vt_hokie

I'm going to have to vote not. I think that nose is incredibly ugly. I can't stand the oversized, ungainly headlight assemblies, the gaudy chrome strip, or the smiley face look with that grille/bumper design. I think the Pontiac G6 is a much better looking car. And with the dent resistant plastic panels gone, what reason is there to choose Saturn over the divisions, especially if Saturn's still going to charge MSRP?

That two door hatchback isn't a bad looking car, but I would hope Saturn would offer a 4 door sedan and maybe a conventional coupe and a wagon. Not everybody wants a hatch, after all. Still, no new Saturns for me unless they bring back the dent resistant body panels.

My 1997 Saturn SL2 gave me 220,000 miles and was practically bulletproof until the last 20k miles or so (when I finally decided it wasn't worth pouring money into repairs). Saturn proved that GM could embrace change and do things as well as the Japanese. But I always wondered if GM would screw up a good thing, and sure enough, it did. By killing every unique aspect of Saturn and turning it into just another division selling rebadged old school GM stuff, GM has ensured that I have purchased my last new Saturn vehicle, and quite possibly my last vehicle from General Motors. Oh, and with its polymer body panels, my SL2 looked better than any Honda Civic or Toyota Corolla would have looked after 220,000 miles! Naturally, GM has decided to do away with those polymer body panels on future Saturns!

I haven't read the article or this entire thread, but I have to wonder how much GM hurt itself by giving the G6 a relatively low output OHV engine and a 4 speed automatic at a time when the imports are moving up to the 250 hp range with their DOHC engines and offering 5 and even 6 speed automatic transmissions. Sure, the more expensive GTP has 240 hp, but only gets 26 mpg highway with the old 4 speed auto.

Okay then, the Accord offers a 244 hp 3.0 liter VVT V-6 rated at 29 mpg highway with the 5 speed automatic. In order to get up to that hp level on the G6, you've got to upgrade to the GTP model, and that's only rated at 26 mpg highway and comes with a 4 speed automatic. It's no wonder GM keeps losing market share. They still insist on coming out with cars that are almost up to par, but never quite there. Why does GM still use a 4 speed auto mated to the old pushrod engine on a car that's coming in as an underdog attempting to steal some sales back from the aforementioned competition?

If Saturn = Opel now, why don't they just rename the division Opel?

Which is what I just did (replaced my 1997 SL2 after 220,000 miles with a used 2000 SL2). And while I'd really like to get a new car, I guess I'll continue to buy used until someone offers a new car that I like with a body at least as rugged as my Saturn's.

That may well be true, but I wish that at least one other automaker would pick up where Saturn left off and give people the choice of getting a car with dent resistant body panels. I don't understand why more people don't care, especially when the middle class struggles more with an increasing cost of living every year. The average price of a new car is up to $30,000, which is a hell of a lot of money for most people. But, I guess people are just used to living in debt, trading in a car every couple of years rather than keeping it for the long term and always making car payments. And maybe some people don't care about dings and dents, but I personally don't want to spend 30 grand on a vehicle that's going to look like crap after a few years' worth of real world use. In any case, it would be nice if all of the different automakers offered some diversity to consumers, instead of selling 40 different versions of essentially the same product.

Blah blah blah...bring back the dent resistant plastic body panels, and maybe I'll be interested in Saturn again.

Yes, I rented a 3.5 liter 2006 Pontiac G6. I was the first person to rent it, and I drove it off the Avis lot with like 6 miles on the odometer! I was impressed with the car. I hadn't even really been considering the G6 until I rented that one. I had been leaning toward buying a Mazda 3s at the time, but when a small car like the Mazda 3 can only get 30 mpg highway out of a 160 hp 2.3 liter engine, and a midsize G6 can get better mileage with a 3.5 liter V-6, well, it makes it hard to justify getting an "economy" car! Still, 201 hp out of 3.5 liters and ~8 seconds 0 - 60 are very mediocre numbers for what GM advertises as "one of the best cars in the world". With competition like the 240 hp Honda Accord, with its reputation for reliability and refinement, GM needs to do better in order to regain market share. And as I said before, check out the specs on that new Toyota Avalon! 268 hp, 248 lb-ft peak torque, 0 - 60 in under 7 seconds, and still rated at 31 mpg highway!

This is exactly why I probably won't be buying a G6 or any new car for that matter. I would be pretty excited about the Saturn Aura, despite the ugly headlights, if they gave it the dent resistant polymer body panels. But sadly, GM decided to do away with that feature to save money and sell minimally modified Opels as Saturns. So, until some other automaker offers a car that can withstand normal parking lot abuse without looking like crap after a couple of years, I'm going to stick with cheap used cars, as much as I'd like to have a new vehicle. :(

I couldn't agree more! The ION was a very poor replacement for the S Series. It's like they said, "Let's take the S Series, downgrade components, make it less efficient and slower, and give it really cute styling that would appeal to a 14 year old girl." I just bought a used 2000 SL2 to replace my '97 (which had 220,000 miles on it). I wish I had purchased a 2002 SL2 before they were discontinued. The only thing I didn't like about the later S Series Saturns is that they eliminated 4 wheel disc brakes, and had rear drums on all trim levels. A harbinger of things to come, I guess. Even the name ION is too "cute"...it's like they decided to write off straight males entirely in their marketing! Had I known it would be the last good Saturn, I would have bought a 2002 SL2 in black or charcoal, with every option including alloy wheels, spoiler, sunroof, fog lamps, etc. Fully loaded used Saturns are very rare, I have found. I settled on one with alloys, ABS/traction, dual CD/cassette, but no spoiler, sunroof, or fog lamps. If you were to give the Mazda 3 dent resistant polymer body panels, that would be pretty close to what the S Series replacement should have been!

If the G6 GTP's 3.9 liter could get over 30 mpg highway, like the new DOHC designs of equivalent hp from Toyota or Honda, then I'd have no problem with it.

Still beats the G6 GTP, which needs 3.9 liters in order to get 240 hp (still less than the 3.6 liter LaCrosse) and is only rated at 26 mpg highway. I'll be curious to see what the production version looks like then. Yeah, the Camry is falling behind the competition. I don't know why anybody would choose a Camry over a Honda Accord. Oh, and the G6 3.5 only gets 32 mpg highway in the cheap version. If you want the sport shift transmission, you lose 3 mpg.

The Saab 9-3 is a nice car, but I'm not really a Saab guy. I'd get a Subaru Legacy GT before I got a Saab. As for the Toyota Camry, I can't stand it.

I think the CTS is ugly. I don't like angular, boxy, or in your face designs. I like a nice, well proportioned, sleek and streamlined but somewhat conservative and understated look. That seems exceedingly rare these days, unfortunately. The G6 sedan is one of the few new cars that I actually like the looks of. The Subaru Legacy would be another example.

Guess I'll have to find some other car to buy then, as I don't think I'll be waiting for '07. Sorry GM. I was looking at the specs of the new Toyota Avalon again. 268 hp, 240+ lb ft of torque, 0 - 60 in 6.9 seconds, and still rated at 31 mpg highway! Too bad the Avalon is so butt ugly. :AH-HA_wink: But as for the powertrain, the bar has been set! That Aura does have a nice aggressive stance, like the G6. I just can't stand that smiley face nose with those awful headlights! And I really don't care for that huge lip that runs along the underside and the wheel wells.

Isn't part of the reason for having so many different divisions to let consumers have more of a choice? Otherwise, might as well just have one label called "GM", if all of the cars are going to be similar rebadges. Have Saturn maintain the polymer panels so that those who want them have the choice to get them. Those who care about stupid "panel gaps" and would rather have dents in their car are free to buy from one of the other divisions!

Does the Corvette seem cheap to you then?

That's interesting, but '07 or '08 will be too late for me. GM will lose a sale because of those old pushrod engines, as I don't want a Saturn Aura so I'll likely end up buying an import instead! I don't really care whether the engine is OHC or OHV, but I want the best hp/fuel economy ratio I can get with the most refinement possible. If the Toyota Avalon's 3.5 liter V-6 can put out 268 hp and still get 31 mpg highway, then the 201 hp 3.5 liter pushrod is looking a little outclassed, I'd say! (Not that I'd get an Avalon, but it's just an example.)

Not really. If they're going to sell Opels, why not just rename the division Opel? The Aura isn't a bad looking car, aside from the big smiley face grin on the front and the exaggerated headlights. The concept car has too much "bling" and I can't stand the pimp wheels, but I assume the production model will be toned down a bit. Still, I think the Pontiac G6 is a better looking car. My SL2 will likely still be dent free as the first Auras start getting dings and dents in their steel body panels!

They can and are "moving beyond" the plastic panels in order to save money. But I think that sucks. I really hope that as GM goes bankrupt, some other automaker comes out with some form of dent resistant body panels on its cars.

Without dent resistant polymer body panels, it ain't a Saturn!

Wait, are you saying that the G6 has odd proportions? Quite the contrary, imo! The G6 is a well proportioned sedan. On the other hand, the nose of the Aura could best be described as ungainly! I also don't care for the exaggerated wheel well flares on the Aura. Basically, I would describe the Aura as being a pimped out Dodge Stratus with a very ugly front end! Not all of us want a cute, cuddly, friendly car that looks like it's smiling at you, and that seems to be the image that Saturn is going for. Why give Saturn the better powertrain options, if Pontiac is supposed to be the performance division? How will the G6 stack up against the Aura in terms of performance and power/fuel economy tradeoff? Would the 3.9 liter G6 GTP be able to keep up with the 250 hp 3.6 liter Saturn Aura? Just curious. I'll bet the Aura will beat the G6 GTP's mediocre 26 mpg highway rating, while still delivering more power!

Well, let's put it this way - they're probable if you park in parking lots, which most people have to do at some point. Whether it's at the supermarket (especially with shopping carts rolling around), mall, movie theater, train station, or wherever...sooner or later something is gonna get ya! My 1997 Saturn SL2's plastic body panels still looked as good as new after 8+ years and 220,000 miles! The odds are very high that it wouldn't have held up so well over that span with steel side panels.