oldshurst442

34 minutes ago, Robert Hall said:

I can’t imagine going back to manual windows after decades with power windows.  And with any vehicle of sufficient size, can’t reach the passenger side and can’t reach the back windows.  Crank windows are best left to the past.  

I understand all that.

But...if we want to save money, compromises need to be made, in order to achieve a car market that is well...affordable.  

Yes, crank windows need to come back.  What you just explained right there are just minor nuissances.  Unless of course you personally has the money to spend on luxuries like that.  Im discussing this as if we are still talking about having $25 000  midsized vehicles again.  Plenty of Americans and Canadians are in a pretty bad financial situation.  Inflation is just awefull and prices of goods and services that are of the necessary kind and not of the luxury kind are not going to go back down.  And our salaries are not going to go up matching inflation.  We are in a huge pickle.  I understand the pleas for cheaper cars.  Im a huge advocate for them.

45 minutes ago, Robert Hall said:

I get the appeal of a $25k car, I’d pay cash and not finance something that cheap.  But I don’t like decontented or stripper models, I’m old enough I want all the goodies and not a subcompact 4cyl despair-mobile. 

I know you do.   And I fully comprehend where you are coming from.  Please dont take our banter that Im schooling you and tsk tsk tsking you.   Its just that. Banter.  And rightfully so.  You want what you want and worked hard in your life that you do NOT need to compromise.  👍

48 minutes ago, Robert Hall said:

I like CPOs, get something 3 years old w/ low mikes at a reduced price.  A $60k car for $40k or a $50k suv for $30k.  I plan to do that again on my next vehicle. 

That is how one should do it.  I always buy new.  But more folk like you and less folk like me could also bring car prices down.    

10 hours ago, Robert Hall said:

In today's market, $25k is a decent used car, not much of anything decent under $30k for new and your average midsize CUV is $40k and up...

This is one of many reasons as to why new  25 000 dollar cars dont exist.   Especially if said 25 000 dollar vehicle has no frills.  A used car of a couple of years with extras might be more enticing.  not might be more enticing, for many people it IS more enticing...   And I get that 100%.

10 hours ago, Robert Hall said:

that's it's all they can afford

Nothing wrong with that.  There shoudnt be any judgement by ANYBODY!

10 hours ago, Robert Hall said:

they are a cheapskate.

Nothing wrong with that either.  While a cheapskate could be judged for being a cheapskate, ultimately its the cheapskate that is the smartest one of all.  A penny saved is a penny earned and no reason to just part with your hard earned money on nonsense.  But lets be honest, NOBODY needs power windows.  Its nice to have them, but in icy cold Montreal and plenty of times the power windows dont power window in the winter, I sometimes bitch and wish for crank windows...  So there is that considering the cheapskated-ness of stripper cars.  

I dont aspire to be cheap.  But I certainly wished I was more of a miser than the make it rain type of guy i kinda was back in the day.  

1 hour ago, riviera74 said:

Are we spoiled in the USA and Canada? yes.

When will I see a midsize car at about $25K, anytime soon?  never, apparently.

Will we ever dump the two-box SUV/crossover for sedans again?  hard to tell.  right now, I doubt it. 😦

The good times have been loooong gone for us to STILL wanting to be spoiled.

In some parts of the world, their standard of living has almost caught up to ours and in some cases, even suprassed us.  Our standard of living has dipped as compared to the good 'ole days.  We can buy more junk today, but we are indebted several life times over. And that would be one of many reasons of why we are in the situation we are in.  Including the tantrum filled lives we lead...    Maybe we shouldnt be looking to 25 000 dollar midsized sedans as the answer...   And quite honestly, that kind of car you are looking for has been inexistant for a looong time. 

20 years ago...midsized sedans were 25 000 dollars.   20 years ago!!!   Geeze Louise!!! 

Regardless though.  Would anyone consider buying a car, whatever the price. Obviously for 25 000 or less,  with crank up windows and no A/C?    No electric anything?  No shytty apple car play and the like?  Could we actually do that?  Or are we soooo out of touch with what is TRULY important in life that we need all that garbage in our cars? 

Its NOT about two box SUV/crossovers.  We had the cheap econoboxes that other markets have embraced for the longest of time, like since forever that we have NEVER embraced.  Well, in the 1970s when gasoline prices shot up the roof.  And then some of us started hating American cars...  

But THAT is not the point either. 

The point is that, like how it WAS in the '70s and the gas cruch, when shyte hits the fan, we buckle down, but as soon as the noose is loosened, we become avarice in overconsumption of everything.    

Can we buy ANY car, midsized, without ANY creature comforts so the price COULD be $25 000?  If enough of us in Canada and in the US  actually BOUGHT cars that way,  they'd still exist in THIS market... 

9 hours ago, ccap41 said:

It's not pretty but I can appreciate an analog clock in a vehicle. 

Im not too crazy about watches in cars.  If its there its there.  The Escalde Bulgari is OK, I guess.

The later Chrysler 300 clock is better looking than the Escalade clock.

 It was round in the earlier generations.  

Obviously the ones in Rolls Royces clocks and Bentlys are chic, expensive etc...but I dont view them as I do plain ole wrist watches.  OK...I  CAN AND DO  appriciate them.   I prefer to see  clocks in the older cars.  I guess from the 1900s-1950s'.   Not in the modern ones. 

11 hours ago, David said:

Weird, I totally missed this post, what thread did you post this in? Very valid points you made.

There was dialogue about the Malibu rental and then some dialogue about a Malibu in general and then some whining about car prices.  The same type of whining that I responded to in this thread.   So I had to react to both...

In this thread @trinacriabob has blessed us with yet story with another car rental from his famous trips.

Quote

I don’t know if I’d want to own a BMW 2 Gran Coupe overseas as its owner would have to contend with a lot of rambunctious drivers in “beaters” and on more challenging roads.  However, if money is no object and one can afford the repairs down the line, or is leasing one, this could be a great way to go about motoring.

This is what he said.   In bold. 

 I laughed at that.    Why?  Because it reminded of Greece. His story resides in Portugal but he has ALSO seen this in Italy.   Because in these places, especially in little villages or towns, they buy a car, a cheap car, well, cars are hella expensive to begin with, but they usually buy a no frills model and drive the hell out of it.  These cars have all kinds of dents on them.  Dusty... parked on the side of mountainous cliff sides carrying all knds of stuff in them.  The windows are ALWAYS dusty.  The tires. the interiors.  Its a thing you have to experience.  BTW...in the bigger cities, you will continue to see that as well.. 

Way different than what our North American rednecks do. Almost the same. But different.    

Point being:  We Canadians and Americans have become spoiled brats.  We whine and whine and cry and stomp our feet especially when we cant have nice things anymore without making ANY compromises.  Its like we are OWED something... 

Yet...as we know...NOBODY owes us NOTHIN'!!!    But we do NOTHIN' to change our ways.  We CONTINUE to buy on credit...yada yada yada...

Like I said...in other parts of the world...THEY MAKE DO with what they got.    

Self-winding, $160 000 US Bentley Bentayga Breitling optional clock

Ill just regurgitate the usual since the announcement of Oldsmobile being phased out back in 2000.  

Why Oldsmobile and NOT phoquing Buick?    Yes. I know the reason.  

I still hold THAT sentiment.  

With that being said.  When Buick gets its (EV) models in order and available for sale (here in the Canada and in the US), maybe Buick wont be so pathetic like it has been for ohhh....I dunno, since the 1990s.  

They had an upswing there in 2010 or so (maybe later as in 2015 there)abouts when the they had some models for sale and they were actually selling.   Both sedans and CUVs.  But then their sedan sales went down the loo and their CUVs were not enticing and we are back here again when Oldsmobile died and Buick had NOTHING to sell.  

*SIGH*

Im almost upset of myself for clicking on this thread.

Kinda hopefull with the title being true and kinda sad that it aint so.  But kinda relieved that its just a kinda click baity title.   

I wont be happy if Buick ever goes away.  But I will BE kinda happy if they do if they continue being as sad as they are. 

I want Buick to be Buick again.  This, what we have, in North America is NOT Buick.

I want THE Buick that China has. Obviously not the Chinese styling. But the quality and image.  Hopefully Buicks EVs in North America will recapture the essence of what Buick was in the 1960s...  

Well...I wrote this in another thread and nobody saw it, but it has come up again in this one.    $25 000 dollar cars EXIST. Its just that WE Canadians and Americans want NOTHING to do with these types of cars.  We should blame OURSELVES for this...

On 9/2/2023 at 11:13 AM, oldshurst442 said:

 

About cars getting more expensive and if GM will regret not offering a cheaper sedan in their line-up.

Part of THAT problem lies with the North American consumer.  I have to stop saying North American because that includes Mexico and a couple of other countries as well when I REALLY mean Canada and the US.   

In Mexico...  VW sells its Polo and Nissan the Versa.  Both start at about 20 000 US dollars.   The Versa is sold in Canada and in the US, but NOT the Polo.   How many of us Canadian and American spoiled brats buy the Versa  and how many of us bought the Aveo  so VW could actually offer the Polo here?

Chevrolet offers cars like the Aveo, Nuevo Aveo (NEW Aveo...LOL), Onix and Cavalier RS.   

MSRPs are as follows:  14 000, 17 000, 18 000, 24 000  US dollars... 

Dodge has something called the Attitude.   16 000 US dollars.  

2023

 

2019

 

Does THAT look like an interior that an American or Canadian would want to BE in???!!  And yes, the Attitude is a small car.  Bigger than the Aveo and on the same size as the Chevy Onix.  Or the Polo for that matter.  Just in case some of you were wonderin' the Polo is smaller than today's Golf but in reality, the Polo is as big as the 1980s Rabbit/Golf. 

 

Honda has something called the City.  21 000 US dollars.  

 

WE do NOT want to HUMBLE ourselves with these kinds of cars, yet the REST of the world actually GETS BY with THESE things!!!!

Like honestly!!!  Lets take a step back from ALL the bullshyte. From ALL the marketing and the lies and deception that our corporations shovel our way. Our politicians etc...

 

At the END of the day...WE make our daily decisions to do what we do. What we buy.  And we do NOT buy entry level A or B class cars with the bare minimum interiors. 

GONE are the days when we were content with those types of cars.  We bitch and whine that GM does not offer anything like that yet...GM actually DOES. And everybody else in the REST of the world.   WE just do NOT buy it here...  WE...do NOT want that as a society...     I guess we have prospered long enough that we think we dont need to compromize anymore.  Maybe that is true but unless we hold accountable all the corruption...but more to it than that...  

UNLESS WE TAKE RESPONSIBILITY OF OVER CONSUMING AND DEBTING OUR FUTURE SELVES SEVERAL LIFETIMES OVER WITH CREDIT CARD DEBT AND THE LIKE...  maybe WE SHOULD start driving shyeboxes again...

Note: I am not directing that at you @daves87rs.   Just general speak.  

https://www.vw.com.mx/es.html

https://www.nissan.com.mx/

https://www.chevrolet.com.mx/

https://www.honda.mx/

https://www.dodge.com/mx/

Horsepower and torque is the cure to many things in life.   I approve. 

But it was a good thing he pressed on forward and continued on that way (pedal to the metal) because had he lost momentum by easing up on the throttle, I have a feeling those 700 horses would just dig a deeper hole and go nowhere. 

However.  This little stunt did screw up at least one of several Burning Man princples.   

Leaving No Trace
Our community respects the environment. We are committed to leaving no physical trace of our activities wherever we gather. We clean up after ourselves and endeavor, whenever possible, to leave such places in a better state than when we found them.

But also solidified the last one

Mother Nature is a beast that mankind will NEVER be able to tame. She will ALWAYS overpower us.  No idea can substitute from this experience... that contact with a natural world EXCEEDS human powers.  Well...unless one owns and drives a TRX from Dodge.  One could try and possibly succeed in overcoming what Mother Nature may throw at us.  

Immediacy
Immediate experience is, in many ways, the most important touchstone of value in our culture. We seek to overcome barriers that stand between us and a recognition of our inner selves, the reality of those around us, participation in society, and contact with a natural world exceeding human powers. No idea can substitute for this experience.

I have been in an Italo-American crooner kinda mood for several days myself.  The crooner style kinda being being jazz itself is what Im trying to say.

And in particular this one always popping up.  I was wanting to pair this one up with a car.  But I couldnt feels the car that would go with this song.  Not yet at least.  Im still trying to figure it out though. 

RIP Mr. Bennett

I did this one with a Detomaso but in the song's original format.   Love this version more than the original though! 

Actually, Ive had this style in my head for almost all summer long.

Its started out with this song with all the weird and sad stuff going on around me. 

And then the death of Tony Bennett really cemented my choices all sumer long.

RIP Mr. Bennett

I forgot Fisker existed.

Partly because Fisker will not be offered in Quebec.  I just learned than right now when googling andn hence why up here, I dont get a lot of info on them.

The Ocean ius set to start at 43 000 CDN in Canada. Vancouver and Toronto.    Im guessing its 30 000 US dollars.  

I googled again and in the US, its MSRP is supposedly 37 000 US dollars.   Deliveries start in September for both countires.

But the prices spike up very high after the base model.   Like very high. 

The base model has a 250 mile range.  The next one up is 340 miles but at 50 000 US dollars.   Yowza!  That is not how market share will be taken away from Tesla.  Sure the Ocean looks great, but Tesla has its market down pat.  Last time Fisker and Tesla competed on on one, Tesla won!  

And Fisker doesnt even want to sell in Quebec, in which Quebecois are more easily convinced in buying EVs moreso than in Ontario.  Sure Toronto is Canada's biggest city, but Toronto does not have an EV friendly mayor.  Montreal not only has an EV friendly mayor, the Minister, Monsieur Legault is also a friendly EV type of guy.  And THAT is also because Quebec has ALL the things going for it fior the adoption of EVs...  

Its a stupid miscalculation of Fisker to ignore Quebec...   Costly mistake perhaps? 

Does Toyota EVER create something in their OWN image when entering a new luxury segment?  Or do they ALWAYS have to copy somebody else's style?

This one looks like a Rolls Royce Cullinan

Although I must say, the Toyota looks to be more refined as a design.  But that aint sayin' much.

This is yet another reason as to why I hate Toyota.   They are afraid to use their own design languaga and would rather play it safe with someone else's hit and copy that.  

Toyota has been its best styling wise, when they have been PROUD of their OWN history and presented their OWN style behind the cars they design and sell.   

8 minutes ago, ccap41 said:

While I agree it isn't all that useful as an actual watch, watches of this caliber are just a form of jewelry. It's no different than wearing a ring, necklace, earrings, etc. It's just jewelry. It's real purpose if for looks and/or "status". If one is wearing a Richard Mile, they are successful. Whether it's an employer gift or you can afford one yourself it's a sign of success, just like a 5ct diamond ring. 

Definetly its just eye candy and status (with the high price) of these kinds of watches.  High end watches in history were always jewlery.  Functioning jewelery like @Drew Dowdell said and prefers his watches.  

I must admit, I prefer my watches as functioning pieces as well.   

I am not a 1%er.  Duh...

Cars like a Cadillac NEVER fit my personality.  Forget about Rolls Royce as that is old money and my family history is as poor as one gets.  So extremely high end watches never fit my personality either.  HOWEVER, sometimes I like obnoxiuos things to flash around.  Exotic cars were really not my thing either. 

Muscle cars? Yes!!!   Blue collar speed and performance. 

And this is where watches intersects with the automobile passions that I have.  I like crazy styled Lamborghinis as much as I like the really high end crazy stuff like a Bugatti Parmesiani Fleurier or a Richard Mille.  But it aint my personality.  I oike looking at them behind a glass or on another man's RICH as phoque wrist.   No jealousy.  But admiration. 

And then there is the normally styled or slightly differently styled extremely expensive watches

And those would look GREAT on my wrist.   But that kind of thing goes against my life principles as well.   I am not a commie, but I do NOT feel comfy in my skin knowing that we have such a huuuuge divide between the haves and have nots in the world.  And if I was that filthy rich to be able to afford several things of that nature, maybe I wouldnt give a phoque, but as I am now.  Yeah... Not my style.

All to say, that Im willing to pass on function since time is kept and viewed anywhere and everywhere today, I still prefer a watch to perform its MAIN duty, and that is to tell time, but it does have to look good doing it, but not crazy priced either as a Casio or Timex do it perfectly and for peanuts.  

13 minutes ago, ccap41 said:

I actually really like that it's built by Shinola. I don't own any Shinolas but I would because it is a US brand, and I think that's cool as hell. Most of their stuff is too large for me though. 

Most Bulova watches don't do anything for me so while they're a more well-known name, I just don't care much for Bulova watches. I would, however, own a Bulova clock. 

I like the history of Bulova. 

They have made, as an AMERICAN watch as well, they have made SEVERAL important horological breakthroughs in time keeping.   And I like keeping that information close to my heart as many people do not realize how Bulova shaped the watch industy in the 1950s and 1960s.  I respect them for that.   And the fact that those breakthroughs do not break the bank.   

1 hour ago, A Horse With No Name said:

It is like about 1912 or 1914 all over again, but this time with electric cars. We have a hundred years of stupid crazy progress ahead of us, and none of us will sadly live to see what wonderful things are coming in terms of EV's. 

Except today we have a MAJOR advantage over that time period.  We not only have seen the car of tomorrow several times in our history through literature or movies that we could use that imagination to foretell the future of the automobile accurately, we literally have the future of the car...TODAY.  PLUS, all the other technologies we use daily.  Wifi and bluetooth and internet and all the crazy shyte we pull off with that when we combine them with the other gadgets and toys and appliances and cars we like to consume.  

And I think we could glimpse where the majority of the car hating  illuminati want to push towards to:

Driverless, autonomous pods.  And we have seen that future too,  in movies.    But as concepts as well.   But also in the airplane world.  We see it NOW especially with the Ukraine war:  DRONES.  But we've also seen that too waaaaay before the Ukraine war.  MOVIES.   The Terminator comes to mind here.

And we could take an educated guess where this battery technology will lead us to other than cars and war.  In our commercial and residential buildings.  And we have seen that too.   Elon Musk has taekn the time to demostrate to us how the Powerwall system works.  And we have that today.  

But I do agree with you, the future of an electric car seems exciting. 

I wonder though,  those lament the loss of engine noises. Do they still feel like someone punched them to the gut?   Like Jay Leno said on his last Audrain Museum podcast:  Automakers could record sweet sweet engine noises on cassette and play it back in the cabin for those that still want to live by that experience. 

3 hours ago, JamesB said:

I was living in Australia.

Australia.  Guten Tag, mate! 

I ALWAYS wanted to visit Vienna! 

3 hours ago, JamesB said:

I moved to Canada in 2008, and have been living in rural Nova Scotia with my Canadian wife of 17 years, for 11 years.

Im in Montreal!  

Welcome back!!!    

10 hours ago, ccap41 said:

That's honestly a pretty good looking watch. I just don't want some car branding on my watches so that "V" logo ruins an otherwise good looking watch. 

I dont mind the branding.  The watch itsef is from the Detroit Watch Company.  Shinolla.   it is a Detroit company so it makes sense.   

Id rather Cadillac be associated with Bulova.  But Bulova is from NYC. Aaaaand...Citizen group bought Bulova sometime in the 2000s.  Citizen is Japanese....

Cadillac on a Bulova Precisionist mouvent.  Yeah...that be awesome!!!    

My only gripe is that Cadillac is not associted with Bulova.   

8 hours ago, Drew Dowdell said:

That's pretty subtle compared to the Bugatti watches in the other thread.  I normally don't do branded stuff if the logo was huge, but I wouldn't mind this.

Those Bugatti watches are too much in EVERY sense of the phrase too much.    The price tags of those watches are astronomical.   Like the Ferrari watches I posted.     Money for nothing.  But they are nice to look at.  

10 hours ago, ccap41 said:

It was definitely more of a principal thing than a "I lost my 500k watch". Richard Mille is a Ferrari Sponsor so I can almost guarantee that was free to him and a replacement also would be free. That's still awesome they chased the thieves down and retrieved his watch. 

As for Richard Mille watches, they're almost all hideous to me but just knowing WHAT they are, makes them extremely desirable still. I would absolutely wear one, considering I could pretty much custom design the colors and whatnot. 

I  also think he was more pissed at the fact that his privacy was violated and got robbed more than anything else.  Aint he a driver for Ferrari?  Yeah...those are the little gifts Ferrari showers him with.   

I also find them meh.  Im sure the mechanicals on thse are just as exotic as any other high end watch.  I wouldnt wear one UNLESS Ferrari courted me as a driver for them and that is how they showed their appreciation towards me.  With  huge paychech as well of course. 

8 hours ago, Drew Dowdell said:

 

I've got very good eyes, but if I can't make out the time quickly because there isn't enough contrast or the face is too busy, it's failed me as a time piece.

Yeah...too busy Id agree!   The ONLY thing I like about them is that the mechanicals are shown.  I sometimes like watches like that.  

https://ca.sports.yahoo.com/carlos-sainz-chases-down-thieves-083403469.html

1 hour ago, trinacriabob said:

My real random thought for the day:

Lately, I've been wondering how people get a job tagging great white sharks.  And what the length of employment at such a job would be.

Ive had that kind of thought from one of the very first times I saw Shark Week (on Discovery channel) way back when. How adorable I thought.

 As long as your fingers stay intact I presume, would be the correct answer in longevity of said career choice. 

But I quickly learned the one thing about myself that I knew I couldnt be one of the lucky ones to have such a job.  And it aint the fear of those teeth either.   I saw the Tyson/Holyfield fight live... I have teeth of my own.  I could always bite back.   Imma not so much a religious guy,  but an eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth comes in handy in this line of work. 

Its this: