balthazar

Duesenberg Model J doesn't qualify, it was 420 CI (419.7 = 6.9L) - - - - - The >427 CI cars generally are too late to earn my lust. Not an Olds or Chevy guy, so those are out. I like Ford trucks and old Ford cars, but the big cube Fords don't do anything for me. I'd like a 455 Buick, but I'm not overly enamored with the cars the engines come in. '70 GS455 Stage 2 might be nice, 455 CI '67 Pontiac 2+2 hardtop, 376 HP 428 CI '71 Plymouth Sport Fury GT, 440 CI : '68 Cadillac Eldorado, 472 CI '68 Riviera Gran Sport, 430 CI What I'd really like would be a hybrid; a '61 DeSoto coupe with a six-pack 440 and a TorqueFlite. Guess that's why I'm building the 'GM version' of that : '59 Invicta coupe with a 455.

Let's say it reaches an even 500,000 pre-orders. THEN WHAT??

Digest what? You're answering a straight-up numbers point with superlatives and brush-offs. You said you didn't understand the negative opinions. I responded to your 'bah; everyone is doing a money grab so it's OK" by pointing out 48 > 5.

Cadillac has 3 VSports and 2 Vs (IIRC). Mercedes is going to have FORTY-EIGHT AMGs. Do you REALLY not see any difference?

Can I get your specific opinion on a specific scenario here? When 50 Shades of Grey was released, it had a HUGE buzz. The first print run was 1.25 million books. One week later, the publisher ran a 2nd, 3rd, 4th and 5th print run, bringing the total copies up to 2.1 million. The public ordered/bought, and the printer produced immediately. There were 30,000 Model X pre-orders, but only 2100 cars were built (not sold) in 4 months (after it went on sale). That's a rate of 6300 for the year. At that rate, it would take 4.8 years just to fill the pre-orders initially placed. Is this a real problem? People HAVE to understand the difference between orders and production. They do, don't they? I mean, if they think about it a minute?

In about 6 month's time in 1975, advertising executive Gary Dahl sold 1.5 million Pet Rocks @ $4 each.

Theres understanding the market... and delivering to the market. It's definitely an uphill battle...

Because someone compared an SUV to coupes.

Suaviloquent ~>>Tesla has already put a path forward to profitability.<< What is it, exactly? >>I don't see any big name automaker invest in America to make new facilities.<< You haven't seen a DOZEN new assembly plants built in this country over the last 25 years?? You are aware Tesla is in an ex-GM plant, right? I know: you were talking about the battery plant, but still….

Escalade Platinum loses $61% in 5 years? Mercedes SL loses 41% in ONE year. SL 65 AMG costs you an average of $15K per year in depreciation. In 10 years that's $140,000 + I know a number of multi-millionaires personally; they care about money just as much as anyone, maybe more. They'll spend it on themselves, but they absolutely care about value.

That's what Tesla charges for it, but they don't charge what the whole car costs to build, so we're still spitting into the wind. But as you've said many times, 'sedans are a dying breed', so the model 3 is already chasing a disappearing segment, right?

Well, you're wrong again. 300K CTSs is not what Cadillac as a brand is going for. As a whole, Cadillac would sit very nicely at 200-250K units annually. 300K of one series is NOT what they're looking for. Cadillac just recently adjusted the CTS pricing/equipment level, and you think raising the price $3K and running the factory 24/7 is the answer. Wow. 320i is wretched. CT6 2.0T is not. Not the same car and choice appeals to luxury buyers. I have no issue with the XTS getting phased out & the CT6 occupying that (general) spot in the catalog. It's a great move forward on many fronts.

Leasing = a lifetime of monthly payments. Proof that money can't buy you 2 fiscal cents to rub together.

Ideally, going forward, there will be (likely a very unpleasant) merging of the sedan and the crossover, making 1 vehicle. As it is, the differences are getting slimmer and slimmer.

You are still equating "sell" with "sales volume". A CT8 is not meant to be high volume, just as Cadillac isn't.

Has anyone ever seen any estimates as to the cost of the batteries alone vs. the rest of a Tesla vehicle? Because this Gigafactory is all well & good, but how much will it effect the vehicle price?? Certainly NOT $10K worth. Gigafactory batteries aren't going to be free, just cheaper.

I3 and i8 are abject failures. 6-series basically is, also. I seem to recall when Cadillac was down like 5%, there were numerous articles blurbing "slide" and the like, so BRACE YOURSELF for the like RE BMW's 10% YTD decline.

Yes: profit is the goal, profit drives all future development. But no one outside of General Motors Accounting knows exactly what Cadillac's profit level is. Via ATPs, it's going up- that much we know. I also loosely recall some official statement WRT the CTS wagon (IIRC), that Cadillac had to sell an absurdly low quantity to break even (which I believe they eclipsed).

It remains to be seen RE the Model 3. I'll wait until the actual production model gets here and see if they fix the 'toast slot' trunk opening. And what the actual price is. The scenario you spell out above certainly has it's appeal, but there are other factors involved; don't pretend there aren't. A brand new Camry starts @ $21K; an Avalon, which should be a much nicer car, starts @ $32K. Which sells more??? I'll tell you: so far in '16 it's 37K Camrys to 4K Avalons. @ $35K, the Camry & Tesla 3 aren't remotely in the same price tier. But my belief is the Model 3 will be substantially higher than $35K. If Tesla doesn't make money on the Model 3, the company is going under. And if Tesla CAN make money on the 3, they need to GREATLY up their production schedules- Tesla has only built 12% of the Model X pre-order volume after 4 months of production.

Retaining 40% of $50,000 costs you $30,000. Retaining 60% of $150,000 costs you $60,000. 'Percentages' is a 'feel good' metric. What matters is the bottom line, the 'number on the check'. In the above example, one would be a fool to brag about their 60% value retention. Fact is, AMG cars top lists of the worst depreciation models- they cost you MORE to own, not less.

I dunno about that. Previous gen S-class was around for 8 years before getting replaced, there's no incentive (out-of-warranty repair bills aside) to get a new one if it's the same car. I'll have to ask my one customer what year her's is- I believe it's at least 5 years old. Anyway, owners who do buy are seeing whatever slice of the massive depreciation, still running well into the 10s of thousands of dollars at the AMG level. I just find it interesting that the top trim levels fall faster than anything else.

Running a grocery store for a mere 26 months is hardly the stuff of a "successful business". I SEE YOU "G. P. Gorin", 105 years and a sloppy mis-spelling can't hide you from me!!

Problem for the brand (mercedes) is, AMGs traditionally top all lists for the worst depreciation on the market. A CL55 AMG from the early 2000s ends up costing you $100,000 in depreciation after 10 years! That's 85%. Maybach 1.0 costs you $200,000 in 10 years!! By making everything available as a 'AMG' (and I just read that in India, MB discontinued the 4.7L V8 in the s-class…. unless you pony up for the mercedes-maybach trim level), it's going to skew MB's average value retention. It's just the typical Corporate mindset: Revenue Above All Else.

^ Those are fine… IF mass market global sales numbers is your mission statement. But that's not Cadillac's.

He said they would be "cheaper & faster" than ICE cars. Are you saying that's the case in the areas you mentioned above? - - - - - There are real AND perceived disadvantages to the EV that will take FAR more than a decade to overcome. IMO, EVs need to reach 20% of vehicle sales to be an established, recognized segment. Right now, they are an extreme niche, akin (in sales penetration) to convertibles, maybe less than even that (IIRC, converts sit around 1.6%??). Imagine all the hype/buzz RE Tesla...instead talking about convertibles and how they're going to "take over". Most manufacturers have one, people like them…. At the rate EVs are going sales-wise, we're looking at at least 25 years to come close to 20%, not less than 10.