Genesis News: Genesis believes the people still want FUN in a Car, welcome the X Concept Trilogy

[smk4565]

32 minutes ago, David said:

Genesis wins as they have actual working Prototype EV Concepts. Where is Mercedes?

Mercedes sells more EVs than Genesis does.  Good for Genesis for having a concept car.

I am also not Anti-Genesis, I’d take a Genesis over about half the luxury brands cars.

[surreal1272]

11 hours ago, smk4565 said:

Mercedes sells more EVs than Genesis does.

Which has nothing to do with the concept part of Davids post. Absolutely nothing. 

[surreal1272]

11 hours ago, smk4565 said:

Mercedes sells more EVs than Genesis does.

In honor of your content need to move the bar...

[ccap41]

On 11/23/2022 at 4:01 PM, smk4565 said:

The 4x4 squared is also $359,000 so not much points comparing it to a Wrangler.  Would be like a sports car comparison of a Ferrari and a Mustang.  

Not necessarily though. When it comes to off-road stuff, an 80k Bronco/Wrangler could 100% keep pace with a 400k 4X4 Squared. Their prices don't compare at all but their abilities certainly do. While I love the G Wagen, it would be ignorant to believe that it's better off-road than a 392 Rubicon Wrangler(with the extreme recon package) or Bronco Raptor. The only real advantage 300k gets you is 13.1 inches of ground clearance for the Bronco Raptor, 12.9 for the above Wrangler, then 17.2 inches for the 4x4 Squared. The Wrangler 392 even has more HP and TQ, to boot(50hp,20tq). The Bronco has 1 more HP and 30 more TQ so that extra 300k isn't getting you more under the hood either. 

Edited November 25, 2022 by ccap41

[David]

3 hours ago, surreal1272 said:

In honor of your content need to move the bar...

Awesome Surreal, thank you for posting the latest EV sales. Even I did not know how many EVs Hyundai Motors is selling, but clearly way more than Mercedes.

Heck BMW outsells Mercedes.

Stellantis is surprisingly strong in EV sales.

VW is expected as they lead in Chinese sales for OEMs out of China selling in China.

Interestingly enough, I do not really consider Tesla an American company anymore. Why you ask! Simple, the amount of Chinese ownership in Tesla is controlling.

The top two investment companies that control Tesla are while setup via as LLC here in the US have majority owned by Chinese Nationals.

• Susquehanna Securities
• Capital World Investors

Top Tesla Shareholders: How Much Does Elon Own? (investopedia.com)

Both companies are focused on growing investor wealth globally, yet while they have international investors from all over, they are heavily and controlling invested percentage from Chinese billionaires. 

Plus, interesting that all other Legacy Auto companies have to have a Chinese partner in a 50/50 relationship, but Tesla was approved by the communist government to not have to do this. HOW AND WHY if not for Chinese owned.

Now put Mercedes EV Sales in comparison to the much larger GM/Wuling/Baojun EV Sales and Mercedes is falling even further behind.

Interesting world of change for everyone. Maybe it is time to retire all those 70 plus year old's trying to run Mercedes and Bring in some younger woman and men to run it.

 

[smk4565]

4 hours ago, ccap41 said:

Not necessarily though. When it comes to off-road stuff, an 80k Bronco/Wrangler could 100% keep pace with a 400k 4X4 Squared. Their prices don't compare at all but their abilities certainly do. While I love the G Wagen, it would be ignorant to believe that it's better off-road than a 392 Rubicon Wrangler(with the extreme recon package) or Bronco Raptor. The only real advantage 300k gets you is 13.1 inches of ground clearance for the Bronco Raptor, 12.9 for the above Wrangler, then 17.2 inches for the 4x4 Squared. The Wrangler 392 even has more HP and TQ, to boot(50hp,20tq). The Bronco has 1 more HP and 30 more TQ so that extra 300k isn't getting you more under the hood either. 

Still 4 inches more ground clearance and 2 inches more water fording depth than the 392 Rubicon.  The G63 is 577 hp and 627 lb ft torque.  Also the G-wagon is a luxury vehicle where Genesis, Lincoln, Cadillac, BMW, etc aren’t making an SUV as capable as a 392 Rubicon.

[smk4565]

1 hour ago, David said:

Awesome Surreal, thank you for posting the latest EV sales. Even I did not know how many EVs Hyundai Motors is selling, but clearly way more than Mercedes.

Heck BMW outsells Mercedes.

Stellantis is surprisingly strong in EV sales.

VW is expected as they lead in Chinese sales for OEMs out of China selling in China.

Interestingly enough, I do not really consider Tesla an American company anymore. Why you ask! Simple, the amount of Chinese ownership in Tesla is controlling.

The top two investment companies that control Tesla are while setup via as LLC here in the US have majority owned by Chinese Nationals.

• Susquehanna Securities
• Capital World Investors

Top Tesla Shareholders: How Much Does Elon Own? (investopedia.com)

Both companies are focused on growing investor wealth globally, yet while they have international investors from all over, they are heavily and controlling invested percentage from Chinese billionaires. 

Plus, interesting that all other Legacy Auto companies have to have a Chinese partner in a 50/50 relationship, but Tesla was approved by the communist government to not have to do this. HOW AND WHY if not for Chinese owned.

Now put Mercedes EV Sales in comparison to the much larger GM/Wuling/Baojun EV Sales and Mercedes is falling even further behind.

Interesting world of change for everyone. Maybe it is time to retire all those 70 plus year old's trying to run Mercedes and Bring in some younger woman and men to run it.

 

Compare Mercedes EV sales to Genesis, Cadillac, Lexus, Acura, Lincoln. Audi, Porsche and BMW without Mini.    Of course Hyundai has decent EV volume, Genesis doesn’t though.

Ola Kallenius is 7 years younger than Mary Barra and Jim Farley.  

[ccap41]

43 minutes ago, smk4565 said:

 The G63 is 577 hp and 627 lb ft torque.

It also comes with street tires and won't be able to go anywhere close as far as the Bronco/Wrangler/4X4 Squared. 

You either get the best off road abilities or more of a street vehicle with awesome lockers. 

I get it. It's a kick@ss vehicle but, as I've mentioned, it's aftermarket tires with some sidewalls away from competing with the others from the factory. As with everything, you get one or the other. 

[surreal1272]

2 hours ago, smk4565 said:

Compare Mercedes EV sales to Genesis, Cadillac, Lexus, Acura, Lincoln. Audi, Porsche and BMW without Mini.    Of course Hyundai has decent EV volume, Genesis doesn’t though.

Thanks for never disappointing.

 

[smk4565]

4 hours ago, ccap41 said:

It also comes with street tires and won't be able to go anywhere close as far as the Bronco/Wrangler/4X4 Squared. 

You either get the best off road abilities or more of a street vehicle with awesome lockers. 

I get it. It's a kick@ss vehicle but, as I've mentioned, it's aftermarket tires with some sidewalls away from competing with the others from the factory. As with everything, you get one or the other. 

The 4x4 Squared is a G63.  It has Pirelli Scorpion ATR all terrain tires. 

[David]

1 hour ago, smk4565 said:

The 4x4 Squared is a G63.  It has Pirelli Scorpion ATR all terrain tires. 

Joke of a HYBRID Tire, per their own web site:

The Pirelli SCORPION™ ATR is a versatile hybrid on / off road tire for use on a wide range of highway and off-road applications, designed to provide confident braking and handling. ... Download the brochure and learn more SCORPION™ ATR tire warranty. ... SCORPION™ STR SCORPION™ WEATHERACTIVE™

So lets look at a review that I found to be consistent across tire reviews and for which @ccap41 clearly pointed out. This tire is really just a street tire that they also are trying to say is off-road all terrain and it FAILS.

Pirelli Scorpion ATR Tire Review | CarShtuff

QUOTE: 

How Does the Scorpion ATR Perform on Ice and Snow?

When it comes to ice-covered or snow-covered roads, the Scorpion ATR doesn’t perform to the level you would expect.

As much as it may deliver some usable traction in ice and snow, you will have to drive extremely slowly in these conditions.

If you drive fast, the vehicle may swerve off the road, due to the tire’s poor traction. Simply put, it lacks the level of traction needed to deliver safe driving in snowy and icy conditions.

So, if you live in an area that experiences heavy winters, then the Scorpion ATR is not the right choice for your vehicle. Instead, you should choose a dedicated winter or snow tire.

 

It’s important to note that the Scorpion ATR is not specifically engineered for serious off-road conditions.

It lacks some key features and technologies that you would find on a dedicated off-road tire.

So, if you consider yourself a rugged off-roader, then the Scorpion ATR may not be the best choice for your driving needs.

[smk4565]

If you don't like Pirelli Scorpion then buy something else, someone paying $350k for a car can get a different set if they go off road and a set for on road.

Point still is, where is the off roader from Genesis, BMW, Audi, Cadillac, etc?  None of them are there, Audi is killing the R8 this year, none of them are making sports cars or super cars either.  

And according to Car and Driver, none of these Genesis X concepts are seeing production.

Edited November 26, 2022 by smk4565

[surreal1272]

2 hours ago, smk4565 said:

If you don't like Pirelli Scorpion then buy something else, someone paying $350k for a car can get a different set if they go off road and a set for on road.

So again...

 

You CANNOT sit here and praise the tire in one post and then go "well, just get another tire" when it is proven that said tire actually worthless for off roading and worthless towards your argument. FFS

[smk4565]

19 hours ago, surreal1272 said:

So again...

 

You CANNOT sit here and praise the tire in one post and then go "well, just get another tire" when it is proven that said tire actually worthless for off roading and worthless towards your argument. FFS

I didn’t praise it, I just said that it has an all terrain tire, not a street tire.

[surreal1272]

46 minutes ago, smk4565 said:

I didn’t praise it, I just said that it has an all terrain tire, not a street tire.

"Praise" is a stern word, for sure, but you clearly felt was acceptable until it was pointed out to you that was pretty much garbage. Then it's "Buy another tire" for the "best or nothing" $350K+ Mercedes lol. Again, goalpost moving.

 

Edited November 27, 2022 by surreal1272

[ccap41]

On 11/25/2022 at 5:43 PM, smk4565 said:

The 4x4 Squared is a G63.  It has Pirelli Scorpion ATR all terrain tires. 

The new one is, the previous one was a G500 or G550. 

Anybody who knows anything about off-roading knows those aren't much of a real all terrain tire. Just look at it and you'll know. 

[Suaviloquent]

Aside from the thread getting away from itself.

 

I hate to say it, but no one would buy this coupe at all if Genesis made it. It would lose money hand over fist for Genesis just to prove a point. 

 

They can do a low volume prestige special with a V8 manual and higher price tag. It would be Genesis version of their last V8.

 

If they did EV version... They should not make the coupe and only have the 4 door coupe style. 

 

Genesis has done some amazing styling here, but if these came out as production models and did not have 3 consecutive years of concepts, it's telling what Genesis always knows.

 

Maybe in China with limited sales in Korea, but nowhere else.