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William Maley

Cadillac News: The Unclear Future of the Blackwing V8

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38 minutes ago, balthazar said:

^ but NOTHING is special anymore. ☹️

Too True, Cadillac just has nothing exciting right now that is WOW, Gotta spend my hard earned money on.

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Isn't that already done being produced and the other one hasn't officially been announced, just assumed?

Edited by ccap41
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I don’t know if all the BW’s are sold out or not. They definitely are exciting tho.

CT5-V is on the way shortly (along with the CT4-V), so if one wanted a hi-po Cadillac, there obviously are products ‘out there’. Oh, and a ‘21 Escalade V.

You just can’t sit there, not buying, then complain if it goes out of production.

Didn’t the last gen BMW 3-series, when it first came out, take 1.5 years for the M version to be released?

Edited by balthazar
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23 minutes ago, balthazar said:

Blackwing CT6-V 4.2L TT does nothing for you?
600+ HP 6.2L SC CT5-V too slow?

Blackwing is exciting, but not in an Escalade ESV yet that we know of.

CT5-V is exciting but not released yet nor will it fit me.

I am not cramming my size into a car, Cadillac does not have a luxury pickup anymore and the new Escalade is just Meh on the exterior.

So NO, nothing exciting to get me to spend money outside of service on my existing fleet.

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Who knows if they will really do a V8 in the CT5, that could easily get budget cut if the CT5 sells slowly out of the gate.  SUVs are what sell, and Cadillac put all theirs on chassis that can't support much more than 300 lb-ft of torque, this is the great miss.   And Escalade-V, we'll see if they actually make it.  I think they should, it is easy profit margin, but they haven't done it yet after years of horsepower wars.  In the 2020s things will probably become the EV wars, and the 6.2 V8 will seem like yesterday's powertrain.  

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4 hours ago, dfelt said:

Blackwing is exciting, but not in an Escalade ESV yet that we know of.

CT5-V is exciting but not released yet nor will it fit me.

I am not cramming my size into a car, Cadillac does not have a luxury pickup anymore and the new Escalade is just Meh on the exterior.

So NO, nothing exciting to get me to spend money outside of service on my existing fleet.

OK- I should have assumed, but you didn't state you were talking about you as a consumer.
I can easily say ferrari or lamborghini doesn't build anything exciting (because I have no intention of paying $100K+ for a vehicle).

Edited by balthazar
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33 minutes ago, smk4565 said:

Who knows if they will really do a V8 in the CT5, that could easily get budget cut if the CT5 sells slowly out of the gate.  SUVs are what sell, and Cadillac put all theirs on chassis that can't support much more than 300 lb-ft of torque, this is the great miss.   And Escalade-V, we'll see if they actually make it.  I think they should, it is easy profit margin, but they haven't done it yet after years of horsepower wars.  In the 2020s things will probably become the EV wars, and the 6.2 V8 will seem like yesterday's powertrain.  

Hello McFly, The Chassis can handle more than 300 lb-ft of Torque. GM just has not built the motor tranny combo to go above that as you pointed out, they have not exceeded above their potential yet!

1 minute ago, balthazar said:

OK- I should have assumed, but you didn't state you were talking about you as a consumer.
I can easily say ferrari or lamborghini doesn't build anything exciting (because I have no intention of paying $100K+ for a vehicle).

Valid point and thank you my friend you are right, I was thinking myself with my comment and should have clarified it.  Many of us I think tend to think of ourselves and leave comments that are very wide open to interpretation. We all should clarify ourselves versus the market.

They have Excitement that others will find, but for myself not yet!

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1 hour ago, dfelt said:

Hello McFly, The Chassis can handle more than 300 lb-ft of Torque. GM just has not built the motor tranny combo to go above that as you pointed out, they have not exceeded above their potential yet!

Valid point and thank you my friend you are right, I was thinking myself with my comment and should have clarified it.  Many of us I think tend to think of ourselves and leave comments that are very wide open to interpretation. We all should clarify ourselves versus the market.

They have Excitement that others will find, but for myself not yet!

Does GM have a FWD transmission that can handle 400 hp?  I guess they can resurrect the XTS V-sport powertrain for an XT5 or XT6, but would either of those be any good?  Or would they torque steer all over the place and have reliability issues?  

But again, I hear the "Cadillac could do it"  but at the end of the day they don't do it.   And others don't either (Acura, Lexus etc) but then you see a Lincoln Aviator with 400 hp base and 495 hp as an option, when Cadillac maxes out at 310 hp because that is all the front wheels can handle.   If Cadillac was going to do all this stuff, have the brand product line, or have good marketing, it would have happened by now.  

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10 minutes ago, smk4565 said:

Does GM have a FWD transmission that can handle 400 hp?  I guess they can resurrect the XTS V-sport powertrain for an XT5 or XT6, but would either of those be any good?  Or would they torque steer all over the place and have reliability issues?  

But again, I hear the "Cadillac could do it"  but at the end of the day they don't do it.   And others don't either (Acura, Lexus etc) but then you see a Lincoln Aviator with 400 hp base and 495 hp as an option, when Cadillac maxes out at 310 hp because that is all the front wheels can handle.   If Cadillac was going to do all this stuff, have the brand product line, or have good marketing, it would have happened by now.  

Yet now they are going EV with names, so I am sure they will have 400, 500 and 600 newton meters of torque on top of the 400, 500 and 600 kW power motors.

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3 hours ago, smk4565 said:

And Escalade-V, we'll see if they actually make it.  I think they should, it is easy profit margin, but they haven't done it yet after years of horsepower wars.

Cadillac did not have to make an Escalade V with gi-normous horsepower upgrades. Even with the horsepower wars STILL going on. 

As an enthusiast, I think they should myself. 

As a business owner, Ill say: Hold on a minute! 

Easy profit YOU say...

Ill say maybe? Maybe not.  

The small R&D money needed to engineer room to  package the supercharged V8 in the Escalade engine bay. The small R&D money needed to create new body panels to differentiate it from the other lesser models.  The small R&D money needed to safety crash it and approve it.  All that creativity and energy and money spent  may not have been enough and worthwhile to recuperate even with a higher price tag for a market that simple may NOT be there...  

The Escalade always sold well. Especially towards its competition. There was NO NEED to invent a new niche for it.  Simply put, monies and energies were needed elsewhere...especially when the market deems 400 some odd horsepower ENOUGH for the Escalade...

Like the independant suspension thing.  It took long enough, right???!!!  Well, there was no need to fix that aspect. But finally,  for the next gen Escalade in 2021, Cadillac saw that the time is now for independent suspension. Maybe a hi-po V version is what Cadillac people are seeing for 2022? Maybe not...    Like I said before, the Escalade engineers and marketers KNOW what the Escalade is and what its not.  And if they deem that the time is right for a V version, then the market will see a V version...

You could shyte on GM all you want for whatever reason you want...and you will probably have a good argument on your side, for your side.

BUT...there are 2 models at GM that GM gets right each and every time.  And nobody should question what they are doing with them.  Those 2 models are the Corvette and the Escalade. 

Both the Corvette and Escalade engineering and marketing teams are really really dialed into their products. 

 

 

Edited by oldshurst442
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As pointed out recently; the base Escalade has 40 more HP than the base GLS.

Edited by balthazar
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9 hours ago, oldshurst442 said:

Cadillac did not have to make an Escalade V with gi-normous horsepower upgrades. Even with the horsepower wars STILL going on. 

As an enthusiast, I think they should myself. 

As a business owner, Ill say: Hold on a minute! 

Easy profit YOU say...

Ill say maybe? Maybe not.  

The small R&D money needed to engineer room to  package the supercharged V8 in the Escalade engine bay. The small R&D money needed to create new body panels to differentiate it from the other lesser models.  The small R&D money needed to safety crash it and approve it.  All that creativity and energy and money spent  may not have been enough and worthwhile to recuperate even with a higher price tag for a market that simple may NOT be there...  

The Escalade always sold well. Especially towards its competition. There was NO NEED to invent a new niche for it.  Simply put, monies and energies were needed elsewhere...especially when the market deems 400 some odd horsepower ENOUGH for the Escalade...

Like the independant suspension thing.  It took long enough, right???!!!  Well, there was no need to fix that aspect. But finally,  for the next gen Escalade in 2021, Cadillac saw that the time is now for independent suspension. Maybe a hi-po V version is what Cadillac people are seeing for 2022? Maybe not...    Like I said before, the Escalade engineers and marketers KNOW what the Escalade is and what its not.  And if they deem that the time is right for a V version, then the market will see a V version...

You could shyte on GM all you want for whatever reason you want...and you will probably have a good argument on your side, for your side.

BUT...there are 2 models at GM that GM gets right each and every time.  And nobody should question what they are doing with them.  Those 2 models are the Corvette and the Escalade. 

Both the Corvette and Escalade engineering and marketing teams are really really dialed into their products. 

 

 

If only GM were really dialed into the rest of Cadillac too. . . . .

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14 hours ago, smk4565 said:

Who knows if they will really do a V8 in the CT5, that could easily get budget cut if the CT5 sells slowly out of the gate.  SUVs are what sell, and Cadillac put all theirs on chassis that can't support much more than 300 lb-ft of torque, this is the great miss.   And Escalade-V, we'll see if they actually make it.  I think they should, it is easy profit margin, but they haven't done it yet after years of horsepower wars.  In the 2020s things will probably become the EV wars, and the 6.2 V8 will seem like yesterday's powertrain.  

Do any of their CUVs make more than 300 lb-ft of torque? Obviously the Escalade does but that's not a CUV. 

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6 minutes ago, ccap41 said:

Do any of their CUVs make more than 300 lb-ft of torque? Obviously the Escalade does but that's not a CUV. 

No, but the LGX 3.6 in the XT5 and XT6 makes 271 units.

Edited by Robert Hall
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5 minutes ago, Robert Hall said:

No, but the LGX 3.6 in the XT5 and XT6 makes 271 units.

Weak. 271 torques in a 3-row, luxury SUV shouldn't be a thing. The XT5 is large enough that there should be an upgrade available and the XT4 doesn't really need more(258 in the turbo-4) but an optional engine would be nice. This is a luxury automaker, after all. 

Lincoln, mother fckn Lincoln, has a much better drivetrain portfolio than Cadillac does right now with the 4.2 being discontinued and no s/c V8 available. 

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36 minutes ago, ccap41 said:

Weak. 271 torques in a 3-row, luxury SUV shouldn't be a thing. The XT5 is large enough that there should be an upgrade available and the XT4 doesn't really need more(258 in the turbo-4) but an optional engine would be nice. This is a luxury automaker, after all. 

 

It’s more torque than the 3.6 LFY in the XT6’s siblings from Chevy and Buick though (but the Acadia being Professional Grade gets the same engine/torque).  And about the same as a major competitor (Lexus RX).  

Edited by Robert Hall
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25 minutes ago, Robert Hall said:

It’s more torque than the 3.6 LFY in the XT6’s siblings from Chevy and Buick though.  And about the same as a major competitor (Lexus RX).  

It technically is more than the Buick and Chevy... 5 lb-ft more but at 2200rpm HIGHER. 

Wouldn't the GX be closer in comparison to an XT6? 

GX : $53,000

XT6 : $52,695

XT5 and RX are similarly priced as the XT6 & GX. 

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2 minutes ago, ccap41 said:

It technically is more than the Buick and Chevy... 5 lb-ft more but at 2200rpm HIGHER. 

Wouldn't the GX be closer in comparison to an XT6? 

GX : $53,000

XT6 : $52,695

XT5 and RX are similarly priced as the XT6 & GX. 

Well, GX is old school body-on-frame and only available w/ a V8 in the US, the RX is a generic transverse V6 layout as is the XT6.  And it is available in a 3rd row now.  

Edited by Robert Hall

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Just now, Robert Hall said:

Well, GX is old school body-on-frame, the RX is the same generic transverse engine layout as the XT6.  And it is available in a 3rd row now.  

If those two are cross shopped, the XT6 looses 10 times out of 10, saving $10,000. 

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Ugh, GX or XT6, I'll pass on both.  If I was into offroading I might like the GX but such a dated interior and poor on-road dynamics.  Nice leather I'm guessing though.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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13 hours ago, balthazar said:

As pointed out recently; the base Escalade has 40 more HP than the base GLS.

But the GLS has 3 other power options at 483, 550 and 603 hp,  

Escalade has the diesel option now, do at least there is another engine choice.  Looks doubtful that MB will bring the diesel GLS back here.  
 

I think a supercharged V8 Escalade would sell better than a diesel Escalade though.

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Diesel seems like it would be a dead end, outside of HD pickups.   A supercharged V8 then a Hybrid of some sort would make more sense...

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Diesel is DEAD ON ARRIVAL for Escalade. This Diesel engine has not had the time to really have enough real world driving to see if an Aluminum block with steel sleeves can live up to the 15:1 compression and not crack or have other issues. I would leave it in the Chevy and GMC brands and not in Cadillac. Luxury buyers in the US are past wanting diesel even in German brands. Diesel is Dead Dead Dead.

Hybrid, Supercharged / Turbo charged is where the engine options should be.

This whole basic V8 and Diesel  with a look that is way too Chevrolet shows that the new head of Cadillac is more concerned with playing politics than building Cadillac back into the standard of the world Luxury company with unique engines, interiors, exteriors, etc.

If Cadillac CANNOT set themselves apart from the rest of GM with their EVs and using names again, then Cadillac will never be anything other than a small local specific luxo auto company that has given up on the world.

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