FUTURE_OF_GM

C-L-A-S-S-I-C-! Their best album by far and I can't wait for the new one coming out this year! My turn! "Blackened Is the End Winter it Will Send Throwing All You See Into Obscurity Death of Mother Earth Never a Rebirth Evolution's End Never Will it Mend Blackened Opposition...Contradiction...Premonition...Compromise Agitation...Violation...Mutilation...Planet Dies Darkest Color Blistered Earth True Death of Life" "Blackened" This is probably my favorite MetallicA song ("Probably" because I hold "Master Of Puppets" and especially "Creeping Death" very close to my heart as well) P.S. And before you all make the fundamental attribution error, the song is about politics, hypocrisy and nuclear war, not just death.

I still wouldn't mind picking up an SS... Attractive cars that kick ass in the performance department (considering what you're buying) especially when compared to that F**k-tard Solara abomination.

I've said for a while that the G6 was catching on big, especially with my generation. Then evok called me an idiot.... Of course, he also said that Daimler would never sell Chrysler as well. Hmm.

EXCELLENT! These three puzzle me... Seems like a lot of new product has been hitting the showrooms at PAG, (New XK, LR2 & LR3, C30) so why are sale still down? Or maybe the product hasn't hit yet and I'm just having a senile moment. These brands are also showing a lot of potential through concepts, hopefully it'll pay off. Haven't even seen one on the road. I've seen A LOT of these on the road though!!! It seems to be a grand slam.

Something tells me that the Accord is being "supplemented" (Although I'm sure it's not much. I'll be the first to say that I'd steer an import loyalist to an Accord way before I'd send them to mothership Toyota. The CR-V is new, so it's getting the benefit of all the diehard Honda loyalists. I'm not saying it's a flash in the pan, but I'm sure a lot of sales are loyalty based. Not to mention Honda has done an excellent job of marketing (Something GM and Ford can NEVER seem to do) Not to mention, the B*tchline and the Excrement certainly aren't "On fire" That is quite possibly the most creative way I've ever heard the line "Our sales are relatively flat" remanufactured.

I agree 100% Ford needs to do it's best to 1) tread water where it's products aren't so strong and 2) promote the hell out of it's hot products (Fusion, Edge, Milan, MKX, MKZ) What better way to compensate for less than stellar product than an EXCELLENT marketing campaign... It works for Scion! I think Ford will stabilize soon, especially with the Taurus and Sable names coming back. BUT, the trick there is VERY good INFORMATIVE marketing. Ford also needs to refrain from whoring the Fusion to fleets.... As tempting as that might be, the tradeoff down the road in a couple of years is NOT in any way WORTH IT. They need to build the brand around the Mustang as well (as a halo) and update the F-150 a bit. But, also keep in mind, F-series sales could be down because of the transition into the new Super Duty model (Which I'm sure will be a huge hit)

Won't this company just die already?

Meh... It's just that all of the old people are now buying the new Camry instead of the crap-a-lon. Well, maybe that, or the HORRID quality issues. :twocents: And, BOY HOWDY, is that Prius ever moving!!!!! Guess those "incentives designed to open the car up to new consumers" READ: and BTW, how arrogant. I remember back in December when my local Toyota dealer had 50 Prii or whatever in stock. (In the Southeast, no less --Where Toyota hung the moon) They even made pathetic little commercials about it begging all the yuppies and social do-gooders to come down and "take one off of our hands". Toyota definitely has a bright future, but the game is FAR from over.

I agree for the most part... I'm really starting to see the Auras around here and it seems to be target clientele as well. Saturn is going to take some time to see results from. They went from offering a cheap SUV, completely inadequate van, and crappy (at best) economy car to offering segment topping, VERY stylish automobiles. The consumer isn't going to click with that overnight, especially since Saturn has a rather tarnished image in the "cool" department. The Aura will continue to catch on as long as it continues to get positive press, our dealer only has 2 Outlooks, so maybe that has something to do with the (maybe) slow start. Sky will naturally be sluggish this time of year because of the weather and because of the BOOM last year. NOT TO MENTION ALL of these are brand new names that the customer isn't familiar with. Hopefully Astra will take off and I think the wild card will be the Vue. The Vue has been Saturn's shining star for the past couple of years, it's been the only vehicle in the line up consistently showing life. So, when the new one is introduced, I think it'll start strong on both design and name recognition. AND I think it'll bring more customers in that will opt for the Aura or Outlook instead as well. I think the real "volume star" if you will, is going to be the new Malibu. Chevrolet has the recognition, awareness of the 'Malibu' name and dealer network to have a VOLUME hit. The Aura was never really meant to sell in huge volumes (I know, it still has room to grow, but you get the picture) The Aura was never supposed to be the Epsilon that saved GM. That's not to say that the car and the brand won't grow in popularity, but it'll take some time. Be patient GM, you have the right strategy, eventually the people will come and they'll bring lots of friends.

The rating should've been this way: 1) Silverado 2) F-150 3) Titan 4) Tundra 5) Ram I think the F-150 placed last because EVERYONE has it in for Ford. I just find it funny that the F-150 kicked the Titans ass all over the place when it was introduced, yet now, the essentially SAME trucks rank with the Titan besting the F-150 by 3 whole slots. Thats biased and it's Hopefully, the F-150 is a strong enough name to not be harmed by bad PR such as this. But, Ford needs to update with more power and some freshness. It's just another knife in the back of Ford trying to push the company over the edge.

Unfortunately, Edmunds has a big audience, especially on the coasts (Where GM needs to win some/keep some share) But even they said good things about the Silverado overall. (Remember my huge post about why the Silvy should've won)

The products are so good these days that they're pretty much grabbing at straws... Which (ding, ding, ding,) makes the auto rags pretty much irrelevant. Which is why 1) they're getting more and more opinion based and $h!ty (when it comes to analysis) and 2) They're not doing so well numbers-wise. Luckily, most people know this as fact. Funny how the "performance enthusiasts" (READ: Fat, bald yuppie assholes) at C&D rate cars on such cheesy criteria.

Fresh cut grass always gets me... I LOVE spring here in NC (especially the mountains) and given that I have Seasonal Affective Disorder and I ususally bottom out around Feb or March, anytime I smell fresh cut grass it puts me on cloud 9... It's the first sign that spring has arrived and takes me back to my youth when I used to play baseball. New cut alfalfa gets me too... We have horses and I have a lot of happy memories from my childhood tied into that. Honeysuckles... OMG!!! It's the best smell of spring!! Back when I worked late at night when I lived in the mountains the whole year, I had to commute 20(ish) miles for my second job. The honeysuckle patches are so strong that you can smell them when you drive past a patch. So, when I would come home each night I would roll down all the windows, open the sunroof, crank up the metal and enjoy the ride.. It was one of the most peaceful things I've ever experienced. Fresh cut oak... Smells bad, but reminds me of my childhood when we used wood heat for our house. We would hit the logging roads on the mountains and cut our own wood eventually to split it and stack it. (Don't worry, it was always trees that had been blown down, never did we 'fell' a tree) Natuarlly, we would target certain woods that burned longer or hotter such as OAK and LOCUST. Tomato bisque soup... The bed and breakfast that I basically grew up working at used to make this stuff ever 2 nights or so. The smell of it makes me wanna PUKE, but alas, it does remind me of being 16 again and caring about nothing other than what my friends were doing and messing with my then daily driver 1973 Camaro Z28/RS. Fresh rain on a summer afternoon... You know, when it first begins to rain. I'm bittersweet about this one becuase the car guy in me HATES rain becuase it always ruins my detail. But the smell is peaceful. High Octane Gasoline/Bounty Sheets... The distinct smell of the inside of my Camaros. (The bounty sheets are to keep mice out---trust me, anytime an old car sits, regardless where and what it is, a mouse will find it) and the gasoline is from my Camaros probably burning WAY too rich LOL. That's all I can think of for now.

Hmm... No mainstream media coverage. What a surprise.

East coast is a HUGE market for the imports as well... Unfortunately, with the re-alignement of the media (READ: Media Monopolies like News Corp.) The majority of pop culture is controlled by the coasts now, and what's cool to drive on the coasts? IMPORTED CARS. This explains the media bias and this explains why you'll probably see domestic market share in the midwest begin to deteriorate. (And yes, I am being very negative, so keep that in mind)

I would support that. Anything to save Chrysler and not save it by sawing it up into little bitty pieces and selling the assets.

Here we go again, with the onslaught of bad news from "the street" GM and Ford will NEVER be competitive with the "transplant companies" simply because the "transplant companies" will never retire as many people or give health care benefits as generous as the UAWs. But, this will continue to be a HUGE thorn in Detroits side until something is done (Meaning either government intervention; yeah right! or concessions from the UAW) So, in that case (because the UAW would rather be ignorant and run the industry into the ground than buy their viagra themselves) it'll probably be the final nail in Detroits coffin. Let the cheering begin.

I would LOVE to see a return of Turbo Buicks! In fact, I think it would do A LOT for the division for it (Buick) to pioneer the turbo efforts at GM. I mean, sure, the Turbo Sky/Solstice is already out. But that's a niche as opposed to a turbo Zeta or better yet a Turbo AWD Ep II. The only problem is, this might be Pontiac or Saturn territory.

Don't laugh too hard... If the yuppies here in americant have it their way, we will be in the same boat. f@#k, why not? Lets just outsource it all! Screw heritage, national pride and employment! As for the brits at KA (Car)... Well they're no different than any other journalists. $h!ty.

This is the tail light design which the G8 should've featured except positioned where the G8 tail lights are positioned instead of below the body line like that. We can only hope the G8 will receive this wheel option, because those are gorgeous wheels, even much better than the wheels the cars was introduced with. AND, give me the Pontiac twin grille, with this lower bumper design and we have a G8 that I'd gladly buy.

Oh I agree 100%. It's not going to right itself. But, my mindset is that instead of living in the past and wondering what happened (Like the media keeps us constantly doing by referencing share numbers, and 'the good 'ole days') we need to redefine what the comapnies mean and innovate once again. I agree... Despite what all the "journalists" want us to think, we MUST have backing from DC, or the companies will continue to suffer. THis country is the ONLY country that I know of that values the interest of OTHERS above its own. That's a very scary thought, but I doubt the chinese are ready to buy Chrysler. I just don't think they're good enough to pull something like that off.. Yet. But that's just my personal opinion, so take it for what it's worth. Unfortunately, it's been happening for years now. GM gives me hope though, they're on a roll and I think Ford and Chrysler could still surprise. (Even if Chrysler is bought by an equity firm)

I was with him until this part....First of all, I'm willing to bet (Sadly) that ALL three Chrysler divisions, ESPECIALLY Jeep, have more equity than both Pontiac and Buick. Dodge has a lot of appeal, if you're willing to compromise on the details and Chrysler with the 300 and Crossfire definately trumps Pontiac and Buick, which haven't had stand out "Hot cars" in years (Baring last years Solstice and Lucerne of course) How exactly could Chryslers dealers serve to expand Nissan??? I mean, sure you could pair Nissan with Dodge, but there'd be a lot of overlap. Both divisions go for about the same person, even if Dodge is more traditional and less trendy (READ: fad) I guess they could position Chrysler between Nissan and Infiniti. But then how would Jeep clash with the "generation eXtrme" small Nissan SUVs? Nissan already tried that... The quality sucked and they failed. That's funny... I never read a damn thing about that in the media. (Surprise, surprise) Just like they were over the GMAC split off... And they pushed and pushed until they got it. And, just like they were about a GM bankruptcy and they tried their DAMNEDEST to make that a reality, but fortunately it hasn't... YET. That's quite possibly the best quote I've read this year. It's a sad day in america when we're controlled like this. Yessir, and that subsequently is probably the same guy who is going to get screwed out of a job as american industry keeps dieing, leaving or being sold off.

Actually, it's the entire industry. All I'm saying is that industries, especially in capitalist markets historically cycle just like the economy. It's simply because there comes a time when demand no longer satisfies supply, yet the business has obligations regardless because of it's age (Such as pension) MY summary was more theory than reality. It is "that simple" in theory because a business is designed to do one thing: MAKE MONEY. In order to make money the Detroit companies have to cut cost. The 'right sized' demand is already there since each still holds a relatively LARGE part of the market and each has loyal buyers. So, it's not like all is lost or Chrysler is starting at zero. Now, the reality of the situation gets a little more complicated, but not by much. Just make cars people want to buy. GM is learning this, and Chrysler has made some good efforts. For example; even on the once "hot-hot-hot" LX cars the interiors are a joke. I'm not criticizing Chrysler at all, and I'm certainly not placing GM above them (Because GM still has some craptacular offerings as well) It's just the reality of the situation. All I was trying to do is give a few people a little hope. Chrysler isn't as bad off as everyone here seems to think. Just like GM wasn't and isn't as close to filing bankruptcy as everyone would've liked us to think.

So true! BA degrees are quickly becoming the new HS Diploma. (Which is why I'm either headed for grad school or getting 2 BAs) We were studying some stats in one of my Psych classes here and found out that something like 50% of BA grads work "dead end" hourly jobs and live at home for at least 2 years before they land career employment. And that's totally dependent upon the economy at the time as well. The business school I'm enrolled in has a 99% job placement rate (Mainly because Charlotte is the second biggest banking city behind NY--Both Bank of America and Wachovia are headquartered here) but I'm not sure that I want to stay here, so I'm sure I'll be in that boat in a few years.

I agree 100% That's something I struggled to come to grips with (And still do) but what the Detroit companies are going through now is quite natural and predictable. EVERY business is cyclable, and the cycle usually happens in a given industry about every 100 years (Which would be now for Detroit) simply because of cost. The cost side of the equation (In typical capitalist narrow minded think) just got completely out of hand. We can talk Toyota this and Toyota that all day, but in the end does it really matter? Cost would've been roughly the proportionate (Variable cost anyway) at ANY volume or market share figure. So, are the Detroit companies on a down cycle? ABSOLUTELY. Are they in danger of dieing? DEFINITELY? But, just like with other business, they HAVE THE CHOICE to choose to live or die. All they have to do is turn a profit or in essence cut costs and they'll cycle right back up. Will they be smaller more efficient companies? YOU BETCHA. But is that necessarily a bad thing? Is VOLUME the end all, be all of the industry? HELL NO. It's unrealistic, in a capitalist non-regulated market like this, to assume that one or three companies would hang on to the majority or share anyway. It's inevitable that as more choices are available (In theory because in reality they're pretty much all the same car except with a different badge) MORE diversity will be experienced. As long as GM, Ford and DCX can carve out enough share to make a strong profit, they'll be fine. Sure, the capitalist "Conquer all, expand, expand" side of the business will try and grow that, but it really isn't necessary for survival. In short.. The "old" Detroit isn't working anymore, so it's time for these companies to get creative and redefine themselves (As GM is doing, and Ford and Chrysler are trying to do)