The O.C.

You know.....the front AND rear ends of this car are really attractive......too bad they are part of the old W-body's exaggerated proporations (front-and-rear overhangs.)

...but the brakes....if working PROPERLY....will STILL overcome the inertia and slow the car to a standstill. Tests have shown this to be true. AARRRGGGHH Let's stop BEATING Toyota for this...! Geez! I'd have the same argument whether this were GM, Ford, Toyota, OR Audi.....

...but the brakes....if working PROPERLY....will STILL overcome the inertia and slow the car to a standstill. Tests have shown this to be true. AARRRGGGHH Let's stop BEATING Toyota for this...! Geez! I'd have the same argument whether this were GM, Ford, Toyota, OR Audi.....

Fine....then a much larger majority of the responsibility lies on a driver being able to properly control there car. There are many things (that might or might not be mfgr responsibility) that could cause a potential loss of control of your car. If you are driving and are licenses, I feel, IMHO, you better be able to properly control that car within reasonable abilities of the car and of yourself. If you can't...? You don't need to be driving.

I agree about the corporate radio and HVAC controls. Most of the imports have moved towards unique HVAC and radio controls in many, if not most, of the cars. Doing this allows them to tailor the switchgear to match the look of the interior.....look at the difference in Civic, Accord, TSX, TL. My lord, now a Cobalt shares the same "black tie" radio controls as the much-more (supposedly) upscale Lucerne! Sure doing it Honda's way is certainly more expensive.....but it's these small details that make a car seem "higher quality" and more "stylish" and "innovative" inside. As far as Malibu is concerned......I'm not so sure I even have a problem with the materials....if they are like the materials in the AURA, then they are pretty decent. It's the fit-and-finish, multitude of cutlines, and shoddy assembly that I have a problem with in the AURA. And if the Malibu shares these traits, (and pictures show that it will.....) it will most definitely suffer.

Grand Prix is running about 77% FLEET........where did they get their info?

F*uck that.....the competitiors can bring competitive entries in the marketplace weighing 400+ lbs LESS....and they DO have a sunroof......GM gets no breaks for the new CTS being so grossly overwieght....

Out of touch, Reg....HOPELESSLY out of touch...... "Crappy A3's?" GM can't build a product with the execution, fit-and-finish, and powertrain of Audi's "lowly" A3......

Uh....BOTH judgements are made from pictures. Therefore, apples-to-apples!

It's called "jealousy." Reg is just jealous that BMW is hitting on all cylinders now in a way that GM can only WISH they could. AND, like you stated, they build some of the best-driving, best-handling, best-feeling cars in the marketplace.

You guys just don't get it. It doesn't matter what kind of throttle it is.....if you are sitting still, the car is not going to accelerate away "unintended" as long as you are properly using the brakes. IF you are moving, you can slow the vehicle by applying the brakes. It will take longer ('cause the throttle is open) but it's entirely possible to keep the car under control.

NOT if the brakes are in proper working order.......("marginal" brakes don't cut it.) What happens if you take a Corvette with an automatic, sit in the parking lot, and floor the gas with your foot firmly on the brake? (providing the traction control is off) it sits there and smokes its tires on the pavement.....without moving forward. I even remember doing this in high-torque cars like a Roadmaster Sedan LT1.....with what would be suggested as brakes not as impressive as a Corvette's.....

Oh crap....Fly knows me, and I think he's got thicker skin than you're giving him credit for......we banter all the time. My point is......it doesn't matter how you spin it.....Camry has been the best-selling car for....how many years now? And how you can call a car that can accomplish that feat a "pile" is a baseless comment. AND....I haven't heard of too many "quality issues" on the Camry. I think that's GM kool-aid swishing around. The tranny had some issues at launch, but other than that.....what "quality issues" has the Camry had?

Get your head out of your a*s......how can you justify a statement like the Camry is a "substandard pile" when it's consistently the best-selling midsize sedan in the country....with minimal fleet sales I might add..... I'm no particular Camry-lover either......but you don't get to be the best without some substantial engineering, design, and performance......

"Too many confusing buttons" or not, it's all about EXECUTION my friend......something GM has never been too overly good at compared to the competition.

If nothing else, this new Accord's interior (base or upscale....either of them) just made the new Malibu about as irrelevant as the previous generation........ There's nothing I don't like about this new Honda......I think the exterior is sharp, can't pinpoint one single aspect that I don't like (like the Malibu's hideous rear-end) and the interior that looks like it's worth twice the price of the new Malibu.....(and dammit...in EX-L trim.....very nearly as nice as the new CTS' interior.) GM needs all the prayers they can get.........

It is a proven FACT that a vehicle cannot overpower it's own brakes (as long as nothing's defective with the brakes themselves.) I don't give "unintended acceleration" complaints ANY credit. If your floormat has bunched up in front of your gas pedal, it's your DAMN responsibility to make sure nothing in the car impedes with your ability to control it....including the floor mats.

I agree....probably the best turned-out SS model in Chevy's lineup! An attractive and fun little hatch. I like it alot. LOVE those sport seats too.......but why, oh why just a single exhaust outlet?

Where was I implying it's a "dog" or so you put it? I was making a point that the Lucerne is supposed to be considered a "premium" vehicle to compete with the likes of the Lexus ES350 when, in fact, it sorely lacks the (V6) powertrain to do so. Whereas, on the other hand, GM seems to have equipped the new Enclave perfectly to go after it's "premium" competition.....the RX350. Even the "competitors" you mentioned in your comment about Lucerne sales.....aren't even premium brands.....(Chrysler, Toyota).....yet even to you, they were the ones that came to mind when you wanted to compare Lucerne sales. Perhaps a better comparison would be the ES350 (36,997 retail) to Lucerne (34,012 retail.)

But the point is.....new GM cars are coming in much heavier than their competition....and the competition is offering the same features that "add weight."

Why does GM have to build a 4,100 lb CTS just to get it to "feel as solid" as a 3,500 lb BMW or Mercedes?

GM is still too confusing with it's option content. Why can't they follow BMW's lead? For example..... 328i or 335i (powertrain choice) Premium package Sport package Cold Weather package Premium Sound package That's IT...! Then, you've got a selection of individual options to choose from (Nav, Adaptive cruise, power sunshades, etc.) Why is the CTS order guide SO COMPLICATED?

Dude....why don't you check N/A sales numbers...... Through May '07 (latest figures I have) retail sales BMW 3-Series 58,300 BMW 5-Series 27,625 CTS 20,343 No BMW taxis over here......

Yeah....it is interesting the article referred to Buick as a "non-premium" brand. But right now, that's what it is.....with the exception of Enclave. However, the reliability ratings don't surprise me. GM is building totally reliable products now. (If there's an area where they still fall behind the competition, it's not "reliability"....it's perceived quality, fit-and-finish, and material choices.) I've just turned 20K in the CTS and it's been flawless with two exceptions.......1) key fob that works intermittently and 2) nasty creak/groan somewhere up in the I.P near where it connects with the A-pillar. Both are irritating.....and dealer won't replace my key fob because it "magically" works everytime I'm in for service....and, naturally, I live with the creak/groan every day.....except when I'm in for service.....(I can't believe how true Murphy's Law is....) Other than that, the car is mechanically flawless. My only one gripe is poor fuel economy. Over 20K miles, I've averaged between 17-19mpg....with significant freeway miles. I don't drive that aggressively either....and cruise is set every day at 70mph on the way to work. It's really disappointing....but I've convinced myself that the gearing in the 6-speed manual must be significantly different that it gets worse gas mileage than the (probably) economy-tuned 5-speed auto. Still love the car though! Still would be tough for me to trade up to an '08.....