trinacriabob

seals

That has been a real "black eye" for the Catholic Church...and I am truly embarrassed for it. I am very careful how I donate to make sure the money doesn't get funneled into paying for these legal battles. In fact, I typically donate to other Christian organizations for relief services and such as a result of these events. Several archdiocese have bankrupted over this very issue - Portland OR included. It has never occurred in any parish I've attended nor in any of the schools in which I have been enrolled. Now, this isn't to say it hasn't happened in other sects as well. A big Christian church on Seattle's east side suburbs, called Overlake, had a bad scandal of this type in the 90s. And so have the Boy Scouts over the years. It's just that, admittedly, the Catholic Church is the biggest offender in this regard. But that's just the "bad apple" factor. For starters, the clergy should be able to marry. I've never been against that. I saw bits and pieces of those trials in the media. What a terrible thing for the people who went through that at a young age to have to deal with those memories again, and have to share them with the public in the process. It has been a bad thing. But look at how the tide has turned to vigilance and "whistle blowing"...I think that these events, going forward, will be few and far between in North America.

Quoting scripture to a currently subscribing "Christian" (ehm-ehm) is also irritating. I dropped my best friend from childhood who went from being Catholic when I knew him in LA to making an entire circuit of Protestant churches in the Sacramento CA area to find the "right one" (church, that is). The bottom line is that I have noticed no improvement whatsoever in how he lives his life as a Christian but a drastic improvement in his ability to quote scripture...which has always been in a condescending tone. People should just LIVE their Christianity and SHUT UP.

pre-law

speech

I guess I don't understand why some of the (toward the fundamentalist end of the spectrum) Christian sects are so INVESTED in taking pot-shots at Catholicism (and probably Greek Orthodoxy and Eastern Rite Catholicism, as well) when we are not in the least bit geared toward reciprocating these feelings. Is it that our congregation is a self-confident one? In a Catholic university, two of my business profs were Jewish, one of my stats teachers was Muslin and my operations management prof was Mormon. They were welcome on the campus and on the faculty. I wonder if the inverse would be true at a small Bible college. As I drive down the freeway and see a Lutheran, Episcopal, Baptist, Catholic, Orthodox, AOG or Foursquare church, the first reaction I have is "oh, there's another church that teaches the message of Christianity." The ONLY difference might be that some of the sermon readers, depending on their demographics, may have more of a "twang" than others. That's it.

And so expensive.

Colosseum

Question 1: Then where do the First Reading, the Second Reading and the Gospel Reading, which is the focal point of our Mass, come from? Essentially the same Bible you use. Question 2: Then what are we? Did you read an earlier post of mine? My Catholic university had courses called "Roots of Catholic Christianity" and "Moral Teachings of the New Testament" - the latter out of the very book that should UNITE all Christians rather than splintering them. Incidentally, to address comments such as your last one, a parish in the foothill community of El Dorado Hills very clearly states in its mission statement something about a being community of "Catholic Christians." You can rag on Catholics all you want. I (and the other Catholics on here) have both a thick skin and we are brighter than the average dweeb walking around (Catholics and Jews have the highest educational attainment in the US), but saying we are excluded from the ranks of Christianity is a reactionary, a vestige of some church congregations who don't like us...probably because our "market share" is the highest.

Another reason for the lacking of Bible integration at a young age is because it's tough. It wasn't even that integrated in religious classes in high school. However, at my Catholic univ., I finally got into the Bible. The lower div course was called "Roots of Catholic Christianity" (Look, in the same phrase ) and the upper div course was called "Moral Teachings of the New Testament." It was the latter course that really gave me an appreciation of what being a Christian is all about.

NDL, I think I understand what you are saying. Catholics, Lutherans, Mennonites, Pentecostals and fundamentalists are ALL Christians. It's just that any of the people in these sects may or may not be able to call themselves Christians - that's a function of whether they believe in the message and act like one. Agreed? But even then, those who believe and act accordingly sometimes "fall off the wagon." They just happen to be a Christian who fell off the wagon and is dusting themselves off to get back on board. Turbo, I don't know how the Catholic church asks less of its members than a Lutheran, Baptist or A.O.G. church. That was a head scratcher for me. I will say this - there are parishes within our church that differ drastically. One that I was a member of in Atlanta made my skin crawl. Itc "culture" comes from the top. I thought the priests and the office personnel were uptight snobs and it filtered into the congregation - kind of dysfunctional, really. Then, I've been to some that are truly a community. Like I said in an earlier post, I will NEVER knock another Christian sect...only when they have the balls to think that their group can take "cuts in line" in front of another Christian sect at the end of our journey here on earth.

Turbo, I hope that's a RARE occurrence. I know VERY FEW fire and brimstone Catholics and I like it that way. The more Catholics you know, the more you should run into the "it's up to you -- whatever" mindset regarding religious beliefs. Ignore this person on this issue.

And THAT's the irritant. For some "born agains," Catholics ARE NOT Christians. How do they figure? Well, it's because we haven't "been born again and accepted Jesus as our personal savior" in the exact same manner and timeframe that they have.

Oh, wow, this topic...and I have a bit to say about it. First, I was raised Catholic and still consider myself one. Sixteen years of Catholic school. I like the foundation they have given me. It's a church that has its problems, but then so do the others, so why switch? That's my thought. I don't accept 100% of it, but then I wouldn't accept 100% of other Christian religions either...let alone non-Christian religions. Now, for the "born again" part. First and foremost, I will NOT accept any difference between any New Testament based faith. Period. The only difference is the institution or flavor one chooses to surround themselves with. Through the invitations of people I know, I have gone to other Christian churches. They are not for me. I didn't feel comfortable. The New Testament message is and ought to be the same. Then, why this ardent recruitment of members content in one sect to another? I'm not buying. I find the overused line "Have you been born again and accepted Jesus as your personal savior?" annoying. I was baptized, took First Communion and was confirmed by the time I was a teenager. The way I choose to look at it is that, at the time, I was going through formalities programmed by my parents. Now, I affirm those "vows" by having matured in my Christianity. I think that if a person believes in and tries to live by the New Testament, they have nothing to worry about. (I still worry though, you've seen the bumper sticker "Jesus is coming...and boy is He pissed"). I was at Starbucks one night. I tried to avoid a co-worker (who I like very much) and his wife, but they saw me. They are very Christian. I wanted to avoid them because I had things to do. At any rate, the topic predictably went to religion. She had to talk about her negative and empty experiences in the Catholic church. Within no time, she had invited me to their church...almost pushing. And, of course, the question "Have you been born again and accepted Jesus as your personal savior?" It drives me nuts. I accept my faith through my actions. I can be an ass hole sometimes, but I make a concerted effort NOT to be one. Simply put, I try to do the following: 1) treat others the way I want to be treated, 2) know that every one is equal in the eyes of the Lord ($h!, I could have ended up in an embryo in Kenya instead of one in Los Angeles - how can anyone think they are more worthy than someone else?, 3) try not to be greedy...comfortable is fine, excessive is not...others have needs, too, and 4) remember that I am an inconsequential piece of crap on the face of the earth -- 9/11/2001 really drove that home...your Hamptons estate, Upper East Side apartment, Harvard MBA, money, accoutrements, connections and corner office weren't insurance for what transpired on that day....you can never take yourself too seriously. I plan on remaining a Catholic. I find it to be a user-friendly religion that, beyond a couple of hang-ups in certain areas of doctrine, is actually liberal, tolerant and egalitarian. So, maybe, I plan on remaining a "cafeteria Catholic" - pushes the tray down the food line "I'll take that and that, but not that." Either way, I'm just as much a Christian as the "born again" individual who talks about it ALL the time. I never talk about it...this has been the first time since Starbucks, about 5 months ago. I just try to let my actions speak for how Christian I am. Mustang, you're tough. I know you will stick to your convictions.

my father's Oldsmobile

Tacoma

case

bordello

In Bremerton WA.

prostitute

This is heavy but, at any rate, Vipes, glad to see you're back.

Mud on the tires

You've often heard that saying - they happen in 3s. Sad, though.

Does Argentina count....it's close....and it has a lot of the same letters. :AH-HA_wink:

I won't comment on the movies item, but this is an interesting term and I doubt I'm boxed in, having lived in:Southern California Northern California New Jersey surburbs of NYC Portland OR Seattle WA Atlanta GA Champaign IL PLUS Italy for 4 years Have a great day, buddy!