hyperv6

Bottom line goes like this. Even with a drop in total sales GM will still make a killer profit on the new SUV's. This in turn will help fund much on the new RWD cars. Cash flow is the name of the game here. 2ND the trucks from Japan are going to make gains but will not bury the domestic lines. They do not have near as much pull in the heartland and they do on the west coast. The heartland is truck land. 3RD the imports still don't have the best handle on what a American pick up/suv is. The Ridgeline is a good example of a good truck but not what most look for in a truck. Honda may make a better Harley like bike but one problem, it is still not a Harley. GM will move a lot of these SUV's high gas prices or not so sit back and enjoy the sales.

[quote name='blackviper8891' date='Sep 22 2005, 04:22 PM'] Oh... so this is the actual prototype, then? I've never seen it before. That makes things interesting. I was always under the impression that it... looked different. I especially never would have guessed it was it... Well there were several. This one was done by ASC with Pontiac approval. Pontiac used it as a show car. They also had the following 1984 Speedster with chopped windscreen and no roof 1985 convertiable with soft top that stored under a side opening rear back half of the car. 1985 sliding hard top, it was a hard top with removable targa and retracting back half. 1988 convertiable GT this one was production ready but just did not make the cut. all but the first and last ones have been crushed. I think they may have had one or two more but I would have to look it up. I saw most of them one time or another, the speedster would have a hit.

Production the last I saw was bumped to 15,000 with 13,000 sold. They were just ramping up slow and preparing for the Sky and Opel to start production.

Well this car was a ASC prototype show car built as a proposal to GM for production in 1985. It is a stock 4 cylinder and is sitting on stock spring per GM tire clearance regs in the 80's. [they reqired chain clearance for years on the tires] This car was saved by ASC and sold to a man in KY, he intern sold it to a guy in TN and has been for sale in MI on E bay from time to time. This car is very well built and uses many of the things used on the first 80's Corvette also designed by ASC for GM. They never removed the VIN and it was never crushed. It is onme of the few prototypes you can own ans drive. It has low milage and is in good condition. With the space frame of a Fiero it was hard to make a good covnvetible but this one was done right so flex is at a minium. It may not be trend setting but it is also nearing 25 years old. It is a very nice historic car. At least they were able to save it from the crusher

I wish they would have used a emblem like the GM design emblem. It looks much like the Pinifarina emblems. The design emblems are only on show cars.

Lets take em to Mid Ohio and see who has the best lap times, a true test of a sports car.

I wonder when the final totals are in and Lutz is proven right will anyone admit they were wrong? I think in the long run this is only one of many more time Lutz will be proven right.

The PT is a truck till they take the roof off and it becomes a car. Got to love Gov. regs. I is just fun to watch the "it is not going to sell" people not understand tha it is selling. I would not buy one myself but understand a new car with different styling and cheap will catch the publics eye and sell well. I expect it will do fine for the next 3-4 years and they can restlyle it to more of a degree than Chrylsler canthe PT. How about a mini 55 Chevy panel look? If they can sell those boxes from Japan the HHR should be a hit.

Some photo's are when someone lets their gard down and get caught! But on the other hand as tight as GM is on security they are leaking just what they want seen, they are not as stupied as many want you to believe. I have seem many controlled leaks in the last few years. Keep in mind the C5 was tested with a Camaro body when it was being driven. The new car may have been seen before and no one noticed.

I feel the Camaro is farther along than most relize. The car will have cue's from all gens. I was told all the pictures we have see are not correct so toss out what you you have seen. We should see more mules after January once the show car is let out. My guess we will see one in Germany at the ring after the first of the year on GM first 06 trip. I would not be suprised if 08 could still be a possibility even if it is an early 09 model. I expect the show car at Detroit to be along the lines of past show car at 80% production based like the Aura. Also note the time line of the Aura from show to production, I think this is telling.

I heard 07 refresh but never heard the details. What you show is along the lines of what direction GMC is going on grilles. I just pray they upgrade the interior as they have on the other lines. As of now I would not trade my Sonoma for one based on interior materials alone.

GM will survive, thing may change but they will not go away. As for price, I think too many under estimate it. Chevy has sold more new trucks with their employee plan at the end of it's life cycle than it did new. I think if you off a very good car with a great price it will always out sell a perfect car at a high price. I wish it was not this way but in these times the almighty dollar is very important to many. I hope the new GM pricing is only a start but I would like to see them do better. As for one man saving GM? NO! It will take a group of leaders working together and not apart as in the past. I think we are now getting thr people that can do it if given the time. Lutz and Wagoner have a lot of good people under them and they are the future.

I don't care who built it most of todays cars have cheap plastic and very cheap door panels under $40,000. The GTO is one of the few that has good interior feel. GM, Ford Chrysler, Honda, Toyota, Mazda, Nissan and other love to used hard plastics as they are cheap and light. So don't over blow GM on this many more have and are doing the same.

Sure! They could replace the aging fleets of Fiero squad cars. I don't know where this idea came from but the car would never pass the testing for the pit manuver let alone many of the other requirements. You got a better chance with a Cobalt SS and it's not that good of a chance either.

I know the guy I work with well and he Knows turbo's. He has a 400HP Neon he built himself. I just wondered if it was a 07 Turbo set up on a show car or what. It was the first time I heard of a turbo in public on display. This was a GM display showing Pontiac, Chevy and Saturn. They also had a extensive Ecotech display. I am not a sport compact guy but now I wish I had gone when they tried to talk me into taking my car up.

I did not see this but had a coworker who went to Hot Import Nights in Clevleand last week. He reported a lot of modified Cobalts and other cars at the GM dsisplay. He did say they had a Turbo Solstice at the GM display. I do not know anymore than this so if the GM display is around someone please take a look and see if it is there.

The next batter up to the plate will be the Silverado/Sierra 900 pickups. The way it looks the SUVs are going to be seen long before January and make a good segway. The Camaro looks to be Chevys big concept this year. I would speculate that the GTO may be shown in some 90% production form like the Aura concept this year as it is not going to be too long till the new one will be available in late 07 as a 08. Pontiac will also show what they will show at SEMA this fall with the various Racing and modified Solstice. The only thing I ponder id who will leak the first Camaro picture and how many will complain it is eiterh too retro or not enough.

The info I heard came from the first rock beyond earth [if you get the hint]. What I said earlier about a preshow preview in Detroit has a lot to do with your statement Also the invitee is heavily involved with Chevy F bodies. This info is just a few weeks old.

The Camaro will be at Detroit in January and they already have a preveiw in the works right before the show for the press and invited guest. I know someone who was told by someone close to this that they will be invited once it is offical. So if there is no car why are they having a preview? Also the car may be farther along then stated so it is possible it could be sooner than the date give. But as with anything at GM it is always subject to change.

I would have voted but none of the above was not offered. I am a long time Pontiac fan and feel that too much is made about calling the new car a Garand Am. There are many still upset that the name was used on a FWD in the 80's. I just feel this car was suited for a new name but G6 was a lame cop out. Pontiac has not had many good name of late so G6 may not be all that bad ofter all. I would like to see Pontiac use names they had in the past on show cars and use them today. They have a heritage but with out the production past stigma. Banshee is a goo example of this. Also the Fiero name came from a Pontiac Firebird show car of the late 60's. Also I am sure they could find some Native American names that would fit there heritage and not offend anyone. Phoenix was a good example. Are car companies are so lame today they have to rely on retro to style their cars or use old name and numbers to sell cars. If you do a great looking and performing car you could name it the Pope mobile or Solstice and it would sell. So few have good original thoughts today or willing to take a chance on something new in the Auto industry and television industry. Lets face it how many more reality shows or carbon copy cars do we need.

Now we have seen 3 of the first Lutz cars the HHR, H3 and Sostice all have seen good or very good reviews form places not know to like GM. I hope these and the models we are about to see soon will keep the Piss and Moan clubers quiet. I know it won't but you can only hope. On a second note a V8 in the Soltice is ok for the after markert, Leave Mallet to become a modern day Shelby.

GM'S trun around is just starting to show with the Solstice, up till now everything was a quick band aide since Lutz's arrival. We have 18 new models coming many that are clean sheet of paper new. Hint the Camaro is not that far off as reported, just watch. Six speeds are ready at Caddy and even Pontiac and Saturn will see one in 07. Six speeds are for the most part a advetising gimick for engines with no low end power. If you don't believe that drive an Acura as see how when you drive it is like rowing a boat. As for Hybrid's they are also great on paper but in real life your not saving a dime with present technology. Cost are high, perfoprmance is low and milage is not really that great. Your as well off with VW deisel vs a Toyota hybrid. Start looking at the interiors, Lutz's interiors are now just hitting. Most anti GM press people have said nothing but good on the Sosltice and HHR. It takes time and money to change a company. A company the size of GM take a lot more than most so the 5 years since Lutz arrival is just now starting to pay off. The ship is headed in the right direction and the changes in the next 5 years are the ones that will show what Lutz has been working on and done. Anyone here who thinks change could have happened any faster has no clue what it take to change one car line let alone a whole company. The man hours and Billions of dollars it takes to bring a new line to market are staggering. Many good things are just starting to happen and they will start happening fast. Will everything be a home run? No! But you will find it is a vast improvment over the last 30 years.

The Miata has always been limited in sales in the States to keep up demand. I would have to check but I think I read they averaged around 17,000-22,000 units per year here. If you over sell a 2 seater your only killing future short term sales. There were a lot of mistakes in the Fiero program and selling 130,000 Fiero's the first year was on of the biggest. As for Miata competitors in Europe, can anyone say Opel!!

Most American car companies building V8 cars tend to go to Canada due to the CAFE. If the REW sedans are based on the same platform as the GTO or Camaro I expect to see them built across the boarder. They have got to keep the average fleet milage up anyway they can.

The top end Camaro SS will be no less than 400+ HP. But it will be important to have a very good V6 and I could see it over the 250 HP. If the V6 fails the new Camaro will fail. As much as I like Spring Hill for the New RWD GM cars, I expect them to all be from Canada just because of the V8 and CAFE factor alone. Oshwa is the prime plant. Deleware is out as Kappa and Zeta platforms just don't add up in the same plant. I expect we will see more Kappa based small cars as soon as the RWD Zeta cars are done. GM has more plans for Kappa but the development time and money need to go to the Zeta first.