dado

I would like to see that. But on the other haand..i don't know how version with let say 4.8-5.0 l v8, forced induction,DI, CIB. and close to 480 hp+ would be accepted. I mean it has 100 hp/l, not too big displacement, direct injection, it doesn't have to spin to 8000 because it has turbo and turbo is well accepted, in some circles on car engine, as "new and modern technology" (it was put in first car in...'60s..very new.) What else?? oh yes..the price. Now maybe Cadillac should offer that for extra 15 000 they could put some carbon fiber, lighter wheels, better tires, more powerful engine, parachuet, capuccino maker or something like that. Customer choice.

Problem is CTS didn't change much in Europe about how people thinks about american cars. Common perception when you say to normal guy or woman (not some car fanatics) is: HUGE fuel consumption (especially when they heard it has above 6.0 l engine), very bad handling, boat,...oh yes...famous truck engine not suited for sedans , low on new technology, of course most of them read it in car magazines or heard it from their parents. So if Cadillac is planing to sell ATS-v here..well you can guess what kind of car will normal people see when they read it has 6.2 l v8 with 450 hp and then compare it to.... i don't know 3.x I6 or 4.x v8 TT with even more HP . On the other hand . Maybe Cadillac should first sell versions with I4 Turbo and V6, and diesel so people can get accustomed to idea of modern american vehicle and then drop in V version with "old" technology.

:roflmao: :roflmao: Kind of..but in European version. But sad thing is..here are a lot of people who thinks like that.Like it or not it is reality. These kind of buyers don't know much about engines (and why should they) so they read what car magazines write about it. And thinks that the more expensive the car is that you have higher status in society. And more complicated engine means better . I don't think that in USA is much different. Or am i wrong??

I won't say i disagree or agree but i will give you example. Situation in your country (USA) is very different than in my. I now couple of peoples that are..lets say they parents are much above average in income section. They drive Audi, BMW, mercedes..well not everyone but enough. They went in law, and business universities (i went in engineering so i know thing or two about engines). One of them bought BMW M3 with V8. In my country it cost about 105000 euros. And that is a lot of money here. One day we meet and started to talk about cars. Now you must understand he doesn't know much about engines. He was talking about his car that "has superb engine that has over 100 hp/l and over 8000 rpm redline" etc. All the stuff you can read in some car magazines review.I told him there are more important things than that if you look at engine alone and that even americans had an engine in late 60 which could rev to 8000 rpm (the one in Camaro z28 from'69). Now he was little offended by that but conversation carried on. To summarized my end conclusion was. He bought a car with engine that can rev to 8000 rpm, but 98% of time spend in driving he doesn't go beyond 5 000 rpm. He has over 400 Hp which he doesn't use, his engine has over 100hp/l but he doesn't now what that really means. So why he bought that car? Because he wants to be noticed. Even little boys in my country know what M3 stands for. Because every magazine writes how good that car is and how good sound engine makes when it is spinning to 8000 rpm. Because that car cost so much not everyone can afford it. Because with that car he is accepted in club of rich, modern, young,successful etc. etc . people. Or that is what he likes to think. Now everything what is described here it can't be said for ATS-V with pushrod engine. It probably won't have high rpm capabilities (i will be suprised if it hits 7000 rpm) it doesn't have over 100 hp/l and it doesn't cost much. Audi RS4 on the other hand...well it was second car he looked before he bought M3. Now i would never give that kind of money for M3 when i can have same kind of performance for less money. It doesn't have to go to 8000 rpm or have 100 hp/l. But it has to be better in handling, overall perfomance etc. But i'm not the buyer of that kind of cars. I don't have that kind of money. But guy described before is. I would like to think that most of the buyers aren't like him.. but like i sad on the beginning. In my country it is a little bit different situation. I bet first thing when ATS-V comes out with CIB engine most European car magazines will say something like " it is good,etc etc, despite engine coming from stoneage" well maybe DI will change their minds but i doubt it.

I was refering to this "The beautiful thing is that the Gen V pushrod V8 is probably no more expensive than the 3.6 DOHC V6". If engine is cheaper but more powerful profit will be bigger (usually) . If gen V cost almost as 3.6 l dohc v6 engine, but it has 150+hp you can charged much more for the car. Of course the car will have bigger brakes,different transmissions, different setup which will effect price of the car. But you "saved" some money on the engine.

What is a price diferrences of new ford 5.0 l v8 and ls3? I think ls3 weight less, have smaller external dimensions but what is the price? I think Ford engine is on sale for around 7000 $. IF (big if) LS3 version is around that price(i think it cost less) then i can't understand how Ford can make V8 with Dohc heads etc (without DI) for same money GM needs to make V6 DOHC (with DI). I'm not sure how much version with 440 Hp from Boss cost. Does anyone knows what was the price of northstar engine when it was in production?

That is what i'm afraid of. If ATS aims at younger demographics maybe DOHC engine in ATS-v would be a better choice or CIB but with smaller displacement.Pushrod engines are great.. And yes they are lighter, smaller, cheaper, easier to work on, less complicated. But that means a little to finall buyer because they don't work on their engine,don't care about engine weight as long as car is light i etc. I know people who will see hp/l number and say that engine with higher HP/l is better. I know it is stupid argument but most people believe in what they are told by carmagazines, journalist etc (most of them, at least in my country don't know nothing about car engines but that doesn't stop them from writing about cars). So buyer will see 6.2 l and 450+ hp. That is 73 hp/l. Yes the torque will be high but i don't think young people take too much notice on that. That kind of engine would be great for luxury sedan..but this is sport sedan. My suggestion. If GM will put pushrod engine in ATS-V let it be something like 5.0 l v8 with turbocharger (or supercharger ) and 480+ hp.Or 4.5 l v8 with 430 hp. Hp/l is high, torque curve will be great, redline wouldn't have to be high since it is forced induction..now the weight of the engine?? I don't think supercharger like the one on LS9 engine would add too much weight. And im' curious. What is the differences between new Ford 5.0 l v8, BMW V8, Mercedes new TT v8 and LS3? Yes i know LS3 is smaller in external dimension but i never heard people(who are not engineer,mechanics,tuners etc.)complain about external size of the engine.

I'm wondering. If block on Gen V is made to accomodate both DOHC and CIB design, and if DOHC heads are put on CIB block won't that leave empty space where cam used to sit in block. Will they put cam in block on Dohc engine (maybe it would drive some assesories) but then you get engine as large as noraml Dohc engine(external dimesnions)and extra weight from cam (5 cam). Im curios to see what size and weight will be Revolution engine from Nelson racing(i know it is machined from aluminium billet so i think wall can be thiner than in cast block) Here is also one engine based on Small block (DOHC setup).Weight is 226 kg SwissAuto

I was just reading something interesting. On this FORUM PAGEthere is some information on new SSC ultimate AERO 2 car. There is a scan of the page where it says "the hole botton end of the engine is same, it's just that he is replacing pushrod heads with OHC cam" Now i'm not sure if this is true or is this completely new engine .Something in the line of Nelson racing engine Revolution with 4 cams

I think engine such as 3.8 l v8 from MCLaren MP4 (V8 with twin turbo) isn't heavy and very wide at all. But on the other hand..price probably isn't small.

Wouldn't then 5.7 l v8 with around 450 HP (direct injection etc) be better choice.It won't make as much torque as 6.2 l v8 (it would probably have to go to higher rpm for power). IF Cadillac plans to offer ATS-V on European market i can already see bad comments about so much displacement and so low HP per liter ratio (unfortunately this is what critics and car reporters mostly watch in sports car; they don't really care about weight and outside dimensions of an engine as long as it fits inside car... Hp/l are one of the main criteria.Weight ,handling etc are other). Also isn't 6L90 used in Cadillac CTS-V which has max power output at 6100 or 6200 rpm? I'm not sure what are maximum rpm before limiter is engage. I think 5.0 l v8 turbo (or supercharger) would be good choice. It doesn't matter if it would be CIB or DOHC. It would have direct injection, pretty high HP/l (let say around 90 hp/l), flat torque and since it has forced induction it won't have to go to higher rpm for power. I'm not sure if it would fit under hood (supercharger+intercooler etc.), but small block is small in size and i think if V6 with TT can go under hood small block with supercharger could also fit.

Nah..too little horsepower for v8. something close to 400 HP would be better

I think that horsepower rating for 6.2 l v8 with DI etc is on the low side. Maybe around 480 HP would be better.

What would be the length differences between v6 TT and 5.5 l v8 ? I assume v8 would be longer (bigger bore and more cylinders). I know that wouldn't be such problem when engine is longitudinally mounted (like the engine in CTS is mounted and most likely in ATS)but i think it would present difficulty in cars such as XTS. I mention that car because there is rumors that it could get v6 with TT and about 420 hp, so maybe this is the engine that GM is already planning to put in ATS-V also. So GM could use V6 TT for V version of ATS, between model of CTS (between 3.6 with 300 hp and future V model with 5.5 l v8 and forced induction) and top engine in XTS (i'm not sure if XTS can acommodate V8)

Looking at competition I think it should aim close to 500 HP (Mercedes c63 AMG with sport pack offer around 480 hp). I don't know if V6 TT from GM can offer that much HP and keep warranty,reliability etc. Maybe 5.5 l v8 with forced induction would be better choice. I wouldn't be suprised if AMG put their new 5.5 lv8 TT in next gen. C class.

On March 5th Peter de lorenzo said, on "Autoline After hours" (LINK ) at about 1h 2 min, that there is small block v8 prototype with 3.0 l, and it looks like V8 from oldsmobile and REPCO from the sixties. Wasn't that SOHC engine when Repco finish with it?

From this page LINK Where the C6.R and ZR1 differ significantly are in situations where GT rules actually prohibited the use of the more sophisticated ZR1 components. For example, the ZR1 is equipped with carbon-composite brake rotors, while GT regulations require ferrous (steel) brake discs. And, where the ZR1 utilizes a 6.2L, supercharged V-8, the C6.R will use a naturally aspirated small-block, production-based 5.5L V-8. The Corvette C6.R race cars' 5.5-liter Chevrolet small-block V8s are developed, built and maintained by GM. The Corvette C6.Rs' LS5.5R is a naturally aspirated race engine, based on the Corvette Z06's 7.0-liter LS7 engine (which in turn was developed with the 7.0L race engine used in the C6.R GT1 cars), built on production cast-aluminum cylinder blocks. Pending GT2 class regulations specify a maximum displacement of 5.5 liters, the reduction in displacement to meet this requirement was achieved by shortening the crankshaft stroke and reducing the cylinder bore diameter. In accordance with the regulations, the race engines have two 28.8mm diameter intake air restrictors. The LS5.5R engines are equipped with dry-sump oiling systems, CNC-ported aluminum cylinder heads with titanium intake and exhaust valves, and sequential electronic port fuel injection. The race engines use E85R ethanol racing fuel in the ALMS and E10 fuel in Le Mans. I thought that new GEN V, which this new 5.5 l v8 should be based on, will have new block with cam in higher position, DI etc, not the engine which is basically ls7 engine with smaller bore and stroke. Dwightlooi any info on this?

Here is something from Mercedes. New DOHC 5.5 l v8 engine with Twin turbo I think that Gen V with DI, VVT , and supercharger (or maybe GM will start using turbochargers on their V8) could easily surpasse that number. This is around 100 hp/l. LS9 develops that much and i think GEN V could go even further (with flat torque curve ). So the top engine in Mercedes will soon be 5.5 l TT v8. And top engine in GM will also very soon be 5.5 l v8 (supercharged or turbocharged), if there isn't anything biger planned. Can wait to see real spec. when top engine from GM come out.

I have read somewhere that ultra V8 engine (which was cancelled) was finished before GM pull the plug on it. Now that engine was supposed to have Direct injection, VVT , Dohc heads, 4 valves per cylinder etc. But GM didn't want to spend money for investing in engine plant necessary equipment etc. (or something like that). Dwightlooi will probably now more about this. I was thinking..if GM doesn't want to spend money needed to build that engine but they already developed it etc. maybe they could outsource some company to build that engine for them if there is need for let say cadillac with DOHC v8 (maybe cosworth, illmor, mclaren etc)

I can see GM implementing this type of VVT in their future LS series (if future small block will be called LS series at all because all i've read is that for now is being called Gen V).

I know i've read somewhere about dohc SBC. I hope GM will also make some effort in looks department. This was also nice looking engine from GM (lt-5)

Will this GEN V engine be new engine with new block?? If they will change position of cam in block they would need new block i assume. Will this engine be also smaller in size and not just displacement? I think i've read some year ago that there could be two version; one with cam in block and one with cams in head. I know that it is possible but what are the chances GM would make such block.

Rolls Royce is different league from cadillac and at the present moment out of reach for Caddy.If GM had money and a will they could aim at Mercedes (which is probably standard of the world if we don't include ultraluxury -small-number -selling cars) but caddy don't have any car which can't compete against c class or S class. CTS is E class competitor (at least here in Europe) but at present moment it offers only 3 different engine. They need v8 for below V series model and v12 ( nd big rwd or awd sedan) if they thinking about going after germans. But since GM doesn't have money i doubt they will go after German trio.

And a 4 wheels I expect gen V engine in it. Maybe turbocharged v6 in some base version of it.

Yes i remeber that. But all that was before GM decided not to build ultra v8 (which was supposed to come in 2009) and decided not to put any more money in development of new V8 engines and keeping cam in block design for v8 engines. I didn't heard any rumors about this DOHC engines since then. But there is rumors about Gen V being pushrod engines with DI, VVT ,AFM, and smaller displacement.