NINETY EIGHT REGENCY

GM is not finished fixing the brands it has..

Those were interesting photos to say the least. Makes you wonder what could have been. They were very nice to look at and notice the things on the Oldsmobiles that are now in other production cars.

I only reported what I read. I would not say I "believe" this. This would be more of a headache for GM. The only reason I see do this would be for the minvans and that is a shrinking market. There would be too much overlap , plus GM is not finished fixing it own divisions. It is probably a rumor based on fear. If Dr. Dieter Zetsche from Mercedes Benz/Daimler Chrysler wants the unions to give in, you threaten them will selling Chrysler and play hard ball. I really do not know.. I just have a hard time believing this in the first place.

Report: GM in talks to buy Chrysler Dale Jewett | | Automotive News / February 14, 2007 - 4:39 pm DaimlerChrysler is reportedly talking with General Motors about the possibility of GM's buying the Chrysler group, according to the German magazine Manager Magazin. The magazine cited company sources as saying the talks were in full swing but still at an early stage. The report came today as DaimlerChrysler AG said it was open to all options for the Chrysler group. Chrysler today unveiled a restructuring plan as it posted a $1.47 billion loss for 2006. That plan calls for cutting 13,000 jobs in the United States and Canada by 2009. DaimlerChrysler CEO Dieter Zetsche declined to comment on the report. "I cannot and will not go into any further details," Zetsche told reporters in Detroit, where he announced the automaker's 2006 results. A GM spokeswoman also declined to comment on the report. DaimlerChrysler has retained JPMorgan Chase & Co. to consider options for the Chrysler group, the Detroit News reported this afternoon. In a report on its Web site, the newspaper quoted unidentified company sources as saying the automaker had hired the investment bank. Reuters contributed to this report.

A 1986 Ford Taurus commercial: A Taurus SHO commercial: I wonder since they are using the same platform as Volvo S80 which now offers a V8 engine, will they create an AWD Taurus SHO with a V8? The new 2008 Taurus/Taurus X/Sable video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UqV6CwrtzJU&NR I agree with you AM6 Cutlass. Not everyone wants bucket seats. Just because some do not like them, they cannot speak for the whole. If they were hated so much the DTS and Lucerne and Impala, LaCrosse would not offer them. There would be no need for Grand Marquis and Lincoln Town Car. There is still a market for the bench seat. It may have shurnk, but there is a market for them. For some odd reason people think if they have a floor shifter abd bucket seats they are driving a "sporty" car. Sporty is Camaro. I wonder if Taurus and Sable are offering bench seats.

I saw a silver Rainer yesterday.

As much as some of us like the old GM names on many GM cars and grew up with them there are facts: 1. The market has changed since the 1950's to the early 1990's. GM does not own 50% of the market. I wished they still had that, but they do not. People do not want to accept that. 2. Younger buyers do not remember or have fond memories of the past GM names like most of us do. They do not know GM history either like some of the older buyers. 3. Our society has changed. People are not loyal like they were to jobs, cars and on and on. 4. The coasts (East and West) dictate a lot of the trends in this country. 5. GM is to blame for the mess they created. They are cleaning it up. GM damaged those names and brands over time. The G8 represents that time frame. It was over 20 something years. 6. Toyota aimed directly at the heart of the market and shot a bullseye just like Honda. They studied the GM buyers and GM was refusing to change because they thought they were the best and good enough.When they woke up, Honda and Toyota were knocking on the back door. They knocked so hard, they knocked the door down. 7. We sadly live in am image conscious society that is driven by greed and keeping up with everyone else. 8. GM ceased to be relevant at a point in the 1990's. I will even admit as much as I like my Oldsmobile Ninety Eight and Toronado, the versions I have are former shadows of what the cars truly were. Toroanado was getting back to that winning formula, but it by that point and time was not the only fwd car on the market. 9. The big switch of every GM car to front wheel drive and copying imports hurt GM too. They dropped the rear drive cars in 1996. 10. Plus... the big thing... Buick and other GM divisions customer base got older. Can older names return? Yes. It will take two generations or more. What was Grand Prix from 1988 until now would have to be forgotten. When people fondly remember Grand Prix, it was the ones from 1987 backwards. Ford is doing something right with Taurus and Sable. Love them or hate them, those names carry some weight. Can you sat that about LeSabre or Century in the last form they were in 2003? Let me give you an example. Let's say a well to do family bought a new car. Because of the image they maintain, what would look like when they tell their friends "I bought a Pontiac Grand Prix"? You can only the reaction they would get. The first reaction would be is that the " hired helps" car? Take the same scenario. They instead said We bought a Pontiac G8. The first reaction would be what is that? They can brag on their car and show it off. The GM brands are damaged GM brands and GM instead of being the great company it was is starting from scratch. They have to show they have it all over again. It is like an older baseball player coming out of retirement. Can he do it? Is he great as he once was? GM has to show the public something in order to show they have changed and have that old GM swagger. In the process of that change, they have to show they can compete, change the way they do business. Toyota and Honda took those buyers one car and one step at a time. It is no mistake that Toyota Avalon looks like a big "American" car. DESIGN. QUALITY. PERCEPTION. It all has to change.

Hard to believe the last time we had a rear drive Pontiac sedan was 1986. The last rear drive Pontiac car like vehicle was a station wagon. Those vehicles were: 1986 Pontiac Bonneville( G Body) 1986 Pontiac Parisienne ( B Body) 1989 Pontiac Safari wagon( was Parisienne Safari) Ronald Reagan and George Bush I were in office. DANG!! Everything comes full circle. The G Body Bonneville was 198 inches long until a slight update in 1984 which put it at 200 inches on a 108 inch wheelbase and it used a 3.6 liter V6 rated at a 110 hp and a 5.0 305 V8 rated at 150 hp. The trunk was 16.6 cubic ft. When Bonneville went FWD in 1987, it was 198.7 inches long, on a 110.7 inch wheelbase, and offered a 3.8 liter V6 rated at 150 hp. The trunk was 15.25 cubic ft. That was 21 years ago!! DANG!! The Pontiac G8: WELL... big difference..... Everything old is new again in a different way.

Thank you. Your compliments are appreciated.

The photos with Bob Lutz look great. I was driving home and I realized why GM is not going to use old Pontiac names. It is the way today's market is and the buyers associated with the market. There are many who are loyal to GM and Pontiac and would buy Pontiac no matter what. GM once had a huge share of the market. Not any longer. The thing GM is fighting is: The automotive media the import buyers People who would not consider a Pontiac The buyers on each coast. Much as anyone hates to admit it, they do dictate a lot of the styles and trends and more in this country. How do you get them to look at a new Pontiac? Putting the name of Bonneville or Grand Prix on the car for loyalists is not enough. They want buyers ,not watch their customer base die. This is one of the biggest things Buick is facing. The buyers I mentioned above do not fondly remember Pontiac like the loyalist do. Several people in this thread have said it. Baggage. Perception. The G8 is one way to over come that. Let this car become the "new" Pontiac legend. Let this car along with Solstice create new legends and new memories. I would say the same thing about Oldsmobile if it were around too. If they had a new car that was exactly like Ninety Eight and called just Regency or something like that, it would be a car for me to consider. In the end, they did not. That is beside the point. The point here is new car, new legends, new history and hopefully new buyers. This car is what Pontiacs of the 1960's were in their day. This is a modern interpretation of it. This car is saying GM has figured out what Pontiac is. Buick is going to get that shot in the arm too. They just need the right sedan along with Enclave. Again.. new legends, new history, new buyers based on what the brand truly stood for in the day. Maybe in a generation or two when the past is forgotten, they may bring the old names back. By the way.. isn't it interesting the front end pushed the length on this car from 192 in Holden form to 196 in Pontiac form? This car dimensionally is between the old C and H bodies of the 80's and the W and C and H Bodies of the 90's. This car borders on fiullsized status. I say this because for a year or so the Bonneville was 199 inches long in the 1990's.

The militant Ford : Taurus X! Fighting for the cause of the oppressed domestics.

Ford puts it on wheels. Have you driven a Ford lately. Taurus for us! That is the quickest turn around for a car. At least Ford admitted the mistake and corrected it. I have no problem with the car. People will buy it. It is all new compared to the last Taurus which was the same size pretty much. You have to do something to turn the tide. There are still a lot of Taurus owners out there. They have something to trade up to now.

I thought the same thing too!! I see the Bonneville GXP in the front and the current Grand Prix in the rear. It is like it combines the best of those two cars into one rear drive car. That is the way it has to be. Since Pontiac and Buick and GMC are in the same dealership, Pontiac gets the midsized car that does not clash with the Buick, and Buick gets the fullsized car that does not clash with the Pontiac.

This car looks fine. It reminds of three vehicles: The current Grand Prix GXP The late Bonneville GXP and the Grand Am (grille) I see nothing wrong with it. It looks like a Pontiac Bonneville GXP in the front. The back reminds me of current Grand Prix. The over all theme is very current Grand Prix GT and GXP. Let's see how it sells. I can say one thing about the interior: It is not hard gray dull past Pontiac plastic. There is some color in the interior. This car deserves a fair shot. It is not offensive or ugly.

Yes it had a diesel. There were others which used it. There was the notorious 5.7 liter diesel V8. There was the 4.3 Liter they used in front drive cars. The 1985 Oldsmobile 98 used that diesel. The diesel faded away quietly.

GM is changing. So much has changed for the better. In the process of those changes for the better, names , divisions and cars have been dropped. It has upset many and more. In the end we all hope it is for the greater good of GM. I drove the current Grand Prix for 12 days when my first Ninety Eight was totaled. It was a great riding car. The interior was a different story.. I knew they were trying to make it like the 1970's Grand Prixs. These cars have had long runs. I remember the heyday when they were rear drive before. Maybe in time people will fondly remember them. I remember when they came out in 1988. That platform is almost twenty years old. So many cars have been on that platform too. It is funny how it grew in size. The first W Bodies were 188 inches long. The last ones are 198-200 inches long. You hate to see a product go when you liked it or whatever. Was it really competitive still? We will see what things bring. Everything is coming full circle.

This is good news indeed!! Please let the people here know it is okay...

I am glad they are giving it a second shot. It was not clear if it would be a Buick Royaum again or a Holden Statesman/Caprice in China. There must have been something they did wrong they can do right this time. I am sure Daewoo will be getting a new Statesman too. I look forward to seeng photos. I am sure GM China is going to modify this car some how. It may even have a different interior than the Statesman and Caprice. Only time will tell.

Thank you for pointing that out. The Lucerne does not have both. It is nice to know they do have the digital gauges. Lincoln at least put the seat controls in the right place on the door.

I drive a 1995 Oldsmobile Ninety Eight and a 1992 Oldsmobile Toronado. The Ninety Eight has all those things, but Oldsmobiles made them contemporary and used the latest technology on their cars. The Toronado was sporty, but that is another market we lost was the large personal luxury coupe. I have some issues with some features on DTS, but like the Town Car, it does what it is supposed to do. There is a market for these type of cars. If they did them one better and offered the features people wanted, and made them contemporary they would have some hits on their hands. The only real examples we have left are DTS, Lucerne, Grand Marquis, Town Car . The thing is it is not really the older people buying these cars. They associate them with older buyers. I personally do not need a German ride, sport gauges, bucket seats, floor shifter, spoiler on the trunk and a five speed transmission. The theme is comfort and luxury. I like my cars because they have digital gauges. I hate analog gauges because they are so boring to look at. I grew up on needles and dials. I am sure others like sporty rides and more, but there is still that segment who prefers traditional comfort. The Americans know how to do that.They got away from it because they spent 20 years trying to copy styling from other places. If anyone would go look at a Lincoln Town Car, you would find it does not have digital gauges. It has full analog gauges just like DTS. There are other buyers who want a large comfortable affordable car with all the options. The DTS is a comfortable and competent luxury car.

The arrowhead was silver in the early 1960's. No big deal there. It is a nod to the past I am sure. The grille itself is a nod to the grilles of the late 1970's to mid 1990's. It is the subtle things they did to make it Pontiac.

I have no problems with the car or the front end. It looks like A Pontiac grille. They made a little investment. I hope it pays off. The front end reminds of Pontiacs of the past(that is a good thing). I looked at the newscast, and it was interesting. GM is having to globalize. If Buick and Pontiac become the American Holden so be it. Saturn is already the American Opel/Vauxhall. I will add this: GM China is getting a new Statesman and I am sure they are going to put the Chinese Buick touch to it. They will produce it there. Will we benefit or get to see the Statesman stateside??

In the late 1970's and early to mid 1980's GM got burned really bad on diesel engines. We have had them. There was a 5.7 liter 350 V8 diesel. The division who gets most associated with it is Oldsmobile. There was a 4.3 liter diesel V6 and Cadillac had that engine that switched off cylinders. Those past mistakes have made consumers weary and GM is proceeding with caution this time. They did get the cylinder shut off right this time. I think they offer one on the trucks and I think the Impala with the V8 has it too. GM offered weaker V6's for economy in the 1980's and 1990's after that. I remember the 3.8 and 4.1 liter V6's. The 3.8 had 110 hp. Before everyone says something, GM had a bunch of 3.8 liter V6's. In Europe, you need a diesel in order to sell and make in roads. Cadillac is making sure the car has what it needs to succeed there. In order for GM to take its brands global, those cars have to be adapated to those markets. Diesels are where it is at in Europe. The BLS is the right size and it is not a hit there because of the interior not being Cadillac enough and what Europeans expect from Cadillac. Only time will tell...

Only time will tell how this turns out. What if the STS went up in size to 197-200 inches into BMW 7/Lexus LS territory and the DTS went back up to its old size or the Lincoln Town Car size? That would move STS away from CTS and put DTS back where it once once still doing what it does not appealing to a certain buyer? They would have each segment covered. But any way... I do not understand why they won't at least put a stand up hood ornament on the DTS with the bench seat. I do not like the headlights because there is only one headlight on each side of the grille. I prefer a quad headlamp design. It looks bug eyed just like that GMC Yukon which also has one headlight on each side of the grille too. They do not offer digital gauges on this car other that small speedometer under the "analog" cluster". The seat controls are on the side of the seat instead of being on the door. I think it is sad that GM and others do not see there is a market for this kind of car like DTS still. They just need tp update them and keep them contemporary. The Lucerne and Lincoln Town Car and Grand Marquis and Impala are all we have now. This is one of the reasons why I drive Oldsmobiles and allthough they may be older, they still work well and do their job. Not everyone wants or needs a slick looking car with bucket seats and a floor shifter and a spoiler on the trunk or a sporty look trying to compensate for some other short coming in life. Sorry... Just ranting here because DTS does what is supposed to do.

Hmm.... Too many too list. It was my division. There are some Oldsmobiles I did not like.