z28luvr01

Don't get too excited. The floor's all gone behind the seats. She's probably a lost cause unless someone who's a master sheet-metal fabricator decides to give her a second chance. It is a shame that there is no aftermarket for these cars. Did you get to see the white early 50s Bel Air that he just painted? It was on the oppoite side of the house from where he kept the El Camino and the old Dodge. My grandfather had a '50 Bel Air like that in pale yellow. Get your butt over to Carlisle this June. A lot of C&Gers are probably going. If I can swing it, you'd better be there. It was an awesome day yesterday. Camino's a class act and BBL is a cool guy as well. We really do have a top-notch community here.

IROCs are cool. Actually, all the 85+ Z28s and IROCs are lookers, especially the convertibles. It is only a matter of time before the collector market recognizes them and their value skyrockets.

Nissan and Cadillac were both irrelevant by the turn of the century. There's no argument that both brands are in much better shape now. Why act as if Pontiac is any more of a lost cause than those two? The Catera was, for all intents and purposes, a piece of garbage. Electrical demons were everywhere and engine reliability wasn't that great either. GM also engineeered all the European-ness out of the suspension, the one good quality that the Omega had. I don't see how anyone can mention Catera and G8 in the same sentence, except maybe this one: "Quite frankly, the Catera isn't fit to sit behind a running G8 and inhale its exhaust fumes." The GTO's styling was from an era that had passed quite a few years ago in this country, and was arguably its biggest handicap. The G8 is a much more contemporary design that as you can see has a lot of people talking. I have heard too many people walk away from the car impressed to believe that it is not "enough" of a design. According to Northstar, the G8 display was more crowded than the Camaro display was last year. That should say something. Touche. (though I would like to see Focus year to year sales because I thought it did fairly well). All three of them, however, were loved by the media when they first came to the US. Anyway, IIRC both Lexus and Infiniti have used various foreign market Toyotas and Nissans for the US market in the past. Regardless of sales numbers, the vehicles did help to grow the brands' presence in the US.

Before you retaliate with pictures of the Catera, GTO, and Contour/Mondeo, I'll say I get your point. The point I'm making with this post is, rebadging a car from an international market can work, if the car is relevant in the target market and priced right. As I've said a couple of times before, lessons were learned from the GTO exercise, and the G8 proves that - notice the lack of a gas tank in the trunk, the choice of more than one engine, and what looks to be a much more extensive option list.

I was referring to the reactions of the people here on this board, a couple others, and the press reviews in general, but it's not too much of a strech to say that these reactions are a microcosm of what will happen when the car hits showrooms. The recent past has taught us (well, me at least), that a car whose design elicits an emotional response of some sort will get attention, and eventually buyers. For example, you yourself have said that styling alone is selling the LX cars, with all due respect to the HEMI. For each of those cars, the styling represented a new design direction for the brand and people took notice. Some people loved it, flocked to a Dodge or Chrysler showroom, and drove home in one. Some, like me, hated it and eliminated the brands from their shopping lists. Same thing happened with the CTS. The same is happening with the G8. Pontiac has just introduced a car that represents its latest direction. You can't argue that there hasn't been an emotional response to it, regardless of the individual's preference. That, to me, is an indication that the car will be all right. I can respect that. Beauty's in the eye of the beholder. Me - If I had 30K to spend on a new G8 or a new CTS, I'd go for the G8. Right now it is the top choice for my next new car. The only thing that would change that is confirmation that the Ute is coming. I'm no more able to predict the future than anyone else, but I'll go on record as saying you may be surprised at the number of conquest buyers. Everything depends on how GM prices and markets it. Again, diferent strokes for different folks. I know who's getting my money the next time around.

One thing is for sure: people either love the G8 as a Pontiac or hate it. There does not seem to be a middle ground. When was the last Pontiac sedan that divided people the way this car has? Polarizing designs sell (see 1st gen CTS). The G8 will be fine.

* Kicks Croc in the shin twice * Whoever said that you can ask 10 people what they think a Pontiac looks like and get 10 different responses is dead on. Pontiacs have filled many a niche throughout the brand's existence: boring, basic transportation, simple understated sleeper performance cars, outrageously flashy muscle cars, cushy personal luxury cars, whatever you call the 80s to now. The G8 and the Solstice represent yet another rebirth at Pontiac. The brand has been givien a clean slate because it is time to start over. The possible reason for people feeling that it doesn't capture the essence of past Pontiacs is that it is not supposed to. If it helps, judge the car on its own merits instead of how it stacks up to the Pontiacs from your favorite era. Here we have a roomy sedan with taut, sexy proportions, a simple but athletic shape, an aggressive stance, two great motors, a quality interior, and (assuming Lutz gets his way, which he will) a very competitive price. Would you want a car with those qualities being sold as a Pontiac? I sure do.

That's me in the black. Glad you made it home OK....pretty good time too! Sorry about getting you guys lost That intersection where CR-21. CR-16, Montauk Highway, and Sunrise Highway all come together is pretty confusing. How was it on the way back once you made it to the LIE? Thanks for the ribs I'm looking at both cars back to back now, and it looks like you do have the stainless trim that you need for the drivers' side 1/4 after all. On the tan car, the bottom piece is missing, and on the parts car, the top piece is missing.

I can fiddle with the size easily - now it's 70px wide as opposed to 50px. The speed is another isue - it appears to be a browser thing. In IE it scrolls normally, in Firefox it's alot faster

Except for the very occasional drink (my last one was Christmas '04), I'm clean.

Whoever kinked that hood must be more than human. Was your car's previous owner the Hulk?

G8! G8! G8!

"Don't be a cowboy, Billy. Be carefule...don't be a cowboy." Pay careful attention to Ray's mother on Everybody Loves Raymond. That's my mom, and every Italian mom ever.

That wouldn have anything to do with all the money Fiat got from GM last year, now would it?

It's probably cheaper to fly out there, fix the engine, and drive it home, not that I'd recommend doing that. I feel your pain, though...it cost me almost 2K to get my Corvette from Ohio myself. The shippers wouldn't touch it since it was in pieces.

I really can't bring myself to organize a long winded rant, so I'll just post the thoughts running around in my head now: - The nit-picking and criticism of this car, based on the information we have right now, is unsubstantiated, and I'm officially tired of it. - Taking a look at Holden's web site should give a pretty good idea about the G8's potential wheel, tire, color, interior, and option packages. If it's offered on the Commodore, nothing's stopping them from offering it on the G8 - Lessons were learned from the GTO. I would expect those lessons to be evident in this car - Those who have seen the Commodore in the flesh (two that I know of) are saying this car definitely looks the part of a muscular, athletic sports sedan

I sure hope they do something about the radio. Something about seeing the preset buttons as "6-5-4-3-2-1" bothers me. Other than that, I'm probably in the minority in saying that I like this layout just fine. Folks, this is an interior befitting a performance car. I can see how the separate display in this interior (and the one in the Astra) would end up being a more driver oriented set up. You can fiddle with the radio and HVAC without having to look down and take your eyes off the road. It's one step below having that info on a HUD. I won't get my undies in a bunch because there's not a NAV unit in this photo. Besides the fact that I prefer the use of (and already own) a portable GPS system to in-dash NAV system, it's already been alluded to that GM has learned from the mistake of not offering the GTO with certain options, a mistake that will be corrected with this car.

Spacetruck II??? Or are you saving that moniker for a new Elky. Nice find Camino, and the price is right on what looks to be to be a pretty sound body.

If you don't think that is cool, you must be dead.

Northie: ai <> ia

I'm all over the map, and the list grows bigger with each new bit of info NEW: G8 (hopefully they eventually offer a manual on the V6, otherwise it'll be a V8) Ute-based El Camino (if the rumors are true) Camaro next-gen Cobalt Astra HHR Panel USED: CTS w/ sport package S10 SSR Cobalt SS or SS/SC (without the wing)

I'd love to, but....I think one of those weighs more than I do.

I only wish the V6 had a manual option, as that would have been the most likely combo for me. Guess I'll be forced to go with the V8

Oldsmoboi: check my edited post.

Well, I don't think GoDaddy or Snickers are going to lose too much business because this guy rated their Super Bowl ads poorly, and I don't think GM will either. Of the lot, I like the 'Ain't We Got Love" commercial. Anybody catch this: I know, I know. It's the widebody Cobalt concept. But its inclusion in the commercial is interesting.