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Alternative Fuels & Propulsion RANDOM

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10 hours ago, oldshurst442 said:

Ill agree to that sentiment that Porsche is doing just fine...and that people dont tend to overanalyze...to a point.

I read an article not too long ago that Porsche's marketing department is concerned with their current image. Many new and recent Porsche owners arent really connecting to or  relating to the 911 or the supercars Porsche makes.   In other words,  Porsche is worried that they are fast becoming just another automobile company making just another CUV or sedan...   And the performance part and/or enthusiasm part of what made Porsche performance cars legendary  is not exactly  on top of new Porsche or would be Porsche car buyer's minds.

And hence the Jason Bourne/Fast and Furious/The Italian Job Superbowl commercial this past February. It was to try to rekindle that special Porsche performance magic...

In other words...

When did Porsche have to remind us car guys that Porsche has made some of the world's most thrilling cars?

Answer:

Since they build not one, not two, but three, tall, heavy,  SUVs  that are the exact opposite of what the original air cooled 911 was...

Not to mention the heavy AF sedan they got and the even heavier EV they are just beginning to peddle...

Back to Tesla...

A carefully crafted image that becomes accepted in the car community and has carved up itself a decent market and niche is easily shaken up with the peddling of the wrong product.  Oh sure, the wrong product could and would be WILDLY successful, but it could and would be a detriment to the image of the company sometime in the future and that could and would cause irreparable damage to the name sake....and good luck in getting that image back...and then eventually, sales...

Look at Cadillac.  

Look at Pontiac

Heck...look at Porsche. 

The Cimarron (1982-88) destroyed Cadillac's image in ways nothing else did.  Cadillac needed nothing smaller than the Seville period.

Pontiac's problem was FWD generally.  How do you build excitement out of a W-body Grand Prix and an A-body Grand Am? and a FWD G-body Bonneville?  BORING!

As for Porsche, they may have too many CUVs, but the 911 is still being built.  Porsche does need to lighten up the Panamera and the CUVs to bring them more in line with their original 911.

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1970's and 1980's era Mercedes-Benz are best used for what?

Electrification according to a Belgium company that restores them to like new off the assembly line with an electric power train.

From $179,000 to $200,000 depending on model, you can have your dearly loved 70's or 80's MB restored to factory fresh with a high output EV system.

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https://www.thedrive.com/news/33731/electric-conversions-dont-get-much-better-than-70s-and-80s-mercedes-benz-classics

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Looks interesting.  Would rather have a 2030 version of a GM BEV but OK.

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Interesting EV news this evening.

First up is Lordstown motors which bought the 6.2 million square-feet Ohio Factory from GM last year. In the latest interview, CEO Steve Burns says they can produce 600,000 EV's a year out of the plant and are planning to fill it up fast with not just their AWD EV Truck but also an SUV when production starts later this year and deliveries scheduled for January 2021. Starting in 2022, an SUV and other auto's will come on line and Lordstown is planning to employ as many as 5,000 people by then in production of EVs.

They believe they can outsell GM which does not expect to sell 1 million EVs a year till 2025.

https://www.greencarreports.com/news/1128301_will-lordstown-motors-outsell-electric-trucks-from-gm-ford-and-rivian

Next up is the posted interview with Mark Kaufman, Global Director of Electrification for Ford. Mark revealed 5 geeky details that shows or proves to some that Ford is committed to EVs long term and eventually replacing ICE auto's all together.

  1. There is two battery tunes depending on if you buy RWD or AWD. This will satisfy the high performance crowd and still serve the long range distant crowd.
  2. Rapid-prototyping prodigy is what the Mach-E has been for Ford. This has allowed them to get feedback and quickly build various versions to allow quick testing with customers. Example is that even on an EV with everything digital, customers still want a physical volume knob to use when driving and not have to look at a big screen and hunt for the touch point.
  3. The Revolutionary new Sync 4A system that will debut with the Mach-E is a clean sheet infotainment system that is built on HTML5. Allows for superior system customization and layout. Owners can customize the interface to work the way they want it and not stuck in a Ford only mode. This also allows for future upgrades that can completely change the look and feel.
  4. Over the air updates is being taken very seriously as they have an in-house cybersecurity team ensuring that the auto will be encrypted and comply with all privacy laws globally. To quote him: We take our customer trust very seriously.
  5. The first update for the Mach-E that will be over the air 6 months after release will be Ford pushing out their Fords Autopilot feature for the EV. Kaufman did not state it would rival GM's supercruise or Tesla Autopilot, but enough comments from him leads the media and writers at Green Car Reports to believe so.

https://www.greencarreports.com/news/1128304_ford-mustang-mach-e-electric-suv-5-geeky-details-show-ford-s-commitment-to-evs

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Well bless their widdle pea-pickin' hearts.  So earnest in their dreams.  600k units per year?  Aww, that's an awful big number for a product that hasn't been delivered to one customer, and is coming into a market that has very little interest, and only the possibility of a lunatic fringe fan base.  At best.

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Getting closer in pricing

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Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, ocnblu said:

lunatic fringe

 Good 'ole Canuck rock.  

CANUCK ROCK RULES!

 

Now...if Im restomodding a 1970s or 1980s Mercedes, Id be a freakin' lunatic to do so. Especially with a price tag of  179 000-200 000 American freakin' dollars.  But if I was on the fringe to do so,  Id think long and hard about electrification, but really, Id HEMI those bitches JUST to stick it to Mercedes! 

Id take the AMG HAMMER 

The AMG Hammer is a Legend of the 1980s | Mbworld

And DEMONIZE it!

Take that grille, Dodge-ify it by making it it a Dodge Crosshair look-alike. Rip those silly headlight washers out, take the left side headlight, modify it so I got one functional headlight and one functional air duct feeding the Hellcat crate motor under the hood that I will modify to have huge air scoops to feed that huge Kompressor...    Take that small and  silly 3 pointed star at the front on top of the grill and throw it out in the trash.  Put Hellcat logos on the left and right side front fenders and Im ready to go to Mercedes gatherings to show off my new MOPAR ride!  

If I had money to burn, Id get my hands on this nice electric blue, hybrid SLS 

2013 Mercedes-Benz SLS AMG Electric Drive - specs, photo, price ...

 

Rip out all the drivetrain in it, trash that 3 pointed star. Modify the grill for it to be a Dodge Crosshair grill and stick any generation Viper V10 I could get my hands on in it.  You guessed it. To STICK it to Mercedes! 

 

 

 

Edited by oldshurst442
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I question whether many people would be happy dumping major coin into a car as crappily built as a 70s-80s mercedes.

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Im sorry. This is an alternate fuels and propulsion thread.  Sorry I derailed it with MOPAR propelled German cars. 

The thing is, I wouldn't spend a dime restoring 70's and '80s Mercedes cars.   Not worth my time or money.  

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^ yeah- its a hilarious proposition. Take a $5K car, pay $175K and make it slower with a fraction of the range. Meanwhile you still (assumedly) have the same vinyl sticker ‘wood’ and shoddy, cheap engineering. 
would anyone do this to a Pinto?

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Seriously, it would be better to restore a true classic, like the Invicta project elsewhere in these forums.  I doubt any Germans would restore a 40-50 year-old Mercedes Benz.

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Posted (edited)

For a vintage Mercedes resto, I'd rather go the Mechatronik route.   Vintage car updated w/ modern Mercedes hardware.  

Edited by Robert Hall

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Posted (edited)
3 minutes ago, balthazar said:

Why would want a mercedes engine in a classic Mercury? 😉

Merc = Mercedes.

For a classic Mercury, I'd want a Ford powertrain, of course.   

If I had the garage space, wouldn't mind something like this for summer weekend  'tooling around' (as my Dad used to say)...

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Edited by Robert Hall
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3 hours ago, Robert Hall said:

For a vintage Mercedes resto, I'd rather go the Mechatronik route.   Vintage car updated w/ modern Mercedes hardware.  

I googled Mechatronik.  Interesting.  I love stuff like that.  Companies that take classics and restomod them to high standard levels. Although I wouldnt be a customer of theirs (if I had ungodly amounts of money at my disposal) as Mercedes is not what Im into, but I love what they and other similar companies do.   

 

 

 

 

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Posted (edited)

I saw a couple of Mechatronik's cars on display at Barrett-Jackson Scottsdale a few years ago, they look well-built and well detailed...very pricy but very neat also.   Similarly,  I love the resto mod Singer Porsches..

Edited by Robert Hall
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In reading the Press release, Toyota's web site and the first review on the Rav4 Prime, a plug-in hybrid. This Rav4 Prime is the fastest 4 door in Toyota's auto lineup other than the Supra. I will say it is not bad looking since it does not have the predator mouth.

One thing that I compared and am not surprised by since you have the electric assist system is that 0 to 60mph is 5.8 seconds compared to my 2008 Chevrolet Trailblazer SS AWD with a V8 that goes 0 to 60 in 5.7 seconds. Toyota Rav4 Prime is 90 MPGe versus my 12 MPG. WOW very impressive.

My sister and her best friend and room mate are both on site nurses that travel all over for in home care. As such putting on 30 to 45,000 miles a year is not uncommon for them. While she loves her Buick CUV, it is time to replace it and I have to say that it is hard to not recommend this AWD that just beats everything else out there in it's class.

My email to my sister posted here for you all to read.

Other than the Toyota Supra sports car, this is the fastest 4 door Toyota they have and it is no slouch with 302HP. It is worth a look as a replacement for your CUV’s you have. Battery warranty is 10 years or 150,000 miles whichever comes first. Assembled / built in Alabama from parts from Canada, Mexico, Japan and the US.

Based on the reviews, the Rav4 Prime XSE fully optioned including the weather package has the following:

  • 9” Audio Plus system with Android Auto and Apple CarPlay
  • Heated steering wheel
  • Heated and cooled front seats
  • Heated rear seats
  • Parking assist
  • HUD – color heads up display
  • Adaptive front headlights – Means as you turn, the lights turn with you so you have maximum visability at night.
  • Rain sensing wipers with deicer
  • JBL premium audio
  • Panoramic moonroof
  • Hands-free power-hatch actuation
  • Plus more

A True Performer

Tuned with responsiveness in mind, RAV4 Prime's powertrain rockets this SUV from 0 to 60 in an estimated 5.8 seconds. Its Electronic On-Demand All-Wheel Drive is able to send power to all four wheels, so every press of the throttle produces instant torque and thrilling acceleration. The available steering wheel-mounted paddle shifters help put this power directly into your hands, delivering even more exhilaration every time you get behind the wheel.

A Driver's Space

RAV4 Prime's cabin was tailored for the spirited drive, with everything designed to help keep you in full control. An available all-new 9-in. multimedia display places your entertainment, maps and more at front and center. Loaded with tech features, RAV4 Prime comes standard with Amazon Alexa, 65 as well as Android Auto 63 and Apple CarPlay® 58 compatibility. And the available Head-Up Display (HUD) puts key driving information right on the windshield, so you can keep your eyes on the road ahead.

Review you can read about the Rav4 Hybrid Prime

https://www.greencarreports.com/news/1128330_2021-toyota-rav4-prime-42-mile-plug-in-could-cost-less-than-rav4-hybrid

Toyota web site for the Prime

https://www.toyota.com/upcoming-vehicles/rav4prime/

Press Release on the Rav4 Hybrid Prime 2021 model

https://pressroom.toyota.com/toyota-revs-up-lineup-with-new-302-horsepower-rav4-prime/

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They certainly did their homework to make sure the RAV4 would sell ridiculous numbers worldwide, though the Corolla is still far and away ahead of it and the FSeries. I question the wait period for the prime as when my wife was interested in the hybrid it was at least 4 months for the XSE.  Apparently the vast majority of RAV4 sales in Europe are the hybrid.

 

 

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14 minutes ago, frogger said:

They certainly did their homework to make sure the RAV4 would sell ridiculous numbers worldwide, though the Corolla is still far and away ahead of it and the FSeries. I question the wait period for the prime as when my wife was interested in the hybrid it was at least 4 months for the XSE.  Apparently the vast majority of RAV4 sales in Europe are the hybrid.

They clearly are hitting a sweet spot for many who want AWD, CUV and Fuel Efficiency with performance.

Be interesting to see what GM, Ford and FCA respond with as currently they have nothing to compete against this.

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2 hours ago, dfelt said:

They clearly are hitting a sweet spot for many who want AWD, CUV and Fuel Efficiency with performance.

Be interesting to see what GM, Ford and FCA respond with as currently they have nothing to compete against this.

The domestics need an answer for the RAV4 Prime STAT.

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GM is working to educate the public about EVs and as such has released the following videos.

The whole series which some are very GM customer serving will help to better understand EVs. Hopefully the sales people at GM dealerships especially Chevrolet will watch them and get educated on the BOLT.

Bolt EV Acadamy - 

 

https://media.chevrolet.com/media/us/en/chevrolet/home.detail.html/content/Pages/news/us/en/2020/may/0529-boltev.html

 

 

 

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Israel startup REE is going into production building what they call the first true skateboard concept using in-wheel hub motors and putting everything except the battery pack, cooling and power distribution equipment in the wheel arches.

https://ree.auto/

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On 5/30/2020 at 8:09 PM, dfelt said:

They clearly are hitting a sweet spot for many who want AWD, CUV and Fuel Efficiency with performance.

Be interesting to see what GM, Ford and FCA respond with as currently they have nothing to compete against this.

They are also re-introducing the Venza to North America with a version of the Japanese Harrier model with a pretty much RAV4 sized hybrid vehicle but more upscale appointments.

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2021 Venza (initially Hybrid only in NA).  So in the last few years the Blazer, Passport, and Venza names are back and pretty directly competing with each other.

 

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GM supposedly is going after the Commercial delivery fleet of the world. Production and availability is expected by the end of 2021 for Electric Delivery van.

Sounds like this is an answer to Rivian and their 100,000 EV van contract with Amazon.

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https://www.greencarreports.com/news/1128390_report-gm-electric-van-for-fleets-due-as-early-as-2021

Chinese EV auto company NIO has proven what Tesla originally proposed and then failed to deliver that Battery swapping is faster and makes customers happier than sitting and charging.

According to NIO and their country wide battery swapping sites, NIO had their 500,000 battery swap. Not that people do not also recharge their NIO, but when on the road, a 90 second battery swap and off for another 300 miles is faster than any Gas fueling ICE auto can do.

https://www.greencarreports.com/news/1128364_hey-tesla-china-s-nio-has-completed-500-000-battery-swaps

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