TaurusSHO

This looks really good, much better than I was expecting.  Hopefully Ford will follow with the Mustang and Toyota with the Supra.

http://www.motortrend.com/news/chevrolets-new-nascar-race-car-will-look-like-camaro-zl1/

34 minutes ago, A Horse With No Name said:

Two thoughts...this must be Photoshop, as no 1989 car in the state of Ohio is this pristine and clean.

Also, you write and think so clearly I assumed you already had an advanced degree.

It was my grandma's car and has always been garaged except for a few years after she passed.  I started driving it with 58k miles and it now has about 67k.  I know it's just a LeBaron, but I hate racking up the miles on it.  I couldn't turn down a free car though.  

Thanks.   Back in my MT forum days, most people thought I was in my 40s or 50s before I revealed that I was 15 lol.

15 minutes ago, dfelt said:

I take my TB over your Taurus SHO.   TB would win.

Well if I actually had a Taurus SHO I would gladly race you somewhere!   I'm currently driving a 1989 LeBaron until I get a full time job after I graduate college. 

No doubt it would.

1 hour ago, dfelt said:

Possibly depending on the person driving, their skills and your idea of what Handling means in regards to each auto. My Trailblazer SS AWD handles much better than the Taurus, Fusion and Focus. My skill as an experienced racer puts me even higher than most people driving my TB. All auto's are subjective to the type of auto it is and the driver and so many other things.

So it is hard to say an Apple is better than an Orange. This is a moving goal post trying to compare CUV's to Cars and depending on the experience of the driver.

It's not a moving goal post at all.  I chose those specific vehicles because I knew they were on the same platform.  You know, an apples to apples comparison.  Check the tests and you'll see the sedan performs better each time.  As far as a Trailblazer SS goes, I'd pick a Taurus SHO to win the race every time.  Assuming equal drivers of course.   

Does the Explorer handle better than the Taurus? No.

Does the Edge handle better than the Fusion? No.

Does the Escape handle better than the Focus? No.

I can go on...

Good to see the S90 is doing much better.  

Looks like the Continental is going to settle in the 900-1000 units per month range.  I was hoping it would do 15000-18000 per year, but that was before the shift to CUVS really began to set in.  At least it's outselling the CT6 and XTS.  I read that Transit sales are so low because of a hold due to a recall.  Bronco and Ranger can't get here soon enough. 

Lack of space is just another lame excuse in the same way people buy trucks because they might need the bed once a year.  In my old Taurus, we had no problem getting all of our luggage in the 16 cubic foot trunk.  Granted, it was just three of us, but if there was another kid in the back seat there would still be enough space.  In our current Taurus, the trunk is a cavern, but I recognize most trunks aren't that big.  Bottom line, if you have two kids or less, there's no reason to not buy a sedan.

Good point about the union contact, although I thought the XTS was originally supposed to be killed off by now.  Maybe that was just a rumor.  

50 minutes ago, cp-the-nerd said:

It kills me how poorly the CTS has done since its release. Especially now when the model is so dialed in with the new V6 and 8-speed transmissions across the board. I hope Cadillac can find the right balance of price and features with future sedans because the A6 and 5 series shouldn't be outselling an American car this good on its own turf for the same or higher price.

They really need to drop the XTS.  I find it hard to believe that XTS buyers wouldn't move to the CTS or CT6.  Now they're giving it a (ugly) refresh in a down sedan market.  Makes no sense unless a good majority of those sales are fleet.

Last weekend my brother got married in Destin.  Since we were only staying a few days, we decided it was worth it to rent a car for the trip from Cincinnati to Destin.  I was hoping for a Malibu or Fusion and we received a Malibu that had about 1900 miles on it.  The 1.5L was a solid engine.  I've read where some people complain about turbo lag, but it seemed fine to me.  The sound system was pretty good, although it had a weird issue with my iPod where it would randomly skip a few seconds ahead in the song.  The usb location could have been better.  It's out in the open, so you have to remove whatever device is sitting there if you don't want to worry about someone breaking in.  Not a huge deal, but it would have been nice if there was some kind of cover. 

The ride was really smooth.  I'd say it was about a half step below our Taurus.  Wind noise was minimal as well.  On the way down we averaged 33mpg, which I guess is on target considering we were doing about 80-85mph most of the time.  Driving around in Destin brought the average down a bit and when we got home it was at 31.3mpg.  I think the EPA rating is 37mpg highway

I can see why people want GM to give the option to turn off the start stop feature.  Too many times it almost felt like the car was stalling instead of starting up.  If there was any kind of incline it had issues as well.  This was my first experience with it, so I'm not sure if it's an issue with all cars, but it definitely felt as though there were some kinks to be worked out.  It's also possible that over time I would adjust how I let off of the brake pedal to make it feel more seamless. 

Overall, I really enjoyed the car and would consider it for my next car if I liked the front end.  Maybe they will fix it in the next refresh, but the Impala will probably always have my attention before the Malibu anyway.    

1 hour ago, ccap41 said:

I hate everything about what you just said.

Drop the ATS and CTS?!?! Keep the XTS(nothing actually wrong with it, I just don't think it fits where Cadillac is going). Continental has the same presence as a Camry?!?!? You're Drunk.

 

And as far as not being wide enough, it's four inches wider than the CT6 and 5 inches wider than the XTS.

22 minutes ago, Cmicasa the Great said:

Envision started selling on the last few days of may amidst controversy due to its manufacturing origin and the political atmosphere spawned by an egomaniac that makes even me seem humble . To top it all off  when it went on sale it was only in top form, meaning the most expensive trim. 

The MKZ should outsell the Regal.. an excellent car that I'd take in a heart beat over the Fusion clone, especially in GS form.. they advertise the hell out of it. 

As to the Continental vs the XTS.. The XTS is an excellent cruiser, plenty of power, quiet as a mouse, looks upscale and feels upscale. Did I mention that despite some enthusiasts' ideas about its FWD proportions.. I think its gorgeous. The Continental??? Couldn't get me up if it had a life size nude picture of Margot Robbie down on all fours taped to its rear.

None of that refutes what I said. 

16 minutes ago, Cmicasa the Great said:

Well why not? Buick is a marketing channel. It is in and of itself a near-lux brand, same as Lincoln, but with a an additional channel over at GMC. Specifically I speak of the Denali brand.. interesting enough one could easily but the Yukon Denali up against the Navigator and see my point. The Denali is more luxo than the Navigator. 

Seriously bro. U wanna really examine Buick without including its truck/suv brand in a sales argument? It makes no sense.

So now you want to bring in another entire brand to prove your point?  Keep grasping.

4 minutes ago, Drew Dowdell said:

Buick sells more Regals globally (not even counting Insignia which adds another ~75k to the total) than Lincoln sells vehicles. 

And generally, Buick sells more vehicles globally in one month than Lincoln does in an entire year. Yes there is a price difference on those global cars... But even in just the US, Enclave sales alone (which is inside of Lincoln's price range) are 50% of the Lincoln brand total for the year.

Even if you take out Encore and Verano, count only Regal, LaCrosse, Cascada, Envision, and Enclave.... Buick is ahead by about 10,000 units.

Ok, but that has nothing to do with US sales where both are established players.  As for the last half of your post, I already detailed that in a post above.

16 minutes ago, Cmicasa the Great said:

Your boy brought up Buick sales so I took a swing and came up with a Grand Slam...

Why would anyone have to pull out a companies sales to help your argument? Last I checked the Envision was just hitting the market and still wasn't up to full stride with product mix. I effin HOPE to God that the MKX, now going on two decades old, could outsell the limping into existence Envision. 

Regal vs MKZ? Are we even serious? The same MKZ that Lincoln markets the hell out of and pretty much got a redo just last year versus the Regal that gets no marketing and has been around for 6 years? Ironically the Regal/Insignia's sales globally should still be far and away better than the MKZ's 

As to the Lacrosse vs Continental.. Perhaps the fact of the matter is that Buick is perfectly sitting in the spot it needs to be right now.. not misconceived into trying to be something it isn't.. like Lincoln. I wouldn't touch a Lincoln with your money let alone mine. I would instantly feel like I had just been robbed, bent over, and raped.

The Envision has been out since May.  Even if the product mix was the issue, the sales gap is too large to surpass the MKX.  The MKZ has outsold the Regal every year except 2011.  If you feel that way about the Continental, you'd have to feel that way about the XTS as well. 

19 minutes ago, surreal1272 said:

Given that Lincoln sells an equal size SUV (can't be helped that Lincoln can't sell near as many even though they're cheaper than the Escalade), it makes the statement even sillier. 

It's not silly considering the Navigator has had one minor update since 2006.  I don't expect the new Navigator to outsell the Escalade, but I bet sales will be much closer. 

31 minutes ago, Cmicasa the Great said:

Ooops. I already did. I guess the Enclave and LaX sell for $22K??? The Regal?? The Envision??? Even the Encore I bought for my ex sold for over $30K before haggling . U my boy are reaching for 

Take out Verano and Envision sales, both of which top out around where the cheapest Lincoln starts, and you will see that Buick has sold less than 10k more units so far this year than Lincoln.  MKZ outsells the Regal even though the Regal starts for about $8k less.  The MKX handily outsells the Envision even though the MKX starts for about $4k more.  The Lacrosse outsells the Continental, but a fully loaded Lacrosse is only about $6k more than the cheapest Continental.

GM fans have a number of valid arguments against Lincoln, but using Buick sales to put down Lincoln is grasping at straws at best. 

23 minutes ago, Cmicasa the Great said:

Anyone else find it ironic as hell.. that while Cadillac's SUV/CUV content does make up about 52% of Cadillac sales.. Lincoln's SUV/CUV mix makes up 64%? Almost every time Wings opens his mouth.. he screams hypocrisy. 

I promised myself I was only gonna half ass my posts when responding to some but threads like this make me wanna come fully back on 

He said large SUVs, not SUVs/CUVs in general.  Huge difference.  You're right though about Cadillac offering more high end/performance trims than Lincoln. 

Good luck with everything!  It's always good to get away for a while from the intense debates that occur on forums. 

^It also seems like more automakers are doing standalone events.

2 hours ago, Suaviloquent said:

Alright, some administration of discipline aside, TaurusSHO is a person of class, please stop muddying this thread. Civil discourse, or get your comments made gone.

Thanks for the kind words.   Casa doesn't bother me though.  He's like that crazy uncle that's fun to be around just because of how crazy he is. 

3 hours ago, Suaviloquent said:

 

You talk smack, but you know to hold your tongue, because damn right there's things I can do here that you can't.  Direct competitor. People will look at Conti, and say it is a direct competitor to BOTH the CT6 and XTS.

 

No one here saying that the XTS is irrelvant. What is nonsense is saying the CT6 and Conti don't compete. They damn well do, because netither the XTS or CT6 can deliver the damn luxury part of the equation. The Conti, blows them out of the water. Hands down, every day, people will get in the Conti and say the interior is better in materials. Style is one thing, but the materials, abosultely in favour of the Conti. Plebian platform?

Why make 3 different car platforms, when you can take 1, and deliver exactly what the customer wants, desires, has unfulfilled NEED for, and save big money, and reap better profits.

You do realize that the Omega platform will give GM a big hangover, and it needs more cars on it for the scale.

That's what I've been saying.  People ultimately shop on price and the CT6 has a huge overlap in price with the Continental.  We can talk about all of the engineering that went into the CT6 and talk about how well it handles, but when the average customer can get a better equipped Continental with a much smoother ride, you can see where the CT6 falters.  The XTS certainly competes with the Continental, but to say the CT6 doesn't is entirely inaccurate. 

56 minutes ago, Cmicasa the Great said:

 

Why? And Why do some auto enthusiasts automatically assume this stuff? Yeah.. I'm a normal car shopper walking into the Caddy dealer.. "Oh.. so U don't have the XTS anymore???  Well FINE!!!. I guess I'm gonna mozy on over that Buick dealership and get a Lacrosse.. since they are on the same platform (well used to be) ." 

BS!!! I literally have had several XTS owners stare me in the face and call me a liar when I told them that not only was my Impala the same car underneath as theirs.. but that LaX across the street was too.. And the old Malibu and Regal weren't far away from that relation either.

This can be duplicated with an Impala or LaX owner as well. Point is that the market now dictates that while GM have a stepping stone hierarchy, they more so need to market each brand as an individual unit not connected to the other.. even Chevy vs GMC. Because lets face it... many people just don't make the connection.. and not to mention that there are some who absolutely have allegiance to one brand with the GM hierarchy over the other.. especially pertaining to Chevy/Buick/GMC. Cadillac very often gets a pass on that logic as it was always the top dog.. where as the Chevy Brand for all intents competed directly with Pontiac/Oakland.. Buick/Marquette with Olds/Viking (and Saturn) and GMC with Hummer. Either way GM would be a fool to not have at least one "CAR" in its Caddy line-up that is not an upgraded Chevy. The E2XX platform should be in every division without question. Quite frankly I think for every  Alpha and Omega thru out Cadillac there can be an E2xx and C1XX opposing it. 

Of course not everyone will think that way, but some people would definitely move to the Lacrosse since it serves the same purpose as the XTS.  Ultimately, I believe the XTS was kept around for a few more years because the CTS is not selling like they had hoped. 

16 minutes ago, Drew Dowdell said:

My thought is far more cynical. I think they kept it going because they need something high dollar to share with Impala in order to justify Impala's existence.

I wonder if the XTS will get the 8 speed or 9 speed and if that will address my complaint of the lack of torque in the non-turbo model.

Isn't the Lacrosse's extra volume enough to justify the Impala?  With the XTS gone I'm sure the Lacrosse would have a noticeable sales gain as well, which I thought was the original plan.

3 hours ago, dfelt said:

If you have friends and Family over 5'10" you will want the 300 over the Conti. The 300 can fit comfy even Shrek size me at 6'6", The Conti is a fail for big people. Nice auto, decent, but not a big persons car. In fact I would say the saving grace is that the 300 is still the last remaining full size that has room for us big guys.

I guess it all depends on how you sit.  I am 6'1" and have no issue sitting in the back of our 2013 Taurus.  On a couple of road trips with my 6'3" uncle in front of me, it didn't feel cramped at all.  I imagine the Continental would seem like sitting in the back of a Town Car in comparison.