Get in touch

Follow us

Recent tweets

facebook

×
×
  • Create New...