El Kabong

Beat Ford in retail sales in June!

Eh. Pushrods are legit technology. As Drew himself said, turbocharging OHC engines wouldn't be a thing if they were able to deliver real-world driving power as effectively in normally-aspirated form.

Uh, Dood?... Please. Just stop. You've earned the rank of "terribad." Yes, this is an intervention. Surreal made one error. The balance ledger is still pretty stacked the other way, is what I'm saying.

Ok, I confess. I visited your profile. ...I wanted to see what it took to be officially described as "terribad" in the ratings system. So shoot me :D I mean, wow. That's not exactly a subtle hint or anything

I have no beef with Tesla. But Consumer Reports is a fail.

On a similar note, it could be wonky compressor bearings. Either way, probably age-related.

Props where props are due-it sounds like a fun car to drive. The instrumented testing will tell the full story. But ya, the Canadian pricing... wow. A couple months ago I was looking at a window sticker for a Z/28 that rang in at 81,000 Loonies, and I thought to myself "hmmm." Now we get this up here after hearing about how the GT350 was going to be more capable AND affordable and all I can think is "I'll wait for the final verdict on that."

Check out my new thread on the GT350. Up in Canada I'd say that the Camaro will be looking like a screaming bargain after seeing what they'll be charging for the Shelby.

Canadian pricing is absolutely brutal. The Z/28 may actually be CHEAPER: "Ford Canada’s pricing for the GT350 starts at $62,599, with two optional packages – Track and Technology. The GT350R, on the other hand, starts at $79,499. Admittedly, there is a lot of choice at this end of the price spectrum."

http://driving.ca/ford/mustang/reviews/road-test/first-drive-2016-ford-shelby-gt350-mustang

I don't understand how you can say that the Camaro's superiority won't matter to buyers. How do you think it became #1 in sales? "Good enough" isn't good enough anymore. Nor should it be.

Well, that might be the explanation for the points jump

I suspect that admin is having a bit of fun. Doesn't change the reality of the situation though-trolling will inevitably get you called out, tossed out, laughed out, and leave your pet topic down and out.

In the end I suspect it will be much ado about little.

We all know what's what with wings and with Ford man. Just because someone SAYS they're winning doesn't make it so... though it does provide a healthy dose of lulz :D

As soon as the Giulia hit the ground I said that Mopar would need to ride the crap outta the thing to make it work. Thankfully, they are. GM showed the way with Alpha, and the approach is ready-made for an outfit with a performance rep like Mopar. Good news.

Dingo writes, I respond: Yes, there's a price hike. The additional equipment added as standard helps contribute. The chassis is shared with other cars. Those cars are Cadillacs. Those Cadillacs have been acknowledged giant killers in the luxury sedan class, both in terms of performance and relatively light weight. Ergo, that kind of chassis tech does not come cheaply. Again, on paper the Shelby will probably not appear to be that much more expensive than a loaded SS2. In reality it will become apparent to any potential buyer that the two take radically different approaches to performance. The big difference, again, will be that GM's more GT-oriented approach will not necessarily mean GT-level mass. So, it will have the best of both worlds in that regard. Couple it with a Magneride Suspension that will go a long way to aping a Shelby's Track Pack and you will be left with a car that will have nothing to apologize for. And finally, again: the price doesn't look bad at all when you consider that a four-banger Mustang droptop can go for 42 large. It ain't cheap, but it's worth every penny. And yes, I'm VERY interested in seeing if there are any whackjob tuners out there who'll give you a 400hp Camaro for 32 grand.

Well... GM has made the turbo the base engine, which will make hotrodding it less expensive. That'll help.

Look. We all need to stop. Take a deep breath. Consider the consequences of our actions. Or go use the can. I dunno. But ya-stop.

The GT350 is a nice car. It is also a pretty high-strung and raw one, by definition. You will be able to get good numbers out of it, but you WILL have to work for them. Which is fine because, again, high-strung and raw. The numbers indicate that a properly-equipped Camaro SS will come fairly close to some of those numbers. But it won't feel the same. And the difference in feel is what will justify the difference in price.

I'd rather have overhang than a hangover.

Well, the other thing that makes me smile about that is that I've seen folks elsewhere post like the difference between the price of the SS2 and GT350 is small enough that it renders the Chevy moot. What a fat pantload. 56 grand will, in theory, get you a Shelby GT350, which will have a sweet V8... and absolutely nothing else. No performance pack, no electronics pack. It is CCAP's dream package, but still at a too-high price. And it still won't be especially light, nor will it offer eight speeds, nor will it even match the Chevy's torque. The Camaro is excellence of execution. No amount of semantics, downvoting, or trolling can change that reality. It will best the GT easily, and it will scare the Shelby. At a far lower price.

Some folks are just stupid. The CTS and ATS are doing more than well enough to justify their existence. Which is more than we can say for some products.

Ok, those 190E homologation specials Benz did were just SICK. I'm pretty sure Cosworth did the heads on those motors. I like them better than the original M3. *checks recent threads* ...somebody's veneer of civility is cracking. Again. Oy vey

Some folks just want the V8 rumble. Nothing wrong with that I suppose, but if you want a car that dances as well as it sings then the Camaro starts looking pretty good at 37 large.