steve333

Yup, it is our fault. Not faulting the Chinese Government for taking advantage of it, I'm more angry with GM for doing this as I don't think it's needed and it makes them look bad especially when people are still angry over the bailout. You want them to be bad at business? If anything, from a strictly business standpoint, more Buicks should be built in China because that's where most of them are sold. GM cannot and should not be spinning up a whole new production line just to build 60,000 cars for the U.S. They've already had to move the Terrain and Equinox around a bit just to accommodate those two. If they build Buick's in China and sell them there I have no problem with that. I think you all are downplaying the way this will play out in the media and in the mind of consumers. We may be rooting for GM, those that aren't will come down on them harder than I am. As for not being able to produce the Envision in the U.S. that's just another sign of GM's shortsightedness. I think GM needs a new CEO, have thought it for a long time. Barra is not up to the job, IMO

I do harp about those things just not in car forums. Maybe it's time to change the hand we were dealt. There's a reason Trump and Bernie are doing so well in the primaries. People are finally fed up.

Yup, it is our fault. Not faulting the Chinese Government for taking advantage of it, I'm more angry with GM for doing this as I don't think it's needed and it makes them look bad especially when people are still angry over the bailout.

And the same goes for the electronic device you are typing on here. There are options but that's not the bigger point here. Again, it's a world economy when it comes to vehicles. I am really not sure how to make this any clearer. I want a Mac I don't have a choice. I want a vehicle I have many choices. As for the world economy, when a country doesn't trade fairly with my country I don't like it. I don't know how to make that any clearer. Actually, you are misinformed because the Mac Pro is made here, so there is a choice with Apple. BTW, most countries have what would be considered unfair trade practices, including us. Facts are your friend here, thus making your supposed argument a bit hallow. You're comparing a Mac Mini to a Mac Pro? That's like saying I should buy a Cadillac when I can only afford a Sonic. I have no problem with that. If a Chinese company wanted to build a Plant here to sell cars more power to them.

And the same goes for the electronic device you are typing on here. There are options but that's not the bigger point here. Again, it's a world economy when it comes to vehicles. I am really not sure how to make this any clearer. I want a Mac I don't have a choice. I want a vehicle I have many choices. As for the world economy, when a country doesn't trade fairly with my country I don't like it. I don't know how to make that any clearer.

China uses State owned companies, including the one GM is involved with in China, the Chinese Government is not an ally, they pay their workers way less than S. Korea, the Chinese Government doesn't allow imported cars to be sold there without a tariff. Some things we are forced to buy made in China because there are no options, there are plenty of options when it comes to vehicles.

Jesus Christ Steve... We had this argument over at GMI damn near to death. Your argument for laid down their and if U keep it up here it will happen again. MiatsoCi You lost the argument over there if you want to lose it over here be my guest People I have to let U kno that this is the same guy that said steve333 @ GMI post #73 So I'll just do my thing.. as re-writing it would get tiring Tell U what.. U start a campaign.. an effective one that gets behind it 250 money able Americans to STOP buying all Chinese manufactured goods, no matter how small or large, and I'll stop defending GM's reason for doing it as OK.. and American-Justified. I'm no fan of importing and selling the Envision here either.. but then again.. I'm no fan of importing and selling BMW, Toyotas/Lex, Hyundais/Kias, Benzes, VW/Audis, Jag-LRs, Honda/Acuras, Nissan/Infin, Volvos, Subies, or Mazdas either. The idea of allowing the Chinese to send all their cheap **** over here and we sop it up like biscuit wheels on a road of gravy.. but suddenly find "Uncle Sam" when GM pulls a car from one of its global factories and brings it here is just weird hypocrisy.. I gave up on the American worker a while ago.. went my own path. Saw that American would rather feed Japanese, German, and Korean workers while they themselves stood in line waiting to cash unemployment checks so they could make payments on their Prius, Jetta or Sonata.. rinse repeat.. Where I'm confused is .. How does it make sense that the Japanese worker building a Prius.. making a weekly $133,254 JPY is less of a problem than the Chinese worker making $6,483 YUAN, when the American.. who bought the Prius.. is making $392 a week in unemployment wages (used Michigan)??? Basically what this entire silly thread is saying (and I used this example before) is as an American.. we are "OK with Adolf, Goh, and Hiro sleeping with our significant other, but that Chung??? He better go find another tramp to sleep with and keep his hands off my cheating tramp so Adolf, Goh, and Hiro don't get their feelings hurt" What I still don't get... Is why this, and only this import...seems to ruffle everyone's feathers when so much more from China is imported equaling higher overall dollar amounts and utilizing far more jobs. Also... I find it exceptionally interesting that no one has brought up (except me of course) that the UAW was complicit in this decision. I haven't even heard a word of them protesting hard or threatening to strike. Could it have been part of their deal? Lastly.. I am still blown away with the American job argument Vs China... but no issue with the Mexicans, Canadians, Koreans, Germans, or Japanese taking jobs. A lost job is a lost job, whether it be to Pablo in Mexico City , Anne-Marie in Ontario, Adolf in Germany, Goh in Korea, Hiro in Japan, or... And I kno y'all hate him the most.. Chung in China. Explain these to me.. with out prejudice or fear mongering and I'll exit from this thread Interesting how you don't use the same nickname here as you do there, you're such a popular guy. If you didn't get it from the long discussion over at GMI then you won't get it here either. You have a hard on for GM and whatever they do, but not all of us are fanboys who accept every decision GM makes.

Jesus Christ Steve... We had this argument over at GMI damn near to death. Your argument for laid down their and if U keep it up here it will happen again. MiatsoCi You lost the argument over there if you want to lose it over here be my guest

It's just a temp move most likely. But it makes a lot of business sense to do it this way when there isn't currently a line in the US to build them on. GM sells 4 times as many Buicks in China as they do in the US.... including a good bunch of Enclaves that are built here in the states. They should have waited if they weren't smart enough to plan down the road. This is just what those opposed to the bailout were waiting for and it's pretty sad that they can't find another factory to build it. It's not like they don't have options

Terrible PR and a stupid move, IMO. I hope Barra gets canned and GM goes out and finds a real CEO

The CT6 doesn't have any design appeal. The front end is ugly, the rest of the car is boring and that tumor logo looks ridiculous on anything but a black mesh grill like the Elmiraj. I don't see how the CT6 will sell while the ATS and CTS are not selling. GM should have fixed those cars first, IMO. Better grills and front ends, re-designed CUE with buttons and knobs and a nicer dash.

That grill is awful, looks much better with the black mesh, IMO

I was comparing the Cobalt LT to the Corolla. I drove a 2006 version of the Corolla and it was awful. I considered getting the Tripletreds for my Cobalt but went with Michelins. They really get caught on the grooved freeways in san diego. I kind of wish I tried the Tripletreds first.

The Corolla may take bumps better but the Cobalt handles better than the Corolla. I guess it depends what you're looking for in a car. I would not be a happy camper if I had to drive a Corolla everyday but my Cobalt is fine. For me.

I agree. I test drove a Corolla before I ended up buying my Cobalt and it was the worst car I have ever drove. I was shocked at how bad it was-uncomfortable driving position, the engine had as much power as a lawn mower and sounded like one. I am continually amazed that it got even half way decent reviews and that sheeple bought so many of them. Just an awful car.

I just wanted to replace my Cobalt with an improved model. I honestly don't know if I can buy a car with that name. When I first read that they were changing the name to Cruze I thought I was going to vomit. Nova? Fine Monza? Fine Optra? Fine Cruze? Um, no

Its claimed that GMs marketing Dept came up with Cruze and most likely the other names. If this is the case the entire Dept. needs to be fired along with Red Ink Rick.

Maybe someone can ask him why GM never learns. Changing the name of the Cobalt to the Cruze is moronic, just as it was dumb to change all of Pontiac and Buick's names.How did that work out for you, Bob? Cruze is the dumbest name for a car I have ever heard. And where's the coupe?

I think I'm going to projectile vomit. Cruze!? I was waiting for GM to come out with a replacement for my Cobalt and now they think I'm going to buy a Chevy Cruze!? Who in Gods name came out with that idiotic, moronic, witless name? I didnt think they should change the name at all but I would have had no problem if they changed it to Nova, Chevelle, Monza, even Optra. To make matters worse they are waiting until 2010 in their weakest market to sell the replacement while not improving the current Cobalt at all! What do they think the resale value will be on current Cobalts? What about all the Cobalt fansites that exist now? Cruze? Oh man, I think I am going to have to jump ship this time. Its just not worth an ulcer trying to prop up a company as clueless as GM. The next Focus may be my next purchase or the Mazda 3. GM, you deserve whatever fate befalls you. I am nauseated right now.

Personally I think it looks like ass. I don't like the way the grill cuts into the hood. I think the majority of Chevy fans are dissapointed in what we see so far. Go here and let GM know that we won't accept anything less than a homerun: http://fastlane.gmblogs.com/archives/2008/...a_little_1.html

Oh, too good to be true I guess

Why not?

They should just add a K & N Air Filter to all new cars and get an additional 2 or so MPG.

Gm is just letting the Cobalt rot like they did to the Cavalier. I can't believe they still refuse to put a telescoping steering wheel in it-EVERY car in its class now has one, including the Astra. The Cobalt desperately needs that telescoping steering wheel and more comfortable seats. Those are the 2 most glaring issues with my Balt. Well, that and the defective intermediate shaft and steerong column. I know GM hasnt done squat about fixing that issue.

Yup, the least they could have done is improve the seats and put in a telescoping steering wheel. The suspension and steering need tweaking also. GM has a habit of letting its products rot on the vine. The Cobalt is the perfect example of that.