surreal1272

When Cadillacs still ruled the world.

And I will politely tell that I know what both of them are and I also know the shell game behind it (for example, the invoice price is not what they actually paid for it). I am also politely declining any further discussion on this since you continue to cherry pick one part of a much bigger problem I have already covered in spades here.

Did you actually read what I said? I never said that they didn’t do it ever but they do not make a damn habit out of it. Why? Because they would go out of business. I cannot make it any clearer than that. The fact is that everything you just mentioned there is part of their well known she’ll game with numbers. You think they offer vehicles at invoice out the goodness of their hearts? Sorry but again, you keep moving the bar to make up excuses for well known problems when dealing with your average dealership. Again, see my above statement. That is not the norm and you know it. FFS. I said I was done with this nonsense and here I am getting dragged into the same endless back and forth with someone who will never see the other side of the coin and thinks that dealerships are necessary in the modern world. Well now, I am officially done. Conflate all you want. Move the damn bar all you want while ignoring the other facts that run counter to your narrative (like why dealerships fight tooth and nail to prohibit direct sales in states where companies like Tesla want to business). I’m out.

It is still their lowest seller so by your GM and Ford logic, it is a failure. Thanks for playing though.

That avoidance of facts seems to have spread to others, as evidenced by the last 24 hours. Shhhh! You know we don't talk about that around here lol.

You’re exactly right about that. What is also true is that the prices would be even higher if they used the dealership model. See how that works yet?

And what dealership is this because I’ve worked at three in two different states and the only time a vehicle is sold below MSRP is when it’s a carry over year model or otherwise something that has been on the lot for more than a year? Dealerships would go out of business if they made a habit out of that and you know it. You mean like how dealership lobbies have spent years trying to block direct sales in a lot of states thus taking away the choice for potential customers? That is making them the only choice for buyers which is the opposite of how a free market economy works. It’s almost like the dealerships want to make it mandatory that you have to “choose” them. Help it make sense Balth.

In the same universe, there is exists these two scenarios with the same person regarding the same practice. See if you can spot the difference. Dealerships and market adjustments=Good because of free market capitalism and customer choice. Uber and other delivery services expanding during a pandemic and giving customers that same choice under that SAME free market=Bad That is both a double standard and hypocrisy. And I didn’t even need ten paragraphs and fifty thousand words in one post to explain it. Ain’t that some shyte?

So what you are saying it that buying direct was far cheaper and far more convenient than having to haggle with a dealer over phantom market adjustments. Interesting.

You were not in that boat. You were pretty clear about your situation and stance with them. Like Robert said though, this thread is a mess and I made my case and I will stand by it. I’m just not going to waste anymore space on this than I already have though.

And I’m out…

And you clearly didn’t actually read a damn thing I said regarding choice and it wasn’t just about greed of dealerships, all the while you bitch about the greed of delivery services. Either go back and actually read what I said because I don’t give two $h!s about your votes one way or the other. Fact is your hypocrisy is right there for everyone to see and that’s good enough for me. And WTF is that so supposed to mean anyway? Just more babble or an empty threat? Which one? The first down vote was from you but hey, don’t let that little fact get in the way of more meaningless words from you. Maybe take up two more pages with this nonsense.

So how about those alternative fuels and propulsion? I caught on 10000% because I know you’re being hypocritical. That’s the difference here. And btw, I will continue to laugh at the hypocrisy and especially after your little “your words are meaningless” remark. Save the talking down for someone else next time. I stand by everything I have said here.

FFS. Where do you come up with this BS? Low volume? High volume? Who cares? You said they couldn’t sell $100K cars and I gave you just two that did. Besides, you never use that “low volume” excuse when folks bring your precious G-Wagen. Sorry but I’m done pandering to your endless bar moving. You said GM couldn’t and I and others showed you that they did and will continue to do so, end of story.

So about the alternative fuels and propulsion…

Be careful @oldshurst442 . You’re going to use up all those down votes, and all because you don’t seem to like the facts when they come to your door.

Interesting that you are calling him out for hypocrisy but not the other poster who has wasted almost two pages now screaming about free market and customer choice yet he has a problem with those two concepts when it came knocking on his door. And that’s why I’m still laughing.

I’m laughing at your hypocrisy. You and restaurants like yours had a choice. Remember saying that over and over again? “Choice”? That is a result of the “free market”. That is all. You may now downvote this too.

Same can be said for you since now you don’t support the middle man approach because it affects businesses like yours. Also hypocritical because it flies in the face of your “free market” mantra you have been going on about for the last page and a half. Funny how that works.

Well guess I called it. Damn near a page wasted already.

Yet they sold every single one that they made. Guess that fact never occurred to you. And their worst selling SUV still sold more than anything out of Germany, mainly because the biggest player doesn’t even have an EV SUV yet. Again, BS. Despite the struggles of their sedan sales overall, they sold every V series and Blackwing model produced so you are lying about that too.

There's the part I was looking for. It's "coming" but not before they released a low demand ugly ass sedan. Again, your criticism of MB does not equal the criticism you have bestowed upon literally everyone else. And congrats. That EQB will have a whole 26 miles more range as the equally paltry ranged Jaguar E-Pace. The "best or nothing" right?

And your proof of this is what exactly? The EQS? It has no gasoline equivalent. The closest thing to it is the S-Class and it sure as hell isn't that. The EQB? That will start, minimum $50K while the GLB starts at $38K. Why are you lying?

@oldshurst442-Again, you have skipped over everything that has been said. That is why this is last response to you regarding it. Sincerely, Someone who has been in sales and negotiated such things damn near his entire life.

Maybe he'd like to explain this from the FTC website (not directly written by the FTC, for the record). It was written in 2014 but it is still spot on in relation to the dealership monopolies and their lobbying power with various state governments. Again, if it is a "free market", then why are dealerships fighting the very principles of the same free market? https://www.ftc.gov/news-events/blogs/competition-matters/2014/04/who-decides-how-consumers-should-shop