zete

The Provoq is very nice looking don't get me wrong. It's just the first impression was 'it's on the Vue platform all the way', but I think they did a very nice job inside and out with the detailing.

We know it's on a premium (emphasis on premium) Theta platform, but most people don't know that and won't care. They'll care about the execution of the product. Looking at the Vue vs. the Provoq and you see no comparisons. When placed beside the competition, the Cadillac looks much more expensive and upscale. Ironically, the Saturn looks in the BMW's league in terms of look. The Cadillac looks like it's in a totally different and much more expensive marketplace.

I do think that all too often car nuts -- like us -- look at things with the skewed view of what underpins something. However, taken in context -- which is why I provided the pictures -- shows that this car looks like a Cadillac and has little resemblance to its non-premium brethren. I'd argue it has no similarities and that most people are fixated on the Premium Theta (emphasis on Theta this time) platform and that side vent. Had the vent been where the CTS vent is then I think many folks would not have claimed they're the same. From side-by-side shots they're not even close to similar. Everything is different.

In the end, that size and type of vehicle has a limit to the way you can put it together. Cadillac did a fine job. The Lexus and BMW look nearly identical. If someone thought something was platform shared, they'd assume the BMW and RX were and not the Saturn and Cadillac.

I think we just want to see the Vue in it. Side by side it doesn't look like the Vue.

And, when you put it beside it's obvious competitor -- the BMW X3 -- you see how well proportioned the Provoq actually is. It is, after all, 10" longer than the Vue offering a much better balance. The Provoq simply looks way more expensive than either the Vue or the X3.

Quebec's not invited?

That's kinda funny.

Quebec falls under Civil Law, as opposed to Common Law that's the norm for the rest of North America. Hence, it would require a special set of rules and registration to fall under Quebec and allow Quebecers to actually participate.

It happens here in Canada all the time when you see "Offer not valid in Quebec". And yes, it is rather funny and yet fully understandable.

Rowing my car no longer appeals to me. I'd prefer a semi-automatic. Of course, by offering a choice GM gets to keep both factions happy, not just those willing to row their car home through traffic on a daily basis.

Lutz said 2008, not 2009 (the main page shows 2009). That's "next spring". Also, he indicated the batteries will be delivered in October of this year, hence the testing in spring 2008.

In the end there are only so many ways to put a rear end on something that large. Really, they all look similar in the back. Look at the Outlook and the CX-7/9. It's the overall effect that makes a car look right and the Enclave just looks right overall.

As a current CTS owner I love this. It just made my next car purchase that much harder. Good on GM for that.

I wish companies would split out fleet into at least two bins: corporate fleet and rental fleet. At my firm we can buy cars from GM as part of their fleet purchase. This is really a special kind of personal purchase. A rental fleet purchase, on the other hand, is totally different.

So, if Kia is pushing ~50% of their cars into rental fleets that's bad. If GM's fleet is 50/50 corporate and rental, then the numbers aren't as bad as some folks think (i.e., 12.5% rental and 12.5% corporate).

As for why we're seeing Toyotas at rental agencies, they're just filling a void. GM is getting out and the rental companies need cars. I'm sure they're looking around to find who can give them the best price for a specific size of car. Ironically, Toyota can leverage fleet sales to surpass GM in sales in 2007 and no one would bat an eye in the press, though they'd kill GM if they tried to keep #1 in a similar way.

Either way, too many rental sales can be deadly to resale. GM seems to have learned their lesson, which is why they sell fewer cars to rental fleets and also ensure they're not stripper models anymore, which made the cars look worse than they should have.

I like it and it's rare I like anything from Toyota style-wise. It's different and stands out. It polarizes folks -- which in my book is good; the CTS also polarizes people, for example. And at that price point it will sell on looks -- for those that like it -- and not only on Toyota's name.

I say, bring it on and don't water it down.

One thing I just noticed: That Cadillac badge is HUGE! Too big, perhaps.

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Nah. It's perfect. Proud and large.

I notice the lights are even more angular than before. Cool.

I like all the extra chrome bits. Nice.

Maybe GM should do less testing in the searing hot deserts of Arizona, and more testing in their own frozen backyard of Midwest winters.    They shouldn't have missed this.

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It may only have cropped up after freezing rain or some other weirdness. Or, it might be the production part that's causing the problem and the preproduction parts were OK. It might just be that the production part is just that much different as to result in a problem. It happens.

I can live with that list, though I'd rather have a Sky Redline than an MX5, hard top or no. It'd be way more fun to drive than the MX5 -- and it's way better looking than the Mazda.

I don't like VWs, but it's a quality thing with me. Too many bad family experiences with VW to ever want to look at another. I'd have put the Mazda 3 hatch on the list.

what V8? NS or OHV?

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It's supposed to be the v8 dubbed "Ultra v8" which is a smaller sized one that will fit into the engine compartment of the Enclave.

I hope they call it the Enclave Ultra and fit it up like the concept. I'd pay for that.

The more I look at the Enclave the more I want it. My lease on my current wheels is up next Fall, so this will be my next vehicle. It just makes every other comparable vehicle look pathetic style-wise.

And I agree, it seems folks in the media are grasping at straws re: GM and Buick, in particular. This car is simply gorgeous. Who else could have designed such a vehicle? It simply harkens back to Buicks from the 50s and early 60s, especially the Skylark. I find the fender curves and body look very reminiscent of those cars -- more so when I saw one go by me the other day.

Before anyone says I'm a geezer, I'm mid-40s and never thought I'd buy a Buick but I'll be buying this one.

That poor beautiful car! Why must the world's roads be polluted with morons?!

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Because 50% of people have below average intelligence. A fact that simply is.

That arched roofline is worthless in a minivan. Cuts down on the cargo space terribly. I an very disappointed if these reports are true. . .

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Not if the arch provides more headroom for the passengers but still having the same amount of cargo space behind the rear seats as any present minivan. Theatre-style seating would require an arch to provide better headroom.

If the CR report is supposed to be on reliability what has a place to put your cell phone or your drink have to do with reliability?

When stretched like that it looks excellent, with a bit of Sixteen in the profile. The interior is fantastic -- and it best be what the STS looks like next year. In fact, it better be stretched like that otherwise the difference between STS and 2008 CTS will be non-existant in terms of size.

I like the full console, in fact it should always be an option on Buicks and Cadillacs. It looks expensive. I'd take the Buick Enclave with a full console and six seats! And like another poster said, the SLS is perfect as the bump up from the CTS. Let's hope this is the 2008 STS as a refresh.

Todays paper lists the Consumer Reports most and least reliable cars. The Solstice is the worst in the Sports Car category......Bad for GM again

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What you really need is actual numbers and not just a "best" and "least". Let's say the best has 115 flaws per 100 cars while the worst has 116. It makes little sense. Now, if the best had 115 and the worst had 200 or more, then that's a disparity worth noting.

As always, I need to see real figures and not just a textual comparitive.

That Echo? Another example of more money than brains.

BMW used GM trannies. So if they're so bad why would the poster child for the import crowd use a GM transmission? Go ask your classmate that one.

GM should take pictures in places like Arizona or Montona, with blue sky in the background in a natural setting. The colours of desert or Rockies would nicely offset any car. Plus, with the car front and centre and everything else "in the distance" it would look better.

i think its about 3k too high to start.

oh well, that's what dealer discounts are for.

07 Pilot starts at 27,5 roughly.

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I think we'll have to see what you get for that $30k. Then we can compare apples to apples. Perhaps once you up option the Honda it might push north of the base Acadia price. I know the wheels aren't comparable on the two, plus the Honda is smaller. Honda has less horsepower and one speed less on its tranny. Plus, GM has the longer warranty now, too. I wish they'd put 4 years across the board and 5 on Buicks and Caddies, though.

I just thought they were funny as "public service announcement" type ads. It puts a spin where Johnny each time does the "right thing". I think it may be lost on the younger generation. Go watch "Reefer Madness" to appreciate these types of ads, or "Duck and Cover" ;-).

I'd love them to do this: Ferrari Super America. The flip top is just so cool and leaves the trunk space alone. Of course, the two humps on the back of the Solstice would go away, but you'd have the permanent flying buttresses to take up the slack as to visual cue. Not sure if Ferrari has a patent on that type of top, but it is cool.

And, yeah, I know that Clarkson on Top Gear said that it would collect water and dump it on the passengers, but I doubt it's that much of a problem.