thecarguy

Moraine, OH will close. It will just die a slow death, not any different than Linden, NJ did.

In this case it is.

RJB, Could you go into a little more detail?

First time truck buyers and Texans. One cannot underestimate the threat of locating the plant in Texas. What happened to Tundra sales after Toyota announced its investment in Texas? I will give you one guess.

Ghost Dog, GM isn't going off shore. Going to China isn't the solution, particularly when you have excess capacity in North America. Even with the announced closures, GM still has more than enough capacity to satisfy current levels of demand. Logistically and politically it just would not make sense for GM to build in China and ship vehicles half way around the world. We're not talking about shirts and shoes here. GM needs more automation and flexibility within their assembly facilities. Investments will continue to be made in North America by both GM and Ford, we've already seen this with Delta Twp., Pontiac Truck, Fort Wayne, IN, Chicago, IL, Belvedere, IL, Oakville, ON, etc. etc. Unfortunately, these companies will require far fewer workers in the future, both in the blue collar and white collar ranks. Fewer people are needed to produce one car today than were needed 40 years ago, this is just a function of productivity resulting from greater levels of automation and technological advancements.

Hudson, You have a good point, however I still believe that when GM comes out with the Lambda crossovers it will make it difficult to maintain any reasonable levels of capacity utilization in Moraine. This issue is still the subject of debate. Time will tell with the Lambda intros.

Was the Canton, MS plant dedicated just to the Titan and Armada? I mean did they build this plant just for the full-size trucks? If they did, why is it running at full capacity? Something doesn't add up? Wait.... the plant is a flex plant, capable of building the Altima too. Nissan needed the capacity and is still running full out, despited the Titan's somewhat lack luster performance. When I say somewhat lack luster, keep in mind that no one every expected the Titan to sell 1M units annually or even 500K annually. Nissan's forecast called for 120K and yes they are shor of it, but their North American plants are still running at full capacity. Canton was not dedicated to Titan alone. As for Toyota, the Big Three should be worried. While it might take the Japanese time to unlock the code to the US pickup market, Toyota is now closer than they ever have been before. The Tundra's are going to be produced in San Antonio, Texas. Do not underestimate the strategic significance of this move. 25% of all pickup trucks in the US are sold in Texas. I can tell you that Toyota does not seem so foreign to Texans anymore. The upcoming Tundra is not the Titan or the Ridgeline. I agreed on the Ridgeline and never believed that Honda would meet their forecast of 90K units annually. They haven't and they won't, at least not with the Ridgeline in its current form. GM and Ford will not survive by underestimating competitve threats. They did this in the luxury car segment and again in the SUV segment, just before the crossover craze swept the market.

I guess it gets back to whether or not you want to see GM survive. If you want to see them fail, we should make certain that they are not able to close any plants and not allow them to reduce their overhead cost structure. GM has lost marketshare and now needs to become smaller as a company, if they have any hope of surviving long-term. This is simple business 101 outside of the auto industry. Why should these simple rules somehow not apply to the American auto industry. I believe that the new Lambda crossovers are going to be very successful, but it will have a significant impact on the traditional Trailblazer/Envoy. It will be diffucult to justify the existence of these vehicles and Moraine, OH in the next 12 to 24 months.

I wouldn't bet on Moraine staying open. GM needs to close plants and reduce its overhead cost structure. I am affraid that GM's plant closure announcement in Late November was just the first pass. The cuts announced at that time were not deep enough. Mid-size body-on-frame SUVs will be killed with the introduction of Lambda crossovers. If someone needs a body-on-frame they will need to go to the Tahoe or Yukon.

Hudson, Product plans are often fluid, at least at GM. :AH-HA_wink:

My post was taken away with the demise of the Outlook thread. Anyway, I am hearing that GM is seriously considering the possible closer of Moraine, OH. This would be the end of the Trailblazer and Envoy as we know them. In fact, the next generation Trailblazer might in fact be a crossover after 2008. Something to think about. :AH-HA_wink:

Dam it GM!! They are cutting costs to make their short-term earnings look better for Wall Street. They are mortgaging their future... again.

I do think that Flint will give credit when credit is due and in the case of the new GMT900 SUVs credit should certainly be given. Over the last few years there has been a lot to bash at GM from a product perspective. The 900's hit the mark and I am thoroughly impressed with the fuel economy. Truely amazing! GM pulled rabbit out of their hat with this one. Great job! Furthermore, a lot of GM's new products coming up are some of the best vehicles that GM has ever introduced. I just wish they could hit the market sooner.

It has much more of a clean look, like the Ridgeline. <_<

Is it just me or does the new Avalanche look an awful lot like the Honda Ridgeline? <_<