oldshurst442

The Vette beat it in almost every performance metric. Sorry, but a sweet engine note alone does not a car make. http://www.caranddriver.com/comparisons/2016-chevrolet-corvette-stingray-z51-vs-2016-ford-mustang-shelby-gt350-final-scoring-performance-data-and-complete-specs-page-4 BUMP... Yeah...tell that to Ferrari...Lamborghini... Especially when EVERYBODY knows their cars burn themselves to the ground...

Dude...go back and see if I answered your comment about sound....and you will see I never answered you back... Tis YOU that said that V8 sound does not sell cars alone... Yet...Jay Leno...he keeps on talking about that sound the Voodoo makes... And...Ferrari. Hey...Its YOU that made that claim...now..live with the shame.

Not based on what's going on up here with the GT500 and Zeta ZL1. Consumers know that SVT is the real development muscle behind the Shelby name, so it's judged accordingly. Yeah....its a little too soon to be talking about Zeta ZL-1 depreciation... Come and see me in just a short 3 years... Why? You yourself keeps on wax poeting about the Alpha Camaro... As good as the ZL-1 was...YOU yourself is clamming about OVERPRICENESS and OBSELETENESS...you think the Alpha Camaro wont hamper on the ZL-1's depreciation? Dude...the Zeta Camaro was NEVER lust worthy...in the end it was a fantastic performer...but that's about it... Like I said....YOU YOURSELF thinks the Alpha Camaro is the second coming of Christ...hey...its your rules...

@ Surreal . Seriously? You didn't make that half page post (on top of the many long winded posts you have made)? Must been someone else who goes on endlessly that I was thinking about. My bad. Yet you keep on coming back for more... Dude....either stop responding or stop trying to make it seem like you are no drama queen either... @ EL K YOU are the ONLY one making it a point... Remember dude.. the 2015 GT350 were cars that were LIMITED to 137 units...all accounted for. Dude...the Voodoo 5.2 liter engine is bespoke to that particular trim ONLY... EL K...you cant possibly be that obtuse... LT1 engines have been in the Vette....34000 the first year and 32000 the second...that is 66 000 units that rolled off the assembly line... THAT is what makes the GT350 SPECIAL... But go ahead...continue arguing with me... Ill stop you dead in your tracks...YOU re the one that looks foolish here...not me...despite my novel worthy posts...

Hey, if they bought one right out of the gate then good for them. If they didn't then that's between them and their wallet.But where your comparison breaks down a bit is the fact that it took Ford two or three years to reel in the Chevy. The Alpha Camaro was already capable of being a headache for the Shelby as soon as it dropped, which was only months after the Shelby. Which, in turn, is already seeing it's options list juggled around in order to try and fight back. Yeah and?That my friend is normal business in the industry... Thing is... People in Greece, the ones that can actually buy a new car in 2015...are buying brand new Mustangs... So are the Brits... They are peeved off that they arent getting the visceral Mustangs that Hammond kept on taking about... But that is the thing though EL K... Lets talk like adults... Its hard to engineer a classic pony car to sell to the world when for 50 years all you've ever heard was how the rest of the world views the classic muscle car as uncouth... When it comes to a mythological creature like the Mustang, Ford had to really be careful NOT to screw it up for us and for them....as you know EL K, Ford is engineering only ONE Mustang platform for the world...only one... They miscalculated...its OK...they are correcting....dont act like a douche...you know what is what... Chevy...BEFORE the Corvette went racing with the C5...was a JOKE to the world....even when the C5R was winning, the world was laughing... Even when the C6R was winning, the world was still laughing...only the French in France started loving it...now...with the C7....the world is starting to take notice... CUE IN SURREAL HERE Yes Surreal, the French started loving that good 'ol V8 sound, yeah...like how CCAP and myself love the GT350 sound...kinda how universally, FERRARI ENGINES ARE REVERED for THEIR SOUND...hell a Ferrari is worth their price of admission SOLELY on the way they sound...who cares of they CONTINUE to burn to the ground! How many years...decades does that make for the Vette finally to get world acceptance? Dont kid yourself EL K... The C7 Vette is still not as revered in the world as it is here in North America...the C7 is still eons behind in respect as the Porsche 911 is world wide... Ford....with the GT350...made a EUROPEAN style SPORTS CAR....the Jay Leno video CLEARLY states that...and that video CLEARLY gives the reasons why... Yet....you seem to be all hell bent to dismiss ANY qualities the GT350 has... You know...the 1LE probably feels like a muscle car...someone who HATES muscle cars...like 99.99% of the rest of the world, probably will DESPISE a Camaro 1LE...and if GM was to go global with the Camaro...it would probably fail in that regard... Why? Unlike the Mustang...where the Mustang is a mythological creature...the Camaro is not... The world wanted a muscle car Mustang...they got a more European car....but they are OK with that... If the world got a muscle car Camaro...they would probably hate it...like I said...the Vette is as much a muscle car as its supposed to be...and yet...its laughed upon...and a Vette has more cachet than a Camaro world wide me thinks... PS: you think Ford marketers werent noticing the failures of Vette and Cadillac on European shores in the 1990s? You think they did not know the dangers of selling pure Americana to Europeans and how difficult it is? PSS: Ford of Europe has more presence than GM does...not Opel...Europeans think that Opel is truly European...German... They also think that of Ford of Europe... But a Ford Mustang is PURE Ford USA.... Think about how hard it is to engineer driving dynamics on a classic like a Mustang... GM STILL hasnt perfected that with its Corvette....get what Im sayin? Porsche is fantastic....they managed to create a legend that both continents enjoy, and literally for the same values... Ford and GM are still finding themselves in that regard....the world wide image thing... Why you felt the need to bring me into this, without knowing why I posted what I posted in the first place, is kind of silly and pointless but if it helps you write another diatribe laden novella. diatribe laden novella. You are full of those...more than mine... And yet you responded too...which you also have a history of doing...non...stop... About the sound.... Yeah..I know why you posted it...you were directing that to me...and with the FERRARI response I gave you...well, ITS OK...I guess people dont buy Ferraris for their engine noises, they buy them for their reliability... Dude...even women have orgasms when they hear Ferraris drive by... But yeah...engine noises arent that important for performance cars...

Price advantage? Who gives a phoque about price advantage? Especially when it comes to a BESPOKE V8 engine.... Everything about the Camaro is hand me downs... Chassis, engine, ...all hand me downs...of course the car is cheaper in price... Like I said...Id just buy myself a Vette and be done with it, or just the basic V8 Camaro instead of the 1LE, EL K...stop with the idiocy over a factor than nobody gives a shyte about... A GT350 is not your run-of-the mill pony car...like a 1LE... A BESPOKE flat plane crank V8 IS special... It was engineered for the Mustang GT350... You dont like it....cool, you are allowed... But like I said...the flip side to all that....a 1LE is nothing special....so that 37 000 dollar price tag is deemed to high for me...as I would rather bet it all on black at the Flamingo knowing Bugsy Siegel has rigged the round thing to stop at red....Id get a bigger thrill losing and possibly seeing Bugsy and buying him a drink which that would put me in the hole for $37012...10 dollars for his scotch ontherocks and a 2 dollar tip....than be seen in the Camaro... Its all how one sees it!

Hey, if they bought one right out of the gate then good for them. If they didn't then that's between them and their wallet. But where your comparison breaks down a bit is the fact that it took Ford two or three years to reel in the Chevy. The Alpha Camaro was already capable of being a headache for the Shelby as soon as it dropped, which was only months after the Shelby. Which, in turn, is already seeing it's options list juggled around in order to try and fight back. Yeah and? That my friend is normal business in the industry... Thing is... People in Greece, the ones that can actually buy a new car in 2015...are buying brand new Mustangs... So are the Brits... They are peeved off that they arent getting the visceral Mustangs that Hammond kept on taking about... But that is the thing though EL K... Lets talk like adults... Its hard to engineer a classic pony car to sell to the world when for 50 years all you've ever heard was how the rest of the world views the classic muscle car as uncouth... When it comes to a mythological creature like the Mustang, Ford had to really be careful NOT to screw it up for us and for them....as you know EL K, Ford is engineering only ONE Mustang platform for the world...only one... They miscalculated...its OK...they are correcting....dont act like a douche...you know what is what... Chevy...BEFORE the Corvette went racing with the C5...was a JOKE to the world....even when the C5R was winning, the world was laughing... Even when the C6R was winning, the world was still laughing...only the French in France started loving it...now...with the C7....the world is starting to take notice... CUE IN SURREAL HERE Yes Surreal, the French started loving that good 'ol V8 sound, yeah...like how CCAP and myself love the GT350 sound...kinda how universally, FERRARI ENGINES ARE REVERED for THEIR SOUND...hell a Ferrari is worth their price of admission SOLELY on the way they sound...who cares of they CONTINUE to burn to the ground! How many years...decades does that make for the Vette finally to get world acceptance? Dont kid yourself EL K... The C7 Vette is still not as revered in the world as it is here in North America...the C7 is still eons behind in respect as the Porsche 911 is world wide... Ford....with the GT350...made a EUROPEAN style SPORTS CAR....the Jay Leno video CLEARLY states that...and that video CLEARLY gives the reasons why... Yet....you seem to be all hell bent to dismiss ANY qualities the GT350 has... You know...the 1LE probably feels like a muscle car...someone who HATES muscle cars...like 99.99% of the rest of the world, probably will DESPISE a Camaro 1LE...and if GM was to go global with the Camaro...it would probably fail in that regard... Why? Unlike the Mustang...where the Mustang is a mythological creature...the Camaro is not... The world wanted a muscle car Mustang...they got a more European car....but they are OK with that... If the world got a muscle car Camaro...they would probably hate it...like I said...the Vette is as much a muscle car as its supposed to be...and yet...its laughed upon...and a Vette has more cachet than a Camaro world wide me thinks... PS: you think Ford marketers werent noticing the failures of Vette and Cadillac on European shores in the 1990s? You think they did not know the dangers of selling pure Americana to Europeans and how difficult it is? PSS: Ford of Europe has more presence than GM does...not Opel...Europeans think that Opel is truly European...German... They also think that of Ford of Europe... But a Ford Mustang is PURE Ford USA.... Think about how hard it is to engineer driving dynamics on a classic like a Mustang... GM STILL hasnt perfected that with its Corvette....get what Im sayin? Porsche is fantastic....they managed to create a legend that both continents enjoy, and literally for the same values... Ford and GM are still finding themselves in that regard....the world wide image thing...

BULLSHYTE, bro! I showed you a video where all that SHYTE does NOT matter...yet you IGNORE it...and PLOW ahead with YOUR agenda! EFF OFF, bro! Besides...the 1LE aint out yet.. Will it have heat soak issues like the Corvette Z06???!!! We will soon find out...wont we? And if it does...what will be your excuse then? You know...the GT350 is flawless so far! So is the Hellcat... Yet the Vette...it even gets beat by a 4 door Cadillac sedan in speed performance...and NO HEAT SOAK ISSUES!!!! Yet..you seem docile about that matter! Let me hear you say negative shyte against Chevy and their shytty engineering on the Z06 with heat saok issues... Yeah yeah...brothers did not break in the Vette properly... Them Toyota excuses are great...works for GM just as good too! THAT would be YOU... CONGRATS right back at you! Yeah yeah...the GT350sucks and the Camaro 1LE is the best! How PHOKING CHILDISH CAN WE GET???!!!

Yes...Im PISSED OFF! Wings is no longer around. I did not think Id be reading the same shyte again, this time on a GM level rather than a Ford. I happen to love ALL American cars...not the ones that employ me....or in your case EL K....EMPLOYED me... Yeah...you are no better than him, dude!

Cut the BULLSHYTE EL K!!! Just cut it out! I wanna know why you hate upon the GT350!!!! Dont give the BULLSYTE excuse that the 1LE is superior crap! The 1LE aint even out yet...the GT350 is already in its SECOND YEAR!!! YOU are rather that pumped up that Chevy will obviously try to upsatge the GT350? It aint rocket science,man! Since 1967, the pony car wars are as follows: Company 1 brings out a trim version of their pony car that surpasses all performance levels of previous years... Company 2 the following year, updates their version to beat last year's competition model. Company 1 brings out an updated model to upstage the competition the following year. Company 2 brings out another brand new model to upstage competition the following year. Company 1 also brings out another model to.....the following year. Why must you insist in embarrassing yourself with this childish antic of yours? Tell me...why the PHOKING hatred for the GT350? Because other than stupid childish numbers that YOU personally will NEVER get to experience...there is really no reason for you to be so stupid about a GT350... And yeah...you are just another arm chair bench racer EL K... No different than my nephew playing Forsa 3 or Grand Turismo 5 on hos XBOX and Playstation 3... You know...wait 'til next year excuses are right up your alley! The GT350 last year...was in a league on all its own! Yet YOU, not a single word of BRAVADO...but this year...you are all high and mighty for your 1LE... SHOVE THE 1LE up your ASS EL K!!! SHOVE IT DEEP!!! Before you shove it up your ass EL K... ANSWER ME WHY YOU HATE ON THE GT350...and DONT GIVE ME PERFORMANCE NUMBERS...because YOU are an ARM CHAIR BENCH RACER! PS: maybe you should try the blue pill Oval badge GT350...it might actually make your penis rise because obviously you have a slight defecit problem in that area the way you wax poetic about a 1LE that aint even out for sale yet!

YUP! And THAT is what I wanted to say...and I did say some things you said...except I did not take what EL K was saying seriously...so my responses became childish...because his constant berating was...childish... It seems he wasnt interested in an adult conversation...just an adolescent one...and he got it from me.

What??? That is the best you got? Looks like I win the battle of the wits...no contest. Remember EL K...

Im sure Ford does not care about Transformer badges either... Between you and me though, I think a snake caricature on a car is more...um...muscle car worthy than a Hasbro Toy logo...

Problem is... The nicest bumblebee was the one GM called junk... It even had some wicked battlefield scars. And a nice set of rad Cragars if Im not mistaken... And Megan's best shots were with that Camaro... Even THAT...GM screwed up in...they gave the hottest scenes of Megan to the 1970s Camaro instead of the mucho macho 2010 Camaro.

1LE man....get it in yellow and you are a fantasy movie star pleasuring yourself to the thoughts of a semi naked Megan Fox.

I hope you guys realize...that your arguments for the 1LE arent doing the Camaro 1LE any justice... The over zealous fanfare is exactly that...over zealous.

Hey...you said it yourself....STUPID MOVIE....and Chevrolet has got that blood all over their hands...by themselves... A Stingray that really aint the Stingray...and a 2016 Camaro that really aint the 2016 Camaro... Zeta Bumblebee. Latest Edition Actual 2016 Alpha Camaro. Transformers Edition Camaro In the meantime...HE IS GUSHING OVER THE GT350R so much for your hooray hooray GM Bravada! OOOPS....that is a dead GM model on a dead GM brand...I meant to say for your hooray hooray GM Bravado!

Need for what? Your bench seat racing? Your arm chair shenanigans? You know, the kind that adolescent boys do when they look at stats... I invite you once more to listen to Jay's commentary on the GT350...R. because according to that cool cat...the GT350R is an AMAZING vehicle...so...I guess that is all that is needed for Ford too...

It is buddy... Very blah! Just like the 2010 model...nothing has changed on it... What? Round front fenders as opposed to a straight slab? So it saw Jenny Craig... You see... 1969 Camaro 2010 Camaro 2015 Camaro ILE or Z/28 2016 Alpha Camaro http://www.today.com/health/kirstie-alley-talks-50-pound-weight-loss-time-its-different-1D80404553 Kirstie Alley talks 50-pound weight loss: 'This time it's different'

Hey..what about a Camaro with a Voltec powertrain? Nah...the Voltec deserves a much better exterior package than that ...so...a yeah...a Prius does sound like a nice start...

If you rooted for winners...you'd be a Mustang fan today, as the Mustang cleaned the Camaro's clock in 2002... Sales wise... And quite honestly, in the corporate world....IE the real world, THAT is the ONLY thing that counts. EL K....GM is making fan-phoking-tastic cars today...but...on the Camaro...lets be honest...its kinda on the bland side. OK...so its got a Corvette engine, and it handles better than a Porsche because the chassis is sublime...OK But does it got the "cool" factor? I dont think it does.... Honestly...Id rather the Corvette. It does everything the Camaro does...even if a 1LE might do it better than a base Stingray. The Vette....its cool. The Camaro...1LE or Z/28...looks like its trying real hard to fit in....somewhere in between a Mustang GT350 and bigger brother Corvette... And...if a Z/28 wants to approach 700...that DEFINITELY tells me that Camaro is trying real hard to be liked. The Camaro does not have Megan Fox semi-naked anymore to up sell it...The big bad robots are getting stale. In the meantime...Ill enjoy Hell on wheels called the Hellcat a tad more...with the Ferrari like hypnotic sounds of the GT350...because if I wanted to listen to the Detroit Motown sound Chevy Small Block V8...there is the Vette for that...

You're missing the point. You're going to bat for the Mustang as bad as he goes to bat for Das Boots. And neither argument holds water. Ccap himself has said that despite the Shelby name a local dealer just sold one for list. People aren't just lining up to say "take my money" anymore. They want steak, not sizzle. It matters not a jot if you can reach the limits of either on the street-you're paying for the POTENTIAL to be able to do something. And you're paying more for the same ability if you buy the Ford. And the Ford just can't match the bang for the buck that Chevy offers. There. Is. No. Escaping. That. If Im going to bat for the Mustang as hard as he does for Das Boots... Arent you going to bat for the Camaro as hard for Yankee Doodle Dandee? But you are allowed to go ape for Yankee Doodle Dandee though... Argument style...not what he actually does...

You aint doing that... Besides...I could read. Actually, I read THREE languages...there is no need for you to "point out" what was said... What YOU are doing is EXACTLY what Wings was doing... You cant see that? Now...I aint about to let you go just because I like you and I did not like Wings... Fair is fair... You say the GT350 overpriced...great...dont buy one. But...dont try to justify your biases to me... This Mustang is not the 2005 Mustang where a few glaring mistakes were on it... This 2016 Mustang GT350R is truly a special vehicle...and if Chevy keeps this up on its DULL Camaro...it will eventually die off again... PERFORMANCE NUMBERS...EVEN on PERFORMANCE CARS are NOT the end all be all... The Camaro...15 years ago...KILLED the Mustang in performance numbers...and we all know how that ended up... The here and the now??? Yeah...you argue like Wings...expect me to argue with you like I did with him...

About SMK....leave him out of this...he hasnt chimed in...

Yup! The GT350 aint overpriced EL K... That is you trying to shove Chevy over Ford in our faces... YOU are NOT in the right here and now...because had you were...you would be a little more like Jay Leno regarding the GT350...and a little less self absorbed. Yeah...the Camaro 1LE and a possible future Z/28 will eviscerate ANY Mustang... SO BLOODY WHAT? Are you tracking them cars El K? Because I know you cant track them on the street... Jay Leno took out the Recaros on his personal GT350 and he put the standard GT seats in... Why did he do that? So he could ACTUALLY ENJOY the Mustang GT350 R...GT350R no less...on the street...and we know that Jay actually tracks cars too...and we know that he ENJOYS JUST DRIVING THEM!!! Over priced? Hell, if I ever bought a Turbo 4 cylinder Camaro at ONLY 26 000 dollars Id be OVER PAYING...'cause I KNOW ID WANT TO COMMIT SUICIDE EVERY TIME ID LOOK AT IT... Oh...so you are talking about engineering... Yeah...real clever for GM to take a platform from a Cadillac and make it into a Chevy...that is good...no trolling... But Ford took a Flat Plane Crank approach for a V8 at 5.2 liters because...well...for the PHOQUE OF IT!!! It works dude! And its well worth the price of admission... For track days? Yeah well, if I was tracking for money...Id buy myself a REAL track car....something that has no backseats, no radio, no AC...roll bars...no interior whatsoever... Yeah...the interior would be something like that...so yeah...in other words...a Camaro 1LE with all that crap inside is MONEY WASTED... Because...you know...unnecessary weight and all... If I was cruising...you bet your ass it would be the GT350R...JUST FOR THE UNIQUE ENGINE SOUND... So yeah EL K...sorry if I think your trolling is...trolling.