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    Rumorpile: Diesel, 10-Speed In The Cards For The F-150


    • Diesels, Ten-Speed Automatic, Aluminum Bodies.. That's what Ford has in mind for their trucks

    Even though Ford has just announced the new F-150 back in January, the automaker is already working on improvements that will be coming down the line.

    The Truth About Cars reports that Ford is working on a 3.0L V6 diesel engine, codenamed “Lion”. The new engine is in response to Ram's diesel engine for the 1500. Ford was reportedly working on a diesel engine for the F-150 in the mid-2000s, but it was canned due to financial meltdown. This new engine is expected to arrive in 2018.

    TTAC has also found out that the new 2.7L EcoBoost will produce somewhere in the range of 290 to 300 horsepower. Torque numbers are still a mystery.

    That's not all Ford has up its sleeve. TTAC reports that a new ten-speed automatic will appear in trucks and full-size SUVs in the near future. Ford also is working on aluminum bodied versions of the Ford Expedition and Lincoln Navigator.

    Source: The Truth About Cars

    William Maley is a staff writer for Cheers & Gears. He can be reached at william.maley@cheersandgears.com or you can follow him on twitter at @realmudmonster.

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    Could they first work on replacing the plastic cheap looking interior in the new truck. I just do not get what people seem to love about Ford Products. They even when new seem to have a cheapness about them.

    Went skiing yesterday and a Titanium edition Fiesta pulled into the parking lot at the pass and for what should be a fully loaded high end model, even my wife was not impressed. Fit and Finish left allot to be desired.

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    The old F150 is easily outselling the new Silverado. Imagine when the F150 gets the aluminum body, the 2.7 ecoboost, this diesel and a 10-speed. GM better move fast or else the F150 could leave the Silverado in the dust.

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    I do not see Ford leaving GM in the dust. Northwest, GM is currently selling more than Ford based on how much older inventory is sitting on the lots at Ford. I think this is very much regionally based as some areas clearly sell more Ford or Ram or GMC or Chevy depends on the area.

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    The styling is awful IMHO, but the improvements are noteworthy. 10-speed will work well in squeezing a few extra MPGs as long as the transmission software is clever enough; pretty sure Ford engineers will find a way to make it smooth and seamless also...

    Edited by ZL-1
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    In sleeping on this, the best thing I can see this doing for Ford and GM as well as Ram should be also considering this is to get a final gear that keeps the Diesel around 1000 to 1200 rpm to maximize cruising. This is where as we all know Diesels can really ring out efficient mileage due to the torque that can keep the auto moving where gas motors would balk and die.

    Sad that marketing has built such a lie about HP is everything and you know have the bloated heavy Over Head Cam Garbage motors with 600HP and 315lbs of torque or what ever the low torque numbers have been that some just think are amazing cause Ferrari, Lambo, etc makes their auto's this way and yet American Engineering has proven time and again that just the basic small block push rod V8 can beat them.

    Back on Topic, Exciting as I hope this finally forces GM to get with it to get the Whole Duramax Family of Diesel engines in North America. No reason not to have whisper quiet torquey diesel motors as options in the whole family of Compact to full size SUV and light duty trucks.

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    The 8-10 speed transmissions are what are going to give diesels the great advantage. When hooked to a 4-speed auto how often were those old diesels in their peak power range? From video reviews I have seen of diesel cars form the early 2000s, it seemed like they were all the same, you get power and torque briefly then the car shifts and it is gone and it takes a while to get it back. A 10 speed should eliminate that and keep the diesel within that narrow power band so that the 400+ lb-ft is always on tap.

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    >>"Now, Automotive News Europe quotes ZF CEO Stefan Sommer as saying nine speeds are the “natural limit.” In Sommer’s words, “There is no hard line, but you have to consider the law of diminishing returns. The question is whether adding even more gears makes sense.”

    That sentiment is echoed by Julio Caspari, president of ZF’s North American division, who believes that the race for more gears is driven by marketing and not engineering."<<

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    Semi's have to move extraordinary weights- there the gears are mandatory.

    Light-duty trucks, even towing, don't see such an extreme vs. their outputs. IE; 5-spds behind a DuraMax is all anyone ever needs; absolutely under normal conditions, but also under 90% of towing loads.
    I can see an argument for specifically-spaced gearing totalling 8, but 10 is marketing pacification.

    And you just wait, if 10-spds become relatively common, the 'number junkies' will just clamor for 12-spds. It's bragging rights/ marketing spin, and it sucks a lot of people in, unfortunately.

    CAT C15 I-6 diesel, in the '11 Kenworth W900 tractor, is 928 CI (15.2L), is rated at 435-550 HP and 1550-1850 TRQ. It moves up to 80,000 lbs on the road. 80000 / 1850 = 43 lbs / TRQ

    A 403 CI Duramax moves like 18,000 lbs with 397 HP and 765 TRQ. 18000 / 765 = 23 lbs / TRQ.

    900 CI motors also rev much slower and in a shorter RPM range than a LD truck diesel.

    Why would 43 lbs/TRQ need 18 spds and 23 lbs/TRQ need 10??

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    Good one balth. Small diesel engines do not need more than 7 speeders.

    Unfortunately, as the automotive industry innovation when it comes to powertrain has become saturated, need for one upmanship is driving the marketing ploy.

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    At least as far as marketing goes; yes.

    There is undue emphasis on highway mileage here WRT the Ram, IMO.

    Back in the past energy crunches, highway MPG was prominently advertised in order to show big numbers. That practice was frequently called out as misleading of real world conditions.

    Since then (perhaps in response to a degree), they've come out with the so-called combined number (Yes; more fair than the prior approach). I've scanned a few articles on the Ram diesel where the city MPG number was wholly absent.

    Anyway, let's do some math, as any consumer concerned with MPG should be doing :

    Silverado 4.3 EcoTec3 is rated 18/24. Sounds terrible in comparison; "C'mon GM, get in the game!!", right?

    15000 miles/yr, divided by 18 MPG = 833 gals/yr x $3.19 (using today's prices in my area) = $2,657 for fuel.

    15000 miles/yr, divided by 24 MPG = 625 gals/yr x $3.19 = $1,993 for fuel.

    Ram EcoDiesel is rated at 21/28. "Wow Dodge, you go!"

    15000 miles/yr, divided by 21 MPG = 714 gals/yr x $3.99 (using today's prices in my area) = $2,848 for fuel.

    15000 miles/yr, divided by 28 MPG = 535 gals/yr x $3.99 = $2,134 for fuel.

    Not a huge difference ($141-191), but the Ram is more costly here.

    The bottom line is, the consumer needs to weight the WHOLE picture. Real world MPG average against the huge premium of the diesel powertrain (Ram vs. gas V6 : some $4000) and the huge premium for diesel fuel (now averaging 80 cents over 87 in central NJ). The video I saw of the Ram taking 10.3 sec to hit 60 (vs. the 4.3L being in the low 8s), and you may see much heavier feet in the Ram diesel that further compromises the MPG benefit. As more & more diesels come to market, the oil companies had better be adjusting the supply side, too, or the fuel cost gap will widen further. Sprinkle in maintenance/service costs too.

    Obviously I'm not anti-diesel (going on Year 8 sans spark plugs here), but the calculator doesn't lie. They are not cheaper to buy, maintain or operate.

    Question is, is the consumer more interested in saving gallons or dollars?

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    That $0.80 difference between regular unleaded and oil burner is not unrealistic. I would wager close to $0.65, but then you are still talking difference of mere dollars. Fuel efficiency wise, even with 10-speed transmission Ford is not going to do much better than RAM's 8-speeder.

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    The variance between diesel and 87 octane varies greatly around the country.

    As I've said to Smk, 0-60 times don't matter in the real world...especially in trucks.

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    Of course it varies, but guess what : the national average today is.... 3.26 / 3.92, a 66 cent premium/gallon for diesel. Certainly, no where is diesel close to 87 in price.

    I am positive, as more diesel cars come into the market- the "fuel inequality" price gap is going to only s p r e a d.

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    At least around here, the price for diesel sometimes swaps with gasoline in price... but that is a fuel oil demand issue.

    We've been in a bit of a cold snap lately, I would expect diesel prices to be higher.

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      Rear Brakes
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      Wheels
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      Tyres
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      Rear
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      Overall length
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      0-60 mph
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      0-100 km/h
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      View full article
    • By William Maley
      They said it would never happen. But for the first time in their history, Bentley will be offering a diesel in one of their vehicles. This week, the British luxury automaker announced the Bentayga will come with the option of a diesel engine in 2017. The engine in question is a 4.0L triple-charged V8 that produces 429 horsepower and 664 pound-feet of torque. If you're wondering why this engine sounds somewhat familiar, this is the same engine found in the Audi SQ7 TDI. Bentley claims the Bentayga Diesel is the fastest diesel SUV in the world as it can hit 62 mph in 4.8 seconds and continue to a top speed of 168 mph. Even with this performance, the Bentayga Diesel can return a combined fuel economy figure of 35.8 mpg on the European cycle (allowing it to have a range of 621 miles).
      Aside from the new engine, the Bentayga Diesel has some small differences to separate itself from the regular Bentayga. There is a blacked-out grille, discreet 'V8 Diesel' badges on the front doors, and new tailpipes.
      Sales of the Bentayga Diesel will begin early next year in Europe and expand to other markets in due time. Bentley isn't planning to sell Bentayga Diesel in the U.S. - a smart move considering the dark cloud brought by the Volkswagen diesel emission mess. Nor will you see this model debuting at the Paris Motor Show next month. Bentley and Lamborghini announced this week they would not be appearing at the show. This is part of an effort at Volkswagen to help curb costs because of the diesel emission mess.
      Source: Bentley
      Press Release is on Page 2
      BENTLEY BENTAYGA DIESEL: EFFORTLESS DRIVING WITH PEERLESS LUXURY
      The first diesel Bentley – power, refinement and range New-generation, triple-charged 4.0-litre V8 engine develops class-leading 435 PS (429 bhp) and 900 Nm (664 lb.ft.) torque World’s fastest diesel SUV: 0-100 km/h in 4.8 seconds and top speed of 270 km/h (168 mph) Bentayga’s go-anywhere grand touring capability further enhanced with a 1,000 km range potential Lowest CO2 output of any Bentley – 210 g/km  (Crewe, 21 September 2016) Bentley Motors today announces full details of the first diesel model in the iconic British brand’s history – the Bentayga Diesel.
      At the heart of the world's fastest and most powerful luxury diesel SUV is an all-new, technologically advanced, triple-charged, 4.0-litre, 32-valve V8 engine. Developing 435 PS (429 bhp) and 900 Nm (664 lb. ft.) of torque, the Bentayga Diesel hits a top speed of 270 km/h (168 mph) and can accelerate from 0-100 km/h in 4.8 seconds (0-60 mph in 4.6 seconds).
      Bentley’s Crewe-based engineers have developed a V8 powertrain to deliver an authentic Bentley driving experience. Peak torque is available from very early in the rev range (just 1,000 rpm), which makes progress in the Bentayga Diesel truly effortless.
      New clean technology gives the Bentayga Diesel the lowest CO2 emissions of any Bentley, as well as a range of over 1,000 km (621 miles) – allowing owners to, for example, drive from London to Verbier, Bordeaux or the Scottish Highlands on a single tank.
      Inside, the Bentayga Diesel retains the innovative features, advanced technologies and handcrafted luxury for which the Bentley Bentayga is renowned.
      Wolfgang Dürheimer, chairman and chief executive of Bentley Motors, said: “The Bentayga Diesel represents a moment of immense significance in Bentley’s history, by giving the world its fastest luxury diesel SUV. Immense power, grand touring capabilities and superb refinement – this is a true Bentley. Only Bentley could produce a car so powerful, yet so refined.”
      Clean, Powerful Performance – V8 Engine Offers Sublime Capability
      The Bentayga Diesel retains the dynamic performance of the Bentayga W12, while introducing clean technologies and enhanced range.
      The next-generation 4.0-litre V8 engine, mated to a ZF eight-speed automatic transmission, develops a class-leading 435 PS (429 bhp) and 900 Nm (664 lb. ft.) of torque. Variable-geometry, sequential twin-scroll turbochargers are powered by the exhaust gases, while a third electric supercharger – powered by Bentley’s innovative 48V system – spools up within 30 microseconds to eliminate turbo lag. The effect is effortless, seamless power delivery across the entire engine-speed range – the quintessential Bentley driving experience.
      This enables the Bentayga Diesel to deliver a 0-100 km/h time of 4.8 seconds (0-60 mph in 4.6 seconds) and a top speed of 270 km/h (168 mph).
      An immense amount of torque is available from very low speeds, with peak torque achieved from just 1,000 rpm, for both seamless on-road performance and exemplary off-roading ability. The immediate flow of power complements the traditional, class-leading refinement and performance customers have come to expect.
      The new model has also been made with a number of specific developments to provide peerless refinement. For example, the bespoke exhaust system has been acoustically engineered to be as quiet and refined as possible.
      The addition of Selective Catalytic Reduction contributes to lower nitrous oxides. Combined with Bentley’s stop-start system; class-leading CO2 emissions of 210 g/km; and an impressive range of over 1,000 km between fuel stops, this technology puts the Bentayga Diesel at the forefront of advanced engine efficiency.
      Contemporary, Luxurious British Design
      The Bentayga Diesel demonstrates the same authentic and modern British luxury design as its W12-powered stablemate, while also benefitting from a number of unique styling additions.
      A V8 Diesel badge is embedded on the lower front door edge, complemented by a new Bentley ‘twin-quad’ exhaust tailpipe design, which provide a further subtle reminder of the new engine specification. 
      Further distinctive external styling cues include a bold, black matrix grille with chrome surround and central bar, which serves as a signature for the powertrain that lies behind. A new optional Mulliner Driving Specification 21” wheel – available in a silver or grey painted finish (the latter with machined accents to the spoke and rim) – can be specified, with a 20” ten-spoke alloy wheel offered as standard.
      The Bentayga’s cockpit sets new standards for both luxury and precision, with meticulous tolerances between the exquisite veneered woods and metal elements.
      The hand-selected veneers – including a new Liquid Amber finish introduced with Bentayga Diesel – form pure and elegant surfaces throughout the cabin. Each of the 15 pieces are shaped by Bentley’s artisans and finished with trademark Bentley attention to detail.
      As with all Bentleys, the Bentayga Diesel can be handed over to the highly skilled craftspeople at Mulliner, Bentley’s bespoke coachbuilding department, who will respond to individual customer requirements.
      The Bentayga is available with an exquisite integrated Mulliner Hamper Set, complete with refrigerator, bespoke fine Linley china cutlery, crockery and crystal glass, and storage area for dry goods. For comfort in the great outdoors, sections of the hamper can be removed and used as seats.
      A bespoke mechanical Mulliner Tourbillon by Breitling clock can also be specified. The most complex of watch mechanisms, the Mulliner Tourbillon is automatically wound periodically by a dedicated high-precision winding mechanism within the car. This masterpiece is machined in solid gold (customers can select from either rose or white gold), with a choice of either a mother-of-pearl or black ebony face and decorated with eight diamond indexes.
      Effortless Bentley Performance, Unrestrained by Climate or Terrain
      The development programme for the Bentayga has been the most exhaustive in the Bentley brand’s history, ranging across five continents. From the dirt and gravel of South Africa and the dunes of Dubai, to the muddy fields of Cheshire, and from -30°C in the frozen North Cape to searing 50°C desert heat, the Bentayga’s ability to perform on any surface and even in the most extreme conditions has been proven.
      The Bentayga Diesel can be specified with Bentley Dynamic Ride – the world’s first electric active roll control technology that utilises an unrivalled 48V system. Inherent in larger vehicles with a higher centre of gravity, this system instantly counteracts lateral rolling forces when cornering and ensures maximum tyre contact to deliver class-leading cabin stability, ride comfort and exceptional handling.
      Bentley’s adaptive and reactive system provides variable torsional resistance, allowing the Bentayga to be both dynamically capable and comfortable for all occupants at all times. The pioneering use of a 48V system – which on Bentayga Diesel utilises a new lithium-ion battery system to offer even greater reserves of power – results in silent, instantaneous responses to deal with all road surfaces.
      Electric Power-Assisted Steering (EPAS) is also featured on the Bentayga. The new system improves feedback to the driver, while providing isolation from steering kick-back both on- and off-road. EPAS also features a variable rack ratio, permitting light and fast steering while manoeuvring at low speeds, as well as a more subdued response for excellent stability at high speeds.
      The Bentayga Diesel offers class-leading ride comfort, steering feel and handling thanks to the partnership of a highly sophisticated chassis and Electronic Stability Control (ESC). In addition to advanced, multi-mode Traction Control (TCS), the Bentayga also features Hill Descent Control.
      Hill Descent Control automatically regulates the vehicle’s speed on steep declines, allowing the driver to concentrate fully on steering and obstacles ahead. It can be pre-set at speeds between two and 30 km/h (going in either direction) and works on gradients greater than five per cent.
      As with all Bentleys, the Bentayga Diesel comes with multi-mode air suspension. The driver has four different modes to choose from: High 2, High 1, Normal and Low. High 2, for example, can be manually selected when tackling more severe off-road surfaces. Customers can also lower the rear suspension via a switch in the boot, to ease loading and trailer hitching.
      Innovative Features and Advanced Technologies
      A suite of state-of-the-art driver assistance systems and infotainment features designed to enhance safety, comfort and convenience make the Bentayga Diesel an innovative, advanced and connected luxury SUV.
      It offers the widest range of on- and off-road drive settings of any vehicle via Bentley’s Drive Dynamics Mode and optional Responsive Off-Road Settings. Up to eight modes are available, allowing drivers, at the simple turn of a dial, to select the perfect dynamic set-up for any surface or road condition. This versatility is complemented by Bentley Dynamic Ride (electrically activated 48V active roll control) and Electric Power-Assisted Steering (EPAS).
      Responsive Off-Road Settings allows the customer to select the appropriate vehicle settings for a wide range of off-road surfaces, while the Driver Information Panel displays information on pitch, roll, wheel articulation, steering angle, compass bearing and altitude.
      Adaptive Cruise Control (ACC) including Stop & Go, Predictive ACC and Traffic Assist enables the driver to maintain a set distance to the vehicle in front. Predictive ACC uses the navigation data, sensors and cameras to predict upcoming corners, city boundaries and speed-limit changes and can then modify the vehicle speed accordingly, improving both comfort and fuel economy.
      In urban environments, there are a number of driver aids available on the Bentayga Diesel. These systems – such as Traffic Sign Recognition, which detects a wide variety of traffic signs and displays information to the driver; Rear Crossing Traffic Warning, which uses radar technology to detect crossing traffic when reversing out of a parking space; and Top View, a system which uses four cameras to display an overall picture of the vehicle’s surroundings – combine to enhance everyday usability.
      Park Assist is also available – a system that detects suitable parking spaces (both parallel and perpendicular) before autonomous steering takes over to support parking manoeuvres, even in narrow and tricky spaces.
      Other innovative systems available include Electronic Night Vision, which uses infra-red technology to identify potential obstacles ahead, and a Head-Up Display, which reduces driver distraction and increases safety.
      The Bentayga’s eight-inch touch screen infotainment system boasts class-leading navigation technology, a 60GB hard drive, and a choice of up to 30 languages.
      Rear seat passengers benefit from the introduction of the Bentley Entertainment Tablet – a removable 10.2” Android device with 4G, WiFi and Bluetooth for effortless, high-speed on-board connectivity.
      Customers can choose between three different sound systems for the Bentayga Diesel: Bentley Standard Audio, Bentley Signature Audio and Naim for Bentley Premium Audio. The latter is the most powerful system in the segment, with 1,950 watts, a network of 18 speakers and super-tweeters for unrivalled recreation of the highest audio frequencies.
      Customer deliveries will begin in Europe early next year, with entry into Russia, South Africa, Australia, New Zealand and Taiwan planned across the rest of 2017.
      echnical Specification
      Engine
      Type
      4-litre Twin turbo with E Supercharger direct injection V8
      Max Power
      435 PS / 429 bhp / 320 kW @ 3750-5000 rpm
      Max Torque
      900 Nm / 664 lb.ft @1000-3250 rpm
      Transmission
      Driveline
      ZF eight-speed automatic gearbox, permanent all-wheel drive, Torsen centre differential, open rear differential, 40:60 front:rear torque split
      Ratios
      1st: 4.714; 2nd: 3.143; 3rd: 2.106; 4th: 1.667; 5th: 1.285; 6th: 1.000; 7th: 0.839; 8th: 0.667
      Final Drive
      3.308
      Brakes, Wheels and Tyres
      Front Brakes
      400mm ventilated iron discs
      Rear Brakes
      380mm ventilated iron discs
      Wheels
      Standard 20”, optional 21” and 22”
      Tyres
      Pirelli 275/50R20, 285/45 R21, 285/45 ZR21, 285/40ZR22
      Steering
      Type
      Electronic Power Assisted Steering, variable ratio
      Turns lock-to-lock
      2.3 turns
      Turning circle
      12.4 m / 40.6 ft
      Suspension
      Front
      Four link double wishbones, optional 48V electric active anti-roll bar
      Rear
      Trapezoidal multi-link, optional 48V electric active anti-roll bar
      Springs and dampers
      Self-levelling air suspension, Continuous Damping Control
      Dimensions
      Wheelbase
      2995 mm / 117.9”
      Overall length
      5140 mm / 202.4”
      Width (across body)
      1998 mm / 78.7”
      Width (inc. mirrors)
      2224 mm / 87.6”
      Overall height
      1742 mm / 68.6”
      Fuel tank
      85 litres / 18.7 UK gallons / 22.5 US gallons
      Boot volume
      430 litres / 15.2 cu ft (590 litres / 20.8 cu ft load cover retracted)
      Kerb weight (EU)
      2390 kg / 5269 lb
      Gross vehicle weight
      3250 kg / 7165 lb
      Performance - provisional and subject to Type Approval
      Top speed
      168 mph / 270 km/h
      0-60 mph
      4.6 secs
      0-100 km/h
      4.8 secs
      Fuel Consumption (EU cycle) - provisional and subject to Type Approval
      Urban
      31.3 mpg / 9.0 litres/100 km
      Extra Urban
      38.2 mpg / 7.4 litres/100 km
      Combined
      35.8 mpg / 7.9 litres/100 km
      CO2 emissions
      210 g/km
      Emissions Controls
      EU 6
    • By William Maley
      The tentative agreement between General Motors and Canadian union Unifor has a $400 million investment going to Oshawa for a new product. Unifor President Jerry Dias said at a press briefing yesterday morning that Oshawa would be the only GM plant that will build cars and trucks. Neither side is saying what that product might be.
      But Canadian newspaper The Globe and Mail has learned from sources that Oshawa will be handling the final assembly of the Chevrolet Silverado and GMC Sierra. Truck bodies from GM's Fort Wayne Assembly in Indiana will travel to Oshawa to have interiors installed and final assembly. The Detroit News reports something similar, although their source says it will only be the Silverado.
      Oshawa has a history of building pickups. For four decades, Oshawa was one of the places where GM built the Silverado and Sierra. But in 2009, GM closed the truck plant due to the recession. 
      The Globe and Mail also reports that production of the XTS has been extended at Oshawa. Analysts believed previously that XTS production would end in 2019.
      Source: The Globe and Mail, The Detroit News

      View full article
    • By William Maley
      The tentative agreement between General Motors and Canadian union Unifor has a $400 million investment going to Oshawa for a new product. Unifor President Jerry Dias said at a press briefing yesterday morning that Oshawa would be the only GM plant that will build cars and trucks. Neither side is saying what that product might be.
      But Canadian newspaper The Globe and Mail has learned from sources that Oshawa will be handling the final assembly of the Chevrolet Silverado and GMC Sierra. Truck bodies from GM's Fort Wayne Assembly in Indiana will travel to Oshawa to have interiors installed and final assembly. The Detroit News reports something similar, although their source says it will only be the Silverado.
      Oshawa has a history of building pickups. For four decades, Oshawa was one of the places where GM built the Silverado and Sierra. But in 2009, GM closed the truck plant due to the recession. 
      The Globe and Mail also reports that production of the XTS has been extended at Oshawa. Analysts believed previously that XTS production would end in 2019.
      Source: The Globe and Mail, The Detroit News
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