FUTURE_OF_GM

I've often thought about this... Imagine how well limited edition Plymouth muscle cars would do, like a new 'Cuda built from LX. Heck, they'd just have to rebody the car, beef up the performance to very high levels and sell them through Chrysler dealers as a model.... Such as Plymouth 'Cuda (Much like Geo was to Chevrolet, especially in the later days) I'm sure it would never be profittable, but cool none the less.

Did I say anything about Cart, F1, etc? Are you in a Cart, F1 thread? Now answer your own question and stumble out to annoy someone else. You know it's too bad that I adamantly defended you when all the other admins wanted to ban you, you've been here maybe half the time I have yet you *THINK* you have the right to pass judgement That's a load of $h!, pure and simple. Oh, and yes, this is a reply to a few of your other posts as well.

So, pretty much, Toyota's Nascar ploy is to target GM & Fords truck share... Funny, I bet you won't see any "The car has nothing in common with the street" comparisons in Toyota motorsports write ups like you ALWAYS see in big 3 write ups. "We don't need to race Camrys to be the best selling car in America." Arrogant f@#k... Too bad he didn't follow his brother. Nascar is a load of $h!, pure and simple. I even have family in the sport and I still think it's a crock. It is the most commercialized, NO TALENT, NO BENEFIT (For GM, Ford or Chrysler) BLAND, BALL-LESS sport I've ever seen. You can't even say "damn" on the TV without getting bitchslaped by Nascar because it's afraid you'll scare off the yuppie soccer moms. You can't drive on the edge anymore because that's 'unfair and dirty.' Hell, I miss the days where the drivers were men of steel that drove their hearts out in a car that they missed eating for 2 days last week in order to fix "good enough to run this week" and you went to the race with a 6 pack of beer only to punch the Mark Martin fan next to you when he talked $h! about Earnhardt. The $h! was a passion, a RELIGION! Not this pansy, watered down, teach me how to speak, I am a robot with no opinion bull$h! that I see today. This sport was built on deviance and it should've stayed true to that in SOME aspects. I used to love NASCAR and aspired to drive in the sport for many years... Until it got to the point where it took 3 million dollars to win a race instead of TALENT and driving prowess. Sr. was the last great DRIVER we will ever see, in this realm. Nascar has NO talented drivers anymore and they've been shoveling the 'old timers' out of the sport faster than a Hemi exhaust stroke all in order to "Become cool" with my generation. I used to be considered a hick because I loved the sport and now every little yuppie bitch in a Civic has a "Jr." tag on the front and goes to the track to lust over what they'll never have. They don't care about the History, they don't care about the science of driving and they DAMN SURE don't care about the brand of car their heart throb drives (Hell, half of them probably don't even have a clue as to what manufacturers compete in the sport) 10 years ago, Toyota was right there with them thinking Nascar was a hick sport, yet now they're trying to run the domestics off of yet another haloed ground (And they'll succeed, because they have the money. Nascar has no soul, they sold it long ago for $$$. It began when they started dismissing tracks from the schedule based on seating capacity... Remember North Wilksboro (Where short track racing started) remember Rockingham? How about Hickory? or Myrtle Beach? That's how the 'shiners' raced, yet Nascar has sold that aspect out in order to get 'higher seating capacities' It's NOT WISE to turn your back on your culture, especially in the south. And yes, the sport has peaked, that's why you're starting to see less and less BIG sponsers on the cars. The expense just doesn't justify the return anymore.

I hate to hear that. I've never been a Van Halen fan, but being an avid MetallicA lifer I DEFINITELY know what it's like. This band member turns into a pussy and gets offended by this other dude who is in the band. One band member says "screw you guys" and walks out and then another band member tries to play mama and put the pieces back together. It's sad... And I think it has a lot to do with commercialism... It's like "What happened to the days when you guys were just 4 or 5 cool guys that LOVED to play kick ass music? Since when did you all turn in to panty wearing, lawyer toting yuppies that have to have everything in black and white?" The music is about EMOTION and PASSION, it isn't about who gets what or who pissed who off and it never was.

Ugh... I hated Pulp Fiction, which is funny because I usually like Tarantino stuff.

I'm really looking forward to the new Halloween as well. For those of you who don't know, John Carpenter comissioned ROB ZOMBIE (House of 1000 Corpses/The Devil's Rejects) to direct the new Halloween. It IS NOT going to be a sequel or continuation of the other Halloweens. It is an ENTIRELY new franchise that seeks to re-invent Halloween (Not alter, just begin anew... THINK: Batman Begins as oppsed to the four preceeding Batman movies) which is a good thing IMO. The new Micheal Myers is 6'10" (The guy playing him also plays "Rufus" in House of 100 Corpses and Devil's Rejects as well as Saber Tooth in the first X-Men movie) I think the original Halloween is a CLASSIC, but I don't really enjoy any of the other Halloween movies.

I agree... The press and ANALysts would damn the merger before the ink dryed on the paper. partially because they're idiots and partially because it has the potential to make GM too powerful. They'll be out to get GM and 'phase the Chrysler divisions out' within DAYS of the signed contract. I'd say they'd sell to Toyota in a New York minute if Toyota forked over the $$$ (Which everybody knows Toyocrap has) simply to get the money AND because once Chrysler is jettisoned, Daimler no longer has to play the "volume" game. But, Toyota and Honda are smart enough NOT to even get in it. Toyota 1) Doesn't want to take away from their core operations (That is already starting to fray around the edges with the countless recalls and 'even more bland than before', cheapened products) and 2) They'd fear a political and societal backlash from americans. They're already running scared, and if they slipped up or if opinion shifted with a Chrysler acquisition, it could begin a huge death spiral that just feeds on itself. Think about it; americans get pissed about a Jap company buying good 'ole Chrysler, this brings up the "hey, wait a minute, you've been destroying our industry all along" talk. Then americans start to boycott Chrysler even more and Toyota as well. Toyota no longer has it's cash cow because their american market is erroding, not to mention Chrysler starts to act as an anchor, losing even MORE money, gaining more pension deficit and causeing turmoil with the UAW (Which is a nightmare in itself.) Chrsyler withers and dies which leaves an already black balled Toyota with the blood of an american icon on its hands... and Toyota would NEVER recover. Not to mention, the UAW alone is probably enough to deter Toyota.Renault is out because the Nissan 'fad' is quickly ending (See the other thread for my thoughts on this.) VW still isn't in the best of shape, not to mention they have the same "too many damn brands" "Problem" as GM (VW/Audi/Seat/Skoda/Bentley/Lambo/Bugatti... Did I forget any?) AND I don't think the foolish pride of the MB folks would even let them think twice about the prospect of VW. I agree... I don't know why the Germans have suddenly gone schizo.... Maybe they (And GM) know more than we do. My apologies to everyone for the "Thread domination"

Not only that but Brian Nesbitt designed both vehicles. He originally worked at Chrysler and now works at GM. *** I certainly wouldn't rule any of the Chrysler divisions out yet. They all have decent to competitive products, they all have fresh products and they all have products that are still selling pretty well (eventhough there has been losses) Not to mention, they're still rolling a lot of stuff out and rectifying a lot of the 'weaker' products in their line up. Just this year they've rolled out the new Sebring and Avenger (Laugh if you will, but they WILL sell) and refreshed Magnum, Viper and Dakota and the new Wrangler just to mention a few. This just all seems weird to me... It's like Daimler just said on a whim "we might sell Chrysler" at a random autoshow and then the board was like "Seriously?" and everyone said "Sure, why not." I don't know that it ALL has to do with Chrysler losing money, it's almost as if the Germans just 'all of the sudden' lost interest. I don't think we'll see the company die It might get smaller (Which isn't really a bad thing---as we've seen from GM) but keep in mind this is Chryselr, Dodge and Jeep we're talking about here. The names themselves have enough equity for SOMEONE to save them. If Daimler didn't ultimately find a buyer, I'd be SERIOUSLY surprised.

Chrysler might be stronger than Buick and Dodge is stronger than Pontiac... But saying that Dodge is stronger than GMC is a big stretch. GMC is VERY profitable and was earmarked by Wagoner as an "expansion' division along with Saturn and Hummer. It turns a lot of volume, especially to be basically a Chevrolet with some dressing.

I think this is an excellent bet... GMC is much better paired with Buick than Pontiac. They're both 'upscale' divisions that sell to essentially the same target audience. Then GMC could prop up Buick (If GM needed it to) Dodge, being performance and style oriented could become the truck part of Pontiac (Although I'd be sad to see the Dodge cars go) Dodge purists could adapt to Pontiac better than any other GM division IMO. The only problem would be dealers... GM's P/B/GMC dealers just went through the re-alignment. Some of them begrudgingly. Now they're going to have to shuffle again. And what's to become of the Dodge dealers. I guess you could take the 'mean' of both dealer bodies and come up with one strong dealer body. I mean, obviously some of the Dodge dealers will bail and I'd say it's a sure bet that a few disgruntled P/B/GMC dealers will bail. But I bet GM could still get a nice number of franchises.

Ghosen knows Nissan is starting to slide again. The fad wore off because Nissan is no Toyota or Honda, Nissan is not ESTABLISHED like that in the mind of consumers. THere are other options still, beyond GM. God forbid, but a Chinese firm could always buy the company (Or China itself, since it has enough of our currency to pretty much buy our soul) Hell, we allow carmakers from CLOSED markets to come in and destroy our automotive sector, so I don't see that the politicians would be opposed to the communists buying a part of it. Then there's alway independent investors or a group of investors.. UAW, this might be your time to shine and redeem yourself in the eyes of the american public!

Honestly, I think we might see an american investor come in a swoop Chrysler up (The whole company) which I wouldn't mind as long as that person knows what the hell they're getting in to or hires people who know what the hell they've gotten themselves into. I just don't want anymore Proctor & Gambles exectuives RUINING our automotive companies... What about Penske? Didn't he just ink a deal with Chrysler to sell cars? Why couldn't he buy and run the company? Shelby? What about him (Although I see this less likely)

Here's how I see it (Take it for what it is) The Jeep issue is obvious... Jeep could be coupled with Hmmer which would justify Hummer moving up market to compete with Land Rover. Jeep would provide the volume to keep the "division" and dealerships relevant and profittable. Sadly I worry about the future of Pontiac if Dodge is acquired. Dodge obviously does more volume AND has better recognition than Pontiac. Not to mention they have the performance rep (BIG performance rep) and Hemi credentials. Hopefully an acquisition of Dodge would not mean a Pontiac phase out. I'm not sure WHERE Chrysler would fit in... It can't compromise Cadillac and it can't go Euro because of Saturn. Then there is the whole issue of Buick being the middle market division.

I think what happened is that the "merger of equals" failed to materialize. I honestly think the people who spearheaded the progam of a merger of equals saw it as just that. That which you describe where the two companies would become fully integrated and thus benefit from the strong points of each organization while improving efficiency and profitability. What ACTUALLY happened is Chrysler became Daimlers b*tch that nobody wanted to deal with. Nobody in Germany seemed to want to do anything but keep Chrysler chained and throw them a bone every once in a while. In fact, it seemed that a lot of Daimlers top guys didn't even want Chrysler around. The companies were NEVER integrated for the most part which caused 2 things. 1) Too much attention being diverted from Daimler in order to ensure that Chrysler "stays in line" and 2) Chrysler lost ALL of the late 90s momentum that had been churning since the introduction of the concept Viper. Now, what we see is the 'neglect' of Chrysler threatening to drag the entire company into the black abiss of financial ruin. It's like a snake trying to swallow and digest a dog. No matter how much the snake tries, it just ain't gonna happen and eventually the dog will either kill the snake or injure it beyond recovery. So now, Daimler is in a race against time to jettison Chrysler before what they think is their "core" business falls too far behind the times to catch up. We should've seen this coming when DCX ended it's alliance with Mitsu... Remember, the original plan was to have a 3 continent automaker; MB in Germany (Controlling it all) Chrysler in america and Mitsu in asia. The Mitsu collapse and subsequent 'thumbing of their noses' of DCX looks more and more like the cracks in the DCX structure that should've signaled this. I always thought the "Merger of Equals" was a bad idea simply because I always figured Daimler would *NEVER* take Chrysler and their "$h!ty american business model/merchandise" seriously. Now it's just VERY sad to see our industry destroyed like it is. I would tend to agree that nothing will save the "Big 3" unless their image changes (Which is possible, especially with sub 25 year olds who think higher of the companies anyway) If the image does not change, (And I doubt it will with the amount of people DELIBERATELY working against them, one company at a time if they have to) then Chrysler is good as gone (Which, I would rather see GM buy them then let them go out) Ford will be next within 1-2 years and GM is just living on borrowed time. ESPECIALLY if the bitches in the media continue toward job #1 of promoting everything this side of China above domestics at all costs and regardless of reality.

Movie tickets haven't been that cheap here for years either... UNLESS... I go to the drive-in (Which is awesome) Then it's $5 for 2 or 3 movies (New movies at that!)

First off, GM make the damn product decisions that are right for the market and tell the dealers to EFF OFF. (We need to trim our dealer body anyway) Secondly, I doubt the merit of this story for MANY reasons. 1) RWD is ALWAYS preferred by people 'in the know' 2) The Lucerne is quickly running out of time (Last time I checked, G-Body was a lame duck) 3) Buick is, and has been starved of product for a while. So ANY new product is probably welcome product. 4) Whether or not it cuts into Lucerne sales is null and void when we consider that a move like this would increase corporate efficiency, (globalization) probably gain Buick share OVERALL, give the division credibility it hasn't had in too many years and be as profitable (If not more) than the Lucerne anyway. It just makes too much sense.... Buick would have a common product with Buick of China, it would maximize global efficiency, it would easily fill the void left by the Lucerne when (If?) it departs, it would go A LONG way in revitalizing Buick and drawing in younger buyers, it would add volume and share (eventhough it probably wouldn't be much) AND Buick would have LOTS of positive momentum with the new Enclave LAX Super and now Statesman. Buick NEEDS this.

THe prime difference is; Honda is asian and Cadillac is american. All is ALWAYS forgotten in asia-land. Remember the Toyota Previa? Never hear that one thrown up in Sienna reviews... (Not to mention that god-awful dustbuster van they produced prior to the Previa that used to randomly ignite into full flame carrying the kids to baseball practice) How about the Corona or Starlet? Or better yet; ever hear of a T100 reference in Tundra articles?

Wow. Way to go GM! A brocure that absolutely no one will see (Trust me, I work at a Goodwrench Quick Lube and NO ONE but car enthusiasts even cares about the brochures we have) yet at the same time we are being BOMBARDED with Tundra ads ALL over the media. (Even radio spots) That's some EXCELLENT marketing!!!!! (*MUCH sarcasm intended*) Why doesn't GM EVER put this sh*t out where it can be seen?!?!?!?!?!?! The same thing happened with the "What GM contributes to the economy" campaign... It was an EXCELLENT campaign that got LITTLE to NO exposure. At the same time, GM is busy passing off it's core divisions to agencies who come up with tired ass lines like "Life, Liberty and the Pursuit." Excuse me???? What???? What exactly is the ANTIQUE slogan supposed to convey about Cadillac and WHY exactly should it make me NOT have negative feelings about the division, much less POSITIVE feelings about it? Not to mention the way the ads and commercials are shot SUCKS. I'm tired of GM marketing... GM WILL NOT succeed unless it can communicate it's message for EVERY division and product to the consumer. Period.

I went to see it tonight as well. I've been waiting FOREVER to see the damn thing. It was originally supposed to be out last summer but they delayed it in order to do a little more work on the graphics. It did not disappoint, I would give it at least an 8 out of 10! I like Nicolas Cage as well, but I will concede that this is probably his best acting since Face Off (Another phenominal movie) I was also happy to see Sam Elliot have such a big part in the movie because I think a lot of him. And, of course, Eva Mendes is smoking hot! I had some complaints though, I think the battle scenes should've been more dramatic and I would've loved to see the movie be more dark over all. But, that said, I think it is like the first Spiderman in the sense that it serves as more of a foundation from which to build a franchise. The first Spiderman was good, but tepid and cheesy, which contrasts with the second Spiderman (A movie that is 'out of this world') I've never watched The Fantastic Four, nor have I ever been in to the comic, but I must admit that the preview for "Rise of The Silver Surfer" REALLY peaked my interest. I had no idea that the Silver Surfer started out as a vilan in the first place. (AS did The Punisher) I'm extremely excited about Spiderman 3 now; it looks to be even better than the second movie. (Probably because of the dark undertones--- I'm more in to the tormented heroes than the good guys, like Spidey and Superman) The preview for "Invisible" looked good too. I'll probably have to see that movie. On a related note, I'm really looking forward to the second Punisher movie (The first movie still makes me choke up) and the next Batman (My favorite hero) since Heath Ledger has signed on as the joker and the dude from "Thank You for Smoking" has signed on as Harvey Two Face. Then early next year we can look forward to Frank Miller's "Sin City" follow up. It was originally to be called "A Dame To Die For" and already included a huge, talented cast. (Angelina Jolie left though, thank god) But it has been delayed.

Don't get me wrong, global warming concerns me, but we shouldn't try to limit peoples freedom of choice because of it. We NEED to advance technology, not kill creativity. And yes, I'm sure it would help if every idiot in the country wasn't crapping out a kid just because it's the 'thing to do'.

Probably one of the most memorable I've ever seen is on an OLD Dodge truck that comes to the rod run each year. The blower sticks up higher than the cab and the tag simply states "UL LOSE" (You'll Lose)

Toyota just keeps giving the public more and more reasons to NOT buy it's products... Too bad no one will listen and Toyota's PR firm (the media) will clean the mess up. P.S. Oh, and I'm pretty sure everyone but the idiots at MT can figure out what the second "secret vehicle" is. HINT: They traded Ford for technology to build it (Yet, I'm sure you'll never hear that in an article, eventhough every time I read a Ford Hybrid article I get to hear about how generous Toyota is for 'allowing' Ford to bask in it's hybrid glow)

LOL... Some guys are just cocky like that. I had something similar happen to me a while back, some guys (Probably frat boys, since we're in a college town) were talking sh*t from their Frontier after I pulled out in front of them. (Keep in mind I drive a Focus) They followed me into the parking lot of the complex where I live and I got out of the car. After seeing all 6'9" 350 lbs of me, they were MUCH more respectful

Nothing like COMMUNISM. I figure the leftie greenies will try to screw us all out of our 'fun cars' and classic cars now that the big global warming scare is in full swing. (Especially on college campuses and among the hip)

We all know that was a set up. Certain people get certain things they want around here. But anyway, welcome!