razoredge

Well what kind of moron would agree to all that when they also agreed to job banks and higher wages. The roots of these problems are way bigger than I thought. Still I gotta believe that there are or were unemployeed local workers to get in there and run another shift, avoiding the overtime pay.

I understand, I guess, but increasing severance pay during a financial crisis ? Just what is Chapter 11 anyhow :unsure: I know its a tool. As far as Im concerned if you cant meet you financial obligations you should be ....... well how about reposessed or shut down, books, moneys and assetts froze and held ? lock the door, shut off the lights, done, gone, finished, over, outta here, better luck next time, dont let the door hit you in the ass, later for you, we'll do lunch, give me a call.

I meant exactly what I said above. Just like it says. Lets rock and roll, lets dance. Let the shit hit the fan big time and the chips fall where they may. This way the pain will be felt equally across American and we will see point blank the effects of "freetrade" "global economy" then there will be real accountability, there will not be time to sweep the dirt under the rug and convince the American public that all this was in the interest of our children. :blink: Its just not that complicated once one climbs up above the fog.

Well this is all about Delphi and short term evaluations Long term ? I think market share just took a real dive. Profitbaility will be impossible even if we let then have our children for 12 hour shifts. I guess most have forgotten who buys American built cars. Certainly few of the tycoons posting here. I think topics so potentially explosive as this should have requirements of posting a small amount of personal info. Nothing to serious just things like Age work experiance bill paying experiance basic field of employment this would show if there was hidden agenda lack of experience at getting teeth kicked in I say this because I suspect most of the post here, just as mine are all about personal agendas. From where I stand Im sick and tired of having worked so hard for so many years to have it all disappear before my eyes. Spending over 6 years looking for any employment to take seriously and comming up dry and way behind in equity I stand strong for better wages and benefits. Anyone ever wonder if things have been so bad for so long how GM or rather the N.Am auto industry was willing to agree to such high paying packages ? They are steep, I dont think they are steep compared to health care industry or corporate officers. wish someone could pinpoint much of these packages, at ?65$ there must be a tremendous amount per hour into pension funds. Now with all this does that make those $per hour pensions a kick back to the company :P If there is this huge expensive job bank already getting paid why has there been time and a half overtime ? :unsure: If there has been so much downsizing and job cuts and plant closings, why has there been a need for overtime ? :unsure: Myself I hate over time, it now burns me out and takes me away from my family and interests. I have quit a few jobs due to mandatory consistant OT & Saturdays. The money cant buy back your life....or your family

Like I said before and was shuned for it, I have seen this comming for 30 years. I have identified the scam and spoken out against it since the 70's. Our own local GE exec was one of the first "pioneers" of this new way of doing business. and those like me are just supposed to sit back and take it right ? We are supposed to be OK being reduced to third world economy while our utilities, insurance industry, health care industry and real estate rises to a level of economy far beyond. Im American I do not care about the world what so ever. They have all been our enemies. They have not contributed. Now with the help of our American corporate and government leaders they can win the war on a different front. A form of ethnic cleansing from within the country using outside help.

Will be know as the final years. :) Buy Toyota, Honda, Hyundia, Kia and BMW

Delete the reaction but keep the attacks ? I see :unsure:

Good ! I hope GM and Ford follow. time to rock and roll, the big shock will be far more productive that the slow numming death. To bad those CEO's will get that huge severance pay, Id rather see them get the bastille

Well is Chrysler still an American car company ? I say that by 010 there will be no American cars. The burbs will continue to grow at alarming rates with even more expensive showpiece houses. While somewhere off to the side we'll be stuffing in more trailer parks. Perhaps we will see some down town rehabs as minimun wage blue collar folks move close to work or bus route. Should be interesting, all those mullet headed, rednecks sharing districts with the pierce freaks and crackheads. Ah but aint that America little pink houses

what was this, this wasnt a personal attack ? was I just supposed to sit back and take it ? NOT !

another attack, I dont need to change my tune, people here need to change their tune about people only deserve 10-12 dollars an hour. Just go try it. What? I hurt somebodys eyeballs for a second because I misspelled or told them to FO or back off and that thats bad. Well there are hundreds of thousands of Americans that are hurt each and every week when they go to the bank and cash that pathetic little paycheck. Ya ya ya I know they just need to go to college and get "skills" than those hundreds of thousands of Americans will be competeting for your jobs. I am very simple minded and I just cant see how I can comprehend this and the brain children here cant. We need good paying jobs for each and every American born child. Nowhere and I mean nowhere is the government or your attitudes or the current direction the economy is taking makeing any considerations for good jobs for everyone. Its all drivin solely by quick capitol gains for the top. The health care issue is a great example. Its said to be the problem. Its said that workers should cough up the doe. I have tried over and over and over to turn it on the health care industry itself and it has gone completely disregarded. Everyone is in a grand fury to kill the Unions, drive working blue collar back down where they belong and yet we want to ignore the largest contributor to the health care problems. sorry you guys dont intimidate me at all. I learn a little here and there from some posts but most of it is just not impressive because its ignoring all the other major problems and issues facing this country and jumps straight to the bottom, taking all aggression out there. As I said before "how brave"

Thanks for posting this Reg. There will be no reaction to it from the wallstreet tycoons on the Anti American workforce thread. The current trade agreements were built with a purpose, there was an agenda, we are seeing it unfolding now. While we are watching this unfolding we can also go down to the burbs and see $500,000 houses being built, neighborhood after neighborhood. Why does our government use the word "fair" ?

Yea, BTW just what is a 40 hour week ?

"consessions" what ever that means, wont save this countrys national product, nothing will. Generations will fall by the way side while we are waiting for the third world to get to the standard of living that exists in this country and thats if inflation in this counrty stops now. Perhaps if your unhappy with what your fellow Americans are earning you should do their job yourself ? Its obviously something that needs to get done, if not the job wouldnt be there. So jump on board and get the job done ! Nothing to it ya know. Now that your not doing the school/skill thing you have that extra time to pitch in and contribute. With all those special skills you could probably figure out a better way to get it done. "hello, bagdad, could you please send us some immigrants, this job sucks!" Dont assume Im a employee, Im not a employee, Im self employed, no benefits, no insurance, get paid only for exactly what I produce. Standing around the water cooler = 0. On line durring work hours = 0. Paid vacation =0, retirement = 0 I stand to benefit from none of this whatsoever so unlike many of the wallstreet heros here I have no hidden agenda. Nothing to benefit from the destruction of the blue collor work force and nothing to gain on good Union contracts. I just see things for what they are and this state that NAmerica has come to be sucks. The attitude of most of the posters here proves it.

Well good job blowing off the points I was trying to make. OK everybody, we must take cuts, we must work for the rates of Korea and India. Its only fair because there have been cuts every where else. ESPECIALLY IN THE HEALTH CARE INDUSTRY My boss kicks me in the head everyday, how dare you make it through the day without a good kick in the head. THats just not right, we should all be kicked in the head everyday, sooner of later one of us goes down so that another can live. I guess the lack of real war in recent decades has turned to war in the workplace. So with driving that point home which I really get now " its that welcome to the real world". Are the business's that are choking the life out of the work force in this country living in the real world ? Well never mind, we know they are not the problem its those damn uneducated blue collar workers and their lack of skills and lack of time for that further education while raising their familys and paying bills. God Damn them to hell ! Its the real world ! What world is that ? Is that this manufactured new world a bunch of wealthy suits are stuffing down our throats ? They say this is the real world so therefor it is ? I get it. Well to get back to my other post. In regards to this proposal " I'm sure that there are many UAW employees that would take a benefits cut if it meant they could keep their jobs" yep that would be a bandaid. That would delay the inevitable thereby slowing the end results of this "new" way. This is actually a very good thing. The slow painful death numbs the public vision to the reality of the end results. If this all happens too fast the shit will really hit the fan. Its much better to drag this out over decades so it is eventually accepted. the gas fiasco over the past 3 years is a smaller version of this approach. We have been broke to the fact that gas was going to get expensive, now they could just go to 5-6 bucks a gallon and no one that counts would care. Of course all your $10-12 and hour worthless pieces of crap would be scrambling to make rent in Cracktown but hey....cant see that from wallstreet. American pride :unsure:

Now for the head scratcher ? So you feel this is justified ? You feel that its OK for all these cuts and layoffs ? You are saying the last 6 years should be compounded and more N.Americans should suffer ? You are thinking that the Unions want sympathy ? No the Unions wanted all of Americas work force to stand up and not play into this game of corporate and wallstreet greed. Ive said this before but somehow no one absorbs it. Must be something wrong with my brain. Well here goes again. You just said I say a more adequate question is Do you feel that there is a lack of capitol in this country ?

Well folks while I have read very closely and repetedly if necessary each and every post made on most of these topics, at least the ones I have participated in. This time I will stay off the arrogant comments made by some about whos worht what and whos not. I wont question age and real life experiance in paying bills and makeing a paycheck last let alone try to save or get ahead toward some goal. I certianly wont say that members of organized labor cant save and get ahead. Im sure that they can..... which is as it should be. I wont question the job of the "only worth" crowd, or if they have ever tried to get by on 400 a week which is the wages just suggested by many poster. Well forget all of that, its pointless, its the, if you havent been there problem or the cant see it from my house problem and we all know no one wants to open their eyes when all is peachy at home. Ill also ignore the senceless squandering of capitol by poor management decisions. I will only pursue this from the standpoint that all us DMF's are either over paid or only getting what we deserve as is the case of the unorganized sector. This is what I will say now, that I have always known durring all these arguments. Something I have known for years. There is nothing that can fix N.American industries. Even the pitiful wages suggested by some. Even take away the health insurance TOTALLY and screw the retirement plans, do one of those up to 2% of contributions like most of the non organized companys do. They know the workers are living week to week so it will only cost them pennys to match contributions because workers just dont have it to contribute. Throw all that away. Get people to do all this work for $10-12 an hours with no benefits and companys will still not be able to compete with these countries you are all so loyal toward. It really really is that simple, there is no fix, the whole thing is just a hopeful holding on hoping it will go away or iron out but it wont, it never will. Capitolism worked for America when it was just America, now capitolism in its extreme is killing America. We are entering into Asian/Middle east checkmate. I just wish I knew what all the children are going to do for work.

OK, lets go back. What is this ? OK ? I see ? So now that youve been dishonest as to your origional intentions of repling to my simple post. Suppose you break down the sentences of said post and explain to me what was so mind boggling about them. You intended no rebuttal, just degredation and looking to start trouble. Theres nothing to rebutt anyhow. It was simple statements as to the outcome of this particular problem and stated that all others will feel this same bite within their lifetime most likely again for many of us. You can like this "new" "changed" way if you like. I choose not to. So hows about you back off !

Whats your problem ? If Im not mistaken you are trying to start trouble. What did I write in that thread that indicated I was deserving of "trouble " ? Furthermore what kind of man starts trouble from the safety of a mask ?

This is all I wanted to say - get it? got it ? There was not one single statement in here that was calling for your stupid ass to start some kind of fight over. I said all I wanted to say. I have said plenty in the past, I care not to get into again. Is that some kind of problem for you ? Go grind your work force hating ax elsewhere, Im already bled out, long before you even began to think you knew everything about everything. One again Back off !

Fuck saturin its a stupid name in the first place, in the second place the name has come to mean cheap styless cars. Get this off the Oldsmobile page ! Holy shit, lets invite the guy the wife was cheating with over for dinner.

I said what I meant, its just way beyond of any surface mud puddle you could comprehend. Back off !

This will be one of the ugliest pages in American history. We have been telling how this day was coming for decades. Our corporations started this direction decades before they even began selling the "global" plan. Its not survivable by any of the parties invloved so all and any effort is pointless. Good job America. Keep patting yourself on your so called "multi skilled :lol: " back. Must be nice living on that cloud. Everybodys going to get their turn eating this pile of shit. What goes around comes around.

Na, I was talking about GM, Oldsmobile and Carrol Shelby. GM management is too stupid and too arrogant to do something right for a change. Its easier to pack away big bucks and blame the American workforce for wanting to remain in the game of life in America.

Werent the approached by an even more important player once and passed ? The most sucessful non Detroit American car developer and builder ?