CARBIZ

Yes, as a matter of fact. The money stays in OUR economy. Everyone is getting hung up on prices and costs of goods. If we are talking about toasters and running shoes, it doesn't seem to matter a whole helluva lot (unless you work in those industries, of course!), but we are talking about high value added products like automobiles, aerospace, electronics. These are technologies of the FUTURE. If we lose control of those technologies, we will be living in caves and tents in 30 years. Do you know how much money China is spending on their space program now? They have laid out a plan to have their men land on the moon in a decade or so. He who controsl Space will control the future, you can bet on that. Damn straight I am concerned about the future of my country and my people. If my neighbors don't have jobs, they can't buy any cars from me, plain and simple. If all the factories close, not only are my customers losing the ability to buy a new(er) car, but we are going to lose the ability to control the technologies that go with those industries. George Orwell may have been right when he predicted global power blocs being formed. Fortress America may not be far off. I wish I was wrong, but nothing coming out of Asia in the past 35 years would indicate otherwise. Japan softened us up so that China can come in for the kill.

I am with Balthazar on this one. The "emerging markets," such as China, India and Brazil are not bogged down in this wrenching internal debate. They are (with the possible exception of Brazil, which does have a lot of mixed races in their midst) homogenous societies and are nearly single minded in their quest for expansion. Americans and Canadians are too mixed up in their own "specialness" to give a damn about their neighbors. We are so damned convinced that we are right and our way of life will prevail that we haven't taken the time to find out what other governments and peoples are really saying about us. If you truly knew, you would be afraid. Very afraid. The fact that this thread (as has another on this board) degenerates into personal attacks and cries of racism only proves my point. The West is divided and our competitors (and enemies) are using that against us.

Deltaforce, we need to talk. I think we have the same therapist! My dad owned a service/tire center in the '60s and we always had old wrecks in the back of our farmhouse. I used to play (mostly jumping up and down on the roof - try that on any new car these days!) of a cream and white Plymouth Fury. I used to love pushing the buttons (something I am still good at doing with my partner!) of the tranny. NOt sure if it was a '57 or '58, but I fell in love with all cars with fins, even though it was 1966 and fins were long gone.

I guess you gotta do what you gotta do to survive in this world. Our sister Toyota store has made overtures to me on a few occasions and I emphatically will not EVER sell Toyota. I would get out of the business before I would sell Toyota. End of story.

BV, you're doing a pretty good job. I especially like the point about the hubris of thinking God, if he existed, would be bothered with Man's existence at all. Pure hubris, on our parts. Why do we confuse sentience/self-awareness with a "soul?" Perhaps our conscience mind acheives a certain critical mass that allows us to be self-aware, but being as we share on the order of 90% of the same genetic code as a pig, I wouldn't get too high and mighty about us being made in God's own image. And what difference is there between the brainwashing happening with 3 year olds in Afghanistan, being conditioned to hate the West, and my grandmother taking me to Church when I was a kid? We are a product of our upbringing, that is the only thing that is for sure. If you nearly drowned as a 3 year old, you will be predisposed to being afraid of water - for the rest of your life. If people find solace in believing there is life after death and that there is some kind of divine being who truly knows what the hell is going on in the Universe, then good for them. However, I get all squirrely when people use religion as a weapon, and even the most benign religions can only exist through recruitment and conversions. Being gay, I have borne the brunt of religious zealotry in all forms (remember Anita Bryant?), and ever since Roman times the Church (as with other religions) has used homosexuals as scapegoats for all kinds of evils. This nutjob, Ann Coulter, is just the latest bag lady of the Right. She, too, will pass.

Well, it wasn't a bunch of Monks in Tibet or the Pope who gave us nuclear reactors, DNA crime evidence or put several robot ships on Mars. It was people and Science. Do not make the mistake of punching holes in science just because there currently is no official date for the Big Bang, or even an agreement on whether the Big Bang happened, then turn around and say all science is junk. I personally don't know if Rome existed or not, but I can tell you that there is evidence to prove that basic proteins are very easy to build in basic scientific experiments (a common fish tank, sterile sea water, a couple electrodes, some ammonia and other primordial gases, plus TIME is all that is required.) It is also easy to prove the Earth is not flat. Atomic clocks circling the Earth as we speak have proven Einsteins's Theory of Relativity. But FAITH is so much easier for those who can't be bothered to investigate for themselves. Don't bother reading the original Hebrew texts to discover how many possible interpretations there were for a single word. And know that those texts were translated by affluent, white men for affluent white men. Faith makes it all so comfortable and cozy. Faith also kept Science in the Dark Ages for 500 years. Just ask those who dared speak that the Earth was not the center of the Universe.

While we in the West debate semantics, there are forces at work that have no such confusion. As I have said before, the Right wing would have Wal-Mart sell everything from China because it is better for Big Business. The Left wing will drown us in calls for more immigration, more political-correctness and accusations of racism. Who are we to believe? Imported goods are better (Japanese) and cheaper (China). To even raise this issue, it used to be safe to wrap oneself in the flag, but that isn't even guaranteed any more. Don't believe me? The United Nations (don't get me started!!) just wrapped Canada's knuckles yesterday. Geneva based Committee on the Elimination of Racial Descrimination (it scares the $h! out of me that such a committee even exists! United Nations: George Orwell just called!) said that the Canadian government's use of the word "visible minorities" is not acceptable, although no alternatives were offered. Oh, and the same report wants us to provide welfare for illegal immigrants and failed refugee claimants, but I digress. Anyone who doesn't believe that we are FAT and LAZY in the West need look no further than the fact that the Canadian government even treats this report with any kind of seriousness. China The Chinese government just gave Mozambique $2 billion to rebuild its power infrastructure. They're already cozying up to Brazil and India. All this while Bush bombs Iraq? Guys, America's days are fast waning and North AMerica's addiction to imported goods is only part of the problem, although that is a big part of the problem. I used to be a big proponent of Free Trade, but this is not Free Trade. This is our enemies using our system against us and us being so stupid that we just let it happen. But go ahead, buy your BMWs and Lexus while factory after factory closes here. Your children's future is being mortgaged in a way that no other generation in the past has ever done.

I don't have the exact figures in front of me, but the last I heard (just the other day), Canada only recently surpassed Saudi Arabia as the U.S.'s biggest importer of oil. And what about China's interest in Canadian oil? Although I am ashamed to admit it, Canadian governments can get elected by bashing the U.S. and many Chinese companies are sniffing around our oil sands projects and mineral deposits. Mexico is just this side of being a banana republic. Venezuela is a banana republic. China is expanding its interests in Africa and other places - they will be America's biggest competition for oil in the next twenty years. They will have a big appetite for oil to build all the gadgets and cars we love to import! I am just saying, going the way of Brazil, which has recently become completely self-sufficient in oil, is not a bad idea. For those who have bothered leaving this continent, you will know that the Rest of the World has seen the light and is rapidly moving toward fuel efficient cars and trucks. I don't understand why people are so opposed to doing the responsible thing. Nobody is talking about banning private vehicles, just making the best possible use of the resources we have. There can be lots of fun vehicles to drive, they just don't have to get 20 mpg.

.....On related news, Delta Airlines just cancelled its contract with ACE Aviation Holdings (Air Canada) and moved its aircraft maintenance to CHINA. SEVEN HUNDRED Canadians will lose their jobs (and these aren't the $8 an hour jobs everyone is clamoring for!) in Vancouver. Delta Airlines cited cheaper labor costs as the reason. well, DUH. I just shake my head in despair and thank God I will never have children to worry about................................ Rome is burning and, well, you know the rest...............

There is a perfect storm of events (Iraq, rising insurance rates, for example) that are conspiring against the recent silly rise in horsepower wars. I mean, who the F#$k needs 240 hp in a minivan? I am generally not a huge fan of government intervention, but America's dependence on foreign oil is a serious detriment to both her security and her economy. America simply must get off its dependence of imported oil. The future of America depends on that, plain and simple. How Washington attains that goal is the real question. Higher gas taxes? Taxes on displacement? Penalizing the auto companies themselves? Forcing companies to have certain percentage of sales as "alternate fuels?" These are the tough questions. Limiting horsepower is just one of many tools that MAY attain the ultimate goal of stopping financing your enemies to coming back and killing you.

Well, I am glad you feel you have to be Defender of the Faith, but IMO Toyota has no lack of True Believers who will attack and slash GM, Ford or anyone else who dares suggest that it is not by divine right that Toyota will become #1 in sales around the world. I am not one of those believers. Although it is true that events of the past 18 months or so have become so obvious that SOME media outlets have let up on their constant GM-bashing, there is still a nauseating amount of pro-Japan Inc media out there. You, Mr. Krinkle are truly privileged if you have not been exposed to (unfortunately) Canada's biggest "news"paper, the Toronto Star and their continuous Toyota humping. Those of us who are old enough to remember a time when Toyopets were a freakish anomoly and watched in horror as the tide of Japan Inc washed over us - we are not easily fooled. What Toyota has done in the past 30 years and how it has done it would be admirable, except that our two countries are so stupid as to sit back and just let it happen. It is interesting that on the one hand, so-called enthusiasts in the media will decry GM's lack of available manual transmissions in vehicles like the Malibu, then bitch that there is "only" a 4 spd automatic available - while they are driving their foreign built BMW, I might add, then attack GM for not building hybrids fast enough. It seems that it doesn't matter which side of the media you are on, Detroit can't catch a break. I, for one, am totally sick of the media. Whether it is the Iraq war, global warming, or Japan's INc's victories, the media is biased and grossly unfair. Whether on the Right or the Left, they all have agendas. I guess it just depends on whether their agenda happens to be your agenda, too.

Excellent post! It shocks me at the prices of consumer goods. I bought a toaster for $20 recently (made in China, of course!) I bought my first toaster in 1979 and paid $24 for it then. I am guessing that would be the equivalent of about $100 in today's dollars. Probably that first toaster was made in either the U.S. or Canada, providing decent wages for 200 or so employees in a small plant somewhere here. How can a microwave be built and RETAILED for $79? Call me crazy, but I would pay DOUBLE for consumer goods that were built, designed and engineered in North America, but in many markets that is no longer an option. Maybe I am paranoid, but there seems to be some kind of massive cover up going on. I mean, how can the U.S. run the kind of current account deficit it is these days and NOT be pushed into the brink of recession or worse? The so-called wealth being created these days is all on paper and who is buying that paper? China is a state-controlled economy. Japan is not much better. MITI wields unbelievable power in Japan, focusing and marshalling all kinds of resources when on the attack. It was toys and small consumer goods in the '50s, then electronics in the '60s and by the '70s they had turned their attention to steel, tool and die manufacturing and, of course, autos. The U.S. is being attacked on all fronts, both literally and figuratively. How long can America afford to spend billions in Iraq, while at the same time consumers are buying anything that is imported. Even with a $11 trillion dollar economy, it can't go on forever.

Having been raised on Heinlein, Asimov, Niven and other SF greats, it depresses me to no end that we are still having these kinds of debates....into the 21st Century. Religious fanaticism is dragging us back into the primordial muck and it sickens me. There is a ton of evidence - from fossils all over the world (and bottom of the ocean) to watching the AIDS virus evolve right before our eyes, to prove that evolution is all around us. I will repeat what my grade 11 biology teacher said to our class. She wrote the words CREATIONISM on one side of the chalk board and EVOLUTION on the other side. She asked us if we all knew what they both meant. She said that if we believed in CREATIONISM, the class was over and we could all go home. This was a science class, she went on, and to that end the class is about discovery and investigation. CREATIONISM is about absolutes and dogma. Everything is contained in a few books and scrolls and no longer open to interpretation. Science is ever changing and open to interpretation. Even the "laws" of gravity and thermodynamics are being challenged and tested every day. Yet, all around us are proofs that, for the most part, science works. From the nuclear reactor to the Human Genome Project, I think we can safely say that science in general gets it right more often than not. The Ancients had a deity for every single leaf in a tree. The Greeks/Romans whittled it down to a few dozen angry, jealous Gods. Modern man has reduced it to one, with the usual battles over prophets, etc. I am hoping that one day this can be reduced to none, so we can get on with the business of improving this world that we live in because it is the only one we have and the only one we will ever be in. Promises of a great afterlife may have worked on feudal serfs, but I would hope we are more intelligent than that today. [END OF RANT]

Well, guys, I work in the front lines and I can tell you that the propoganda is REAL and it is working. Customer after customer with solid, good running American cars are defecting to "imports" because they are "better." I am currently in a struggle with a 70 year old woman who has a 2003 Alero that, by her own admission, has been a great car. Her son is directing her to Honda. When asked why the imports are better, invariably you get stonewalled or a shrug. When I pull our my arsenal (articles and pieces I have copied from various sources, largely found via Cheers and Gears) I usually get a shocked look. Why, this 70 year old lady asked, don't we read any of this in the "maintstream" news. That, I replied, is the $64,000 question. Why, indeed? Despite this waste-of-time-fluff piece we have just read, it is by no means a far-gone conclusion that Toyota is destined to become King of the Universe. Eighteen months ago, I would have granted you that; however, the public is very fickle and the tide can change. For one thing, GM has a far bigger market share than Japan Inc in both Europe, China and South America. This fluff piece is too American-centric, much like Detroit's thinking. The sooner Detroit stops thinking of NOrth America as special, the better off we all will be.

The two Tundras you saw were probably the dealer principle and his general manager of the local Toyota dealer!

You gotta hand it to Toyota, though: their scheme is very clever. First, locate in low-wage, high income states that really DO need the jobs. These workers will be thrilled (for the most part) to have a job at all. They will be very easy to sway to Toyota's way of thinking. Their taxes will be lower for a very long time. The job losses in the north won't seem so obviously tied to the plant openings in the south. From a business point of view, it makes sense. From a "we're as American as Chevrolet" point of view, it is kick ass planning. I'll give you some more math to chew on: Toyota hires 900 to work in their new Woodstock plant (Ontario) while at the same time GM and Ford laid off 2,400. I love that kind of math - in the same province, too.

The Japanese will always act in their own self-interest because they are a homogenous, somewhat xenophobic society and they can act, for the most part, in unison. Canada and the U.S. are in a different situation. As we often are told, we are nations of immigrants; therefore, it is far more difficult to get a general consensus from the population when different groups are pulling in different directions. I know of many "Canadians" who were genuinely cheered when the WTC came down; of course, none of them were actually born here, and I am ashamed to say that some of them were South American. This clearly puts the Canadian government in a quandary when courting votes, especially when the fat, complacent middle class can't be bothered to get off their pasty butts and vote! But I digress! There will be no Muslims burning Japanese flags in Tokyo or disgruntled Indians protesting in the streets. They simply have no immigration, which is much the same way they view importation of anything. Raw materials are okay. Cars and electronics are bad. The vast majority of Japanese will agree on this and act accordingly. We need to get our acts together on this shore and start to act in our own self-interest. Oh, and BTW: all vehicles sold in Canada are "foreign," but GM sells nearly a half million vehicles here every year, so I think that earns Canadian-built "American" vehicles some slack when being counted as non-American. That is a huge destinction. How many Fords or Chevys are sold in Japan?

Though I like to pee on Toyota as much as the next guy, living up in the hinterland (where we have REAL snow), I wouldn't be without winter tires north of Toronto. Toronto does not get real snow any more (and Thursday afternoon barely even counts as a few flakes, IMO). My RWD Caprice had winter tires. My FWD Dodge Shadow HAD to have M&S on its 16" rims - it was beyond useless where I was living at the time (Blue Mtn) My '98 Blazer was 4WD (which I did not need) and the "all seasons" were not quite that. Getting stuck is hardly the point: it is stopping when the idiot in front of you goes sideways. From what I've seen of Prius drivers around here, none of them would survive in Kapuskasing anyway! That's probably why GM's cold weather facility is up there - to get away from Prius drivers.

The packaging indicates 180 g., but SAE recently determined it was only 165 g.

$1.01 a litre in the hinterland. That's about $3.67 an American gallon. THe oil companies are blaming a fire from two weeks ago at an oil refinery in Ontario. Nice. Could be worse, though: in Brazil where I was recently they are paying about 2.30 a litre!

This is actually a big deal. At one time, Addison was the biggest Cadillac dealer in Canada. Now, there is a hole in the center of the city. I know people who drive in from Mississauga that work in the city core and have their vehicle serviced at Addison. When I worked there (in the early '80s) they had 30 or so technicians on the second floor. It was a huge operation. For anyone who knows Toronto, there is now a big vacuum in the center of the city. The nearest Cadillac dealer is - Scarborough. Not that anybody in nearby Rosedale (one of the top two or three richest neighborhoods in Canada) buys Cadillac any more anyway: BMW Hell in that neighborhood, I am afraid. Somerset is tucked under the Gardiner at the foot of Parliament Street where nobody can find them - it is Chevrolet anyway. West York is way up on St. Clair north and to the west. Brennan Pontiac-Buick would be the next closest, way up on Bayview at Eglinton. Everybody else is downtown. BMW even has an amazing showcase directly beside the Don Valley Parkway. Well, chalk up another 40 storey condo on Bay St. There are two already going up on what was Addison's used car lot across the street. Bay Street will soon be a tunnel of buildings that will shame Manhattan.

"Or maybe this pissing contest over numbers just needs to stop." AMEN. But I doubt people like Toyguy have every towed anything other than their toy wagon when they were a child. Get out and drive the new Silvearado. It is simply amazing.

Quote: "My brother and his wife got 120,000 care free miles out of their Silhouette before trading it off for their prius." Wow. There's a testimonial. "Honey, our GM van has been great, let's go buy a Toyota." Sort of like the customer the other day who declared that while their 1996 Cavalier (with 220k km) has been perfect, they will only look at the Corolla this time around. It is almost enough to drive me to drink! There is a logic loop there. If you are talking about the Venture Valu Van that was being passed around back in '01 thru '03, I personally don't like them (vinyl seats, no armrests, no power windows, etc.) but mechanically they were fine. GM tried to take the high road against the Caravan by providing ABS and side air bags but no power windows or mirrors. Chrysler trounced our sales handily in that low end segment, proving once again: safety doesn't sell. People will pay for power windows or a built in blow dryer, but not ABS, side air bags or OnStar to save their life. Sigh. But I digress. In this market, loaded Ventures can be had for half the price of a Sienna which represents a true value, IMO.

Quote: "My brother and his wife got 120,000 care free miles out of their Silhouette before trading it off for their prius." Wow. There's a testimonial. "Honey, our GM van has been great, let's go buy a Toyota." Sort of like the customer the other day who declared that while their 1996 Cavalier (with 220k km) has been perfect, they will only look at the Corolla this time around. It is almost enough to drive me to drink! There is a logic loop there. If you are talking about the Venture Valu Van that was being passed around back in '01 thru '03, I personally don't like them (vinyl seats, no armrests, no power windows, etc.) but mechanically they were fine. GM tried to take the high road against the Caravan by providing ABS and side air bags but no power windows or mirrors. Chrysler trounced our sales handily in that low end segment, proving once again: safety doesn't sell. People will pay for power windows or a built in blow dryer, but not ABS, side air bags or OnStar to save their life. Sigh. But I digress. In this market, loaded Ventures can be had for half the price of a Sienna which represents a true value, IMO.

I like how they credit Toyota with getting it right out of the gate - as if 12 years and 3 models later Toyota just re-invented the wheel. Fortunately, most people who tow (and I have been one of them for years) are not easily swayed by one magazine article. Ford and GM have been in a pissing contest for decades over whose wee-wee is bigger than the other's. Over all the competition has been healthy and good. We can bitch and whine about how many gears the Silverado or Sierra have, but the real truth is that those measly 4 gears are damned reliable ones - and I think that matters to more people in this category than the no-minds who rush out and buy a Camry. Any vehicle is more than the sum of its parts and certainly more than the sum of hard boiled numbers and tests. The look and feel of the truck is just as important as the numbers these rags cook up. Subjective, but important. Besides, isn't this magazine catering to the same crowd who are towing their boat with a Mercruiser engine - block built by GM? That crowd is not easily swayed.