Croc

I like it. Is this a Lincoln version of the Mazda CX9?

For me, I don't need too many vehicles to be happy. Daily Driver 2001 Oldsmobile Aurora 3.5 (current) Future Daily Driver 2010 Cadillac CTC turbodiesel Inheritance Car 1980 Cadillac Sedan de Ville V6 I love my Aurora and can't see myself parting with it easily, but logically I probably will not own it forever. If I get married and have a family, then I'd add a Buick Enclave CXL.

Way to keep it classy NOS.

Top-producing? What kind of honor is that? Anyone can crank a plant up to full speed, but then quality dips substantially, the market gets saturated faster, overproduction often occurs, and then the incentives start piling up.

Looks good except for the Sebring rear.

It looks somewhat similar to the (IMO) ungainly Centieme concept.

Every religion shares the same basic principles of getting along with other people. Actually, when I look at the laws of our country, I see a lot of differences when compared to Christian doctrine...many fundamental. For example, violence in self-defense is acceptable in the US. Jesus supposedly said to turn the other cheek. I think if you compared the "moral code" of just about any religion to the laws of the US you'd find a lot of common ground. There'd also be differences, though.

Exactly. The Holiday Tree is fine. I know Jews who put up trees, they just decorate them with a Star of David. I believe, though, that public spaces and public buildings should treat all religions equally. If a place is celebrating Christian holidays, fine...but it must also observe the Jewish ones, Islamic, etc. to include ALL religions. That's daunting. So in treating all religions equally, I'd prefer not to have my tax dollars wasted on promoting/observing ANY religious holiday.

Although Walt pretty much addressed it, that early treaty as well as the writings of Ben Franklin, Thomas Jefferson, et al are the evidence/proof. Many of the early founders were philosophers, and those writings lay things out pretty well. I cannot quote titles or page numbers, but I have read enough Franklin and Jefferson to eliminate any credence to the founders being Christian men intent on founding this country as a Christian-based nation. As for your other point about Catholic doctrines and similarities to the US Constitution...well that would be more by coincidence than anything else. The United States based the Constitution on the Greek philosophers as well as many of the philosophers from their contemporary era. That's one of the reasons governmental architecture in the US is largely neoclassical--that was a conscious decision during the Columbian Exposition (Chicago World's Fair) to create an "American" architectural aesthetic--neoclassical styles were chosen for the direct lineage to the Greeks and their political democratic philosophies. True, but we never know what the unknown will bring. We DO know some of what a Kerry presidency would NOT have brought, however.

Not trying to be an ass, but that isn't accurate. The founding fathers did consist of some Christians, but many of them were atheist/agnostic and NOT Christian. The US was not founded to favor or base itself upon any religion, hence the separation clause.

I'm just giving you $h!, buddy.

OMG...I had almost forgotten about that!

NOS...I know you're a Delt at Kettering...and by logical extension that means you took the federally-mandated high school government class, correct? Anyway...what constitutes a "Democrat" versus "Republican" is not set in stone, and has in fact varied quite a bit over the years. Generally-speaking, though: Republicans tend to be fiscally conservative (except in regards to war), prefer low taxes, policies that benefit inheritances, investors, and businesses. Republicans tend to be more of the school of "an eye for an eye," hence why war is not shied away from, the death penalty is often favored, yet abortion is frowned upon. Republicans are generally socially-conservative, and favor protecting the rule of the majority. Not for gun control. Republicans tend to be more religious than Dems. Democrats are not fiscally conservative and tend to favor far-reaching government in the form of social wellfare programs. Taxes tend to go up under Dems to pay for such programs. Dems like to protect the minority from "persecution," often by "lending a voice" to a small "under-represented" segment of the population. Civil rights are favored over security, and Dems as a whole are more liberal than R's. Also, most "activists" are Dems, as Dems tend to be a bit of an umbrella party for the various fringe and minority causes that exist. Pro gun control. Dems tend to be less concerned with religion than R's.

I like it a lot!

avoid the diesels. Avoid the models with the same engine as the 85 devilles. 1980-82 Devilles are decent, our V6 '80 has held up quite well--but be warned most say the V6 is unreliable (no problem here). Northstars are good. Avoid the pre-2000 Catera. Avoid the Allante (reliability issues) despite its beauty. 93+ El Dorados are great, especially the last few MYs.

FOG: sounds like a good book. As someone who is interested in historical preservation, it seems right up my alley.

I hate that movie.

These Auroras are worth it.

Get a 6-pack.

As others have said, I'd stay away. When they refreshed the Deville lineup in 1997, they altered something to the Northstar that led to excessive oil consumption. The 1995-1996 Concours are better in that sense, and anything 2000 and after also does not have the oil consumption issues.

I'm waiting for biodiesel. Diesel technology is inherently more efficient than gasoline, and I'd love for more diesels to be available stateside. As for the V8, I won't miss it too much. I prefer the feel of sixes. My Aurora is a Shortstar, and I can't say I'm ever wanting for power. That is one engine that was killed prematurely--it had some real potential for use in both Cadillac and Buick applications once Oldsmobile met its demise.

Yea what was up with the Cutlass?

For real.

C'mon guys...its only 200 away from 1st place. Let's make a dent in the vote!

Honestly I don't mind the "death of the V8"--at least as it affects me. I don't like driving V8s very much. Sure, they're fast, but I don't need that much power off the line, and I certainly tend to inadvertantly squeal tires at traffic lights. I much prefer the feel of the V6 powerbands (at least of those that I've driven), and that's why my 2001 Aurora is a 3.5 and not a 4.0--It has plenty of power for me, and the mileage is pretty good!