Camino LS6

Maybe underpowered and a bit gaudy, but that aerocoupe GP is already quite collectible.

The same wishes to you PCS, I just wish you wouldn't damn the car before it even gets its shot. I expect it to do fine. Not as well, perhaps, as it would in a less nasty environment, but much better than the GTO (which I still prefer) due to its wider appeal. A Ute or sportwagon will draw me in quickly, if approved. I look forward to putting another Holden in the barn.

That blue color is awful nice.

No problem. And none of us are happy about the slow speed of Pontiac's turnaround. I'll let you in on something else: Pontiac is one of my favorites as well ( I've owned a few special ones) :AH-HA_wink:

I don't remember the exact number, but it is very low - and all of them are white.

A few things here Diehard - Lutz doesn't hate the other brands (especially not Pontiac) - The current Impala's days are numbered as well (though it will outlive the other Ws) - Model rollouts are not done by any executive's "favorite" they are business decisions Just get your GP and be happy - all of us have had favorites cancelled.

There may come a time for that,Reg. Right now we need to get what we can out of dreamhost.

Especially if it is a rare '86 Aerocoupe.

True that.

The G8 also offers a V6. And Alpha will be smaller overall.

Let's just hope that it doesn't march over a cliff out of arrogance.

Or use them to build global product in that part of the world.

The way I see it, Holden has given GM a huge gift at the cost of their own independence. This little sliver of the GM universe: - took a lackluster Opel and turned it into a V8 supercar - merged European precision with American power - reminded GM how to do an interior - reminded GM how to maximize a single platform - taught GM how to export And PCS wants to thank them with extinction.

So essentially, we are saying the same thing (minus your personal vendetta against Holden). What is Holden's is GM's, of course that's true. Dumping the brand and abandoning the facilities makes no sense however.

My frustration is knowing that GM can, and does, build what I want - yet I can't buy it. The strength and diversity of their global product portfolio should enable GM to quickly serve even small demand anywhere with a minumum of investment and time. If they leverage their global capabilities properly, we should all have better choices worldwide.

Which furthers my point. GM being global makes complete sense, ignoring the value of local brands - not so much. I don't see much difference between having Kappa sold as Pontiac, Saturn, Daewoo, and Opel and having Zeta sold as Holden, Daewoo, Chevrolet, Vauxhall,Pontiac, and Buick. Except that Holden is better at it and more experienced. Applying Holden's model to all of GM is really what we are talking about here when you think about it.

Epsilon= FWD/AWD and a different topic Sigma = on it's way out and limited to Caddy Kappa = Limited production and flexibility

When you think about it, minus the drama, that is already happening to a point. - GMNA has invaded Holden already - Oshawa is gearing-up for Zeta - Holden's role is increasingly one of R&D for all of GM rather than a stand-alone subsidiary As for closing them down, why bother? The brand is beloved by Australians and the exported cars already wear other badges. The facilities have just been upgraded at significant expense, and staff from around the world are working there. That part of your position makes less sense to me, especially when you consider that Holden has already been effectively taken over. I'd leave the name in place where it has equity while making the resources available to all of GM. In other words, what's the difference? - The brand has value in its home market - The cars are engineered for multiple global markets and brands already - The designs are more easily exported than the cars themselves What you outline sounds like GM shooting itself in the foot unnecessarily if well-known local branding is dropped for the sake of the vanity of making Chevrolet the "only" global brand. Put the function in place ,sure that makes sense. But why get caught-up in the vanity?

...and, I might add, an interesting one. In some markets, I see the value of all of GM being Chevrolet or Caddy. In others- not so much.

So let me get this straight, you are fine with Zeta and Alpha as long as the name of the brand is changed to Chevrolet from Holden? I just want cars I will like - right now that means Holden. The global branding is of little concern to me, I'm more interested in the product. The branding issue is a wholly different discussion.

Good point.

I think a shirt or a hat would be more my style. My shorts need no adornment. :AH-HA_wink:

*YAWN*

One platform with a huge variety of variants (exisiting and possible) in every major market globally- such is the genius of Holden. And, let's not forget Alpha and the great promise it has to take RWD into the future. GMNA and GM Europe? *crickets chirping* Edit: Oh yeah, let's not forget that cars designed in Oz will soon be built in NA and China.