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Genesis News: 2021 Genesis G80 Packs New Styling, Two Turbo Engines

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Just now, ocnblu said:

Current Cadillac Escalade taillight is over $1500 for the part only!

Thanks for that update, crazy, just crazy.

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3 hours ago, dfelt said:

EXACTLY  how MB and BMW were in the 70's and 80's before finally catching on with the badge snobs. As such, I expect Genesis to reduce from a almost 30 year barely making it to a much smaller time line before they equal the German brands.

Yes, one needs to watch what they say as the market can change on a dime and boom out goes the Europeans for who knows what next. Maybe EVs? 😏

The badge snobs embraced the MB/BMW in the 80s; nobody really cared back in the 70s.  As for the rapid switch to other marques, color me a little skeptical.  The switch to CUVs over sedans took a long while (about 20 years from the original CR-V and RAV4).  CUV sales have essentially replaced sedan sales only 5-7 years ago.  Toyota/Lexus and Honda/Acura have lost very little market share in the past 15 years.  The rise of Hyundai/KIA is amazing but Genesis is not a brand that is trendy.  Where is the fat and unhealthy luxury marque that needs to be challenged from Genesis?  There is a reason that MB/BMW went from obscure in 1980 to the Kings of the Luxury Hill before 1990 (prestige if not sales); then came the 1990 Lexus LS400 to challenge them.  Cadillac is not the slothful and complacent non-leader of the 1970s and 1980s.  Lincoln is no longer an afterthought (unlike before 2017 or so).  It seems to me that just about every luxury marque (aside from failing Infiniti) is pretty much where they want to be.  There is no real growth in luxury car sales at all.  Mostly it is the craze for luxury CUVs; but also there is some real growth from otherwise common car marques, especially really expensive pickup trucks

The same questions remain: where does Genesis find and take market share?  Also, why should anyone buy a Genesis over ANY Other luxury brand?  What is Genesis's unique selling point?

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Mercedes in the 70s and 80s cost more than Lincoln or Cadillac did.  Granted they also mostly had SL, S-class and E-class so they started with their top cars and worked down.  But high prices didn’t stop them from taking the market because they had the best engineered products.

I don’t know if G80 and even GV80 are up to the task of taking on E-class, 5-series, GLE and X5.  All 4 of those offer a 600 hp option Genesis might stop at 375, and if the chassis was built to only 375 hp, it probably isn’t as good as the one built to handle 600 and get around the Nurburgring.

Genesis really needs a GV70 more than anything.  Genesis is practically sales proof, they sold under 4,000 cars in Q1.  

27 minutes ago, balthazar said:

Who in the segment has a unique selling point??

2 of them have an inline 6 that will win on smoothness all day.  Mercedes and Audi will soon have mild hybrid on ever car.  I doubt Genesis does any hybrids, plug-in or electric for years.

There are going to be Audi drivers racing these Genesis’s saying “E-tron just kicked in, yo!”

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mercedes / BMW weren't competitive until the 1990s.

RE : I-6 "smoothness" ; big deal - that's no selling point.
Especially since more & more; the dead I-6 is going to the I-4.

The problem is entrenched now - once upon a time a luxury car meant all the bells & whistles, now you can get the majority of amenities on everything down to the bottom of the barrel. The range has decreased significantly. And then there's the truck segment horning DEEP into the luxury brand territory- the same amenities, some new ones, and capabilities the cars can't even approach.

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It could be construed that luxury pickups are the new aspirational vehicle.  I read somewhere that luxury cars across all brands were being traded in on Denali, High Country, King Ranch and Limited LD and HD pickups at a very noticeable clip.

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Pickup trucks don’t have performance and won’t until the Cybertruck arrives.  Also a King Ranch or High Country truck is still a far cry from an Audi A6 in terms of interior and technology let alone the higher luxury vehicles.

I mean the Kia Telluride has a better interior than a Denali pickup, can’t get Super Cruise in a Silverado or Sierra either and Audi A8 has a system more advanced than Super Cruise.  Trucks are expensive (and do well on resale) but that doesn’t make them luxury.

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Posted (edited)
19 minutes ago, smk4565 said:

Pickup trucks don’t have performance and won’t until the Cybertruck arrives

Are you buzzing again?

JUST because there isnt a Silverado SS 454 or Ford F-150  Lightning like there was 20 years ago...doesnt mean these machines do not have performance...

A Silverado has a a 6.2 liter 420 HP and 460 horsepower V8 under the hood. 

Also...the Ford Raptor IS a performance machine...

And you saw what I wrote?  I said 20 years ago...

PERFORMANCE muscle trucks EXISTED  while Elon Musk was still a baby...

 

 
Quote

 

Elon Reeve Musk FRS is an engineer, industrial designer, philanthropist, and technology entrepreneur. He is a citizen of South Africa, the United States, and Canada. Wikipedia
 
Born: June 28, 1971 (age 48 years), Pretoria, South Africa
Net worth: 29.5 billion USD (2020)
Partner: Grimes (2018–)
Spouse: Talulah Riley (m. 2013–2016), Talulah Riley (m. 2010–2012), Justine Musk (m. 2000–2008)

 

 

 

 

1978  (And yes...it was performance for the time...) And there are a slew of other noteworthy performance trucks from then until now...

Dodge Truck Stripe Kits | Lil Red Express | Dodge Truck Parts ...

 

The Cybertruck is still not in production but Ford will gladly sell you a performance pick-up  right NOW

 

And there is another that Ford could sell you RIGHT NOW

The 750-HP Shelby F-150 Super Snake Is a $100,000 Thundertruck

 

The rest of your post is just word pollution...

Edited by oldshurst442
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A 420 hp Sierra or Silverado does 0-60 in 5.7 seconds vs like 4.7 for a G80.  Also trucks have sloppy handling.  Let me know when the Silverado beats a CT5-V around a race track.  

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19 minutes ago, smk4565 said:

A 420 hp Sierra or Silverado does 0-60 in 5.7 seconds vs like 4.7 for a G80.  Also trucks have sloppy handling.  Let me know when the Silverado beats a CT5-V around a race track.  

word pollution.

But...Ill humour you.

This is what pick-up trucks do...what they are meant to do...with 420 HP and 460 ft/lbs are meant to do....there are base V6 engines in these...and Ford has preferred to go 400 HP with turbo V6...but...

Let me know when a G80 or a Caddy CT5V can do this

DECKED Truck Bed Storage - FREE SHIPPING!

 

or this

DECKED Truck Bed Storage System - Chevy Silverado 1500/2500/3500 ...

 Or even this...

 

2019 Chevrolet Silverado Review: 8 Models Ready to Fight Ford, Ram ...

 

0-60 and Nurburgring times are less relevant in times like these...me thinks...

Screw your head on straight dude. Discuss stuff more like an adult and less like a teenager, please. 

 

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Posted (edited)

And I noticed you IGNORED 0-60 times of the Raptor and the Shelby.

Raptor is a tick above 5 seconds...

BUT...

Let me know when a G80 could do this (for the SECOND time) 

 

 

Oh...the Raptor could just flat out GO THROUGH the NURBURGRING  by actually GOING THROUGH the twists and turns... 

Edited by oldshurst442

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The modern pickup truck is a Swiss Army Knife in all the best ways.

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10 hours ago, smk4565 said:

Mercedes in the 70s and 80s cost more than Lincoln or Cadillac did.

FALSE.

Mercedes has a model or two in the 1980s that was above Cadillac in the 1980s...but in the 1970s...NADA.

Cadillac was starting to fall from grace...sure...but even Oldsmobile was on a higher level than Mercedes was. 

Mercedes threw some high priced stuff our way in the 1970s, and 'twas mostly rich Stepford wives that bought them. Seemingly California  Stepford wives.  Im thinking it was a way for rich pricks to shut them up while they were cheating on them with younger versions of their trophy wives...  I hardly think that qualifies as glamorous...

Keep mind that those rich pricks all drove Cadillacs and Lincolns...

Then the yuppies took over in the 1980s and wanted to show those old rich pricks who is in control of Wallstreet and THAT is how Bimmers and Mercedes cars got a foothold on the luxury side of things in the US...  

Rest assured though, those younger chicks that cheated with those old rich pricks in the 1970s...all married guys that drove Lexuses in the 1980s and 1990s.

But dont forget...those yuppies that drove those Bimmers and Mercedes cars in the 1980s and 1990s...all drive Teslas now...

 

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32 minutes ago, oldshurst442 said:

FALSE. Mercedes has a model or two in the 1980s that was above Cadillac in the 1980s...but in the 1970s...NADA.

Are you considering the interiors at ALL in that statement?
Mercedes had terrible interiors thru the '80s, awful, terrible interiors. S-class, SL, you name it. Been in them, looked them over- they're a joke.

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Posted (edited)
3 minutes ago, balthazar said:

Are you considering the interiors at ALL in that statement?
Mercedes had terrible interiors thru the '80s, awful, terrible interiors. S-class, SL, you name it. Been in them, looked them over- they're a joke.

Just price. 

I dont have the patience or strength to discuss with him that aspect.

Ive done so, like you, in the past, discuss this with him...

Im kinda burnt out with this ad nauseam discussion with him.     That is why I had a trolly response to him in that post. 

Edited by oldshurst442

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1 hour ago, oldshurst442 said:

word pollution.

But...Ill humour you.

This is what pick-up trucks do...what they are meant to do...with 420 HP and 460 ft/lbs are meant to do....there are base V6 engines in these...and Ford has preferred to go 400 HP with turbo V6...but...

Let me know when a G80 or a Caddy CT5V can do this

DECKED Truck Bed Storage - FREE SHIPPING!

 

or this

DECKED Truck Bed Storage System - Chevy Silverado 1500/2500/3500 ...

 Or even this...

 

2019 Chevrolet Silverado Review: 8 Models Ready to Fight Ford, Ram ...

 

0-60 and Nurburgring times are less relevant in times like these...me thinks...

Screw your head on straight dude. Discuss stuff more like an adult and less like a teenager, please. 

 

Right, they build for work and utility, not luxury.  

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, oldshurst442 said:

FALSE.

Mercedes has a model or two in the 1980s that was above Cadillac in the 1980s...but in the 1970s...NADA.

Cadillac was starting to fall from grace...sure...but even Oldsmobile was on a higher level than Mercedes was. 

Mercedes threw some high priced stuff our way in the 1970s, and 'twas mostly rich Stepford wives that bought them. Seemingly California  Stepford wives.  Im thinking it was a way for rich pricks to shut them up while they were cheating on them with younger versions of their trophy wives...  I hardly think that qualifies as glamorous...

Keep mind that those rich pricks all drove Cadillacs and Lincolns...

Then the yuppies took over in the 1980s and wanted to show those old rich pricks who is in control of Wallstreet and THAT is how Bimmers and Mercedes cars got a foothold on the luxury side of things in the US...  

Rest assured though, those younger chicks that cheated with those old rich pricks in the 1970s...all married guys that drove Lexuses in the 1980s and 1990s.

But dont forget...those yuppies that drove those Bimmers and Mercedes cars in the 1980s and 1990s...all drive Teslas now...

 

Some original MSRP's from 1977

Rolls-Royce Silver Spur $42,000

Mercedes 450SEL 6.9  $39,377

Mercedes 450SEL $25,241

Mercedes SL  $22,601

Mercedes 280E $17,114

Mercedes 240D $11,920 (the cheapest Mercedes sold, a 4 cylinder diesel E-class)

Cadillac Fleetwood Brougham $11,546

Lincoln Town Car  $9,636.

They broke in with higher prices and still won, plus Karl Benz invented the car 70 years before they sold a car in the USA, where as Genesis is a total upstart from a car company that itself isn't all that old.

Edited by smk4565
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Posted (edited)
54 minutes ago, smk4565 said:

Right, they build for work and utility, not luxury.  

Right...

Your argument flip flops between Silverado...a Chevrolet and then switch to Denali...

Is this luxury? 

Mercedes-Benz E-Class - Wikipedia

 

Starts at 50 000 or so...

So does a Denali.  

3 hours ago, smk4565 said:

I mean the Kia Telluride has a better interior than a Denali pickup, can’t get Super Cruise in a Silverado or Sierra either and Audi A8 has a system more advanced than Super Cruise.  Trucks are expensive (and do well on resale) but that doesn’t make them luxury.

Like I said you flip flop...

And then you try to denounce a Denali...

But a 54 000 dollar E Class interior is an equal to the Denali's...

And THAT version gets no supercruise or any other luxury tech either...plus a V6. The Denali is a 420 or so horsepower V8...   You know...YOUR kind of definition of luxury...V8...

Oh...and you mentioned work and utility...

CC Outtake: Today's Berlin Taxis – Toyota's Next Step On The Way ...

Mercedes-Benz E 200 d Taxi (W213) '2016–20

 

31 minutes ago, smk4565 said:

Mercedes 450SEL 6.9  $39,377

Mercedes 450SEL $25,241

Mercedes SL  $22,601

Mercedes 280E $17,114

Mercedes 240D $11,920 (the cheapest Mercedes sold, a 4 cylinder diesel E-class)

And all these NEVER sold in numbers to be bragged out about...

Like I said...

J.R.  types from the soap opera Dallas all had Stepford wives and these are the cars they bought for them to silence them because they were cheating on them...

You know...Lexus sold a half-a-million dollar car not too long ago...

There are STILL unsold examples of it...

Your little word pollution discussion...of which I got a headache from...means very little...

 

Edited by oldshurst442
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GMC, even the Denali isn't a luxury brand, Cadillac is nicer than anything GMC has and Cadillac themselves are tier 2 brand.  No one thinks a GMC truck is nicer than an Escalade, and half of Audi's lineup is more luxurious than an Escalade is.  

The Genesis G80 is nicer than any GMC Denali product on the interior and the G80 is going to struggle to sell.  GV80 might do okay to the less discerning crossover buyer.  GV80 is undercutting the XT6 and Aviator in price, it is $4k more than an Acura MDX, so it is right in the meat of the segment there, it could do fairly well if it cleans up on the dated Acura and Infiniti models and the lackluster XT6.

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Median household income of a luxury car buyer in the U.S. is $99K.
Average household income of a Denali buyer is $153K. It's a bona fide luxury product, no question.
The bread & butter of audi sales are cheap cars - the truely nice ones no one bothers with.
 

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1 hour ago, balthazar said:

Median household income of a luxury car buyer in the U.S. is $99K.
Average household income of a Denali buyer is $153K. It's a bona fide luxury product, no question.
The bread & butter of audi sales are cheap cars - the truely nice ones no one bothers with.
 

The Audi Q series, especially the Q5 and the Q3, are keeping Audi afloat.  I have not seen too many Audi CARS on the road in several years.  Maybe the occasional A8 here and there.

Yes the Denali customer is a luxury customer.  That is great for GMC.  Other than the pickup trucks, why can't GM move them up to an Escalade?

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2 hours ago, balthazar said:

Median household income of a luxury car buyer in the U.S. is $99K.
Average household income of a Denali buyer is $153K. It's a bona fide luxury product, no question.
The bread & butter of audi sales are cheap cars - the truely nice ones no one bothers with.
 

Cost doesn't equal luxury.  A Freightliner Cascadia is $150k base model, doesn't make it luxury.  Sierra's with the 6.2 upgrade or the diesel and Allison transmission or the 2500/3500 level are expensive because of towing/hauling capability.  

Look at a Terrain or Acadia, interior, powertrain, ride/handling, etc, compare that to an Acura or Infiniti even and GMC loses, compare to an Audi or Mercedes and it isn't even a discussion.  Heck the Terrain and Acadia aren't even nearly as luxurious as the Cadillacs that share mechanical bits with them.  

And that $153k is for a Sierra Denali, what about a Terrain Denali, what is the household income of that buyer?    Good for GMC for attracting higher income buyers, I would say why don't they raise the price higher?  A GMC Sierra has a base price of $29,600.  Why not just make it start at $49,600, and charge $100k for the Denali if this buyer pool is so wealthy?  And it comes down to even if the avg Denali household income was $10 million a year, they aren't going to spend $100k on anything that says GMC on it.  

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3 minutes ago, smk4565 said:

Cost doesn't equal luxury.

Why not just make it start at $49,600, and charge $100k for the Denali...?

• By the same token; luxury doesn’t equal cost.

• Why doesn’t daimler jack the price of the s-class to the lowest MSRP of a rolls royce and go up to $750K??

Nvrmnd; alrdy trd tht.

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1 hour ago, riviera74 said:

The Audi Q series, especially the Q5 and the Q3, are keeping Audi afloat.  I have not seen too many Audi CARS on the road in several years.  Maybe the occasional A8 here and there.

Yes the Denali customer is a luxury customer.  That is great for GMC.  Other than the pickup trucks, why can't GM move them up to an Escalade?

China keeps Audi afloat.  Audi sells about as many cars in China as Chevy sells Silverados in the USA.

GMC Sierra Denali is probably the nice truck out there, the new Ram has a nice high trim, and the F150 I'd say lags behind both.  So buyers don't really have another choice if they NEED a pickup and want the nice one.  This is where Toyota totally misses in the full size truck game.  The Tundra is dated as can be, has a V8 from 13 years ago that has seen no updates, the truck is a joke.  I know an all new Tundra is coming, but there should be an all new Tundra ever 6-7 years.  They should sell easily double the number of Tundras that they do now.  They can sell 500,000 RAV4's but they can't sell 100k Tundras a year?

And there should be a Lexus Truck that is a hybrid turbo V6, 450ish hp, that has all he off road capability of the Land Cruiser (which would make it the most capable truck) all the luxury and tech of an LS or LC plus Lexus-level reliability.  This should be such a no-brainer.  Toyota has nearly endless cash, they could outspend Ford's F150 program any day of the week if they wanted to, and they have one of the premier luxury brands and premier reliability and resale value brands in the stable.   They could easily sell a Lexus pickup starting at $75-80k, with options up to $100k.  I think that would outsell the LS500 at the same price point and most of the tooling is already paid from the Tundra that they already have that is a volume product.

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      In addition, the Genesis safety platform works to integrate communications between 40+ controllers in real time to help ensure the safest response in various scenarios.
      Next-Generation, Technology-Enabled Luxury
      The G80 offers a high level of convenience to drivers with a suite of new technology. Each new feature is focused on further and seamlessly integrating the G80 with its client’s lifestyle, devices and preferences. A selection of highlighted features include:
      The Remote Smart Parking Assistant (RSPA) provides remote drive/reverse functions that facilitate parking in narrow spaces, as well as perpendicular parking and parallel parking. This can be controlled within the car or outside, remotely via the key fob. The 12.3-inch 3D instrument cluster recognizes the driver's eyes and provides various driving information and can be converted to 2D depending on the driver's preference. The Genesis Integrated Controller allows users to set destinations or enter phone numbers by simply writing on the main control center instead of complicated keyboard input. A 14.5-inch touchscreen infotainment system links with the Genesis Integrated Controller to support Genesis Quick Guide and Valet mode. Valet mode is a function that enhances security so that users' personal information does not appear on infotainment screens when using a Valet parking service. Over-the-air, wireless updates to the navigation system. Phone connectivity including Android Auto and Apple Car Play. With an eye toward the senses, luxury-focused items include:
      The driver's seat is equipped with an ergo motion seat function featuring seven air cells which enables optimum seating for each driving mode and reduces fatigue via a stretching mode and automatic posture correction functions. Ambient mood lamps applied throughout the interior add a sense of calm to the passenger space in various colors. From a sound standpoint, Genesis has enhanced the engine's sound with its Active Sound Design (ASD), standard on all G80s equipped with gasoline engines, adding an additional level of customization. The Lexicon sound system allows passengers to enjoy the vivid sound effects of a concert, such as "Quantum Logic Surround Audience Mode/Stage Mode," adding to the joy of listening. The first row HVAC system allows the driver to adjust the heated/ventilated seats in the second row and the air conditioning mode/temperature independently of the first row, increasing the convenience for second row passengers. Marketplace
      The all-new G80 enters the marketplace on March 30th in South Korea and in the second half of the year in other markets, starting with North America.
  • Recent Status Updates

    • trinacriabob  »  oldshurst442

      Liking that new av - a CP (Canadian Pacific) 747, IIRC
      · 0 replies
    • dfelt  »  A Horse With No Name

      Welcome back, so happy to see you back. You were missed!  
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    • Robert Hall

      Reality is complex
      · 1 reply
    • ocnblu

      What's the frequency, Kenneth?
      · 0 replies
    • trinacriabob  »  balthazar

      It's not possible to message you.  At least, it wasn't possible to do that last summer.  So I'll post it here.  I had a crazy layover back in June at PHL ... for about 8 hours ... and wondered how far into NJ you were from Philly.  What I did is get the PHLash day pass and did the self-guided tour of Center City before heading back to the airport.  I stayed too close to the center because of time. I actually wasted time by going into South Philly.  I wanted to venture out onto the Main Line and see Villanova.  That rail line was included on the pass I bought.  I had to manage my time because of the late afternoon flight to the Coast.  Cheers.
      · 1 reply
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