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Showing content with the highest reputation on 04/05/2020 in Posts

  1. 3 points
    When it comes to Mercedes Benz, I actively wonder why they insist on selling the C-class AND the CLA-class to begin with. Too many badge snobs wanting a subsidized lease I guess. Yes, the original Escalade was little more than a badge job from a same-year Tahoe. . . . . . in 1999. In the last 15 years, Escalade has exceeded anything the Yukon Denali provides in amenities galore by comparison. At least Cadillac has learned to NOT cheapen its brand anymore (unlike the pitiful Cimarron era!) and offer real luxury options for customers. The MB CLA is little more than a 21st century version of a Cimarron. That is awful.
  2. 2 points
    And sedans are just sedans... Talk about a non-sequitor.
  3. 2 points
    That Ford executive wants Cash for Clunkers because he sees an opportunity for Ford to get more money from the government. That is the real issue. I do not believe that we need a Cash for Clunkers program this time. As for back to basics automobiles, maybe that will happen but I doubt it. Not only are current new vehicles too expensive, but used vehicles can be bought at semi-reasonable prices. Unless the fight is over a brand new $10K Chevy Trax, I suspect that automakers will make do with a market that only sells 8-12 million new cars a year for the next several years.
  4. 2 points
    Yeah...you find it hilarious that a pickup truck is a luxury vehicle. I find it hilarious that a taxi cab in Greece is a luxury vehicle States side...
  5. 1 point
    Bad idea, waste of taxpayer money that can go to more important things. Also if did it, they would require the new car to be an EV (which are mostly too expensive, especially for people that have economic hardship) or it would have to be on a car that gets 30 or 35 mpg combined or something fuel efficient and Ford quit making their cars and has nothing fuel efficient, outside of an Escape Hybrid. We don't need more corporate welfare, auto companies were making billions in profits a couple years ago, I didn't see them giving it all away to charity or to the government to pay extra taxes.
  6. 1 point
    No, this is a stupid idea. Really ashamed that someone from Ford would suggest this. How about concentrating on how many more new 2020 Escapes you can sell instead of 70,000 dollar Aviators now? Likewise, GM, maybe something like the Cruze is a valuable entry in the car lineup now? Watch GM spin this into needing all sorts more money to dump into autonomous and electric black hole now. I would be for the development budgets of electric being increased if the charging grid were part of that investment but I haven't seen jack squat of that to date. And in the meantime, how about instead of cash for clunkers, get more hybrid powertrains into volume lines. Like an Equinox hybrid. Give credit for continuing hybrids in some of its product lines.
  7. 1 point
    Can we go back and start at the beginning with Genesis?
  8. 1 point
    Good lord people. Give it a rest already. Somehow, yet another thread about a luxury car gets hijacked by SMK semantics and comparing everything to a Benz (like anyone really gives two s***s) and now it has devolved into yet another semantics laden pissing match. The G80. Let’s discuss that. I’ll start with saying that on looks alone, the interior compares very well to the German competition.
  9. 1 point
    That looks like the trim and spec of one I sat in at the auto show (seems like so long ago now). I didn't care for the dreary charcoal interior and vile CF trim. A light tan interior w/ some wood would be way more appealing to me.
  10. 1 point
    Anyway, trying to get back on topic and away from all the rambling TL;DR nonsense, the new Genesis looks like a nice entry in the premium sedan market..will be interesting to see how it does if the car market comes back eventually..
  11. 1 point
    I say base E Class and base GLC...but you yourself dont equate expensive price tags to luxury so an AMG E Class is also not luxury BECAUSE the E Class is utilitarian in some markets outside the US...just like how pickup trucks ARE utilitarian in the US market. In other parts of the world thoughl ike in Russia and in Dubai...if a Russian oligarch or an oil sheik baron decide to export a Kings Ranch F150...its luxury...) (you could try to counter all you want...the sad reality is that Mercedes went down market in the US and THAT is what is causing SMK all this pain) Ford, Dodge and GM went upmarket for their trucks...meeting up at the doorstep of Mercedes' downmarket path... Dont fault Detroit for that mess... Dont make excuses for Mercedes for that mess...
  12. 1 point
    Yup... And you missed the point that Mercedes vehicles that have the SAME EXACT price tags as those high fallutin' pickup trucks..dont equate to luxury vehicles either... And THAT is the point... Example That E Class...is not a luxury vehicle... Therefore... Not a luxury vehicle But wait...there is more You both have to decide what argument you want to stick to... Define what is luxury first...and then come and discuss it with me. You will find that whatever definition you choose, it does not bode well for Mercedes luxury perception vis-a-vis high priced pickup trucks and Mercedes Benz vehicles below the S Class... I repeat... Price to price interior to interior engine choice to engine choice fit and finish to fit and finish tech to tech Mercedes base GLC and base E Class are no more luxury than top trimmed pickup trucks. Or... If you want to play the hypocrite game. Mercedes base GLC and E Class are luxury...but so are the top trimmed pickup trucks. You cant have it both ways.
  13. 1 point
    Non sequitor, your comparisons hold no water. Apples and oranges. That there are pickups that have similar prices to MB luxury models means nothing, there are Peterbilt, Kenworth, etc trucks that are more expensive. Or RVs. Or Corvettes. Many vehicles are in the same price bracket that aren’t competitors. I thought this was a Genesis thread. Seems to have really gone off the rails.
  14. 1 point
    It does not bode well for Mercedes' luxury plans when plebeian branded, work oriented utilitarian pick-up trucks rival transaction prices and sales figures with those of Mercedes so-called luxury vehicles... Maybe because... Anything below the S Class in the Mercedes line-up is not luxury? Or... Is it that Lonhorn Laramies, King Ranches and Denalis ARE luxury? Tough pill to swallow. Which reality do you wanna follow? Any which way you cut it...its no bueno for Mercedes Benz.
  15. 1 point
    Actually...same applies to Mercedes. How many low level GLAs and CLAs and crappy 4 cylinder C Classes does Mercedes roll out and favorable priced lease queen E Classes and GLCs vis a vis the higher priced ones? I bet you...Dodge and Ford and GMC and Chevy sell MORE 50 000 dollar price tagged trucks than Mercedes does in that same 50 000 dollar range. Mercedes has sold 320 000-380 000 units in the US the last 5 years. The GLC and the C Class are the top cars that sell in the US. 60 000 units per year for the C Class and 70 000 for the GLC That totals 130 000 units. About half. 45 000 E classes, 20 000 GLAs, 15 000 CLA. That is another 70 000 units 200 000 units so far. Add another 50 000 GLEs and another 15 000 S Classes and we are at 265 000. The rest comprises of 40 000 vans, 7 000 G Class SUVs, 4 000 GTs, 1 500 SLs, 1 500 SLCs and we are at the 315 000 units level https://www.daimler.com/investors/reports-news/financial-news/20200104-mbusa-sales-dec.html Numbers are good enough... 60 000 C Classes... starts at 42 000 70 000 GLCs starts at 52 000 I doubt that the GLC goes above 60 000 dollars. Lease queen. I doubt the C Class goes above 45 000 dollars. Lease queen also. That makes an avg trans price of 52 000... for 130 00 units GLE starts at 55 000 E Class starts at 54 000 avg trans price Id say 60 000 dollars. for another 100 000 cars. We bump up that avg trans price $55 000 for 230 000 units. CLA and GLA Id say avg trans prices at 45 000. It wont move the needle as that only makes up for 35 000 units. Avg trans prices for M-B in the US according to MY logic is 55 000 for a measly 260 000 - 280 000 units... https://www.coxautoinc.com/market-insights/average-new-vehicle-transaction-prices-up-3-5-year-over-year-in-january/ That link says that M-B ATP is at 58 000-59 000 dollars. Im gonna say that my analysis is accurate because in my analysis I am not including 100 000 dollar S Class sales...even at only 15 000 units... Ford sells 900 000 F150s and its variants Dodge sells close too 700 000 Rams and its variants. Maybe more now... GM sells 600 000 Chevy Silverados and another 250 000 Sierras. https://gmauthority.com/blog/2018/10/the-average-pickup-truck-price-is-closing-in-on-50000/ In 2018...GM said that the ATP on its trucks in 2018 is closing in on 50 000 dollars... The Silverado STARTS at 29 000... GM sells 850 000 trucks... Without me doing any more math...Im dizzy.... Im going to safely say that yes...Ford, GM, Dodge sell MORE 50 000 dollar trucks than Mercedes does 50 000 dollar vehicles...as I think GM, Ford and Dodge OBLITERATES the 280 000 unit mark with expensive as phoque Longhorns, King Ranches and Silverado HD/Denalis...
  16. 1 point
    Id say those days are over. Cadillac did that very same thing and it hasnt worked... Mercedes sells waaaay to many low level, low priced cars in North America that folks will not remember those high line cars that defined Mercedes Benz in the 1990s. And even then, in '90s, Mercedes also peddled waaaaay too many, low level cars in North America ... One could argue this one...but it was not very luxurious... It sold...BECAUSE it wasnt that expensive to buy. And at the start of the SUV/CUV craze...And this is when Mercedes was riding high on its so called luxury image. But not very luxurious... (look at those ugly grey plastic bumpers...) If Cadillac gets shat on for the 1st gen Escalade (nd for some hardcore GM haters for the 2nd gen) and GM gets shat on for the Hummer H1 and H2 for shoddy builds...then M-B should get shyte for that crap as well...
  17. 1 point
    Bill Withers passed away a few days ago. He was 81. It was caused by other health issues and not related to the current pandemic. He had three big songs, among others, but two were sort of downers ("Lean on Me" and "Ain't No Sunshine"). That leaves this one as his best song, IMO: R.I.P. Mr. Withers
  18. 1 point
    So they just call it a luxury car, and so it is. so EASY! - - - - -
  19. 1 point
    OK- Not quite the same wheels. Or car. I always liked the Sunfire concepts. And those wheels are very cool.
  20. 1 point
    Inspiration: Also...it kinda looks like a high on meth Ford designer was trying to green light a Taurus coupe.
  21. 1 point
    Are you buzzing again? JUST because there isnt a Silverado SS 454 or Ford F-150 Lightning like there was 20 years ago...doesnt mean these machines do not have performance... A Silverado has a a 6.2 liter 420 HP and 460 horsepower V8 under the hood. Also...the Ford Raptor IS a performance machine... And you saw what I wrote? I said 20 years ago... PERFORMANCE muscle trucks EXISTED while Elon Musk was still a baby... 1978 (And yes...it was performance for the time...) And there are a slew of other noteworthy performance trucks from then until now... The Cybertruck is still not in production but Ford will gladly sell you a performance pick-up right NOW And there is another that Ford could sell you RIGHT NOW The rest of your post is just word pollution...
  22. 1 point
    Pickup trucks don’t have performance and won’t until the Cybertruck arrives. Also a King Ranch or High Country truck is still a far cry from an Audi A6 in terms of interior and technology let alone the higher luxury vehicles. I mean the Kia Telluride has a better interior than a Denali pickup, can’t get Super Cruise in a Silverado or Sierra either and Audi A8 has a system more advanced than Super Cruise. Trucks are expensive (and do well on resale) but that doesn’t make them luxury.
  23. 1 point
  24. 1 point
    It could be construed that luxury pickups are the new aspirational vehicle. I read somewhere that luxury cars across all brands were being traded in on Denali, High Country, King Ranch and Limited LD and HD pickups at a very noticeable clip.
  25. 1 point
    mercedes / BMW weren't competitive until the 1990s. RE : I-6 "smoothness" ; big deal - that's no selling point. Especially since more & more; the dead I-6 is going to the I-4. The problem is entrenched now - once upon a time a luxury car meant all the bells & whistles, now you can get the majority of amenities on everything down to the bottom of the barrel. The range has decreased significantly. And then there's the truck segment horning DEEP into the luxury brand territory- the same amenities, some new ones, and capabilities the cars can't even approach.
  26. 1 point
    Maybe, but if EVs do explode in sales and threaten the used car market, then Honda was wise in pursuing what looks like a strategic alliance. EVs, especially BEVs, need to be cheap enough so nobody will want a lightly used ICE vehicle. Otherwise it is all for naught.
  27. 1 point
    Well, I know for sure it is tougher in the rust belt states. My wife’s 17 year old Cavalier had to be replaced not because the car stopped running (engine and trans had a lot of life left at 155k) but rust was making the doors fall off. It’s why it’s not uncommon to see 10 year old cars in the junkyard....
  28. 1 point
    ^ These are the same people who are probably demanding voice-activated power windows (but just as a stopgap until thought-activated power windows appear). - - - - - Just a 'plain Jane', cheap, Plymouth Belvedere :
  29. 1 point
    Gotta say this is not surprising. Hybrid/EV drivers are all the same.
  30. 0 points
    Why? Because Mercedes said the AMG is a luxury vehicle? Why is it a luxury vehicle? Price? You already established in your mind that price got NOTHING to do with it... But Ill humour you. Starts at $108 000 F150 Shelby SuperSnake Starts at $95 000 for 400 HP and $102 000 for 770 HP Performance? The Supersnake and Raptor do things that an AMG E Class wont do and vice versa...but all 3 are performance machines. You gonna pick and choose what performance criteria is luxury and what is not? Technology? What automotive tech is available in the Mercedes is also available in the F150. Fit and finish? Quality of the leather? What about towing capacity and what you could haul? Why isnt THAT a luxury? Because when discussing with biased view points...one will always find a way to dismiss another view point when it does not match their fondness and dislike for certain vehicles...
  31. 0 points
    You miss a fundamental point---price tag doesn't equate to luxury. There are plenty of expensive vehicles that aren't luxury vehicles.
  32. -1 points
    Sad that Cadillac has never really optimized taking their concepts to market and given much less than they could in the luxury segment. Yet still Genesis is way better, but not perfect than many out there and a side profile comparison shows that Genesis nailed it for the most part.
  33. -1 points
    Honda is no dummy. They are letting GM pay the price for money losing tech no one wants. It's called risk management and it is a brilliant move by Honda, we've all heard their stance on EVs... they see no reason to invest heavily in BS. This is for Honda to be compliant with draconian regulations that are counter-customer.
  34. -1 points
    Trucks are just trucks, though...no matter how fancy they are inside. That may be the dumbest thing I've read in a while...the E has lower trims and higher trims.
  35. -1 points
    The AMG E-class is a performance luxury vehicle.. same idea as the CTS-v was.
  36. -1 points
    Sure... You seem to do it all the time... What is a base E Class anyway? In Greece...its a taxi cab... You cant use the 100 000 dollar AMG on me...why? ALL YOUR WORDS... IN ESSENCE...YOU ARE ARGUING WITH.... YOURSELF
  37. -1 points
    What the holy fuck do taxi cabs in Greece have to do with anything????? Priuses are taxi cabs in the US. Stop it with the long winded tedious drivel and focus on the subject of the thread...
  38. -1 points
    Alot Whether you like it or not. According to YOUR definition of luxury. High end trims of pick-up trucks are luxury... If you dont agree with that, then E Class Mercedes is NOT luxury either... Pick your pill and stop the bullshyte!
  39. -2 points
    So you want to compare a base E-class vs a top trim pickup? How about a base Cadillac CT5 with no options to a loaded Toyota Avalon? Which is more luxurious? And if the E-class isn't a luxury car, and has a taxi stigma, how come Cadillac, Acura, Lexus and Infiniti can't challenge it, and Lincoln quit building sedans? The E-class has put the CTS, CT6, Q70, and Continental in the graveyard and the RLX and GS are next. E-class is so great a luxury vehicle it has survived when the rest have all failed, and the E-class has a higher price than all those competitors, even with discount pricing none of those brands could compete. G80 will be no different.
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