G. David Felt

5 minutes ago, ccap41 said:

You just said you still had to wait a few minutes after you were done shopping. That few minutes is all it takes to go from E -> F in an internal combustion vehicle. Until you're charging at home, overnight, there is no real savings or convenience involved. Once your free trial period of public charging has expired, it costs about the same to charge publicly at those fast chargers. 

At home charging is really the only way to save money and time with an EV, when it comes to fuel costs. 

FUD - Unless your driving a subcompact, 5 minute fueling is not true. Compacts to Midsize to Full size can take from 8 to 22 minutes to fuel. If the filters of the gas station are dirty, it can take longer. Yes I realize not everyone drives an Escalade ESV, but that is 22 minutes of standing and fueling at Costco, longer at other stations it seem to be.

Yes, I spent a few minutes waiting, but over all I got all my shopping done, so a few minutes was no different than at a gas station.

I charged this morning for the wife, was 52 degrees outside and the 350kW Electrify America charger did the 80% charge from 14% in 15 minutes and then I left to go get the grandkids and drop them off at school, so the 10 to 80% charge is fast as my Escalade.

6 hours ago, ccap41 said:

How much money did you save because of the interior size? I'm confused by that statement. 

You're publicly charging right now. You're actually spending more time at a charger than you would with any ICE vehicle at a pump. Until you have a home charger, you're spending more time "filling up" than you were before. I'm sure your app or the infotainment screen(s) has charging details. Do you have the number of times it's been plugged in and how long each charge has been? 

So with the price we agreed on for the EV, IRA Rebate and my SS trade in, I dropped the amount that would go in for Leasing by $15,500 from the agreed upon price giving me a reasonable lease rate.

Yes, charging takes longer when you out, but other than the one day that I went and got my walking in so did not go to the gym to work out or jump on the treadmill at home, the other few times I have chartged was all when I needed to do family shopping such as groceries, Amazon returns, new cloth shopping so the time spent charging was nothing as I got other things done I needed to get anyway.

You cannot gas up an auto and shop at the same time. The change in habits is time saving over all as while the auto charges, I was doing other needed things, so I did not loose any time at the pump. 

2 hours ago, Drew Dowdell said:

You need to watch the charger from the app or when you're in the car to see the charge speed you're getting. And, it is odd that it would say "no conditioning needed". Even in 80 degree weather in Florida, the Tesla would condition the battery on the way to the supercharger. 

Temps here have been in the mid 50's both times I charged. While the Charger did not show anything, if your sitting in the EV9 you can monitor it on the screen and it shows you in real time the charging speed as well as in the Kia Connect App and the Electrify America app.

I did notice that the two apps were off by a couple kW but over all were close enough. Kia app was Identical to the EV9 screen monitoring the speed of charging.

On 5/15/2024 at 8:49 AM, Drew Dowdell said:

This sounds like a difference in KWh in chargers more than what percentage you started at.  Plus, you also need to make sure you always use the NAV to tell the car you are heading to a charger. This preconditions the batteries so they will accept the charge faster.  You should always enter the charging station into the NAV even if you know the way there. 

Both chargers were 350 kWh and the battery system in both cases responded that no conditioning was needed as I was heading to the charger. So very interesting observation and will continue to watch the charging.

23 hours ago, ccap41 said:

I thought this was pretty common knowledge amongst the EV community..? 

This is why you'll read the 10-80% or 20-80% charge times, because beyond 80% they slow down a lot, regardless of brand. 

Yes, this is pretty common knowledge, but the difference is that depending on what the level of charge affects how it charges up.  Starting lower is faster overall than having the battery higher. I get that the last 20% will charge much slower but was surprised how slow charging was from 69% compared to 18% and how the last 20% finished. Will be interesting to see how it goes, and I will report back on the updates as I learn.

On 5/7/2024 at 10:13 AM, Drew Dowdell said:

That’s not what I was asking. I think there’s a way to set up your EA profile, either through the car or on your app, that all you do is plug it in and go. You don’t even need to tap.

So have looked all over the EV9 interface and have not found it there nor have I found it in the Kia Connect App or Electrify America App.

UPDATE:

Ugly, if you are wanting to top off the battery pack, it can take way longer than if you drive it to say 20% battery left. Example of this is that my wife was wanting to go down south last week and was going to run around for the whole day so I went to top off the battery as it was at 69%, this took 44 minutes of charging, lucky for me I was at the mall so got my steps in walking around. This compared to last, the wife had the EV9 at 18% battery, stopped by a Walmart where Electrify America has 350 kW chargers also and it only took 33 minutes to charge back to 100%.

Lesson Learned is that it is faster to run the battery down low than to try and top off.

Having had the EV9 now for 20 days, we have put on 1,000 miles and it is very clear, the EV9 is more comfy and has way more interior room for 6 passengers than our Escalade. Yes the Escalade has almost triple the storage behind the 3rd row of seats, but everything else is way better in the EV9 for comfort and space. Kia really packaged the interior well.

UPDATE 2:

Kia Connect has reached out to us to setup a day to answer any questions we may have and to help with features/functions we may have not figured out yet. 

Weird issue, my wife's cell phone seems to keep getting unpaired with the system, not sure why.

Seating is funky, I suspect you have to set Seat position 1 and 2 for each profile. I have not had a chance to test this yet as my wife is busy helping our son and daughter in-law with our new grandson. So by the time she gets home at night, we are both tired and just crash to get sleep. 

Have my companies tradeshow in Vegas next week so will be away and will find out more from Kia the week after.

Have to say that they hit it pretty good as the EV9 continues to impress me daily.

The EV World Will No Longer Be The Same Thanks To The 2024 Kia EV9 (msn.com)

Magical night be it in the city or away for the Solar storm that hit.

Coworker said we would wake up to killer plants. 😆 

17 hours ago, ccap41 said:

"Tired of the Voom, Voom, Voom of a performance Borla exhaust, ... "

Nope. 

Thinking on your response, I realize we all change as life happens. You have a new kid and are in a place that the Voom, Voom, Voom of the Borla exhaust still excites you. For me, I am in a different place as my kids are grown, into their own careers, bought their own homes and are now starting families of their own.

This is where change happens, as we go through listening to our kids and talking with them and still the performance exhaust was fine to me then. Now with my kids having kids of their own, actively being a part of their life and my grandkids life, listening to the grandkids as I help with picking them up and dropping them off at schools before coming home to work myself, Silence is golden. I am at that stage where performance while I enjoy it, has changed in how I enjoy it and so having the silence with no other noise to enjoy my music or have a conversation with the wife, kids, or grandkids makes it one where you choose to give up on certain things. I have chosen to give up on the sound of the old ways of performance autos and embrace the new ways of performance autos. 

Enjoy what you have now as time does change how you view things and what one wants.

Tired of the Voom, Voom, Voom of a performance Borla exhaust, the wife asked for a new ride. This is my journey of what I experienced in working to buy/lease an EV in 2024.

Let me first start off by saying that I am in no way a normal sized human. At 6 foot 6 inches 300 lbs with a 40 inch long legs, I am much larger and big bone than most Americans. My wife being of Korean descent is also larger than most at 5 foot 8 inches compared to the average female height of 5 foot in Korea. The USA census has the average female at 5 foot 4 inches tall and the average male at 5 foot 9 inches tall. With this knowledge of size, subcompacts, compacts are totally out of the question. I know mid-size to full-size is where our EV choices will be.

My journey started with me asking myself, what are the Pro's and Cons of buying versus leasing an Electric Vehicle (EV).

This image above pretty much wraps up what I came up with for leasing versus buying an EV and there was just one last thing to consider, technology. Battery Technology, controller boards and software are all in their infancy and as such will be probably changing greatly over the next few years. Do I take on the risk of buying and having the OEM stop updates to my EV or do I lease and go with trading it in and getting current technology in a new EV two or three years later?

2023 was an explosive year for auto companies as everyone was pushing to get an EV on the marketplace. Some made it with less than stellar results and others delivered. Trucks, SUVs and cars pretty much allowed one to have a selection of what style of EV they wanted. For my wife and I we had already decided to ignore the cars and focus on the SUVs and Trucks. With that in mind we made up the following list of EV companies to consider.

• BMW
• Cadillac
• Ford
• Genesis
• Hyundai
• Kia
• Mercedes
• Rivian
• Tesla

A busy weekend ensued and the experiences of driving so many different EVs showed where some succeeded and others fell short. Clearly some are still holding onto ICE (internal combustion engine) legacy engineering approach and others delivered on what is called a clean sheet design. Here was our weekend experience with the following brands:

• BMW - iX was a nice drive, interface experience was fine, it actually had plenty of room in the front, a little tighter in the back but for short drives, another person my size could sit behind me and would be fine. Exterior is a styling love / hate experience. Wife is not a fan of the huge kidney bean grill; she said it looked like a pig nose on steroids. The side profile was fine, and the back end looked like it was pinched in molding the design. Android Auto / Apple Carplay supported, overall, it would still be considered. Salesperson was polite and not pushy.
• Cadillac - Lyriq was the quietest drive of the day, Cadillac has nailed it, fast, solid and overall, a luxury EV ride. Interior over all was good, a little tight on head space with the sky roof, but the seat goes down far enough to adjust for that, interface of the dash was good. Android Auto / Apple Carplay is supported for the 2024 model year but is supposedly going away for the 2025 model year being replaced with the GM play store. Exterior styling my wife was fine with, better front end looks than the BMW. Would be on the consideration list. Salesperson was polite and not pushy. Nice balance of buttons to touch screen.
• Ford - Test drove an F150 Lighting and the Mach e, interior was fine, she liked the space and comfort. Was hoping for a midsize pickup truck, so ruled out the Lighting. Mach e she liked, both fit comfortably and clearly anyone could sit behind me my size and smaller. Android Auto / Apple Carplay supported. Major dislike was the salesperson who was very pushy and made comments that told my wife he was a male chauvinistic pig. He actually told me to man up as the wife would drive whatever I decided since I was the man. Big mistake as we do everything in equal partnership, so his approach failed to work. Mach e is still in consideration, we will go with another salesperson, maybe even another dealership.
• Genesis - GV60 / GV70, exterior was fine, though the GV60 she did say reminded her of a jellybean. Interior was very luxurious, but no one could sit behind me in the GV60, would be fine for short trips in the GV70. Android Auto / Apple Carplay supported. Interface was easy to use. She loved the interior but had reservations on the exterior but could not put her finger on it. GV70 would be in consideration. Nice balance of buttons to touch screen.
• Hyundai - Ioniq 5 SUV. She was not wowed by the exterior, felt it was sitting a bit low, bunker style, yet interior had plenty of room, Android Auto / Apple Carplay supported. Solid candidate to consider. Salesperson was nice, normal pushy attempts to have us make a decision, but as we told him, we still had others to test drive. Nice balance of buttons to touch screen.
• Kia - EV6 / EV9 - Exterior was not bad, was clearly different than many of the other EVs we had seen. EV6 is super tight inside for me, was fine for the wife as was the interface of their dashboard. No one could sit behind me. EV6 was out she said. EV9 was great, more room inside than our Escalade. Anyone could sit behind me, spacious for both of us and would transport anyone in comfort. Liked the exterior styling much more than many of the others we had test drove to date. Android Auto / Apple Carplay supported. Salesperson super nice and not pushy. Solid candidate. Nice balance of buttons to touch screen.
• Mercedes - EQS, interior was nice, driving was the second quietest behind the Cadillac. Interface was fine, but lower menus seemed cluttered. We liked the interior for the most part, the hard part of this EV was the exterior lack of any real styling. The worst Jellybean style around. Android Auto / Apple Carplay supported, Salesperson was super nice and not pushy, but as we told him when we thanked him for his time, the auto needs an identity. Wife said for her daily driver, this was a hard pass.
• Rivian - R1T / R1S - Exterior was a win for the wife right up there with the EV9 from Kia. Interior was also a big win as it was spacious and comfortable front and back. Interface was easy to use, over all a nice balance of buttons to touch screen. Sadly, Rivian is off the list as she asked the counselor about Android Auto / Apple Carplay, no support, no plan to support it. Must buy your apps from the Rivian store, failure big time we felt. Bummer as Rivian was a leading candidate for us.
• Tesla - Due to friends who have Tesla, even with her knowing my dislike for the Tesla CEO, she wanted to check out the Y / X. Overall the experience in talking with their counselor was good, good people skills, they went over the interface with the wife, in the meantime she saw that while I could fit in the Y, no one could sit behind me. in the X I could also fit, but only about 2 inches of space from the back of the seat to the back seat. Wife asked about Android Auto and Apple Carplay, they told her no plans, they offered her a test drive and she passed. Told me it was a bit weird in how you used the single interface in the center of the dash and a few other things, minimalist failure to her. Pass on Tesla.

Now that we had spent a long weekend driving so many EVs, I asked her what her thoughts were on what she was leaning towards. She told me give her a few weeks to digest the information and she would let me know. While the wife digested the EV overload of info, I moved onto researching the EV technology of these auto makers.

Auto EV Platform Info 2024.pdf

One key item is that I do not want to be behind the 8 ball of technology standards. In this case, I am talking about companies that are on 400V platforms versus 800V platforms. in this case, this brings us down to the following, Cadillac, Genesis, Hyundai and Kia as everyone else is on 400V platforms and already have announced that 2025 and 2026 model years will be the conversion to new 800V platforms.

Knowing my wife, one does not rush her, when she is ready, she will let me know, weeks passed by and finally one day at breakfast, she said I have an answer for you. I like the Cadillac Lyriq and the Kia EV9 the best. I want heated seats, steering wheel and AWD, otherwise I could care less about other features.

In looking on the websites for my local dealerships, the Cadillac dealership that I have bought from before was sold during the pandemic to Brotherton Cadillac of Renton. So Brotherton Cadillac NW is the dealership near me, and the wife and I reviewed all the Lyriqs and settled on the following:  Cadillac Lyriq Sport 2 AWD Celestial Metallic. This paint color is a color shifting paint that covers purple to silver / grey spectrum depending on the light of the day and especially as I discovered sun versus rain. In the sun it is a radiant purplish color and under dark raining weather a serious silver/dark grey.

Chuck Olson Kia which is less than a mile away from Brotherton Cadillac NW on HWY 99 here in the greater Seattle area had a nice assortment EV9s in Wind, Land and GT versions. They had the traditional blue GT and an Ice Green that the wife really liked. So I settled on the Ice Green to test drive and see what the final price would be.

Again, like the Lyriq, the ICE Green metallic paint job has a dominant blueness but turns various shades of lite green to greenish blue depending on the light of the day.

At this point we get to the nitty gritty of the dealing, Price paid, rebates, final pricing to determine what the deal ends up being. Over dinner, the wife and I discussed the options of buying versus leasing and to both of us, it made sense at this early stage to lease rather than buy an EV. The addition of the IRA $7,500 rebate also played into our decision. For Cadillac the Lyriq qualifies again for the full $7,500 rebate whether you buy or lease, in the case of the Kia, due to manufacturing in Korea, the EV9 only qualifies for the rebate if you lease. This fall, Kia and Hyundai start manufacturing in the US allowing their EVs to get the full $7,500 rebate if buying.

For me, I wanted to see what a zero down Lease deal would be as a starting point before paying down. Depending on credit rating, most auto leases require anywhere from $3,000 to $10,000 down and of course the more you pay down, the lower your monthly payment is.

The nature of my work allows me flexibility and as such, I was able to go on a Friday morning at 10am to the Brotherton Cadillac NW to test drive the Lyriq Sport 2 edition. In fact the EV is still on the lot now almost two weeks later.

New 2024 Blue Cadillac 4dr Sport w/1SJ LYRIQ for Sale North of Seattle, VIN = 1GYKPVRL1RZ127387 (brothertoncadillacnw.com)

Upon driving onto the lot, I parked and saw the Lyriq as it shinned in the morning sun giving that purplish glow that my wife liked. I walked up and checked it out externally and it looked great. After about 10 minutes of checking the Lyriq out, I was still not approached by anyone, so I went into the sales floor and asked if I could talk with someone about a Lyriq. First salesperson said I needed to talk to their EV specialist and walked away, a second person came out of a side hallway and asked if I was being taken care of and I told them what just happened, and I was still standing here. He did apologize and asked me to wait just a moment and he would get the specialist. 

A young man came out, introduced himself and asked me if I had any special model in mind and if I wanted to take a test drive. I took him out to show him the one I was interested in. He took down their special code and left to get the keys. At this point, over all experience with the dealership was not bad, neutral for me as it is nothing personal, just business and some do it better than others.

The sales rep returned with the keys, he opened up the Lyriq and took me on a tour of the auto pointing out many of the features and explaining the functional differences between how it works on the EV versus an ICE auto. This I have to say was very welcomed as it showed me the man had knowledge of the auto and could show / explain to me how it was to be used. I appreciate this as my wife is not a tech person but show her how to do it and she it set, so this was a good start. We did the traditional driver's license and insurance validation, signed on the dotted line and I then took off for a road trip in the Lyriq. Android auto works as expected, over all interface was easy to understand and use with a nice balance of common used items in physical form right under the screen. Steering wheel had all the expected buttons and dials for using the auto. The Noise canceling of the auto gave it a quiet ride that I have never experienced before and still to this day is the best yet of all the EVs I have test driven. 

Negative of the Lyriq is that it is not a true SUV, you sit lower more car like and headroom while I would be fine, required me to drop the seat to the bottom of it's settings which makes my driving position even lower. Knowing that this is the wife's auto, I returned to the dealership to talk price.

Here is where things started to go south and why people hate dealerships.

I tried my best to negotiate in good faith for a fair price on the EV. The dealership replied that it was the hottest ride available and as such no discounts, you paid the price they had on the auto which was MSRP plus $5,000. I informed them that no I was not going to pay over MSRP for an auto that shows over 300 are available in the greater Seattle area. 

The Dealership then said fine, they would sell it at MSRP to me. Knowing that I get $7,500 off I was not put off by this but also not happy that they would not go down on the price. I told them at this point I was interested in leasing and wanted to see what the lease rate would be for 15,000 miles a year for three years. Here is where it got ugly. 

The sales rep came back to me and had a handwritten piece of paper with a TRD (Total after Rebates and Discounts) price, Lease money factor number, Residual price and monthly payment including tax. The monthly payment was a little over $1,200 a month. I asked to see firm numbers showing the selling price minus the IRA rebate, tax, etc. all lined up so that I can understand the numbers. I was informed this is how leases are done, your rebate is figured into the residual amount and that this is all the accurate info they provide the buyer. If I agree to this, they can then process and sell me the Lyriq.

I told the man that this handwritten paper did not explain any of what I asked to verify and see, so they would need to properly print out or hand write all details in order for me to make a decision. The rep left and was gone for about 10 minutes and then came back with another salesperson who reminded me of a traditional wild west snake oil salesman who tried to use the same paper I was shown and yet tell me I was not able to understand the complexities of leases and should trust him on this awesome monthly cost.

When I told him I would not accept that vague random info, he then moved into the terrible game of "What can you afford a month?" Here is where many people either give up and accept or leave as they feel overwhelmed, I on the other hand laughed and told him that I would not play his game. Show me the valid real numbers with a final price on the Lyriq before processing for the Lease monthly amount. 

My wife always told me I was a very frustrating person when it came to buying an auto as I would push for facts and have on more than one occasion made salespeople cry when they could not get their way playing their monthly afford game. This is how people get ripped off and taken advantage of. The two folks left and came back with the sales manager who tried again with the paper to spin a different tale. At this point, I said fine, I would consider this as I needed to talk with the wife, and she would need to drive the auto anyway before we would buy. 

Leaving the Cadillac dealership, I drove south to Chuck Olson Kia, figured I would see how the EV9 drove again and see what kind of deal I could get.

Arriving at the dealership, I saw the EV9 I was interested in on the lot, looked it over and turned around to see if I can get some help and a young man greeted me and said he was with another customer, but would let another salesperson know I was looking at that EV9. Only a few minutes later, the sales rep came out, greeted me and had the keys so he opened up the EV and showed me the SUV. 

Here the experience was similar in that we took the EV9 in Ice Green for a drive. As I drove it, I was informed about the various features and how they all worked. An overview that was enjoyable as I drove the near silent EV locally. I did notice that it was not as quiet as the Lyriq, but most would not really notice the difference, everything else on the road was far louder.

We returned to the dealership and sat down; I asked the rep for the best price on this EV9 he could give me. He left to talk to his manager. Now I was comparing the price of the Lyriq Sport level 2 to this EV9 AWD Land edition and the MSRP price between the two was within a hundred dollars of each other. The EV9 had a number of features that the Lyriq did not have unless I paid substantially more and go to the top end Sport Level 3.

At this point the Kia was winning on features giving it a better value due to the two being priced nearly the same.

The sales rep came back to the table with a price that was $5,000 off MSRP. I felt based on internet searching that this was a fair price and felt it was good. I asked him then at this price with my IRA rebate of $7,500 what would a three-year lease with 15,000 miles a year cost me per month. The rep said give him a few minutes to have the manager put this in the system and he would come back with a detailed price for me.

The salesperson returned about 10 minutes later with a Deal Sheet for me to review. Here is where the difference became clear between this Kia Dealership and the Cadillac Dealership. The Deal Sheet had all the numbers listed out clearly. Any person could walk through this in full understanding.

The lease deal, started off with the Stock number for the EV9, had the MSRP listed, discount, then Selling price of the EV9. This was followed by a blank field for accessories or add on sales items as the sales rep explained. The rebate for $7,500 was clearly listed, blank space for Trade, cash cap reduction, license fee, doc fee ending in a final price of the EV that was then broken down by 36 months @ 15,000 miles a year for a Base monthly rental cost and then the sales tax on the whole deal which was broken down into monthly tax rate added to the monthly lease amount. Residual value at the end of the lease, a residual money factor that is a decimal number used to figure out the monthly lease rate.

All in all, a very clear understandable deal and the monthly price for the EV9 was $837 per month compared to $1,200 plus for the Cadillac. I told the salesperson that I would need to talk to my wife when she got home tonight and would give him a call back. As I was getting ready to leave, I realized I had forgotten to ask an important question. Could the front driver and passenger windows be tinted to match the rest of the auto. Due to having had skin cancer, blocking out UV plus just having it darker is what I prefer. The sales rep said he believed so but would have to check with his manager and could call me if I gave him my number later. I left him my cell number and headed home.

Sitting at home, I was thinking about the experience at the Cadillac dealership and wondering, can it really be that bad at any other dealership? So, I did a search and found the identical Cadillac Lyriq Sport 2 AWD Celestial Metallic at the Bellevue Cadillac dealership and much farther away at Larson Cadillac of Fife. Off to Bellevue I went.

Arriving at the Bellevue Cadillac dealership, I was promptly greeted and professionally questioned on the auto I was interested in. The young man was always polite and more than happy to help me. This dealership is one of the newly built from the ground up dealerships that truly echo's Luxury and what I would expect from a luxury dealership.

Due to the knowledge of the salesperson like the other dealership, it started off positive, went out to check and see if the auto their website stated they had on hand was actually there. It was, Identical to the one at Brotherton Cadillac NW in Shoreline Washington. At this point, I gave him the same info I had given the other person to see what the pricing would be.

Ten minutes later he returned with a printed sheet of paper, that was better than handwritten. Had a set sale price that was a couple thousand off the MSRP, had a rebate of $1,000 showing a reduced price, document fee, licensing and a theft engraving that he said they do on all autos sold there so nothing I could do about not wanting it. The total at the end showed a lease money factor, term, mileage and residual with a base payment of $1,042 dollars. with no money down. 

Now two things I noticed, one was that the IRA rebate was not showing anywhere on the paperwork and the second item was that at least their price was over $200 less than the other dealership. I inquired about the $7,500 rebate and he said he did not know and would go ask. Upon returning he said it was factored into the residual value of the Lyriq when I traded it back in.

I pointed out that the rebate does not go into a value of the vehicle but is paid to the dealership and so comes off the price of the auto. Things continued to go downhill from here as I was told by him that I did not understand how leasing worked. His sales manager stopped by, and I pointed this out, same response, I do not understand how leasing works. I informed them that I would need to present this to my wife and discuss it with her. They attempted the pressure response of get her on the phone, we can explain it and you can drive home in your new EV. They were not happy with me and would not let me have the paperwork. When they stepped out to talk, I snapped a quick picture of the printed paperwork.

Two Cadillac dealerships, two different lease prices on the identically spec / priced Lyriq Sport 2 and no honest showing of where the rebate would end up at. 

Heading home this made me wonder about Cadillac and their EV focus which we have since learned in the news has changed to having ICE and EV through 2030 and beyond.

At home, I explained my day of EV shopping to the wife, she was disappointed that Cadillac was not forthcoming with their pricing. She liked the looks of the Lyriq as much as the looks of the Kia EV9. At this point the phone rang, and it was the sales rep for Kia. He informed me that yes, the doors could be tinted and that his sales manager if we were willing to move forward with the deal would throw in the front window tinting. We setup an appointment for Saturday morning to go and test drive the EV9 with the wife to ensure she would be happy driving it.

For full details on our EV9 Purchase read this story:

Now at this point, I figured I would relax for the evening, but I got another phone call from a sales rep at Larson Cadillac who informed me that the Lyriq I was interested was already sold at their dealership, but he could make me another deal on a like existing Lyriq, different color. I informed him that my wife liked the 800V Lyriq in the Celestial Metallic. The man on the other end of the phone said he could see if they could do a trade to get what we were interested in, but he wanted me to understand that the Lyriq was not a true 800V EV. I was surprised by his comment and asked him why it was not a true 800V EV. I learned and have verified that the only EV GM makes that truly can handle 350 kW fast charging is the Hummers, the Lyriq has an 800V electrical system, but the battery packs are first generation and as such only rated at 400V meaning they have a top charging speed of 150 kW. GM is planning to roll out 800V battery packs starting with the Chevrolet and GMC full size pickups. All other EVs will continue to use the 400V battery packs for now. At this point, I thanked the man for his time and would think on it and get back to him.

As a person wanting to be current, this takes me to the Kia EV9 only. I did not say anything to my wife about the tech and hoped she would be happy with how it drove. Luckily that was a success the next day.

I have spent half my life on the sales side and in training new sales folks there is a pretty basic 5 step process in sales:

1) Greet the customer inquiring what brought them in today 2) Qualify the person on what they want 3) Trial close to see if they are ready 4) Clarify questions and overcome concerns 5) Close the Sale.

To accomplish this basic 5 steps, you first have to fully train the individual in what they are selling. Here Cadillac clearly is not or possibly the dealerships are not wanting to ensure everyone know how to sell an EV.

Recap of this whole shopping experience is that Kia is nailing it with a professional sales experience, knowledgeable people on their products and a sales / lease process that is clear hiding nothing from allowing you to commit to buying or leasing a new auto.

Cadillac on the other hand has left me with the feeling of snake oil salespersons at both dealerships with vague pricing, vague rebates and me wondering just how much they really want to earn my repeat business as I would love to replace my current Escalade with an Escalade IQ, but at this point, Genesis the luxury brand for Hyundai / Kia will reveal their Full Size GV90 ICE/Hybrid/Electric SUV summer of 2024 and I might just be replacing it with a Genesis.

Any questions, ask away.

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On 5/7/2024 at 7:01 PM, smk4565 said:

That's an exciting purchase, EV is tempting to me, but I still think all these current Gen EV's are too expensive compared to ICE cars.  If they can cut weight and cost 15% then I think the flood gates open on EV sales.

Let me put it this way, The amount of money I saved with the interior having more room inside than my current Escalade and the silent comfort, It is a win to me with not having to deal with any of the ICE maintenance or gas trips. My leasing / buying story should help enlighten you on why leasing an EV is a good thing right now. I am also putting in a Level 2 charger at the house that will be another story on the research, cost, etc. So you can follow up on that story too.

UPDATE: Realized a BIG BIG Benefit to having an EV on a Hot day, Seattle yesterday and this weekend is in the 80's. I live in a Split level home, meaning that the two car garage is under the upstairs bedrooms. I have a gas furnace in the garage so the garage is always warm, but with ICE you bring in the Hot Engine with the auto when you park so the Garage gets really HOT. With EV, no heat generation like an ICE and the Garage stays much cooler.

31 minutes ago, Drew Dowdell said:

That’s not what I was asking. I think there’s a way to set up your EA profile, either through the car or on your app, that all you do is plug it in and go. You don’t even need to tap.

Oh, very interesting, will have to look into that. I have been so busy with work, I got my wife setup and have not had much time to learn since she drives it 99% of the time.

15 minutes ago, ccap41 said:

Yeah, those things are massive when up close to them. They really are cool vehicles to be around and look at. I wouldn't hate to own one, but I cannot see myself ever actually buying one. 

They take up 1 1/2 charger spaces in parking, so I am sure others are not thrilled to have them in the charging lots. Twice the price of my EV9 and yet I am not sure I would have really get anything extra by having a hummer. Course if they gave it to me I would take it.

46 minutes ago, Drew Dowdell said:

I thought this had plug-n-charge?

My EV9 came with a 110/240 plug in charger with 9ft cord. Wife was going to see a family member, so since we only have 110 in the garage right now, and you get 1000 kW hours of free charging with Electrify America, I ran over to do a fast charge.

Saw this in the wild, uglier than ever, true love hates on the design. Interesting that this last weekend was busy with seeing these and all had wraps on.

In the office today, crazy how busy the chargers were and mostly Tesla, Kia, Hyundai and Ford charging.

Saw only the second time ever a GMC Hummer in the wild. Very big and brickish. Unbelievable in how big it is in person and cool charging on the front indicator.

 

4 hours ago, ccap41 said:

That's actually a horrible comparison. Any auto review by MSN is crap. 

"here's the spec sheet" is about all they give you. 

MSN just reposts stories they pay for, it is Marketwatch who wrote it, but it is the first I have seen showing the details of the two SUVs side by side. Not great but cool none the less to at least quickly compare the two. Kia gave me lots of value for what I got in my EV9 compared to Rivian. IMHO

Cool Comparison review.

The 2024 Kia EV9 and the Rivian R1S compared: Which of these 3-row electric SUVs is better? (msn.com)

Very impressive video of the Escalade IQ. I can see it as an executive luxury ride in this format that they show here. Have to wonder what the DE contented versions will look like.

Is this Escalade the most iconic CADILLAC of all time? | Watch (msn.com)

Some very cool tech in a Robot heavily automated new Office building.

Hyundai Motor and Kia’s DAL-e Delivery Robot Arrives, Ready to Revolutionize Indoor Autonomous Delivery Services

This Boston Robot with Hyundai reminds me of MAVE that was in the movie love and monsters.

An Electric New Era for Atlas | Boston Dynamics

An Electric New Era for Atlas | Boston Dynamics

Wish I was that flexible.

18 hours ago, ccap41 said:

Congrats!

I can't wait to only hear the good things about this vehicle! Hahaha

I promise to point out the bad as well.

I actually have hit one thing that is bizarre, their printed owner's manual if very much behind their software update interface, as such there are features that has no instructions on using. I get that the printing happens early, but even Kia Connect, their online presence does not cover some of the stuff that has been updated with the latest OTA update we got this week.

Another weird issue is that when you setup the Kia Connect software on your smartphone and invite the wife in this case, it links your two accounts and as such the setting 1 and setting 2 for seat positions, mirrors, environment settings, etc. get merged and you have to unlink your accounts to then have individual settings. Again, nowhere documented. 

Kia Connect online community is a good thing as plenty of folks have posted in it to help each other out on how to do things since the existing documentation from the company is not there. I can see where this would be frustrating for a non-tech person to use the advanced features successfully. 

The EV otherwise drives like any other auto and the wife already did her first trip to the south end to deal with her side of the family and was very happy at the efficiency of the EV in power used.

OTA process is very slick and smooth. You can do it at the time it prompts you, do it when you go to turn off the auto, it will process in the background after you shut off the EV or schedule a time to have the OTA applied.

Have to say the Dealership experience has surpassed anything I have experienced in the shopping process at any other auto company.

I have a Leasing/Buying an EV in 2024 story coming documenting the experience of getting this EV.

So did my first high speed charging at the Electrify America charging station near my house. Was very easy to use with the account on my phone. Pretty much, I backed into the open spot, plugged in the charging cable and then tapped my phone to the NFS point and it did the handshake and started charging.

Since this station is near a Target, I went and did our grocery shopping while it charged, got back with a few minutes left on charging and then disconnected and drove away. Easy Peasy.

Back in December 2023, my wife mentioned to me that she was getting a little tired after 15 years of the Voom Voom Voom of her SS. The sound of the Borla factory exhaust was not what she wanted to hear in a daily driver. I had originally bought this in 2008 for her when, after our kids had finished college, she wanted to fulfill her life dream of getting an advanced education. She started her college career driving our Escalade ESV to the University of Washington campus and finding that a full-size SUV was hard to park in the garages of compact parking spaces with minimal regular parking spaces.

Let's put this all in perspective: the Escalade ESV has 345hp, 380 lb.-ft of torque with V8, 14 mpg average, a curb weight of 5,911lbs, 10 inches of ground clearance, 79.5 inches wide, 75 inches tall, 221.4 inches long and a wheelbase of 130 inches. A comfy, quiet auto that is just big but makes driving very comfortable. 0 to 60 mph of 6.2 seconds.

I replaced it with a Trailblazer SS, Corvette-inspired powertrain that makes 390hp, 400 lb.-ft of torque with V8, 12 mpg average, curb weight of 4,496lbs, 7.8-inch ground clearance, 74.7 inches wide, 67.8 inches tall, 191.8 inches long and a wheelbase of 113 inches. An auto designed for performance with a Borla exhaust that lets folks know you are here. 0 to 60 of 5.9 seconds.

Kia EV9 Land AWD Long Range edition with relaxation package has 379hp, 516 lb.-ft of torque electric, 80 MPGe average, curb weight 5,886lbs, 7.8 inches of ground clearance, 77.9 inches wide, 70.1 inches tall, 197.1 inches long and a wheelbase of 122 inches. 0 to 60 of 4.4 seconds. The relaxation package adds heated and cooled seats to the second row along with calf leg support on both the first and second-row seats, allowing for lazy boy reclining comfort.

The differences of the EV over the SS are as follows: 11hp less, 116 lb.-ft of torque more, 1,400 lbs. heavier, 3.2 inches wider, 2.3 inches taller, 5.6 inches longer, wheelbase is 9 inches longer along with 1.5 seconds faster. The EV comes with the following driving modes: eco, normal, sport, snow, and custom. You can clearly tell that the suspension tightens up in Sport mode, much tighter than the SS ever was even though both had 20-inch rims with identical size tires. The longer wheelbase here allows the EV to have a very comfortable ride still while spirited in driving; back in Normal mode, it rides on par with my Escalade with a Magna ride.

What does that give me? A more comfortable ride with a roomy interior with space for 6 adults compared to a tight fit of 5 adults. The relaxation package, which I did not realize it had till I was being taken over the auto after the deal closed, is nice as it goes from just having the heat and cooling of the front seats to the middle row of seats having heat and cooling plus all 4 captain chairs have the lazy-boy approach of cafe support that comes up, chair will straighten out and give you a very comfy sleep capable setup.

The wireless Android Auto is great. While the system has a high-encryption security system, when you get in based on your fob, you would have to punch in a pin to actually get the EV started. If you have Kia Connect on your smartphone and place it on the wireless charging pad, it will allow you to start the auto without having to enter your pin.

I am pleasantly surprised by just how much bigger the interior is of the EV9 over Kia's Telluride, which is very nice for an ICE auto, as my son traded in his Jeep Grand Cherokee on one. They are pretty much the same width, length, height, and ground clearance, and yet the interior space is so much more on the EV9, especially behind the 3rd seat for storage.Yes, the EV9 has a Frunk, and while some might consider it not useful, it is bigger than many out there but not as big as a Mach e. It can hold 44lbs @ 1.8 cubic feet of space.

I am looking at what Kia recommends the ChargePoint+ 80amp hardwired Level 2 charger for my garage. This gives a 10% to 80% charge in 3hrs and 45 min. I will be trying at the end of the week the 110 Volt charger that came with the EV9.

While I still have plenty to learn about this EV, I will say that I love the lighting of the auto inside; the layout of the dash is great. Turn signals have a circle that pops up on the dash, showing you the side of your auto so you can make sure not to hit anything on the side. The 360-surround camera system is outstanding and clear, even in heavy rain, I have ended up leaving it set to have the rear-view mirror run in camera mode all the time as it is better than a traditional mirror.

Ask any and all questions. I'll be happy to answer them.

For all pictures, check out my garage entry - Members Garage: 2024 Kia EV9

View full article

Seems Kia will have a faster model above the GT-Line EV9, expected to be over 600 HP and Torque.

Kia is presenting a great plan.

Kia CEO Investor Day Kia presents 2030 roadmap to become global sustainable mobility leader

Name: DFELT First EV - 2024 Kia EV9
Category: Vehicles
Date Added: 2024-04-29
Submitter: David

DFELT First EV - 2024 Kia EV9

Have to say this I totally agree with: Leasing is the best, most affordable way to get a quality new EV — here's why (thecooldown.com)