Chasing the Western Maryland 1309 out of Cumberland

[Drew Dowdell]

 

[David]

Having taken one trip on a private coach at the back of Amtrak from Chicago to Seattle, I will say that it is very relaxing and a very slow pace of traveling the U.S.

Not sure trains have much of a future unless we truly invest in highspeed trains as I think the generations that supported steam, coal or wood burning trains are all going 6 feet under, and the younger generations do not care as they have moved forward with the tech and high speed of society and the future.

It will be interesting to see how train museums and private rail cars handle the next decade.

[Drew Dowdell]

8 minutes ago, David said:

Having taken one trip on a private coach at the back of Amtrak from Chicago to Seattle, I will say that it is very relaxing and a very slow pace of traveling the U.S.

Not sure trains have much of a future unless we truly invest in highspeed trains as I think the generations that supported steam, coal or wood burning trains are all going 6 feet under, and the younger generations do not care as they have moved forward with the tech and high speed of society and the future.

It will be interesting to see how train museums and private rail cars handle the next decade.

You'd be 100% wrong based on the crowds that the Western Maryland brings in, it is mostly families with young kids.  In the past three years, there have been three steam engines returned to service within a few hour's drive of me. Another four went online out west. I know of at least two more under restoration for operation, and there is even a non-profit building a brand-new steam engine from the original plans with modern upgrades. They have the boiler done and are now working on the frame. The T-1 Trust

However you are right about one thing: most no longer burn coal, though the engine in this video does. Most have been converted to oil for cleanliness and fire safety issues.

 

[David]

14 minutes ago, Drew Dowdell said:

You'd be 100% wrong based on the crowds that the Western Maryland brings in, it is mostly families with young kids.  In the past three years, there have been three steam engines returned to service within a few hour's drive of me. Another four went online out west. I know of at least two more under restoration for operation, and there is even a non-profit building a brand-new steam engine from the original plans with modern upgrades. They have the boiler done and are now working on the frame. The T-1 Trust

However you are right about one thing: most no longer burn coal, though the engine in this video does. Most have been converted to oil for cleanliness and fire safety issues.

 

Guess it must be where I live as trains here have very little interest by society and Amtrak is rarely used here. So what was local trains has pretty much died out and even support for lite rail here is dropping which I believe is mostly due to the cost of the system and poor planning due to ignoring superior systems over seas. Politics clearly has played it hand here in limiting what rail can do and get done. Would be nice if they actually put rail in that serviced the community rather than select groups.

[David]

22 minutes ago, Drew Dowdell said:

 there is even a non-profit building a brand-new steam engine from the original plans with modern upgrades. They have the boiler done and are now working on the frame. The T-1 Trust

Will be interesting to see if it ever gets done since they say they expect to have it built by 2030 but this is dependent on how many people volunteer and donations. As stated a $20 million dollar donation could allow them to build it in 5 to 6 years. 

Question why, why build something based on the 1940s and is old technology. To me it seems like people are trying to live in the past and as has been proven, stagnation causes death, so I just do not see any value in these old trains, but that is my personal view on it.

Will be interesting to see where they are in a couple of years.

[Drew Dowdell]

6 minutes ago, David said:

Will be interesting to see if it ever gets done since they say they expect to have it built by 2030 but this is dependent on how many people volunteer and donations. As stated a $20 million dollar donation could allow them to build it in 5 to 6 years. 

Question why, why build something based on the 1940s and is old technology. To me it seems like people are trying to live in the past and as has been proven, stagnation causes death, so I just do not see any value in these old trains, but that is my personal view on it.

Will be interesting to see where they are in a couple of years.

In the case of the T-1, there's a century-old feud between the US and the UK. The UK currently holds the record for the world's fastest steam locomotive, set by the Mallard in 1938.  However, the T-1 above was regularly clocked at higher speeds, just not in an official test. The Mallard broke down after the test and had to go in for a severe overhaul.

And just looking at the specs of the T-1 v. A4 Mallard (4-cylinder v. 3-cylinder, 300psi boiler v. 250 psi boiler, 6,500hp v, 2,400 hp) with the same size drive wheels, it's pretty easy to figure out the T-1 was a more capable machine.  In regular service, they ran 8,000 miles a month, with a lot of that time at 110mph. Mallard also hit its 125mph record on a slight downhill. The T-1s could reach their speeds at level and even a slight upgrade.

It will be interesting to see if one of the railroads allows a speed record-breaking attempt for the T-1.

An interesting footnote is that prior to the T-1, there was an S-1 built that was even bigger and more powerful. Designed to produce 7,500 hp, it was intended to haul a 1,200 ton train at 100 - 120mph with a theoretical top speed of 152mph.  The only problem was that it was so big, there was almost nowhere east of Pittsburgh it could run and, in fact, couldn't make the bend through Pittsburgh station, which was the key route between Philadelphia and Chicago.  In the flat, straight terrain of Ohio and west, it shined. It was hauling 24-car passenger trains (huge by passenger train standards) over 110 mph, with multiple reports of it exceeding 140 mph to make up for delays.  But its size was its Achilles heal. It was too big for the turning facilities at either end of its run and had to be turned on a wye instead of a table, and this caused several low-speed derailments.  Only the prototype was built, but it served for 5 1/2 years before diesels took over (at lower speeds).  It remains the most powerful steam passenger locomotive ever built.

The T-1 was made as a much more manageable design that could run from Philly/DC to Chicago without causing the track maintenance crews headaches. 

Footnote 2: Do you think traction control is modern?  The Pennsylvania RR had automatic traction control installed on its Q-2 freight steam locomotives in 1944. Everything old is new again.

[David]

1 hour ago, Drew Dowdell said:

In the case of the T-1, there's a century-old feud between the US and the UK. The UK currently holds the record for the world's fastest steam locomotive, set by the Mallard in 1938.  However, the T-1 above was regularly clocked at higher speeds, just not in an official test. The Mallard broke down after the test and had to go in for a severe overhaul.

And just looking at the specs of the T-1 v. A4 Mallard (4-cylinder v. 3-cylinder, 300psi boiler v. 250 psi boiler, 6,500hp v, 2,400 hp) with the same size drive wheels, it's pretty easy to figure out the T-1 was a more capable machine.  In regular service, they ran 8,000 miles a month, with a lot of that time at 110mph. Mallard also hit its 125mph record on a slight downhill. The T-1s could reach their speeds at level and even a slight upgrade.

It will be interesting to see if one of the railroads allows a speed record-breaking attempt for the T-1.

An interesting footnote is that prior to the T-1, there was an S-1 built that was even bigger and more powerful. Designed to produce 7,500 hp, it was intended to haul a 1,200 ton train at 100 - 120mph with a theoretical top speed of 152mph.  The only problem was that it was so big, there was almost nowhere east of Pittsburgh it could run and, in fact, couldn't make the bend through Pittsburgh station, which was the key route between Philadelphia and Chicago.  In the flat, straight terrain of Ohio and west, it shined. It was hauling 24-car passenger trains (huge by passenger train standards) over 110 mph, with multiple reports of it exceeding 140 mph to make up for delays.  But its size was its Achilles heal. It was too big for the turning facilities at either end of its run and had to be turned on a wye instead of a table, and this caused several low-speed derailments.  Only the prototype was built, but it served for 5 1/2 years before diesels took over (at lower speeds).  It remains the most powerful steam passenger locomotive ever built.

The T-1 was made as a much more manageable design that could run from Philly/DC to Chicago without causing the track maintenance crews headaches. 

Footnote 2: Do you think traction control is modern?  The Pennsylvania RR had automatic traction control installed on its Q-2 freight steam locomotives in 1944. Everything old is new again.

Thank you Drew, was not aware of the history here, very interesting.