CARBIZ

I am amazed that we have come this far, this soon. I remember when I was in highschool and Anita Bryant came up to (London, Ontario, I think) to make a speech and gay groups were going down by the busload to protest her. She was telling people how sick we were and we should be fired from jobs, etc.

WE'VE COME A LONG WAY, BABY.

At 15, I could never have dreamed of LEGALLY being able to marry my partner. I do agree: it is inevitable. If you listen to highschool kids of today, their outlooks and opinions are vastly different than my generations. (God, I feel old!) Once the old coots in Congress are all dead, things will change quicker.

In "enlightened" Canada, the last battle ground is whether the Churches should be protected from being forced to perform same-sex marriages or not. Already there has been a few cases where civil servants, paid for by our tax dollars, have been allowed to decline to marry a gay/lesbian couple.

Being an atheist, I could care less, but I do believe gay organizations are being less than honest when they sidestep this issue. Of course some militant couple will take this issue to the Supreme Court, too - eventually.

I am thrilled at how far we have come, but then IMO marriage is a failed institution anyway.

To quote Andrew McCarthy from the movie St. Elmo's Fire: "The concept of two people spending their lives together is a myth created in a time when you were lucky to live past the age of 30 for being eaten by a dinosaur!" (I hope that is right: it has been about 5 years since I've seen that amazing movie.)

Now are we talking REAL, SAE horsepower numbers, or Toyota's horsepower numbers? You know, the ones that have a padded 20 or 30 horsepower?

We've debated this Ridgeline/Avalanche (Silverado) thing before and they are two completely different vehicles. For my taste, the Ridgeline tries too hard. The buttons and gadgets are too big, too "post industrial." For some of the same reasons I don't like the Ram either. The Silverado may not WOW you, but it is tasteful, understated and, I dare say, will age better than the interior of the Ridgeline (in terms of how well shag carpeting aged 30 years ago.)

With the direction that both Ford and Dodge have gone with their full-sized trucks (big for the sake of being big), I think GM is smart to take on a different path. Real truck buyers are a little more conservative in their views, I think.

I doubt very many people who would even bother to test drive a Ridgeline would have considered a Silverado in the first place.

The Ridgeline.................? (I just spewed coffee all over myself, laughing)

A real world test drive of the Aveo against any of your other favorite contenders will usually do the trick. As with most vehicles, it is the entire over all package that will sell it.

I, too, would prefer more horsepower and better gas mileage, but then I also want a date with Josh Hartnett - that ain't happening either. I think the real world mileage numbers are better with the 5 spd. The Aisin tranny (not GM's) in the Aveo is the culprit, I suspect.

Honda wants serious coin for the Fit and their rates aren't pretty either. The Yaris is only slightly less ugly than the Echo. Toyota has had years to fix that nightmare and they still only finally caught up to last year's Aveo.

If you have GM Visa points (do they have those in the U.S.?), a recent Grad, or any other number of programs you can use to sweeten the deal, the Aveo is a nice little car.

And, yeah, I'd love the Corsa to arrive either. Unfortunately, I might then be out of a job! LOL

It's called keeping it in the news. I am sure it gives the sales guys something to talk about in the show room. GM's 5/160k warranty (in Canada) has met with a big yawn. I've had one customer say they would wait for a 2007 because of the warranty. It's a good PR point, but I doubt it sways many people.

There are a lot of reasons why the Ford still "outsells" the Chevy (which, as we know isn't entirely true!), but the biggest reason is that the average consumer doesn't have the time and the average salesperson doesn't have the knowledge to properly research/demonstrate the advantages of the Chevy over the Ford.

The locking differential video is a big one - if the dealer bothers to put the video and a screen handy for the salespeople to use. The 50 piece (okay, I am exaggerating) cargo bed on the Ford, versus a single, stamped unit on the Chevy is another biggie - easy to show.

Ford spends the money on the touchy feely plastics and the interior look of the vehicle. GM spends it on the things you can't see: bussed electrics, hydro-forming of frame parts long before anyone else, etc.

I've always said that the easiest way to sell a Silverado is to put a F-150 or Ram beside it. A side by side, feature for feature comparison is a killer. The Chevy wallops both of them, but at the end of the day a $349 lease payment on the Dodge probably wins out.

I have a problem with dealing with a company that has no bricks or mortar. I bought an MDG computer (Canadian made) 4 years ago and am very happy with it. (The upgrades that I did last year are a separate issue.)

Dell wouldn't even answer the phone when I went to make my purchase 4 years ago - even after I told some hapless women who finally did answer phone that I had $2,000 to spend and I would be spending it by 4:00 that day - nobody called me back! I mean: how good would their service be if they can't even get back to me to BUY the damned thing in the first place?

So, I bought local. They answer the phone. The computer was loaded, formated and ready the next day. And they were cheaper than Dell.

Virtual banks, virtual stores sound great in theory, but at the end of the day it is faster to take it back or pick it up YOURSELF.

G80 G80 G80 G80 G80 Better build quality (check out how many pieces the bed section is made from in the Dodge, then compare the Chevy.) G80 I am 6'2" and I can't touch the bed floor over the side rails of the Dodge, yet the Chevy has higher road clearance. G80 Did I mention G80?

I don't think a quarter million units is anything to sneeze at. Sure, it would have been nice to hold on to 50% market share, like Cadillac once enjoyed, but even then Cadillac sold - get ready for this, a QUARTER MILLION UNITS.

The market has matured. People's tastes have changed. Anyone under 35 is not going to understand the allure of the '67 Eldorado. You had to be there to understand. Today, there is a dizzying array of AWD, FWD, RWD - who would have thought of putting leather seats and a sun roof in a glorified pick up truck 40 years ago????

Now, everyone wants to pay stupid money for stupid vehicles. I park my car near a ravine in Rosedale (the toniest old neighborhood in Canada) a lot to walk my dog, and the other day every vehicle within sight was either an X3, X5 or BMW 5 series - oh, and once Lexus convertible!

They were all blue-black, too. That is just silly.

I think you would all have to agree that from where Cadillac was 5 years ago, it has come along way. As usual, however, so has everyone else.

Still, I think that if you compare the leaps GM has made recently with respect to vehicles like the Aura and the upcoming Enclave, it bodes well for future Cadillacs. It does make me wonder a little bit about development money being spread too thin (think Equinox/Torrent!), but if MB keeps building crap, the sheeple will come around. Eventually.

It is all a cycle. Everyone's gotta have a MB or Bimmer. That, too, will change.

Whoa, I go away for the weekend and a fight breaks out!

I will buy North American whenever I can. I just spent a fortune and bought a 42" Hitachi plasm TV - because I don't have a choice. Japan Inc. already railroaded the American consumer electronics industry out of business 30 years ago.

My dad's Zenith Chromacolor II 26" TV was purchased in 1969 and I inherited it when he passed away in 1986. I didn't use it for very long - the plastic protective shield had yellowed with age and you could have cooked an egg on the wood cabinet - but it still worked! More anecdotal evidence, though.

Why would we want to dig up dirt on American companies that were involved in dealings with Nazi Germany when there is more fertile ground with current Japanese companies and their involvement....?

Nissan would be great fodder, considering they were set up by the military bank in Japan to build tanks and trucks in Manchuria, using slave labor.

I don't suppose you'd find that on the company website, though, would ya?

Money does not buy you happiness, but it does allow you to choose your misery.

HOw about a complete make over for that fool in N. Korea?

This is going to be very interesting to watch unfold. So Rick and Bob had an idea what Kirk was really up to and spent the 90 days shoring up defenses. Good for them. I am sure Kirk isn't a stupid man, but he has got to figure that Lutz is onto him; after all, didn't Chrysler (Lutz) already go down this road once before?

I'd like to voice what I really think of this decayed old dinosaur, but Fly doesn't want us to use any unseemly adjectives on this board.

The biggest challenge the West faces in Asia is curbing the rampant plaigarism and intellectual property theft over there. They have zero respect for the rule of law. I just don't understand why GM, VW and others are falling over each other to open up shop in China when we have no substantial evidence that they aren't just going to turn around and dump our technology on us for a 1/3 of the price.

It is going to take a lot more tha crushing a few Cds in showy photo ops to stem the contempt that "entrepreneurs" show for patents, trademarks, etc. over there.

Hmmmm...should I go to Antarctica or the Bahamas for my next vacation??

Of course the 300ZX is a "nicer" car, but with the amount you will spend on repairs (just shop around for parts on that car!), you could have leased a new Stratus! Not to mention that a decent 300ZX will go for double what the (far more) common Chryslers will.

The Chryslers will be cheaper to fix, but I suspect you will need to fix them a lot.

The decision is strictly budget (Stratus/Intrepid) or dreaming (300ZX).

I haven't bought a Cd in a long time. I have XM, which has more Cds on file than I could ever afford to buy. Plus, if there is something I really like, I can record it on my XM box and then download to my computer.

$20 for a Cd is outrageous. I am not going to subsidize Madonna's trips to Africa to buy up babies.

I'm with Camino on this one: price whores get treated just like that - whores. An experienced salesperson can still run circles around any average/above average customer. You are far better off to enter a relationship with a dealership that has treated you well. Seriously, is saving a couple hundred dollars worth the hassle of going to 4 or 5 dealerships?

If the salesperson is running to the manager, then probably they are new.

I never go to the manager. If the offer is stupid, I say so. Sure, I could play games and go into the office and sit down, but my time is valuable, too. If someone is being very unrealistic about the deal/trade in, or has a chip on their shoulder, I COULD spend a lot of time with them, only to have them go up the street anyway, or I could just give them an equally BS number back and throw them out.

Oh, and if I was shown $6,500 for my trade and then through negotiating that number became $8,000, I would walk out. You may not like their initial number, but if they suddenly bump it by a couple grand, they were just playing games. An experienced salesperson MUST leave room in the numbers they present to allow for the customer who thinks they are important by haggling, but I would never insult someone with a number I could alter by thousands more.

I hate to sound negative, but most times nice guys finish last. Being straight, direct and honest is often a sure ticket to lose the deal. Nobody wants to hear that their sled is worth nothing, that the advertised car is sold out (nobody wanted them anyway!) and EVERY dealer has hidden charges. And what is to be gained when you spend 2 hours with a client, test drive 4 cars, work leasing/financing payments on all of them, give them a print out and they go up the street and buy the car for $3/month less because the guy spends 10 minutes with them?

You will get out of the relationship what you put into it.

My parents gave my youngest sister the middle name "Gay," but that was 1967. The best advice I ever gave her was to NOT tell any of her friends her middle name when she entered high school!

Seriously, days of empowerment are more about creating dialogue in the public at large, which by the way this thread has taken on a life is exactly what it is supposed to do.

And there is nothing funny about the history of the name Fag, which comes from the English "bundle of sticks," which is what they used to burn homosexuals with a few hundred years ago. Being as there are places in the world that still stone us, everyone - straight and gay, needs to bo cognizant of the fact that all our rights are tenuous and can be taken away at any moment.

That being said, I call many of my friends "fags," but that is more about taking back a negative word, much like black people are trying to take back the N word.

Yes, of course. The Malibu/G6 is a better example of that. At least it isn't embarassing, like when a customer wonders aloud what the difference is between the Uplander/SV6!

There were good examples in years gone by: the Skylark/Cutlass of the late '60s. Or the Eldorado/Toronado. This is what GM needs to return to.

This is bang on! The days of cookie cutter platforms are over. Equinox/Torrent, Cobalt/Pursuit debacles MUST end.

How is this proxy fight going to benefit GM and its turnaround plans? Didn't Kirk lose his fight to Chrysler once already?

Is this guy worried, that on his deathbed he will have built nothing, accomplished nothing but only made money? At least the moguls of the 19th century BUILT things - Standard Oil, railways, etc.

Does Tracinda BUILD anything? Or just tear down for "shareholder value."

Toyota must be laughing its ass off.

This is a disaster for Toyota, plain and simple. The Civic is its biggest competitor and the Civic is doing very well. The Mazda 3 has maintained its sales, even though it is a couple years old. The Cobalt is making good headway. To be seen as NOT having a leading edge vehicle in this market surely will be seen as another chink in the armour.

And all this doesn't bode well for their car market, in view of the flat Camry sales and the problems with the Avalon.

I am not gloating (no, not really!) but am glad to see that reality has hit Toyota. Perhaps being a formidable number 2 is better than a weak number one?

The rest of what DesRosiers went on to say is there will no longer be a Big Three in Canada, but rather a Big One, with the Other Four (Ford, Chrysler, Toyota and Honda) napping at its heals.

As GM sinks to 26% market share this year in Canada, I think it has pretty much hit bottom - maybe dip to 24%, then stabalize.

Toyota will probably max out around 15%, with Ford, Chrysler, and Honda all settling in just below it. Mazda, Nissan, VW and other will all fight amongst themselves for the remaining 15-20% of the pie.

And Canada's market DOES matter to GM. GM cannot afford to lose 450k sales a year.