Scout

I just saw a report earlier today saying two thirds of the model S cars need the drive trains replaced by 60k miles. That's not inspiring.

I agree with you (as I often do because your logic is usually sound) that a car is not an iphone. But I also tend to think that in a free market consumers should have the right to make that choice. Not washington, lobbyis, big money. and if I were to read through everything in this thread I believe that most share that sentiment, even you. after 5 pages of this I think what it comes down to is,

Should Tesla be allowed to sell cars without a dealer franchise?.?.?.?.

My answer is yes. If the big guns in the industry don't like it that's too bad. They can either evolve or go extinct. Such as the way of a free market. like I said earlier, just because it has been so for a long time does not mean that it is right.

you are right in two ways. 1 my dislike for the UAW, and 2 my dislike for unions. I have seen too many piketers shutdown Ma and Pa, hole in the wall stores for no other reason then they simply were not Union. That's why I say here that Tesla seems to be the little guy. However I believe the Union discussion may be a different debate for another thread.

Too many to list. However, at the top would be a salesman, who was unfamiliar with the product he was pushing, asking me if I was trying to take advantage of him. I think that just about says it all.

Last year, the State of Michigan signed a bill that banned an automaker from doing direct sales. This meant an automaker like Tesla couldn't sell any of their vehicles in the state. The move was widely applauded by the likes of GM and the Michigan Automobile Dealers Association. Tesla wasn't impressed by this and since then has been working on trying to change this.

So the UAW and traditional dealers are still scared.

I fail to see how the UAW has anything to do with this.

Fair enough. However the UAW has gone after Tesla for not being Union. And because they are no better than the mob, you are either with them or against them. Perhaps it's a stretch throwing the UAW in there at this point, because I really haven't looked to see if what I said was factual. However, given the UAW history, I would bet that they are fighting Tesla simply because Tesla is not Union. I could be wrong. for full disclosure I'm tired of seeing unions trample the little guy simply for not paying their union dues. And as for this topic Tesla would seem to be the little guy.

IMO.

exactly. I was going to make a free-market argument also. I agree completely I'm just surprised you're the one who posted it given your previous posts. as for how I knew that, I used the most off the wall thing I can think of / find to illustrate how just because it is the law does not mean it is right.

in Arizona it is against the law to own more than two dildos. However Arizona does not enforce that law because it is a bit absurd. I'm not sure who would need more than one dildo however if you would like more than one then it's okay because the law apparently makes no sense and is no longer enforced. there are hundreds more examples of bizarre laws like that one. Point is antiquated laws need to be taken off the books or no longer enforced. Or as some would claim, they need to be changed,through some sort of due process. However it is hard to change a law when lobbyists and money own Washington. This seems to be the case for this entire thread. it's a good thing 150 years ago Washington was not already bought and paid for by money and business. If it were we would all still be walking because it would be illegal to have an idea and try and sell it.

The bottom line is that it's about money.  The dealer laws were established in the early 1900's and are antiquated.  The Tesla model is cheaper, and the NADA is screaming it's not fair.  Perhaps not, but just because something has been so for a long time does not make it rite.  NADA is near the top of all time political donations, and dealers account for about 15 percent of all retail sales in the US.  So Musk has an uphill battle against an established way of doing things.  Not because one way is better than the other.  But because one side is dug in and crying about whats fair.  

^^^ Ah.  There are only two places I post, not including here.  CF is one of them.  My absence has been because I just don't have the time I used to have.  CF has been getting a lot of testers and as always they do good reviews on them IMO.  It's forum traffic has just petered out.  There are a lot of for that, but the freedoms given to the members, and the modding are not a part of them.

 

 

A CF refugee. Greetings.

???

 

Scout, not sure what El Kabong is talking about but please tell us a little bit about yourself, type of auto's you like, hobbies, etc.

 

I wasn't sure what he was talking about either and that's why the ??.  I think some of his facts may be skewed. 

 

Anyhow, a lot of you already know me since I see a lot of familiar names here.  And a few personalities (El Kabong for example) with different names.  

 

For those that don't know me, I'll discuss most things, and I really don't take what goes on in these forums too seriously.  

Another random thought.  I just looked at the little jacket tie guy under my name.  then wondered why I am a Stock Member...

My random thought after skimming only the last page of this thread is 

 

 

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,,,,,

Last year, the State of Michigan signed a bill that banned an automaker from doing direct sales. This meant an automaker like Tesla couldn't sell any of their vehicles in the state. The move was widely applauded by the likes of GM and the Michigan Automobile Dealers Association. Tesla wasn't impressed by this and since then has been working on trying to change this.

 

So the UAW and traditional dealers are still scared.  

A CF refugee. Greetings.

???