Camino LS6

Not handy, I know it was posted before. Anyone have it handy?

Or watch the video comparing the F-150, Silverado, and Tundra going over the suspension test runs.

I would forget about the swap - too expensive to do right and legalities could be an issue. In fact, I'd pass on this one.

Toyota has been building mostly well-equipped extended cab versions and the huge rebates have been moving them to the "I don't really need a truck" crowd. Once that market is exhausted, more trouble is coming their way. Will they then be as willing to try to tap the 3/4 and 1-ton markets with all of the expense involved? Maybe. But this is a gamble, even for cash-rich Toyota. It's not as if the 1/2 ton is anything like a "home run". This could potentially come to be known as "Toyota's Folly" I hope it does.

Toyota will try, and most likely be willing to lose money on this for a long time. Eventually though, they will need to cut their losses and accept that this battle is one that they can never win. The Silverado and the F-150 will never again be allowed to age very long. GM and Ford know that survival depends on beating Toyota at the truck game. Dodge is a wildcard though...

I don't believe that losing trucks will happen, although a pitched battle is a forgone conclusion. Further, I don't believe that G8,Aura, and Malibu will fail. The nightmare scenario you lay out is certainly quite scary, in fact if it comes to pass, the end to the brands in question will be the end of GM itself. I do know the stakes, and how deadly serious the reality is, yet I am encouraged by the steps already taken and the product on its way. The brands are a strength, if handled properly, and I see that happening more and more. My major fear is that it simply isn't happening fast enough. I could type endless paragraphs of detail in how I see all of this, but I will let my simple statements suffice for this thread. The best part of the picture is that Toyota's trucks really aren't better than GM's or Ford's, in fact they are inferior in many ways. The full-size truck market is the domestics' to lose if they falter- I don't think they will. Side note: No, O.C. I wasn't referring to you.

I thought you were done posting about this, Mr. Cryptic. Time will indeed tell. The flavor of your recent posts on the topic leads me to believe that you are counting on the failure of a few products for the future to unfold as you suggest. On that, I believe, you may be the one to be surprised.

Back to the topic at hand, I don't have a problem with GM stopping the Aura program - it did have the desired effect. What I take issue with is GM first announcing, then canceling the program with the Malibu - very stupid move. Backpedaling makes no sense, the announcement should never have been made.

Fixed.

It's strike three and Toyota is feeling the pain. Good.

We're still on this?! Let me sum it up: 1) no brands are going away despite the wishes of some here. 2) California is a self-important, condescending, pain in the ass. We done now?

At any rate, the location of the cracks is certainly odd. I'd like to know what the cause is just to know. There really shouldn't be any stress on that part of the body structure, short of a collision. Strange.

Obviously the frames on the 800s were not to blame, it only affected 36 trucks that never made it into customer's hands and was resolved way back in 1999. Not relevent to the FJ issue whatsoever.

The Z28 was a complete package optimised for the road course racing of the day. So yes, in that context, it far outperformed the SS396.

Thanks for the clarification,toesuf. Were these 30 trucks even released to the public? Or did GM catch the problem before that? As for the Toyota, the location and severity of the cracking makes it a serious issue and a safety concern. If the structure that is meant to save your life in a crash has already failed, it can't do its job should a crash occur. If these pieces were simply bending and deforming, I would likely be blaming the owners. But cracking? No, that's a design problem.

:AH-HA_wink:

Define "outperforms".

I've seen that done before, but the "tow vehicle" was just as radical as the "race car". I can't imagine that the guy actually towed that way.

Love it! I guess i had better get back to the wagon so we can terrorize some Camrys together. :AH-HA_wink:

Ah, you're no fun. :AH-HA_wink:

Thanks! Two questions: Were you there? And, did one of those have my name on it?

Understandable. I am just wondering how critical crash ratings are for most people when making the buying decision. Would you refuse to buy a car you otherwise liked if it did not have a 5 star rating?

But was it a factor in your buying decision?